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Jun 11, 2023 19:56
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Yeah, an explicit point of each of those bosses is that they are there to show you the ATB system and how it is 'different' from normal RPGs. That is why they're the first boss in each case. The Wind Shrine boss in FFV does the same thing.
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Jun 11, 2023 20:00
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ImpAtom posted:Wait Mode does not actually stop enemies from acting except while you have an action menu open. In FFX if you don't touch anything the game doesn't progress. For example in FFIX if you select attack but don't select a target the enemy will continue to act. It's actually very notable in FFIX because enemies will trigger their actions even while you're in a menu if they already were acting before you went in, to the point wait mode in FFIX is almost indistinguishable from Active Mode. (A common complaint about the game.) You are not safe during your turn even in Wait Mode unless you trigger the very specific thing that stops time. It was designed to make it easier to scroll busy menus, not to turn the game turn-based. Okay, maybe there's a minor difference(which people complain about the existence of). But remember, the point you're trying to make here is: "People complaining about the direction the series have taken since 15 don't even know what they want, the series has always made big sweeping changes between games." Do you think the fact that there's a minor functional difference between ATB and turn-based(a difference which people, as you say, complain about)validates that idea the series has made this kind of big sweeping change before? Out of 16 games: 12 use either ATB or turn-based, 2 systems which are very, very similar. 2 are MMOs which use a fairly standard MMO system, since turn-based or ATB would not translate well to an MMO(and which garnered a somewhat different audience as a result). And then the last 2 are action games. Do you really think there's no justification for long-time fans of the series to be disappointed by the fact that it's taken this new direction? Are you actually saying that 15 and 16 are no further removed from 4-9 than 10 is?
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Jun 11, 2023 20:04
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    thanks, this is basically a better way of making the same point
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Jun 11, 2023 20:11
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Man I hope the next ten days go quick
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Jun 11, 2023 20:12
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cock hero flux posted:Okay, maybe there's a minor difference(which people complain about the existence of). But remember, the point you're trying to make here is: "People complaining about the direction the series have taken since 15 don't even know what they want, the series has always made big sweeping changes between games." Do you think the fact that there's a minor functional difference between ATB and turn-based(a difference which people, as you say, complain about)validates that idea the series has made this kind of big sweeping change before? Out of 16 games: 12 use either ATB or turn-based, 2 systems which are very, very similar. 2 are MMOs which use a fairly standard MMO system, since turn-based or ATB would not translate well to an MMO(and which garnered a somewhat different audience as a result). And then the last 2 are action games. Do you really think there's no justification for long-time fans of the series to be disappointed by the fact that it's taken this new direction? Are you actually saying that 15 and 16 are no further removed from 4-9 than 10 is? Well, I wouldn't say that because among other things I don't agree that you should only be counting the mainline games when discussing the evolution of the series. There is a steady development of mechanics that exists not just in the main numbered entries but in their sequels and spinoffs too. FFX-2 set the groundwork for FFXIII which set the groundwork for LR which set the groundwork for FFXV which set the groundwork for FFVIIIR which set the groundwork for FFXVI. There is a *much* clearer follow through in how those games develop then. Like Lightning Returns is the almost exact midpoint between standard ATB and action games. It is a single-character game where you have three ATB bars you swap between, with each one filling up separately, but it also has timed hits and just defends and rewards comboing and in general is a mesh of ATB and 'pure action' gameplay. If you don't pretend it and FFX-2 'don't count' then seeing how we got from FFX to FFXVI is a lot easier to follow. cock hero flux posted:thanks, this is basically a better way of making the same point You missed their point. Each of those boss battles is a mechanic that explicitly isn't turn based. You have to wait for the enemy to drop their defenses. If you just take your action you'll get hosed up and if you defend it won't change anything except making you wait for your ATB bar to fill again.
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Jun 11, 2023 20:14
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Excited to play ff16 in like a week and a half and not think about what a final fantasy game should or shouldn’t be.
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Jun 11, 2023 20:17
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Where the freakin' demo
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Jun 11, 2023 20:18
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ImpAtom posted:Well, I wouldn't say that because among other things I don't agree that you should only be counting the mainline games when discussing the evolution of the series. There is a steady development of mechanics that exists not just in the main numbered entries but in their sequels and spinoffs too. FFX-2 set the groundwork for FFXIII which set the groundwork for LR which set the groundwork for FFXV which set the groundwork for FFVIIIR which set the groundwork for FFXVI. There is a *much* clearer follow through in how those games develop then. I'm not saying they don't exist, or that there hasn't been a logical progression. I, personally, don't mind action games. My biggest problem with the direction the series was taking was that it was executed poorly: I did not think 15 played well at all. 7R was a lot better, though, so I'm optimistic enough. But that's just me: the fact that I like both games like the older FF games and like the newer ones is a coincidence. 15 and 16, while you can see DNA from the older games, are now in a totally different genre of game, and I don't think it's unreasonable to be upset about that or to wish for a return to the prior genre.
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Jun 11, 2023 20:19
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I suppose the demo will be available at 5AM in Europe. And we're getting a new trailer, too.
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Jun 11, 2023 20:20
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ImpAtom posted:You missed their point. No, I got it, I just deliberately ignored it because I realized that it was easier to explain what I was talking about visually. Their cherry-picked examples of ATB being as functionally different from turn-based as possible were still far, far more similar to 1 or 10 than any random image of 15 I could pull off of google. It was easier to just put up screenshots of 1, 10 and 13, the games that you were using as examples of being non-ATB games, and 15, the game you were saying was not as much of a departure from the series, in order to show the differences rather than continuing to try and talk about them.
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Jun 11, 2023 20:21
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Sakurazuka posted:Where the freakin' demo Been saying this
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Jun 11, 2023 20:41
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incorporeal posted:Excited to play ff16 in like a week and a half and not think about what a final fantasy game should or shouldn’t be. FF16 will begin with a quiz about the fundamental nature of FF games, and if you answer wrong you won't be able to play it.
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Jun 11, 2023 21:27
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Just to put my 2 gil into the whole ATB discussion, I think it's worth noting that the FF9 memoria mod has a setting that changes the combat system to play very similarly to FFX, and that the combat system of Xenogears (hallowed be its name) is also similar. Both ff9's memoria and Xenogears (and arguably FFX) accomplish this by skipping the wait anytime it's not someone's turn, and stopping time once it is. My point is that while, for instance, FFX and FFX-2's combat feel very different, the mechanics are more similar than different.
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Jun 11, 2023 21:58
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https://twitter.com/RinoTheBouncer/status/1667803623370137600?s=20
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Jun 11, 2023 22:12
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Ah, so I probably won't get to play it until after work tomorrow.
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Jun 11, 2023 22:21
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So it's gonna be out at midnight my time
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Jun 11, 2023 22:25
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IthilionTheBrave posted:Ah, so I probably won't get to play it until after work tomorrow. Same
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Jun 11, 2023 22:29
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Rino is notoriously unreliable and his source doesn't specify what time the demo will be out, it's simply an ad they ran too early.
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Jun 11, 2023 22:32
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I just want a party of weirdos again. I think the party in XV and a lot of the characters in XVI look like they belong together too much, and the fact you had to wait until the DLC to play as characters besides Noctis was very bad. I do not want stories focused so much on a single character in Final Fantasy, even if the only real ensemble cast was VI (and the MMOs by necessity.)
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Jun 11, 2023 22:38
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Spermando posted:Rino is notoriously unreliable and his source doesn't specify what time the demo will be out, it's simply an ad they ran too early. Yeah but it's also the most obvious answer. The demo's not going to be out before the stream is over. They want you to watch the stream.
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Jun 11, 2023 22:55
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Great time to be unemployed
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Jun 11, 2023 22:56
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jesus gently caress can today get any better as a gamer?
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Jun 11, 2023 22:59
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Ralph whipping out his best Jojo pose while everyone else is doing victory or battle stances. 
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Jun 11, 2023 23:52
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im getting so loving stoked, so loving stoked aaaaaaaaAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
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Jun 12, 2023 00:02
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Well I guess there is your answer on what Final Fantasy is
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Jun 12, 2023 00:26
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Yoshida must have read this thread before his presentation, because he just said that what defines the series is the differences between the games.
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Jun 12, 2023 00:26
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Watching this livestream. It's thundering heavily outside so I hope I don't lose my power in the middle of it.
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Jun 12, 2023 00:29
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They just casually said that this was codeveloped with Platinum Games.
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Jun 12, 2023 00:29
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demo tomorrow, 1 am PST, it may take a couple minutes for it to become available so relax
mikemil828 fucked around with this message at 00:36 on Jun 12, 2023 |
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Jun 12, 2023 00:34
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Demo launches tomorrow.
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Jun 12, 2023 00:34
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Spermando posted:They just casually said that this was codeveloped with Platinum Games. Oh yeah that explains a couple of things for sure. There are sone Platinum rear end moments in the game
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Jun 12, 2023 00:34
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Miss Mowcher fucked around with this message at 00:41 on Jun 12, 2023 |
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Jun 12, 2023 00:37
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gently caress yes....... gently caress yes!
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Jun 12, 2023 00:40
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You can pre-order the plushies Now: https://na.store.square-enix-games.com/franchise/final-fantasy-xvi mikemil828 fucked around with this message at 00:46 on Jun 12, 2023 |
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Jun 12, 2023 00:43
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Torgal plushie merch can now be preordered. Our national nightmare is over.
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Jun 12, 2023 00:43
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Rand Brittain posted:Demo launches tomorrow. at 1am! I have work tomorrow, release it tonight. 
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Jun 12, 2023 00:44
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lol I lost my power like 5 minutes after posting about it, but fortunately can watch on phone
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Jun 12, 2023 00:45
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I'm going back to work tomorrow after being on leave for 3 weeks. This is ill-timed on that front!
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Jun 12, 2023 01:01
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I'm at work/commuting home for like 3 more hours after the demo drops but the moment I get home I'm gonna clive out, trash the house, kill some eikons, gay sex clive, kill chaos
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Jun 12, 2023 01:31
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