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The Chairman
Jun 30, 2003

But you forget, mon ami, that there is evil everywhere under the sun

guntank buff!!!

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Waffleman_
Jan 20, 2011


I don't wanna I don't wanna I don't wanna I don't wanna!!!

B-B-B-But I thought Barbatos was bad at high level play and that's why you couldn't nerf it! Think about the high level players!

E: But no no, I don't want to be mean. They deserve credit for taking about an entire year to notice a problem that people have been loudly shouting at them about since literally the first network test.

Waffleman_ fucked around with this message at 14:20 on May 26, 2023

kirbysuperstar
Nov 11, 2012

Let the fools who stand before us be destroyed by the power you and I possess.


this fuckin game

e: unless picking up health packs somehow counts but even so

e: they do and that's some bad wording

kirbysuperstar fucked around with this message at 10:22 on May 28, 2023

ninjewtsu
Oct 9, 2012

does natural regen count

Kanos
Sep 6, 2006

was there a time when speedwagon didn't get trolled

ninjewtsu posted:

does natural regen count

I haven't played since season 2 but it did not back then. Health pickups always did.

Astroniomix
Apr 24, 2015



Waffleman_ posted:

B-B-B-But I thought Barbatos was bad at high level play and that's why you couldn't nerf it! Think about the high level players!

E: But no no, I don't want to be mean. They deserve credit for taking about an entire year to notice a problem that people have been loudly shouting at them about since literally the first network test.

Part of why it took so long is that he wasn't an actual problem untill they nerfed Turn A and Marasai. Once that happened he no longer needed to play carefully around them and instead just be at full health before rushing in. The changes will be nice but won't solve the fundamental problem of people simply cannot Shoot-The-Barbra.

Astroniomix fucked around with this message at 14:31 on May 29, 2023

kirbysuperstar
Nov 11, 2012

Let the fools who stand before us be destroyed by the power you and I possess.

ninjewtsu posted:

does natural regen count

nope

ninjewtsu
Oct 9, 2012

if barbatos jumpscaring you from around a corner with the sword stun -> mace doesn't kill anymore that's like most of the problem with it gone

ninjewtsu
Oct 9, 2012

i really wish that instead of being based around stuns and kill combos barbatos just did large amounts of damage in melee so fighting it was an actual, like, fight

Vizuyos
Jun 17, 2020

Thank U for reading

If you hated it...
FUCK U and never come back

ninjewtsu posted:

i really wish that instead of being based around stuns and kill combos barbatos just did large amounts of damage in melee so fighting it was an actual, like, fight

honestly that just sounds worse

if I juke a Barbatos into missing its stun or any other part of its combo, then it's not really a threat to anyone until its moves come off cooldown

if Barbatos had no stun and just did a fuckton of regular mace-swing damage, a good Barb could probably tear entire teams to shreds at once, instead of just dumpstering one mech and leaping away every ten seconds

ninjewtsu
Oct 9, 2012

Vizuyos posted:

honestly that just sounds worse

if I juke a Barbatos into missing its stun or any other part of its combo, then it's not really a threat to anyone until its moves come off cooldown

if Barbatos had no stun and just did a fuckton of regular mace-swing damage, a good Barb could probably tear entire teams to shreds at once, instead of just dumpstering one mech and leaping away every ten seconds

yes exactly whether it kills you instantly or you put it down because it whiffed this interaction isn't interesting gameplay and that's why barbatos sucks, because its gameplay presence consists solely of this singular interaction

i would like to fight a barbatos not avoid a jumpscare then play chase the rat

ninjewtsu fucked around with this message at 00:58 on May 30, 2023

Kild
Apr 24, 2010

ninjewtsu posted:

yes exactly whether it kills you instantly or you put it down because it whiffed this interaction isn't interesting gameplay and that's why barbatos sucks, because its gameplay presence consists solely of this singular interaction

i would like to fight a barbatos not avoid a jumpscare then play chase the rat

What do you want fighting Barbatos to look like? because it sounds like you want them to just walk at you while you shoot at them and then do no damage if they reach you before they die?

RevolverDivider
Nov 12, 2016

Barbatos basically needs a rework as he's pretty much total dogshit against competent players if he can't ambush them and TF2 Spy assassinate them. He's really, really wretched in a straight up fight unless he's got ultimate up compared to pretty much the entire rest of the cast.

It's also Barb uses a gun a ton in IBO, just start over with him and give him a goddamn gun

chumbler
Mar 28, 2010

Kild posted:

What do you want fighting Barbatos to look like? because it sounds like you want them to just walk at you while you shoot at them and then do no damage if they reach you before they die?

Sounds good to me.

ninjewtsu
Oct 9, 2012

Kild posted:

What do you want fighting Barbatos to look like? because it sounds like you want them to just walk at you while you shoot at them and then do no damage if they reach you before they die?

probably something similar to fighting literally any other unit in the game

maybe they get the jump on me and cleave off half my health, i dash away and we play positioning while i try to shoot him/lure him to my friends and he either chases to stop me from doing that or backs off

so you know, like it is now except both parties do something after the initial contact rather than that being a binary win/lose for the barbatos

idk man i'm not a game designer but i can say that stun->kill combo based gameplay sucks dick so they should have done anything else. there are infinite possibilities for what else a barbatos could be and many of them are probably better than this garbage.

Vizuyos
Jun 17, 2020

Thank U for reading

If you hated it...
FUCK U and never come back

ninjewtsu posted:

probably something similar to fighting literally any other unit in the game

maybe they get the jump on me and cleave off half my health, i dash away and we play positioning while i try to shoot him/lure him to my friends and he either chases to stop me from doing that or backs off

so you know, like it is now except both parties do something after the initial contact rather than that being a binary win/lose for the barbatos

idk man i'm not a game designer but i can say that stun->kill combo based gameplay sucks dick so they should have done anything else. there are infinite possibilities for what else a barbatos could be and many of them are probably better than this garbage.

imo, Marasai is a way worse offender in terms of lovely stuns

at least a Barbatos has to get up close to stun me and then kill me before I can move. Marasai can do it from across the room

I don't think there's any way to make melee-range units both fun to play and fun to play against, though. there aren't enough dashes to really play positioning with them, and they can't afford to take more than a couple of seconds to kill enemies anyway since they're perpetually at risk of being outnumbered and overwhelmed

ninjewtsu
Oct 9, 2012

marasai's combo doesn't kill anymore tho, they have to either whittle you down first, finish you off after knocking you away with the dagger, or pull you into their teammates

marasai indeed also sucks rear end for the record

kirbysuperstar
Nov 11, 2012

Let the fools who stand before us be destroyed by the power you and I possess.
I haven't seen a single Marasai since they nerfed it lol

Iserlohn
Nov 3, 2011

Watch out!

Here comes the third tactic.
Lipstick Apathy
New Suit

https://twitter.com/gundamevolution/status/1671519059467202567?t=xZOGjiBcupgA_W8DnlnkLg&s=19

Been playing more recently. Casual games feel breezy and it feels great to get MVPs after sitting out for a few weeks. Dom's mines are fun for messing with flankers and units thinking they can get up close for the kill.

RBA Starblade
Apr 28, 2008

Going Home.

Games Idiot Court Jester

Iserlohn posted:

New Suit

https://twitter.com/gundamevolution/status/1671519059467202567?t=xZOGjiBcupgA_W8DnlnkLg&s=19

Been playing more recently. Casual games feel breezy and it feels great to get MVPs after sitting out for a few weeks. Dom's mines are fun for messing with flankers and units thinking they can get up close for the kill.

If it can't kill itself to win like in MBON what's the point

Kwolok
Jan 4, 2022

Iserlohn posted:

New Suit

https://twitter.com/gundamevolution/status/1671519059467202567?t=xZOGjiBcupgA_W8DnlnkLg&s=19

Been playing more recently. Casual games feel breezy and it feels great to get MVPs after sitting out for a few weeks. Dom's mines are fun for messing with flankers and units thinking they can get up close for the kill.

Always a good sign when even their officially made new suit reveal makes gameplay look clunky and awful.

Vizuyos
Jun 17, 2020

Thank U for reading

If you hated it...
FUCK U and never come back
the fact that their last addition was a sniper and their next addition is a melee unit is not encouraging

who thought the game needed more of either of those

chumbler
Mar 28, 2010

Don't worry, they also buffed the snipers since they were struggling.

Waffleman_
Jan 20, 2011


I don't wanna I don't wanna I don't wanna I don't wanna!!!

Also while I do appreciate that they've been willing to go outside the box for unit additions, this one feels......a bit too esoteric a pick? I feel like we could rein it back in to some of the more recognizable stuff.

Wait no that's Mr. Bushido's suit

Waffleman_ fucked around with this message at 04:44 on Jun 27, 2023

kirbysuperstar
Nov 11, 2012

Let the fools who stand before us be destroyed by the power you and I possess.

chumbler posted:

Don't worry, they also buffed the snipers since they were struggling.

I don't think that 100 extra HP is going to make them reasonably any worse

The changes to shielded/boost gauge though, warms my GM loving heart

Kevsop
Jul 20, 2011

Pork Pro
Anecdotally, matches have felt worse since the addition of dynames. My poor team mates have two functioning braincells and increasing the number of snipers from 2 per match to 4 has been miserable. They need to add some cool shooty suits that encourage people to play the actual game instead of pokey-peaky with the aim of someone who shouldn't even be playing guntank.

Groovelord Neato
Dec 6, 2014


They should add Leo looks cooler than most of the suits too.

chumbler
Mar 28, 2010

Groovelord Neato posted:

They should add Leo looks cooler than most of the suits too.

I want nothing more than Leo or Tallgeese in this. Also I noticed they removed the suit restrictions from dailies and weeklies finally. They were already ridiculous in season 4 with how many suits there were, and it's absolutely a good change.

ninjewtsu
Oct 9, 2012

if they put tallgeese in this game i would buy it and nolife a season again

Waffleman_
Jan 20, 2011


I don't wanna I don't wanna I don't wanna I don't wanna!!!

chumbler posted:

I want nothing more than Leo or Tallgeese in this. Also I noticed they removed the suit restrictions from dailies and weeklies finally. They were already ridiculous in season 4 with how many suits there were, and it's absolutely a good change.

Oh thank God.

chumbler
Mar 28, 2010

Grinding out the weeklies, I am reminded once again that casual match outcomes are basically 100% determined by which team has the better Barbatos. They really need to just completely dumpster that suit. Nobody cares about competitive gundamwatch and its win rate there.

Nehru the Damaja
May 20, 2005

Did this game ever get its poo poo together about stability/backfill/the leaver problem? I enjoyed the hell outta this game.

chumbler
Mar 28, 2010

Nehru the Damaja posted:

Did this game ever get its poo poo together about stability/backfill/the leaver problem? I enjoyed the hell outta this game.

Nope! The drops seem at least a little less frequent, though.

Kwolok
Jan 4, 2022
The game is pretty consistently below 1k players so people still playing are largely not likely to dodge lobbies.

Doubt this game will be supported past this year though

RBA Starblade
Apr 28, 2008

Going Home.

Games Idiot Court Jester

Kwolok posted:

The game is pretty consistently below 1k players so people still playing are largely not likely to dodge lobbies.

No lol people bail (or crash out) routinely still

I've stopped playing altogether at this point. The devs just don't know what they're doing

chumbler
Mar 28, 2010

It is a shame, yeah, because I mostly enjoy it when I play and I think for the most part it's gotten better balance wise (except for not getting rid of barbatos), every suit feels decent, and they've made good changes to the maps and game modes. The monetization/unlocks are still complete dogshit though, barbatos exists, and casual queue still takes a while.

Have I mentioned that I hate barbatos?

Kwolok
Jan 4, 2022

chumbler posted:

It is a shame, yeah, because I mostly enjoy it when I play and I think for the most part it's gotten better balance wise (except for not getting rid of barbatos), every suit feels decent, and they've made good changes to the maps and game modes. The monetization/unlocks are still complete dogshit though, barbatos exists, and casual queue still takes a while.

Have I mentioned that I hate barbatos?

Counter point: GM sniper exists also and sucks even more to play against.

Kevsop
Jul 20, 2011

Pork Pro
I stopped playing because battlepass grinding was annoying to deal with (somewhat fixed now) but also there are now 2 snipers and a brand new melee suit in the game and I cannot deal with a point capture mode when half my team is too busy trying to find the farthest sightline possible and refusing to move.

The sniper spiral involves some ding-dong forgetting the enemy has/is likely to have a sniper, do nothing to mitigate it, die, and then think the best and only solution is to counter-snipe when they can't aim with Pale Rider, much less a slower rof unit. It just makes it harder and harder to win games and have an enjoyable time.

Waffleman_
Jan 20, 2011


I don't wanna I don't wanna I don't wanna I don't wanna!!!

Bamco was so laser focused on making this game into an esport that they completely ignored any sort of casual audience in their design decisions

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kirbysuperstar
Nov 11, 2012

Let the fools who stand before us be destroyed by the power you and I possess.
I don't play often but the game's fun imho, especially now that HQ mode is shorter

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