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Just skipped ahead, so apologies if this got discussed anytime in the last six months - for the content creator DLCs like Industrial Evolution and Mid-Century Modern, is it necessary to use the associated district style to get them to show up? That is, will Mid-Century Modern buildings show up as part of the normal residential mix and that district style is just to make sure only those buildings show up, or will MCM buildings not show up at all except in a district with that style active?
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Jun 26, 2023 02:00
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Argentic posted:Just skipped ahead, so apologies if this got discussed anytime in the last six months - for the content creator DLCs like Industrial Evolution and Mid-Century Modern, is it necessary to use the associated district style to get them to show up? That is, will Mid-Century Modern buildings show up as part of the normal residential mix and that district style is just to make sure only those buildings show up, or will MCM buildings not show up at all except in a district with that style active? https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=466158459 https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2982163898&searchtext= I think that you can do it with one of those two mods. The first one is probably more of what you want but I don't know if it works anymore.
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Jun 26, 2023 02:19
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New video/DD: https://twitter.com/citiesskylines/status/1673330545114206208?s=46&t=IW0MSOWK0Lh4VsB3wVLoOA
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Jun 26, 2023 15:05
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Accurately modelling teens being skinflint and picking the cheapest way to get somewhere. People taking how easy it is to park when choosing where to go and what to do sounds fantastic. Everything in here sounds like CS2 is going to be an order of magnitude deeper than CS1. Not just 'better' pathfinding, but so much deeper decisionmaking based on individuals. Also, from a comment, if you go to 3:30 you can see people using their high beams on rural roads but turning them off to avoid blinding oncoming traffic. That's a very cute detail. Oh, here's a neat little detail dropped in: quote:Also, as a major improvement to the first game in the series, Cities: Skylines II doesn’t feature hard limits for agents moving about in the city. Overall, the performance of the simulation and pathfinding is vastly improved which means larger populations are possible. The only real limits to the simulation are the hardware limitations on the platform running the game. MikeJF fucked around with this message at 15:58 on Jun 26, 2023 |
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Jun 26, 2023 15:44
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That suburban sprawl picture is definitely like “Hey cool now we can more accurately model infinite suburban communities!” “Oh god it’s awful”.
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Jun 26, 2023 16:13
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Cool so the traffic AI decision making is a million times more complex, the cars have collision physics, cars have real time pathfinding, the pathfinding takes things like road obstructions and their surroundings into consideration at all times, there's no limit to the number of vehicles in the simulation anymore, and also it runs significantly better than CS1. I feel like the next dev diary is gonna be CO announcing the pricing plan for their spaceship jpegs
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Jun 26, 2023 16:54
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I can buy it. Optimisation of this kind of thing is an art, and they've had mountains of experience discovering where all the bottlenecks were in their architecture in CS1. And also probably learned what kind of specialists to hire. Plus I expect they've ripped the unity agent system apart much more this time. (And the no limit thing doesn't mean you'll be able to have playable cities of unlimited size now, just that as computers grow more powerful over the next decade, so will the practical limits on how big your city can get, instead of hitting a cap that doesn't necessarily apply anymore) And cars only have collision physics when the random generator (weighed by local conditions, road state, and individual driver) decides that a driver is going to lose control. Then the game gives it and the surrounding cars very simple physics for a few seconds as it skids around, and if something bad happens that becomes an accident. It's not like all the cars have physics all the time - they've explicitly described it as extremely constrained in local events. MikeJF fucked around with this message at 17:26 on Jun 26, 2023 |
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Jun 26, 2023 17:10
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turn off the TV posted:Cool so the traffic AI decision making is a million times more complex, the cars have collision physics, cars have real time pathfinding, the pathfinding takes things like road obstructions and their surroundings into consideration at all times, there's no limit to the number of vehicles in the simulation anymore, and also it runs significantly better than CS1. 
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Jun 26, 2023 17:19
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It does sound pretty remarkable, guess we'll see how it turns out.
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Jun 26, 2023 17:54
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Not having a hard agent limit is the best news yet. I hope that also means things like node and building limits are gone too. E: Big fan of charging for parking too. Modders rewrote the pathfinding/traffic AI for SimCity 4 to work a lot more like this instead of how it came from Maxis so I can believe an actual studio working on their game can do it. I am worried about the car crashes, that smells of a feature that is cool on paper and a nightmare in the actual game. I imagine a no crash mod will come fairly quick if that's the case though. Grand Fromage fucked around with this message at 18:14 on Jun 26, 2023 |
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Jun 26, 2023 18:10
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Grand Fromage posted:I imagine a no crash mod will come fairly quick if that's the case though. Yeah that’s what I enjoy about pdox games, the community is lighting quick to provide a solution to “eeehhhh?” choices like these but I guess we’ll see. Something I’m excited for is the day/night cycle not being tied to game simulation speed so you can have it gradually occur a few times over a sit-down and not constantly if you’re playing on max speed. And it’s apparently not difficult to build in night mode anymore either? Also I’m once again asking (and have been asking since SC2013) that this new city building game lets me build really pretty rural communities complete with older modest homes, sprawling orchards, and maybe even a small county fair ploppables. A man can dream.
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Jun 26, 2023 18:27
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Grand Fromage posted:I imagine a no crash mod will come fairly quick if that's the case though. I look forward to the opposite where crashes are increased and more crazy and wild I wonder if crashes also apply to trains, trams, planes, boats etc Or just cars
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Jun 26, 2023 18:29
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If an idiot can get stuck on the tracks and flattened by a train I will never turn it off.
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Jun 26, 2023 18:33
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I'm now picturing this game with the kind of traffic chaos and mayhem I saw living in China and cackling.
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Jun 26, 2023 18:34
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This also shows how the agent based traffic model will be having complex knock-on effects to the economic model, with people's choices of commerce to patronize being set in part by what they're willing to travel to, which is in turn influenced by distance, location, route, and also the effect their socioeconomic class has on those choices. It's all a big intertwined ball that hopefully produces emergent effects when you multiply it by thousands of cims.
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Jun 26, 2023 18:47
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I only just noticed it, but on a detail level I'm really impressed by that shot of a car doing a three-point turn to get out of a small space after an accident traps it.
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Jun 26, 2023 18:53
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Car crashes are such a complex subject, they could be a really interesting mechanic if they actually somewhat simulated the causes and effects of traffic violence. But having it almost entirely down to how well maintained your roads are makes it pretty uninteresting. If it was much more tied to the actual design of your transport network, that could be much more interesting. But that would require so much more detailed control over your network construction than we currently have and probably not interesting to a lot of folks.
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Jun 26, 2023 19:07
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i mean it's going to cause clogs and premote the player to have detours and otherwise secondary routes to your destination, unlike CS1 where you usually want to make what amounts to road islands along your highway to avoid the backstreets from getting congested that said, while you want the no crashes mod, I want the burnout paradise mod
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Jun 26, 2023 19:11
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I think the physically simulated crashes is actually a pretty sensible addition when you considering that CS1 already had a pseudo physics calculation for how roads affected car flow. Cars accelerate and decelerate when turning and that's what made actual intersection design important. Expanding on that to make you want to consider things like safety barriers and not having hairpin turns that fling crashing cars out into oncoming traffic, makes a lot of sense I think.
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Jun 26, 2023 19:25
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Baronjutter posted:having it almost entirely down to how well maintained your roads are makes it pretty uninteresting. If it was much more tied to the actual design of your transport network, that could be much more interesting. It's possible that effects the probability of a driver losing control and they just didn't mention all the factors. But even if it doesn't, it going into a physics spin-out that can cascade onto other cars means that your road designs and congestion and elements like that will still have a direct effect on the chance that a control loss turns into a serious accident, which is something.
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Jun 26, 2023 19:31
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DLC feature, you can place bars in your Entertainment Districts but they increase traffic accidents in the radius
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Jun 26, 2023 19:32
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Looking forward to making an outside connection to export garbage and accidentally flood my city with through traffic.
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Jun 26, 2023 19:35
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I'd love to see things like the actual design problems that result in a lot of crashes factored into the game. Like yeah upgrading that busy 2 lane street through a commercial area to a 4 lane might "improve flow" but now you've got a stroad, now you have people trying to turn left to access businesses and suddenly the rate of crashes goes way up. Or maybe you have a huge straight wide road through a residential area. You plop down some signs saying you can only do 40kph here, but the road being so straight and wide encourages speeding so you have people doing 60+ and smoking pedestrians at crosswalks. But there would have to be the tools to fix those sort of problems too, like giving that street you want people driving slow on some speed humps or chicanes or pretty lane-narrowing median plantings.
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Jun 26, 2023 19:39
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The fact this stuff is being simulated makes me think that even if the base game doesn't go into that level of detail, it might be possible for a TM:PE 2 to add it. They have also mentioned wanting to have as many of the game's systems as possible open to modders to tinker with.
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Jun 26, 2023 19:42
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If it's not part of the base simulation then I hope that there's a day 1 mod which makes vehicles driving dangerously behave as physics objects while they're doing so.
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Jun 26, 2023 19:45
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Are the crashes just randomly located or will it have a model for the safety of an intersection?
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Jun 26, 2023 19:51
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Thranguy posted:Are the crashes just randomly located or will it have a model for the safety of an intersection? It's not clear what all factors go into it, but basically a car is going through a segment of road and rolls a crash die based on things (we know road maintenance and weather are two) to see if it crashes or not.
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Jun 26, 2023 19:53
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Stuff like car crashes can easily be done poorly and end up just being an annoyance people want to turn off. It's the problem with half-baked ideas that are poorly implemented. Like noise pollution being a thing sounds good, but when its poorly implemented so many people just mod it out because people living within 50m of a subway station's stairs dropping like flies from the sonic rays is idiotic. Same with car crashes, the idea is cool but its so easy to poorly implement it in a way where people just want to turn the drat mechanic off.
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Jun 26, 2023 19:57
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Since I'm a dick I'm enjoying all the breathless commentary about new features that SimCity 4 did 20 years ago, like making intersections just by dragging roads across each other.
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Jun 26, 2023 20:00
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Grand Fromage posted:It's not clear what all factors go into it, but basically a car is going through a segment of road and rolls a crash die based on things (we know road maintenance and weather are two) to see if it crashes or not. Specifically, it rolls a "lose control" chance, not an accident chance. The car is then made a physics object and given a shove to swerve it off course. If the driver can regain control without crashing, no accident will occur; if they crash into another vehicle then that'll also become a physics object and it'll all keep going until everything involved has come to a stop. Depending on how bad the physics interactions are, it might just be a minor fender bender other cars can drive around and will quickly resolve, or it might be a multi-car pile-up that requires ambulances and police. A logical result of doing it this way means that even if it's not more likely to have someone lose control in an intersection, it's much more likely for a control loss to become a major accident in one.
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Jun 26, 2023 20:19
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Thranguy posted:Are the crashes just randomly located or will it have a model for the safety of an intersection? quote:The game features traffic accidents where vehicles lose control and crash into traffic or buildings. The likelihood of an accident happening is calculated per road segment and is increased by features such as road conditions, lighting conditions, weather, and disasters. Keeping roads in good condition by using road maintenance services and having streetlights is a good way to decrease accident probability on the road. It doesn't mention intersections or traffic, oddly, but I would have to assume those could be made into factors?
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Jun 26, 2023 20:23
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People have CSI'd the dev insights video and found that buildings have probabilities of having evening or night shift workers, so it seems traffic will be affected by time and the day/night cycle isn't just cosmetic anymore.
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Jun 26, 2023 20:28
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Just replace all your roads with trams and sidewalks, problem solved
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Jun 26, 2023 20:29
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The Maroon Hawk posted:Just replace all your roads with trams and sidewalks, problem solved I liked the little bit where you could see the tram pantograph bobbing up and down as the overhead lines dipped between poles. Everywhere you look in close up shots of this game there's so much detail and life.
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Jun 26, 2023 20:33
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MikeJF posted:Everywhere you look in close up shots of this game there's so much detail and life. It started in the first game where people could and did die at places like children’s playgrounds. 
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Jun 26, 2023 20:37
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The bouncy castle filters out the weak.
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Jun 26, 2023 20:38
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MikeJF posted:I liked the little bit where you could see the tram pantograph bobbing up and down as the overhead lines dipped between poles. Everywhere you look in close up shots of this game there's so much detail and life. Wait what? Did I miss something, which video is this? This sounds delightful Also this game is going to require a super beefy CPU to handle all this simulation, isn’t it 
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Jun 26, 2023 20:47
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The Maroon Hawk posted:Wait what? Did I miss something, which video is this? This sounds delightful https://youtu.be/wgjpo2lKt7I?t=110 Another neat bit, at 0:20 it looks very much like you can have infrastructure running over buildings.
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Jun 26, 2023 20:50
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turn off the TV posted:If it's not part of the base simulation then I hope that there's a day 1 mod which makes vehicles driving dangerously behave as physics objects while they're doing so. Great news! From the dev diary: quote:When an accident check succeeds on a road segment, a vehicle on the segment is selected randomly to “lose control”. The vehicle is pushed in a random direction, gaining simple collision and physics to allow it to hit obstacles on its way. If a vehicle collides with another agent, it also gains collision and physics for the duration of the accident.
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Jun 26, 2023 20:54
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OwlFancier posted:https://youtu.be/wgjpo2lKt7I?t=110 Holy gently caress, take my money CO
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Jun 26, 2023 20:57
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