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alg posted:I think my wife and I must be whales.
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Jun 26, 2023 17:56
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CapnAndy posted:I don't think that's true, though. People kept buying it at $15. When they made $15 the floor and let it float, usage still didn't go down. People are apparently gonna buy this, either becausee they're whales who don't care or because they're once-in-a-lifetime trippers who've saved for this for years, and what's a few hundred dollars more to make sure you have the best experience? That's because he's talking about closer to the $200 Universal charges, not the sometimes $30 Disney does.
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Jun 26, 2023 17:59
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Arquinsiel posted:You need to take another step and define what "efficiency" means here, because it looks like you mean "maximum rides per person per day" whereas to Disney it means "rate of money extracted per customer per minute" and time in rides is not time in shops or getting food. I mean efficiency as in people being able to move around freely and do everything they want to do (including standing in line for food, etc) and cast members at attractions being able to get people into cars and keep riders per hour as high as possible. Obviously efficiency isn't the only thing that matters, if it was then the entire park would be one giant omnimover ride that could handle 70,000 people an hour (sounds like a great park sim game concept). But any ride system is going to have some sort of disruption that knocks efficiency that we have to be understanding of, one most people have experienced occurs when a person wants to ride an omnimover ride who must transition from a wheelchair and needs extra time to get in the vehicle, slowing the entire chain down. We can absorb these understandable variables better if we don't have don't have variables that exist primarily because of marketing. FastPass creates variables for the sake of marketing, especially since throwing "pick your ride" FPs was the company's primary way of dealing with problems it created, and those can be disruptive and very random. Compounding the issue is that FP is essentially a load balancing system and disruptions to it quickly requires it be offset by prioritizing FP return lanes over standby to an even greater extent than before. My philosophy is that operators want to keep every chair as full as possible as quickly as possible. The load balancing effect of FP isn't really felt by people working the seating and operation of an attraction because they want to seat as many people as quickly as they courteously can, the morning crush of people visiting hitting up their attraction is mostly Out There and they would optimize as best they can whether the line is fifteen or fifty minutes long. Doing so keeps Riders/Hr high and keeping that high makes visitors happy because the line is moving a few feet regularly instead of making someone wait 10 minutes in the same spot and grow irritated, and the best way to do that is to minimize the occurrence of random events to largely the ones that are necessary for everyone being able to enjoy the ride. CapnAndy posted:I don't think that's true, though. People kept buying it at $15. When they made $15 the floor and let it float, usage still didn't go down. People are apparently gonna buy this, either becausee they're whales who don't care or because they're once-in-a-lifetime trippers who've saved for this for years, and what's a few hundred dollars more to make sure you have the best experience?
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Jun 26, 2023 18:29
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Another problem with charging for "Fastpass" is that, before, attraction ops management could make the call to make the Fastpass line wait a little longer if needed, as long as they still got on faster than the standby line. It was free, and they still got on faster than standby, so there wasn't much room to complain. Now that people are paying for it, no exceptions, it MUST move fast.
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Jun 26, 2023 18:36
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CapnAndy posted:Or you're savers. Whales are the people who don't care about spending an extra $500 for a family of four to get Genie+ and ILL all week, because an extra $500 is to them what an extra $15 is to people like me; not an amount worth giving a poo poo about and I'll never miss it. Genie+ doesn't bother me but some reason ILLs do. The only time I've ever gotten an ILL for anything was for a second ride on Tron because my wife wanted to ride it at night. We only had one day in MK since we were on property at Universal so it made sense. MK is the only park where Genie+ seemed like it was worth it, but even then, I'm not really sure. I typically avoid WDW during the busiest times of the year, but certain attractions always have a long queue (Peter Pan's Flight, looking at you) and you really only get one attraction where the lines may be shorter if you don't want to watch Happily Ever After. Even then, you still have to navigate the crowds to get to another section of the park if you're not where you want to be. Pretty sure their data showed no one was using Genie+ at Epcot or AK so that's why they split it off. They figure if they cut the price by 40-50 percent at those parks, they may push adoption. The only rides you'd really need it for are Ratatouille, Frozen, and Test Track, and with the exception of a portion of Ratatouille (maybe part of test track too?), those are indoor, covered queues. With AK, it's effectively just River Journey, but so many of those queues are open air that I would consider Genie+ slightly more justifiable when it's hot and busy. I've noticed a significant increase in Express at Universal over the last year, but it's mostly deluxe resort guests since Express is an included perks. I'm convinced the reason they raised the price on the Premier AP was to price adjust the Express after 4pm on it. With the pre-2023 price, if you had a premier and did 5 days on property, that pass would nearly pay for itself just in park tickets and room and food discounts for one trip. Takes two now, but it's still not too terrible.
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Jun 26, 2023 19:05
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Aphrodite posted:Remove it from your account first, then you have nothing to worry about with it being linkable to you at all. Actually, and this is a fun tidbit, RFID tags are primarily powered by the scanner: the circuit takes in the energy of a powerful signal and then activates other hardware and/or transmits back a very weak signal using the same energy it just took in. Batteries are still needed for anything else (lights, return signals that go more than an inch or two, etc) because the amount of energy that can be re-used really is minuscule, but that's how the MagicBand scanning can be ready 24/7 without the battery being dead in a week, and it's how credit cards and the like can do tap scanning with no extra hardware. Roadie fucked around with this message at 19:42 on Jun 26, 2023 |
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Jun 26, 2023 19:38
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CapnAndy posted:And by the way, this is why I think Disney's loving up so hard and screwing themselves on Genie+. Because those two definitions of "efficiency"? Mean the same thing. To both guests and Disney, riders waiting in line are useless. They're not riding rides and they're not spending money. That's why line-skip programs exist in the first place; the business side of the park demands wait times be as low as possible too. Craptacular! posted:I mean efficiency as in people being able to move around freely and do everything they want to do (including standing in line for food, etc) and cast members at attractions being able to get people into cars and keep riders per hour as high as possible.
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Jun 26, 2023 19:59
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CapnAndy posted:Or you're savers. Whales are the people who don't care about spending an extra $500 for a family of four to get Genie+ and ILL all week, because an extra $500 is to them what an extra $15 is to people like me; not an amount worth giving a poo poo about and I'll never miss it. 
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Jun 26, 2023 22:05
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Arquinsiel posted:I think this is reductive of the experience TBH. Sometimes waiting in line is fun. All the times I've been to Paris were with friends and we had a great time just spending a week together talking poo poo and enjoying each other's company. At the other end of things, over in Universal the queue for Fast and Furious is somehow better than the ride itself. At least Disney tries to make the queues themselves inherently entertaining for the two-trip Standard Guest, and TBH it works if you aren't going more than once as an adult. Also, see below as to why they're not actually the same thing. Also I think psychologically it just feels better to be in constant forward motion, rather than the stoooooooooooooooooooooop->quick lurch forward->stop again motion that standby gives you as LLs get prioritized. Akileese posted:I typically avoid WDW during the busiest times of the year, but certain attractions always have a long queue (Peter Pan's Flight, looking at you) Roadie posted:Actually, and this is a fun tidbit, RFID tags are primarily powered by the scanner: the circuit takes in the energy of a powerful signal and then activates other hardware and/or transmits back a very weak signal using the same energy it just took in. Batteries are still needed for anything else (lights, return signals that go more than an inch or two, etc) because the amount of energy that can be re-used really is minuscule, but that's how the MagicBand scanning can be ready 24/7 without the battery being dead in a week, and it's how credit cards and the like can do tap scanning with no extra hardware.
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Jun 26, 2023 23:12
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With VQ, GotG currently moves too fast to see the preshow elements. The ramp room does have a show on the ceiling, it just seems to have long gaps between.
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Jun 26, 2023 23:38
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Aphrodite posted:With VQ, GotG currently moves too fast to see the preshow elements. Yeah I missed a lot of it the first time, mainly the opening ramp room globe bit, because the queue was moving surprisingly fast. On my second ride I got to slow down and see a lot more, and it's great. I could just sit and look at the Xandar diorama for a long time. CapnAndy posted:I mean, hey, you do you. I personally don't see why enjoying each other's company and shooting the poo poo couldn't be done in more pleasant circumstances than in line, like walking around the parks or over some food or drink, but if it makes you happy, great. And yeah, immersive queues are great. Flight of Passage and Rise of the Resistance have really good ones, and Cosmic Rewind has a great one, and they all tell stories that are intrinsic to the ride itself. They'd still be better if I wasn't standing still for ten minutes staring at one particular part of them until I was sick of it. (GotG gets the edge because it's so dynamic; whereas Flight and Rise are static scenes, GotG presents itself as an exhibit in its own right, so apart from the much too long and unchanging ramp room, the computer is always saying something different, different parts of the exhibits are lighting up, different clips are playing on the TVs.) I've been looking for an opening to complain itt about the Ratatouille queue. It's boring and hot and I hate it so much. The last time I was there we were behind a bunch of obviously buzzed college students having a great time and singing Shaggy's "It Wasn't Me" in the first indoor room. After about the fourth or fifth switchback and endless hallway of the same rat-themed red wallpaper, they were clearly losing their buzz and getting irritated and eventually they just got out of line and left. Hazo fucked around with this message at 23:50 on Jun 26, 2023 |
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Jun 26, 2023 23:44
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Hazo posted:I've been looking for an opening to complain itt about the Ratatouille queue. The only part I love is the part with Gusteau's sign hanging up and occasionally moving. The rest of it is as dull as MMRR (which is extremely sad and disappointing, at least for LL/DAS). I don't understand why it isn't like, bolt holes through walls and stuff. They could have had so much fun with it and made it suck.
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Jun 27, 2023 02:51
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Arquinsiel posted:See that's literally optimising for both outcomes at once which is not possible. From the perspective of Disney's moneymaking calculations people in rides have no value beyond being in a queue for the gift shop at the end. If anything the ride itself just serves to make that queue un-necessarily long, which is why you can just skip it on older rides and on a lot of newer stuff like Galaxy's Edge there's just stores all over and you get dumped back out of a ride wherever. There's also the mid-queue drinks stall in Smuggler's Run in Orlando at least, so you can buy stuff while you queue. If anything the new Spider-Man Webslingers idea of hitting the shop before the ride to get your ride toy means that they're acknowledging what they actually want you to do, which is spend regardless of actually getting on rides. The real tough thing to plan for is the moving around freely bit, which is why the pathways are so carefully designed to present multiple routes to any given destination and to try guide you around. Maybe I'm a bit weird because I walk into gift shops without being psychologically manipulated into doing so, but rides DID have obvious inherent value until the ticket books went away. Rides justify the admission prices going up regularly, though if the end goal was people in gift shops then charging to get on rides while lowering admission would be the most obvious course of action. quote:The fully optimised for efficiency system is probably why you see parks merch on ShopDisney these days, just sit at your computer and hit buy.
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Jun 27, 2023 04:10
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Remy's queue is objectively awful. There's one semi-good scene, the Paris rooftop, but you stay there way too long and Gusteau has a very limited amount of thing he can say, so he ends up repeating himself and it's just all around bad. MMRR is also awful, except for the bit when Goofy comes through the screen.
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Jun 27, 2023 05:12
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Havent been on the MMRR in Anaheim, but apparently the queue there is great
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Jun 27, 2023 12:49
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I have literally no memory of Remy's queue in either Paris or Orlando, outside of the floor tiles reminding me of an Italian restaurant for some reason.CapnAndy posted:I mean, hey, you do you. I personally don't see why enjoying each other's company and shooting the poo poo couldn't be done in more pleasant circumstances than in line, like walking around the parks or over some food or drink, but if it makes you happy, great. Craptacular! posted:Maybe I'm a bit weird because I walk into gift shops without being psychologically manipulated into doing so, but rides DID have obvious inherent value until the ticket books went away. Rides justify the admission prices going up regularly, though if the end goal was people in gift shops then charging to get on rides while lowering admission would be the most obvious course of action.  You've identified why Disney do it: you haven't been to the parks but you're buying the merch. That's the ideal for them: no parks costs, still get merch sales.Prices never go down, prices go up. Lowering admission hints at dropping quality even if there's no reason to believe that.
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Jun 27, 2023 13:01
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Arquinsiel posted:I have literally no memory of Remy's queue in either Paris or Orlando, outside of the floor tiles reminding me of an Italian restaurant for some reason. There is nothing memorable, other than the animated Gusteau sign.
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Jun 27, 2023 13:05
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the idea that standing in line in 95 degree heat with 1,000 people talking at the top of their lungs around you is fun is just, completely alien to me
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Jun 27, 2023 13:11
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alg posted:the idea that standing in line in 95 degree heat with 1,000 people talking at the top of their lungs around you is fun is just, completely alien to me ah but this is why I go in winter ("winter") and end up making 100 new friends every trip and just be-bopping along happily, loudly, the most agonizingly cheerful person in the world. Talk to all the people, chatter all the time, cheerfully point folks in the right direction, go live at Epcot.
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Jun 27, 2023 14:12
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Ate at Chef Mickey's for the first time last night. Despite the high price it was awesome, imo great food, and the character dining aspect was contagiously fun. My mom was dancing along to the 'make some biscuits' song though, think it played at least three times while we were there.
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Jun 27, 2023 14:54
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alg posted:the idea that standing in line in 95 degree heat with 1,000 people talking at the top of their lungs around you is fun is just, completely alien to me 
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Jun 27, 2023 15:09
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At Disneyland with our two year old. This morning we did the Carousel twice, then Casey Jr, then he played at the Toontown toddler area while my wife and I took turns doing Runaway Railway lightning line, then we went to Hungry Bear for lunch and now we're taking a break at the hotel. We definitely don't have any expectations for how many rides we're going to go on, but he seems to be doing ok. Just ignoring the meltdown when he decided he didn't want to go on Casey Jr after we had just boarded...and the meltdown when we made him leave Toontown to get lunch.
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Jun 27, 2023 22:31
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Edna Mode posted:then he played at the Toontown toddler area while my wife and I took turns doing Runaway Railway lightning line
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Jun 27, 2023 22:36
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I bet just letting him continue playing while they swapped is probably worth the ILL cost though.
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Jun 27, 2023 22:44
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Aphrodite posted:I bet just letting him continue playing while they swapped is probably worth the ILL cost though. Does Dumbo have the legendary standby line that's basically one big playroom in Disneyland too? Because, y'know, get the kid on Dumbo, and also... playground.
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Jun 27, 2023 22:49
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Yeah we know about Rider Swap it was just quicker to do lightning lane. We'll do the same thing for Rise, even one standby wait is too long. We'd like to be spending our time together even if it means we don't do many rides. Disneyland Dumbo just has a long albeit covered queue. Honestly my kid would probably not want to leave the playground if it was there!
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Jun 27, 2023 23:50
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Oh wait, does Disney rider swap just let you go wherever you want while waiting?
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Jun 28, 2023 00:49
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Aphrodite posted:Oh wait, does Disney rider swap just let you go wherever you want while waiting? Basically? I haven't used it in a long time, but they used to give you a paper fastpass and I think later it was fastpass to your band with an hour or so return time. But you as the second rider, don't wait inside the queue for the ride so theoretically you can go wherever.
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Jun 28, 2023 00:52
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As long as we're talking about bad queues lets talk about how good the Secret Life of Pets queue over at USH is. Perfectly themed with wonderful animatronics and other fun scenes (the little screens in the mail slots!) It's such an instant classic ride from start to finish.
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Jun 28, 2023 01:02
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Arquinsiel posted:You've identified why Disney do it: you haven't been to the parks but you're buying the merch. That's the ideal for them: no parks costs, still get merch sales. Well, I did buy at a mall, which as far as I can tell is stocking stuff that didn't even get picked up by the company store. But that's a small audience, and I'm honestly not normal. I'm not sure what the harm is in me buying a park stuff from a local mall or their store when there's already eBay sellers anyway. (And some of those resellers charge less than the non-AP, non-CM price so cheers to them.)
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Jun 28, 2023 08:37
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I KNEW IT! https://twitter.com/Kotaku/status/1674215938013515776?s=20
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Jun 29, 2023 02:33
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Got our Jollywood and Christmas Party tickets, hell yeah
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Jun 29, 2023 12:38
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This is a horrifying statement "by keeping Hillary’s skull and putting Trump’s skin over top of it"
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Jun 29, 2023 12:41
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alg posted:Got our Jollywood and Christmas Party tickets, hell yeah Same! I was a little thrown off by how easy it was. Normally on drop days Disney's IT is a shitshow.
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Jun 29, 2023 12:53
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mattfl posted:This is a horrifying statement Finally, a bi-partisan candidate
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Jun 29, 2023 13:17
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Braksgirl posted:Same! I was a little thrown off by how easy it was. Normally on drop days Disney's IT is a shitshow. Apparently it failed to launch correctly for resort guests so there was still some of that too.
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Jun 29, 2023 14:03
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It worked OK for us as resort guests.
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Jun 29, 2023 14:09
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Craptacular! posted:Well, I did buy at a mall, which as far as I can tell is stocking stuff that didn't even get picked up by the company store.
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Jun 29, 2023 14:21
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Very late to the party, but Rise of the Resistance is so cool! So glad I was able to keep it unspoiled.
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Jun 29, 2023 16:34
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Edna Mode posted:Very late to the party, but Rise of the Resistance is so cool! So glad I was able to keep it unspoiled.
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Jun 29, 2023 16:41
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