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UKJeff posted:Joe Biden would habitually swim naked in front of female secret service agents. I don't understand why I should care about this one or how it fits the image you're trying to build here. Even in that article it sounds like the Secret Services were more peeved about having to go to Delaware than about the nudity.
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May 31, 2023 00:25
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GlyphGryph posted:I don't understand why I should care about this one or how it fits the image you're trying to build here. Even in that article it sounds like the Secret Services were more peeved about having to go to Delaware than about the nudity.
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May 31, 2023 00:32
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loving hell don't defend bosses getting nude before their subordinates
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May 31, 2023 00:34
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Look, I like to swim naked and these people won't stop watching me.
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May 31, 2023 00:34
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Did he force people to watch him swim or was it part of the job description. I mean I guess he could not swim naked. I know a few people who love to skinny dip and such but if he is doing it as a power play than that is hosed up.
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May 31, 2023 00:40
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Madkal posted:Did he force people to watch him swim or was it part of the job description. I mean I guess he could not swim naked. I know a few people who love to skinny dip and such but if he is doing it as a power play than that is hosed up. Like I’ve been to nude beaches a number of times, but never with students or professional subordinates.
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May 31, 2023 00:42
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Yeah sorry but if he always swam naked and the secret service has a rule like "we can't look away while you swim" well that sucks but I wouldn't change my habits either. E: " you cannot go to and onsen for four years" would be a hard pass for me.
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May 31, 2023 00:43
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cat botherer posted:Do they do that in front of their professional subordinates? They aren't really in a position where they have a protective agency following them everywhere they go.
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May 31, 2023 00:45
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Jaxyon posted:I have no problem believing that the accusations are credible because nobody is a perfect victim and Uncle Touchy Joe is creepy as hell about personal space. This is where I think #metoo has broken peoples brains and forced us not to be able to think critically. People who claim they are sexually abused should always be given a voice and be treated as credible, but we owe it to the accused to vet the claims and if they’re not credible we need to be up front about that too. The problem is and always was that she has a history of lying (including under oath), making contradictory statements and claims of outright fraud. It doesn’t make you a bad person to not trust someone who has a public record of abusing trust. Nobody should be surprised that she fled to Russia to hang with Butina it 100% makes sense. Anyone who isn’t expressing at least a bit of doubt about her claims has an agenda.
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May 31, 2023 00:47
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Archonex posted:2. Reade’s friend admitted to lying to a reporter to fit Reade’s narrative. McGann spoke with one Reade friend, who told her last year that Biden had harassed Reade but had definitely not sexually assaulted her: Archonex posted:, and her friends later admitted that they were pressured by Reade to lie on her behalf corroborating her claims that Biden was handsy with her in public so Reade could set up a "layered" story she could unveil later on after Reade changed the nature of her allegations.
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May 31, 2023 00:50
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Killer robot posted:I've seen studies in the past suggesting that the great majority of rapes are committed by a relatively small number of serial rapists. Not true. Most rapes are committed by a perpetrator known to the victim. Not consistent with the profile of a serial rapist. https://www.rainn.org/statistics/perpetrators-sexual-violence However, it is likely for perpetrators to have a criminal history.
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May 31, 2023 00:50
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kronix posted:This is where I think #metoo has broken peoples brains and forced us not to be able to think critically. People who claim they are sexually abused should always be given a voice and be treated as credible, but we owe it to the accused to vet the claims and if they’re not credible we need to be up front about that too. "Believe women" is "broken people's brains"? No gently caress that. I'd rather err on the side of believing women after a billion years of doubting them. If you have proof that she lied, post it, otherwise I'm still going to believe her.
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May 31, 2023 00:54
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Jaxyon posted:"Believe women" is "broken people's brains"? very cool of you to slam in here and immediately kinda prove kronix's point
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May 31, 2023 00:56
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Madkal posted:They aren't really in a position where they have a protective agency following them everywhere they go.
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May 31, 2023 00:59
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World Famous W posted:im getting worked up, so ill just address 2 there. It seems to be saying her friend didnt stop believing her or that Reade changed what Reade told her, but that she only admitted to the reporter what Reade was at the moment comfortable revealing. Not really To be clear, the friend admitted she lied outright by adding a false detail to the claim. She didn't come forward about it until directly confronted about it because she thought she didn't think it was her place. Also, the whole thing with Reade deliberately perjuring herself is utterly terrifying. She straight up contributed to multiple people getting locked away, and the prosecutors themselves admitted that she lied through her teeth about her credibility, which almost certainly contributed to a reduced sentence to make amends for the clear error in the proceedings and justice. Never mind all the lying to various landlords and neighbors (One even says that they think she's escalated to going after a bigger con by going after Biden in the first article.) to extract money and housing from them before ghosting them which can be seen in the first article. I understand this is a sensitive topic, and I agree that given the culture around rape accusations we should give people the benefit of the doubt when they come forward with an accusation. But there is just so much poo poo with this person that you really should be demanding more evidence before taking her word at face value. She has a clear history of manipulating other people for her own gain, literally preying on their good nature and sympathy as one article puts its, and often has repeatedly done this to other people's detriment without a seeming care in the world for the harm she herself has caused. Hell, she herself claims to be a victim of domestic abuse but straight up had zero problem lying on stand in domestic abuse cases to the point where the prosecutors sought to lower the sentence afterwards. It's genuinely hard to get more untrustworthy than that. This is not saying that the claim should be tossed out outright, or that Biden is an innocent little snowflake, but if there was ever a person who should be given a very clear look at before treating their claims as gospel it's Tara Reade. That she now claims she that has discovered a plot decades out from her association with Biden to steal the 2024 election (a wing nut right wing grifting trick that they tried to whataboutism about at one point to downplay the J6 coup attempt, it should be added) and thinks that she's going to be assassinated by Biden should also concern folks. Archonex fucked around with this message at 01:09 on May 31, 2023 |
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May 31, 2023 01:01
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cat botherer posted:Luv 2 swim naked in front of people I have power over. He was in his own private pool in his own private home and there's no reporting I've seen that he was, at any time, doing anything remotely sexual or otherwise inappropriate - just swimming. DeeplyConcerned posted:Not true. Most rapes are committed by a perpetrator known to the victim. Not consistent with the profile of a serial rapist. This doesn't even make the slightest bit of sense. Most serial rapists are going to be known by their victims, people knowing their rapist prior to the rape has absolutely no bearing on how many rapes the rapist has done before. The most prolific serial rapists I've had the misfortune of knowing knew all of their victims beforehand, those social connections were how they enabled and perpetrated their rapes. GlyphGryph fucked around with this message at 01:08 on May 31, 2023 |
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May 31, 2023 01:06
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Archonex posted:
quote:A former neighbor, however, told Business Insider that Reade spoke of the assault in the mid-1990s. A work colleague from around the same time told the publication that Reade complained to her of sexual harassment in Biden’s office. A document filed by Reade’s ex-husband in 1996 also states that Reade had complained of harassment. From the Vox article the nymag article pulled from quote:When we spoke a year ago, Reade told me the only named sources she could give me were her deceased mother and the friend I spoke to. A recently uncovered tape of her mom on Larry King Live appears to corroborate Reade’s claim that she was struggling in Biden’s office in 1993, but does not include an assault allegation.
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May 31, 2023 01:08
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Madkal posted:Did he force people to watch him swim or was it part of the job description. I mean I guess he could not swim naked. I know a few people who love to skinny dip and such but if he is doing it as a power play than that is hosed up. I mean, this was the guy who nipple-twisted a child while he was on camera; of course it was a power play.
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May 31, 2023 01:09
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Archonex posted:To be clear, the friend admitted she lied outright by adding a false detail to the claim. She didn't come forward about it until directly confronted about it because she thought she didn't think it was her place. Skex posted:The reason I was skeptical of the rape allegation is that abusers aren't typically one and done. It wasn't just Carroll accusing Trump it was dozens. It wasn't an actress accusing Harvey Weinstein once again dozens same with Hi you're both rape apologists, and a direct danger to the women in your lives🥰 (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST) (USER WAS BANNED FOR THIS POST)
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May 31, 2023 01:11
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. The fact that it was just her didn't help her credibility. I mean even with Franken there were multiple accusations of groping.
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GlyphGryph posted:This doesn't even make the slightest bit of sense. Most serial rapists are going to be known by their victims, people knowing their rapist prior to the rape has absolutely no bearing on how many rapes the rapist has done before. The most prolific serial rapists I've had the misfortune of knowing knew all of their victims beforehand, those social connections were how they enabled and perpetrated their rapes. Yeah, after looking it up, I think I conflated the definition of serial rapist with serial killer. Thanks for the clarification.
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May 31, 2023 01:12
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Not sure if this is discussed elsewhere or old news some how but https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2023/05/30/mccarthy-chip-roy-speaker-deal/ Chip Roy is saying he has a deal with McCarthy that nothing passes the House Rules Committee unless all 9 Rs agree to it. Most folks thought the deal was just 7 Rs, but pretty much everyone admits McCarthy was desperate as hell so they're saying "I don't think that's right" instead of "No, that's dumb, committees work by majority vote". I think the debt ceiling will still go through, there's too much incentive, but for folks to be screaming "This wasn't part of the deal, McCarthy" 4 months into his speakership and on the first thing they try is ... about what I expected I guess. Absolute unworkable shitshow. The Washington Post posted:We knew the House was liable to get messy when Republicans took it over and Kevin McCarthy needed to cut a mysterious agreement with the right-wing House Freedom Caucus to become speaker.
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May 31, 2023 01:13
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Tatsuta Age posted:very cool of you to slam in here and immediately kinda prove kronix's point Yeah, some folks can't handle talking about this, it seems. Like, you folks uncritically assessing this are defending someone who claimed in a divorce proceeding to be the victim of domestic abuse, then turned around and straight up loving lied about her credibility and credentials in cases involving domestic abuse that lead to life imprisonment and imprisonment for longer than a decade. She did this ten times. uninterrupted posted:Hi you're both rape apologists, and a direct danger to the women in your lives🥰 As someone who's had to deal with emotionally abusive and manipulative family members that act like her and has been nearly murdered by an abusive family member I invite you to thoroughly go gently caress yourself and shut the gently caress up. The accusation of rape does not exclude people from looking at someone who has gone out of their way to ruin lives themselves for their own profit by constantly lying through their teeth for decades on end with a note of skepticism. Especially now that she's openly gone full right wing wingnut and thinks Biden plans to kill her and is straight up posting right wing grifting conspiracy theories to the news on behalf of loving Russia of all places. Edit: And it looks like you're forum banned from D&D, and are a genocide denying CCP shill going off your rap sheet. Color me loving shocked at this development. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST) Archonex fucked around with this message at 01:33 on May 31, 2023 |
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May 31, 2023 01:21
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DeeplyConcerned posted:Not true. Most rapes are committed by a perpetrator known to the victim. Not consistent with the profile of a serial rapist. That's not at all incompatible. I don't mean "serial rapist" in the terms of someone who stalks strangers: someone attacking a number of girlfriends/dates/coworkers/etc, people he already knew, is what it had suggested. Repeat offenders who keep going until they're stopped because that's how they treat the women in their lives. But again, even if it's true that only a fraction of rapes are committed by a one-time offender, the magic of statistics means that a larger percentage of rapists are one-time offenders, so "there weren't any other accusations" wouldn't mean much even in a world where victims all came forward.
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May 31, 2023 01:22
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Archonex posted:Yeah, some folks can't handle talking about this, it seems. Saying "she lied about one thing, that means she's probably lying about being sexually assaulted" isn't critical thinking. It's the exact opposite of critical thinking. In fact it's one of the most common smear tactics for defending sexual assault perpetrators. It's bullshit when people do it to Jane Doe, it's bullshit when you do it about Tara Reade.
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May 31, 2023 01:27
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https://twitter.com/adamcancryn/status/1663689714145083392 McCarthy somehow got negotiated into increasing the number of SNAP recipients by 78,000???
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May 31, 2023 01:31
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uninterrupted posted:Hi you're both rape apologists, and a direct danger to the women in your lives🥰 Hey just wanted to point out this is disgusting behavior from you.
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May 31, 2023 01:36
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Yawgmoft posted:Hey just wanted to point out this is disgusting behavior from you. You're right I'm sorry I missed your horrifying "what's wrong w whipping your cock out in front of your employees" post Yawgmoft posted:Yeah sorry but if he always swam naked and the secret service has a rule like "we can't look away while you swim" well that sucks but I wouldn't change my habits either. (USER WAS BANNED FOR THIS POST)
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May 31, 2023 01:38
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Yawgmoft posted:Hey just wanted to point out this is disgusting behavior from you. Yeah, there's way too many people being lovely trolls or bad faith arguers to continue this discussion. Still trying to process Fister's nonsense misrepresenting the posts by saying she only lied about one thing when in reality it was so much more than that. Archonex fucked around with this message at 01:43 on May 31, 2023 |
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May 31, 2023 01:40
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Is it really such a burden that along with the privileges of being president, he can no longer skinny dip?
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May 31, 2023 01:41
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uninterrupted posted:You're right I'm sorry I missed your horrifying "what's wrong w whipping your cock out in front of your employees" post Americans are so loving weird about the human body. Being naked is not the same thing as "wiping your dick out". Why are you here, when there are so many children being sexually abused because they saw an old man in the locker room at the Y you could be saving? Adenoid Dan posted:Is it really such a burden that along with the privileges of being president, he can no longer skinny dip? It's really more like why is it even a problem Yawgmoft fucked around with this message at 01:44 on May 31, 2023 |
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May 31, 2023 01:42
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Fister Roboto posted:Saying "she lied about one thing, that means she's probably lying about being sexually assaulted" isn't critical thinking. It's the exact opposite of critical thinking. In fact it's one of the most common smear tactics for defending sexual assault perpetrators. It's bullshit when people do it to Jane Doe, it's bullshit when you do it about Tara Reade. The last time an iteration of this thread went through this, it all went very badly and there were quite a few people who left and never came back due to the seriously undercooked views a lot of the men (sorry, but, y'know) here have on sexual assault. It's one thing to intellectually understand that people with mental illness or disability are the most likely people to be victims of assault -- sexual or otherwise -- it's quite another to actually recognize that when it presents itself. Victims do not need to be perfect; they don't need to be likeable, hell, they don't even need to be good people. But for a lot of men (again, sorry), the ability to empathize with a victim is generally contingent on him being able to see her as someone in his own life. Biden being much more handsy than appropriate isn't news or a new thing for anyone to hear, but a lot of people really do have trouble recognizing what counts as assault because so much of it is played off as "he's from a different era" or "she's overreacting." The best we can do, I think, is to reiterate that there's no good reason for victims of sexual assault to go on record to smear a powerful man because it has been shown repeatedly through the ages that doing so will literally ruin your life. See: Anita Hill; Dr. Christine Blasey-Ford; etc, etc. Personally, I was sexually assaulted as a child multiple times and was told "no you weren't" by people who were literally there while it happened. The burden of proof required to get people to believe you when the person you're accusing is well-liked or powerful is astronomical. It doesn't really matter if she's decided to be a Russian spy or whatever at this point, because none of what she said impacted Biden at all. There's no reason to hound her for more details or delve into whatever her life is like now, but for whatever reason it's a common thing to see when someone "lied" (read: didn't have enough evidence for people already disinclined to believe them) about sexual assault. It sucks. I'd prefer it if we went back to talking about thread-rules lawyering or food chat or that there are no mountains on the east coast, tbh.
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May 31, 2023 01:42
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Fister Roboto posted:Saying "she lied about one thing, that means she's probably lying about being sexually assaulted" isn't critical thinking.
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May 31, 2023 01:43
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Yawgmoft posted:Americans are so loving weird about the human body. Being naked is not the same thing as "wiping your dick out". Why are you here, when there are so many children being sexually abused because they saw an old man in the locker room at the Y you could be saving? What is acceptable depends on the culture we live in.
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May 31, 2023 01:43
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Adenoid Dan posted:Is it really such a burden that along with the privileges of being president, he can no longer skinny dip? I hear he even packs them a hot lunch when he travels
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May 31, 2023 01:43
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I’m pretty grossed out and appalled by a number of statements made in the past few pages. Biden has, at best, touched and kissed women and children without their consent (on camera even). Why anyone would be willing to spend time to defend him or spend time discrediting allegations is beyond me. Skex posted:https://twitter.com/Esqueer_/status/1663624151028908033?t=08hGvHnRwwfzTwrINO_TxQ&s=19 This post that started it all is incredibly gross. What is the point of this post and a single “LOL” behind it? Also I’m confused why it was able to be posted at all without a summary and just a simple acronym. I’d love and explanation on why this post doesn’t violate rule I.A.6.a
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May 31, 2023 01:44
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When I was young living in Europe everyone was naked and it was nbd, it's the weirdos sexualizing nudity that's the problem. What we have are people trying to foist their learned shame on others.
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May 31, 2023 01:45
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Yawgmoft posted:Uh does this mean there is a possibility that Biden's sexual assault allegation was a Russian psy-op? The far-right (including Russia) have been openly friendly and welcoming toward her, for fairly obvious political reasons. Moreover, she was reportedly having career troubles even before the Biden accusations made it even harder for her to find a decent job. And she has some knowledge of Russia and some connections there as a result of research she did for a novel she was writing, and posted a bunch of pro-Putin stuff online during Trump's first term. If the Russian government made her a good offer, it's not hard to see why she'd take it, regardless of whether or not she'd been previously involved with them. In summary, her trip to Russia doesn't tell us whether her sexual assault allegations against Biden are true or false. It does, however, suggest (though not outright confirm) that Putin or other powerful Russian figures are interested in those allegations, since it's hard to imagine that she managed to arrange a Sputnik press conference without a patron of some kind.
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May 31, 2023 01:47
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Archonex posted:Yeah, there's way too many people being lovely trolls or bad faith arguers to continue this discussion. Still trying to process Fister's nonsense about how she only lied about one thing when in reality it was so much more than that.
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May 31, 2023 01:47
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virtualboyCOLOR posted:I’m pretty grossed out and appalled by a number of statements made in the past few pages. I think we all are, although obviously for wildly different reasons. As you point out, there's plenty of actually disturbing stuff to pin on Biden, dipping into the conservative bullshit wells of "everything is inherently sexual and people must be protected from that" and "divergence from the norm is morally wrong and weirdness is bad" as the foundation of your arguments should be unnecessary - and yet people can't help themselves. GlyphGryph fucked around with this message at 01:52 on May 31, 2023 |
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May 31, 2023 01:48
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biden isnt european hes american and america its weird to be naked in front of strangers or professional colleagues him skinny dipping in front of the secrer service, is weird
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May 31, 2023 01:49
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