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Lol I like it. But that foot hairpiece 
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Jun 9, 2023 00:24
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Fuzzy Mammal posted:Lol I like it. But that foot hairpiece Some halflings get self-conscious about premature balding, okay?
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Jun 9, 2023 00:34
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Strong Sauce posted:
this set fuckin owns
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Jun 9, 2023 00:36
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Pocky In My Pocket posted:Fun new pun announced South Park did it first.
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Jun 9, 2023 02:03
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JRR tokin
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Jun 9, 2023 02:51
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JRR token artifact - food
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Jun 9, 2023 03:13
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The dominance of EDH in mtg communities really bums me out. Games take 3 times longer and decks are subject to so much more variance that the game approaches Settler of Catan levels of "oh I lost five minutes into this but I'm going to sit and pretend otherwise for an hour while the winner does their thing". Good ol' 60 let's there be consistency while still offering enough variance that even a top tier deck can get hosed over. Better balance imo, particularly in a free-for-all setting.
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Jun 9, 2023 07:42
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CatstropheWaitress posted:The dominance of EDH in mtg communities really bums me out. Games take 3 times longer and decks are subject to so much more variance that the game approaches Settler of Catan levels of "oh I lost five minutes into this but I'm going to sit and pretend otherwise for an hour while the winner does their thing". None of this is true, fwiw. If you compare cedh games to serious format games, they are relatively similar. If you compare kitchen table EDH to kitchen table constructed, it's all just as slow and random. You can't compare apples to oranges.
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Jun 9, 2023 07:54
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Toshimo posted:None of this is true, fwiw. If you compare cedh games to serious format games, they are relatively similar. If you compare kitchen table EDH to kitchen table constructed, it's all just as slow and random. You can't compare apples to oranges. Weird to just post "this guy's experience is bullshit, disregard." Kitchen table constructed is random but way faster than an EDH game, and significantly less random, because get this, instead of a 1 in 100 chance of drawing a card you have a 1 in 60 -- or -- wild I know -- 1 in 15 chance of drawing it. Commander pick gives you some semblance of a baseline, but it isn't quite the same. I don't know of any place that compiles data on it, but I'd wager money that EDH games on average last longer than 60-card constructed. Feel like given my issues are time and variance it's apples compared to apples. Quantifiable poo poo my man. Not saying anyone is wrong for enjoying EDH, just that I personally find it a bummer given it makes building around less supported archetypes more difficult + less games in a session. CatstropheWaitress fucked around with this message at 09:21 on Jun 9, 2023 |
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Jun 9, 2023 08:20
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I think that the reason that EDH games go long and take forever for someone to finally win is because people like it like that. Games could end much faster if people wanted them to, like if EVERYBODY had a wincon, or even a backup one in case someone interacts with the first one! If you have That Guy whose deck exists to try to make sure that nobody wins, just gang up on him every time until he stops using that deck. I always try to add an infinite combo of some kind as a "break glass in case of game stalling" even if its some 3-card jank combo. I try to win by just hitting people with big creatures, but if that fails, just play things that force the game to move along.
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Jun 9, 2023 13:47
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I don't really play EDH, but I sorta get the appeal of having like, basically a board game version of magic to play with a group of 3 of your friends. I think cube would be the more fun version of that but you kinda need more than 4 people for cubing so  Honestly the only type of EDH deck that sounds truly, truly miserable is the ones jam packed with every "random targets, randomize permanents, wheel hands" effect possible. Mostly because it would make the game go so long in, at least to me, a not very fun way
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Jun 9, 2023 14:01
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Weird Pumpkin posted:I don't really play EDH, but I sorta get the appeal of having like, basically a board game version of magic to play with a group of 3 of your friends. I think cube would be the more fun version of that but you kinda need more than 4 people for cubing so It is expensive as poo poo to do, but probably the best way to do "Board Game" Commander is using the grouped pre-cons. They tend to be roughly equal power level, and have some linking theme either in mechanics, narrative, or setting. The WH40k decks are really really fun to play against eachother for example, and I imagine the Doctor Who decks will be too.
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Jun 9, 2023 14:11
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A Moose posted:I think that the reason that EDH games go long and take forever for someone to finally win is because people like it like that. It’s basically this. EDH is mostly just a bunch of people gathering to try to do cool and weird things. I think if you look at like cEDH or even like Canadian Highlander, being restricted to one-ofs doesn’t mean games can’t end quickly purely from that. Magic has printed many passable different versions of strong cards that even if you can’t get like 4 copies of a single tutor and have to deal with a min deck size of 100, you can simply run like 7 other tutors/ similar effects to get enough consistency to kill people/win extremely quickly. I enjoy casual EDH because it’s the one home for absolute trash cards with fun effects that are literally unplayable in normal competitive formats because they just immediately get removed or whatever whenever they hit the field.
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Jun 9, 2023 14:40
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OneDeadman posted:It’s basically this. EDH is mostly just a bunch of people gathering to try to do cool and weird things. Yeah, Canlander is a good comparison point b/c it’s one-off with no commander, but it still manages to be a very competitive format, with everything that entails (sometimes games are fast, sometimes you get a stalled boardstate, but almost always either player could be one card away from a game ender, and you have to know what your opponent is doing and what you might need to play around).
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Jun 9, 2023 15:15
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OneDeadman posted:It’s basically this. EDH is mostly just a bunch of people gathering to try to do cool and weird things. Exactly! You just gotta figure out what kind of game you're looking for and the other players are looking for. Its helpful to have at least a couple decks with different power levels. Or if everyone else wants long rambling games that end more or less at random, I guess find some other people to play with. Or play to win and get ganged up on. Or I guess just win and bask in that? If there's prizes for winning then it doesn't really matter of course. But for casual games, read the room.
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Jun 9, 2023 15:15
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CatstropheWaitress posted:Weird to just post "this guy's experience is bullshit, disregard." EDH is nice because you only need one copy of a card and it makes individual cards feel more “special” when you draw them. That said, there’s enough tutors in EDH that you can have like a dozen virtual copies of any card, so the question becomes what the heck kind of kitchen table games are you playing? Are people slamming Demonic and Vampiric tutor in their 60?
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Jun 9, 2023 15:20
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EDH is a lot like poker. Tables across the world can all be playing poker yet all playing wildly different games in terms of seriousness, stakes, number of players, and rules variations. I think that's honestly part of why EDH is so popular. Not only are the individual decks customized for each player and their tastes, but what your playgroup wants to experience at the table can be very customized as well.
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Jun 9, 2023 15:22
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Highlander is general is so good. There are too many cool cards to ever feel good about putting multiples of the same thing in a deck. And when you end up with a deck with 4x of everything it feels like a waste, like a 9 card deck. If nothing else Arena could throw me a highlander standard even now and then, but really I want some cards to make singleton decks a viable option
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Jun 9, 2023 15:52
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I think a good game of edh lasts like 30-45, maybe a little longer if everyone's decks are even power and people just keep having answers for stuff (at which point you stop noticing how long the game is going because of how active the board state is), and it only really stands out as sluggish if someone is actively making it so (whether unintentionally if like. Theyre a new player, or the deck has a lot of moving parts. Or intentionally if, say, a player is playing stax. Or their combo is bad and takes forever, like the game last week where a monored urabrask player took 20 minutes to make their combo work enough to kill us while the rest of the pod just spent the time scrolling on our phones  )
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Jun 9, 2023 15:57
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Khanstant posted:Highlander is general is so good. There are too many cool cards to ever feel good about putting multiples of the same thing in a deck. And when you end up with a deck with 4x of everything it feels like a waste, like a 9 card deck. If nothing else Arena could throw me a highlander standard even now and then, but really I want some cards to make singleton decks a viable option To piggy back on this, can anyone speak to how Canadian highlander plays versus Australian highlander? I dislike how "all in" some commander decks are but Canadian highlander variance can be all over the place without powerful/expensive/points intensive cards. I've never played Auslander but a 60 singleton with sideboard seems interesting.
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Jun 9, 2023 16:52
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14 years ago today they announced the removal of damage on the stack and mana burn, and introduced the concept of ordered blockers. I only mention this because my reaction was probably the biggest self-own I've ever had in this dumb game. Game is still here, and I'm still playing it.
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Jun 10, 2023 15:59
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I never played with Mana Burn but it kind of sounds like it would make standard more interesting at times.
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Jun 10, 2023 16:51
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Khanstant posted:I never played with Mana Burn but it kind of sounds like it would make standard more interesting at times. I didn't really play very much when it was around, but I honestly don't remember it ever actually coming up very often
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Jun 10, 2023 16:53
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It really only mattered in combo decks. Flavor-wise it was interesting in the idea that it was powerful energy and misusing it could kill you, but it didn't add much.
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Jun 10, 2023 16:56
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the only time mana burn ever really came up when I was playing as a kid in the card shop was during drafts, competitive events, etc when someone tapped too many lands and tryhards would point it out to ding you for damage. it's a frivolous and pointless rule, although I do like that one commander card that reintroduces it and iirc produces mana for each player, so you have to use it or get bolted every turn, that's a fun way to go about it.
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Jun 10, 2023 17:24
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Jun 10, 2023 17:28
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Only time I remember mana burn being an issue was doing Early Harvest/Heartbeat of Spring shenanigans and fizzling with a billion floating mana, those were the days.
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Jun 10, 2023 18:15
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rickiep00h posted:14 years ago today they announced the removal of damage on the stack and mana burn, and introduced the concept of ordered blockers. I only mention this because my reaction was probably the biggest self-own I've ever had in this dumb game. Okay wait, what was....how were blocker assigned if not by order?
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Jun 10, 2023 18:26
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The attacker assigned damage across blockers however they wanted (or the defender did if they had a banding creature blocking).
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Jun 10, 2023 18:28
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 The most I ever used mana burn for was pinging myself during an opponent's post combat main to cause pulse of the forge to bounce back when I planned to use it in their end step.
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Jun 10, 2023 19:31
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Honestly I misunderstood the mechanic entirely. I thought it pinged you for every untapped land before your turn or I guess at upkeep, I didn't think it through lol
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Jun 10, 2023 20:56
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It came up occasionally to add a drawback to multiple-mana mana sources like Sol Ring and Mana Flare, but the fact of the matter once players actually learned about how powerful fast mana is, Mana Burn stopped looking like a drawback at all. The funniest example of this is probably Su-Chi, a 4/4 artifact creature for 4 that when it does generates 4 colorless mana when it dies... which was intended to be a dangerous drawback that'd potentially smack you in the face for getting such a powerful creature at that rate. Yeah, every part of that statement is hilarious, and people figured out it was hilarious fairly quickly after Su-Chi was printed. ...to be fair, nobody DID play it, but more because a 4/4 Vanilla for 4 was pretty bad even in 1994, and 4 mana is too much of an investment for 4 mana later that also requires you to having some kind of sac outlet or place to dump it if it dies early. Being so expensive and having a difficult-to-use upside on top of a failure case of blasting yourself in the face for a fifth of your starting life total kept kept it from ever mattering even once people figured out the mana generation should be a huge positive even in the face of mana burn.
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Jun 10, 2023 21:27
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Su-Chi was a good rate on stats in 1994. This is still the age of Serra Angel being a control finisher.
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Jun 10, 2023 21:31
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whydirt posted:Su-Chi was a good rate on stats in 1994. This is still the age of Serra Angel being a control finisher. It was a good rate on stats in 1994. It was also still a vanilla 4/4 creature. Serra Angel had a couple lines of text that were... fairly important for her role as a closer in a control deck.
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Jun 10, 2023 21:38
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So out of all the garbage pioneer decks that exists, spirits is actually both good and somewhat fun. I wish the format had good white removal that wasn’t an enchantment though.
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Jun 11, 2023 00:16
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Fateful Absence exists
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Jun 11, 2023 00:39
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Silhouette posted:Fateful Absence exists That card is poo. Poo Doodoo.
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Jun 11, 2023 01:31
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the value calculation for fateful absence is obviously pretty difficult since it's reliant in part on the substance of the other player's deck, but there's a reason it shows up in so many decks. it's less restricted than black 2 mana removal, and it hits planeswalkers too. if you're playing ramp chances are you're going to have a better payoff for getting to late game than the other guy's one extra card
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Jun 11, 2023 01:48
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Venuz Patrol posted:the value calculation for fateful absence is obviously pretty difficult since it's reliant in part on the substance of the other player's deck, but there's a reason it shows up in so many decks. it's less restricted than black 2 mana removal, and it hits planeswalkers too. if you're playing ramp chances are you're going to have a better payoff for getting to late game than the other guy's one extra card It’s played in like one deck in pioneer and it doesn’t seem to very popular in that deck either. Maybe if it exiled the target it might see more play , but giving your opponent a clue token isn’t very good and a liability against a pretty popular deck.
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Jun 11, 2023 03:02
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oh i thought you were talking standard my b lmao
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Jun 11, 2023 03:33
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