(Thread IKs:
weg, Toxic Mental)
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Computer viking posted:I do enjoy Girkin's conversion from straight pro-Russian nationalist to his current seething frustration at how inept they are. Sure, I know it's because he wishes they were more competent so the invasion would go better, but I can only hope there's an element of "Jesus Christ why did I do all those crimes for these idiots". 
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Jul 3, 2023 16:31
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| # ? May 30, 2024 23:55 |
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LOL I've never seen that SadGirk before. It took me several looks to notice the girl's Wagner PMC bag 
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Jul 3, 2023 16:35
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Her face makes me feel that she caught him Igor Gawkin'.
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Jul 3, 2023 16:40
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Yesterday I watched the movie Iron Butterflies at a film festival: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt12427090/?ref_=nv_sr_srsg_0_tt_8_nm_0_q_iron%2520butterflies It's a documentary about MH17 with some artistic B&W dance/"performance" segments. I haven't followed the actual investigation too closely since it was obvious from day 1 who and how did it. So some photos of terrorists posing on the wreckage were pretty surprising (as was the psychic they dragged out to say "yes it was definitely air to air kill!"), and also the "debunking" russia came up with was also new to me. The two main points they showed in the film were "the hundreds of VK videos of the BUK driving from russia were faked" and "we did our own test with a missile and it totally disproves everything". The movie obviously doesn't buy it, but doesn't really address it either since it's more of an emotional film than hardcore investigation documentary. Has anyone seen an analysis of russia's claims here? My guess is that the videos are perfectly fine and they're trying to use stuff like wideangle lens distortion, compression artifacts and other defects to claim they're faked. As for the experiment, they say there should be butterfly-shaped holes in the skin but since there aren't (???) it must be fake, but it seems that the chances of getting a neat butterfly shaped hole would be pretty small as the fragments would have to hit the plane flat and not tumbling. E: to be clear this is just my reaction based on the short segment show in the movie, I'm curious if some nerds actually addressed this stuff in detail. mobby_6kl fucked around with this message at 17:38 on Jul 3, 2023 |
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Jul 3, 2023 16:43
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Thanks for posting that mobby! The boys are (nearly) back in town
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Jul 3, 2023 16:45
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KakerMix posted:lol the "Thanks guys!" at the end is cracking me up Please clap. Can someone make a hot dog man/Jeb mashup?
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Jul 3, 2023 16:47
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Oscar Wilde Bunch posted:Please clap. Can someone make a hot dog man/Jeb mashup? The pic of Prigozhin pointing to a map of Russia that shows that it's 100% hot dog.
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Jul 3, 2023 16:50
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Girkin (like most noted pieces of poo poo) has a single thought on anything at any time, "I could have done it better myself."
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Jul 3, 2023 16:52
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Soyjack pissgoblin is one of the funniest memes to come out of this war. Like its so perfect if it wasnt filmed in some bunker in donetsk you'd think it was staged.
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Jul 3, 2023 16:53
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zone posted:https://twitter.com/Flash_news_ua/status/1675852428485312513 Broke: this war is happening because NATO expanded into the Russian sphere Woke: this war is happening because Vladimir Putin longs to regain the Russian Empire Bespoke: this war is happening because the Byzantine church expanded into the Varangian sphere
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Jul 3, 2023 17:19
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Drone_Fragger posted:Soyjack pissgoblin is one of the funniest memes to come out of this war. Like its so perfect if it wasnt filmed in some bunker in donetsk you'd think it was staged. Crying soygozhin was the best. 
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Jul 3, 2023 17:29
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zone posted:
Beatings will continue until morale improves.
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Jul 3, 2023 17:36
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The first four letters in "Russia" spell out "USSR". Makes you think...
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Jul 3, 2023 17:42
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zone posted:Crying soygozhin was the best. hmmm   idk
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Jul 3, 2023 17:51
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The Prig Balls Website
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Jul 3, 2023 18:12
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Oof. There's been an uptick in mobiks blowing themselves up with grenades while pretending to surrender :/ I hope this isn't more widespread because it will make it much harder for mobiks to surrender in the future if the Ukrainians have to worry about suicide surrenders. Russian propaganda has them believing they'll be tortured and executed by the Ukrainians and it's fostering this behavior by the mobiks that's a lot more like imperial Japanese holdouts in WW2. What a loving waste. It's like the weakest propaganda to fall for ever and in the quickest amount of time. Embarrassing. At least the Japanese had a loving God Emperor telling them it was their heavenly duty to die for the Emperor. Mobiks in 2023 just have Prig Balls and Monke.
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Jul 3, 2023 18:31
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 That's a lot of mobiks
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Jul 3, 2023 19:13
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Sounds like the propaganda booklets worked, if anything.
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Jul 3, 2023 19:13
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How are there still so many mobiks? Have they done another round of mobilization that I missed?
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Jul 3, 2023 19:17
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Toxic Mental posted:Sounds like the propaganda booklets worked, if anything. It's less the booklets and, well. poo poo. Okay I'm gonna type up an effortpost on Russian propaganda efforts since 2010 because it is utterly batshit
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Jul 3, 2023 19:23
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burning swine posted:hmmm 
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Jul 3, 2023 19:23
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mobby_6kl posted:How are there still so many mobiks? Have they done another round of mobilization that I missed? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mq2NTvd8kYQ
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Jul 3, 2023 19:31
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mobby_6kl posted:How are there still so many mobiks? Have they done another round of mobilization that I missed? Hundred of thousands of mobiks takes a while to churn through. Even with how Russia is tossing them away into meatgrinders. Put it like this: if you believe Kyiv's numbers (which you shouldn't take at face value) the initial invasion force has been neutralized (in pure numbers), with all the 200k-300k mobilized troops still to go. They have plenty of manpower.
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Jul 3, 2023 19:40
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lmao
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Jul 3, 2023 19:44
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This but with Gonzalo Lira imho. I mean who basically looks like the original guy but with beard and hat.
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Jul 3, 2023 19:48
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So let's talk about Russian propaganda while my phone charges (and after that I'm gonna go exploring some new parks and trails since it's a beautiful day!). There's been a remarkable evolution in Russia's approach to propaganda starting from Putin's 2008 invasion of Georgia. It was refined and perfected for Putin's 2014 theft of Crimea and it continues to be demonstrated against Ukraine (and was also used in Syria) Russian propaganda in the modern era builds on the Active Measures techniques of the Soviet Union with an emphasis on obfuscation and getting targets to act in the interests of the propagandist without realizing they have done so (hello, facebook boomers). You can characterize Russian propaganda as a firehose of lies, basically gish-galloping so much bullshit at you all at once that you're overwhelmed by the sheer amount of it. It has two distinctive features: a high number of channels and messages (voenkor talking points on social media!) and an utterly shameless willingness to just throw out whatever the hell lies you feel like. It doesn't matter what you say because the goal isn't to convince or inform, it's to entertain, confuse, and overwhelm the audience such that there is no one meaningful truth that can be picked out among the sea of bullshit. Contemporary Russian propaganda has two other distinctive features: the first is that it is rapid, continuous, and repetitive. The second is that it lacks commitment to consistency. You may think that these two things run counter to traditional propaganda wisdom on influence and governmental communications and you'd have a point, but despite ignoring the traditional conventions, Russia's had a lot more success because you can think of the Soviet Union as being the place where the "post-truth society" was first created and flourished. Soviet society was antithetical to truth because truth was what the Party deemed it to be, this primed the Russian people and Russian state to be exceptionally good at exporting this to unfortunate truth-believers in the west because, what, you think someone would just go on the internet and tell lies? Just like that? Well, yeah. Exactly that. Let's dive into this a bit more and talk about those points I mentioned above, about propaganda being high volume and multichannel. I won't go into the stuff people here already know (namely, that Russian propaganda uses text, video, audio, and deepfakes disseminated through the internet and the use of troll farms, social media, etc etc). To achieve success in disseminating propaganda, the variety of sources matters: - Multiple sources are more persuasive than a single source, especially if those sources contain different arguments that point to the same conclusion - Receiving similar messages from multiple sources is more persuasive - People assume that information from multiple sources is likely to be based on differing perspectives and is thus worth greater consideration The number and volume of sources also matter: - Endorsement of a message by lots of users boosts audience trust, reliance, and confidence in the information. This often comes with little attention being paid to the credibility of those making the endorsements (hello, Jason Jay Smart and Igor Sushko!) - When audience interest is low, the persuasiveness of any given message can depend on the NUMBER of arguments made in favor of it, rather than the QUALITY of those arguments. Finally, the views of others matter: - Communication from the groups you belong to is more likely to be perceived as credible. We in this thread are not immune to this!! All of us, including myself, have been suckered by Ukrainian propaganda in the past because we are more inclined to believe it because we support Ukraine. At the risk of bringing down mod wrath for mentioning other subforums, you can also see this in the sources posted in the CSPAM thread, which we would consider very unreliable and untrustworthy (TASS, RIA Novosti, Russia24, etc) because those sources conform to the in-group that those posters belong to and thus they give it more weighted credibility vs, say, Kyiv Post. There is a direct correlation between the persuasiveness of a message and how similarly the source's views match up with the audience's. - Credibility can be SOCIAL! This means that people are more likely to perceive a source as credible if others they agree with perceive it as credible. This is the foundation of how you get echo chambers! - When the information volume is low (such as now, with the Ukrainian counteroffensive and OPSEC being very tight), audiences will tend to favor experts. When information volume is HIGH, however, audiences will be more receptive to information from others. - In online spaces, comments attacking a proponent's expertise or trustworthiness diminish credibility and decrease the likelihood that audiences will take action or internalize information based on what they have been exposed to. So what does all that have to do with Russian propaganda? Lots! First it's essential to know HOW and WHY propaganda techniques work, so that you can appreciate this: Russian propaganda is rapid, continuous, repetitive, and lacks any sort of consistent founding in reality. This means that Russian propagandists do not need to wait to check facts or verify claims, they just throw whatever bullshit they feel like out there to be "the firstest with the mostest". Russian propaganda efforts use the lack of reality consistence to get the jump on pushing their narratives into the information space because they, like all fascists, are not beholden to truth (and as stated before, with Russian propaganda, there is literally no source of truth in the sense that what is "true" one hour may be decreed as fake the next, see: Prigozhin coup. This allows them to be remarkably responsive and nimble, often broadcasting the first “news” of events (and, with similar frequency, the first news of nonevents, or things that have not actually happened). They will also repeat and recycle disinformation. This repetition is important because repeated exposure to a statement increases its acceptance as true. The illusory truth effect is well documented, where people rate statements as more truthful, valid, and believable when they've encountered those statements previously vs when they are first encountered. When people are less interested in a topic, they are more likely to accept familiarity brought about by repetition as an indicator that the information is correct. When processing information, audiences will save time and energy by using a frequency heuristic, favoring information they have heard more frequently. Even with bullshit and urban legends, those who hear them multiple times are more likely to believe that they are true. If an individual is already familiar with an argument or claim, they process it less carefully and often fail to discriminate weak arguments from strong ones. This is where Russian propaganda has an advantage due to the above mentioned agility and lack of commitment to any kind of truth. Russia also uses fiction and media to help mold and shape the populace into being receptive to their OWN propaganda. I will end this already very long post with this link to a great article showing how Russian fiction was used to help prime the mobiks currently fighting in Ukraine. A few excerpts: quote:Since 2009, Russia has seen an explosion of books in the fantasy genre focused on the topic of a war with Ukraine, as well as purportedly «historical» literature and general nonfiction titles discussing the «collapse of the Ukraine project» and mocking the independence of the «nonexistent» Ukrainian people and the «artificial» nature of the Ukrainian language. quote:Russians and Ukrainians have always lived together as friends. The West’s foremost desire has always been to drive a wedge between the Slav brothers. It found its willing agents from among the ranks of the disgruntled, and paid them handsomely. Their efforts met with success in Ukraine but not in Russia. Ukraine Is Russia lays out how creeping revolutions unfolded in our countries and what effects the CIA handiwork had on the bystanding population and the members of the fifth column. The readers will find everything they wanted but could not find in previous books: The above is an example of one such book. If you read enough of these as a young adult it's going to make it easier for you to accept the Ukro-globo-homonazi narrative and other such bullshit, because it's been passively rotting your brain since 2009. https://chytomo.com/en/fifty-propaganda-books-against-ukraine-and-incitement-to-hatred-against-ukrainians-from-russian-publishers/ Anyway, this post kind of got away from me, but that's the ADHD for ya. Hope it's useful anyway!
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Jul 3, 2023 19:49
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It's how creationism works too, and I wonder if the mindsets feed into eachother.
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Jul 3, 2023 19:56
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too big to be a smilie  if you can get it to 90x25 px then i'll buy it as :prigballs: or whatever the thread comes up with that's funnier
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Jul 3, 2023 20:00
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HonorableTB posted:too big to be a smilie I think I can work with that. Any suggestions for modification? (it's actually Putin but I mean who'd notice)
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Jul 3, 2023 20:04
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HonorableTB posted:Anyway, this post kind of got away from me, but that's the ADHD for ya. Hope it's useful anyway! If anything it should be expanded and published somewhere where it can reach. wider audience and be properly shared and cited. Substack, Medium, or Forbes are all decent-ish platforms to reach an audience. At least two of those actually suck, but they're out there. If anyone knows any actually good platforms, please share.
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Jul 3, 2023 20:07
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https://twitter.com/Maks_NAFO_FELLA/status/1675906168114360329 Spokesman for the AFU, Colonel Cherevaty, mentioned that in the Eastern area of responsibility, 180,000 Russians have been accumulated, of which 50,000 are present on the Bakhmut front and approx. 120,000 in the Kupiansk-Lyman direction.
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Jul 3, 2023 20:12
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Scarodactyl posted:It's how creationism works too, and I wonder if the mindsets feed into eachother. creationism works very differently really, a lot of those sorts of basely irrational explanations fill themselves in on spots where there is not sufficient evidence to say for sure. the whole "evolution is just a THEORY" thing is more true than we would like to admit, the more you study biology the more uncomfortable edge cases come up with it, like every other scientific law we know of. that doesn't mean it's not true in the general sense of course. combustion laws have the same problem wherein there are certain exotic states of matter that don't respect it nicely (like plasma), but that doesn't mean combustion isn't real. propaganda spread works very differently because the opinions that are instilled by propaganda are never intended to last a long time. sure, certain principles may be repeated over a long period - see the soviets' almost ad-nauseum use of "beware western decadence!" over the existence of the state - but the point is when propaganda is no longer actively transmitted, the opinions instilled by the programming tend to fade and be replaced relatively quickly. long term rational aberrations like young earth creationism prey on an entirely different part of the human psyche. it's one that lights up when you know something others don't. this is legitimately something that we can trace back to an evolutionary pressure: men, as the quintessential hunters in paleo lifestyles, had status in their group and sexual rewards determined primarily by their ability to bring back meat. consequently, knowing where the secret animal watering hole rested was a stupendous thing. you could buy favors in the tribe, maybe score a seduction or two. huge for your overall "success" as an organism. women, as the quintessential gatherers, are not immune either, since knowing where the hidden tuber copse is will let you barter for status in the tribe as well. extra meals for your kids are also hugely attractive to both sexes. this also explains flat earthism and other trivially disproven conspiracy theories. it's a known bug in human reasoning that god, or whoever, labeled "won't fix". propaganda procedures manipulate social hierarchy norms, a completely different lever.
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Jul 3, 2023 20:14
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HonorableTB posted:- What a brown coup looks like I think Putin is very familiar with that
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Jul 3, 2023 20:16
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Coolguye posted:creationism works very differently really, a lot of those sorts of basely irrational explanations fill themselves in on spots where there is not sufficient evidence to say for sure. the whole "evolution is just a THEORY" thing is more true than we would like to admit, the more you study biology the more uncomfortable edge cases come up with it, like every other scientific law we know of. that doesn't mean it's not true in the general sense of course. combustion laws have the same problem wherein there are certain exotic states of matter that don't respect it nicely (like plasma), but that doesn't mean combustion isn't real. For some reason this specifically brought to mind general anesthetic and that we STILL have no idea how or why general anesthesia works. We just know it does, and we know how to more or less keep it from killing you. But the methods by which it work have several theories but none with more evidence to show than a big ol' ???? and that's something that's in common use every single day around the world. It's quite scary to think that we rely on something so important and have so little idea about how it works on the human body as you're about to undergo a surgery.
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Jul 3, 2023 20:17
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Coolguye posted:the whole "evolution is just a THEORY" thing is more true than we would like to admit
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Jul 3, 2023 20:23
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EorayMel posted:I think Putin is very familiar with that when you get to that point of incontinence, it's more greenish - tan. source: having to care for an elderly great-grandparent.
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Jul 3, 2023 20:26
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as far as scientific theories go evolution is pretty great and has such massive explanatory power it's a little bit ridiculous to try to undermine it by calling it such like what's the alternative? change doesn't happen over time? ok sure
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Jul 3, 2023 20:28
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HonorableTB posted:For some reason this specifically brought to mind general anesthetic and that we STILL have no idea how or why general anesthesia works. We just know it does, and we know how to more or less keep it from killing you. But the methods by which it work have several theories but none with more evidence to show than a big ol' ???? and that's something that's in common use every single day around the world. It's quite scary to think that we rely on something so important and have so little idea about how it works on the human body as you're about to undergo a surgery. I comfort myself on this topic by remembering that canned food was merrily saving people from famine and food poisoning for close to a century before anyone came up with the germ theory that explained why it worked
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Jul 3, 2023 20:30
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HonorableTB posted:For some reason this specifically brought to mind general anesthetic and that we STILL have no idea how or why general anesthesia works. We just know it does, and we know how to more or less keep it from killing you. But the methods by which it work have several theories but none with more evidence to show than a big ol' ???? and that's something that's in common use every single day around the world. It's quite scary to think that we rely on something so important and have so little idea about how it works on the human body as you're about to undergo a surgery. Psychopharmacology isn't much better. Half the pharmaceutical therapies work, but doctors and researchers have zero idea how they work beyond hazy theories. This isn't helped by the fact that we're a long way from completely understanding the brain in all its aspects, on top of that. For lithium alone, there's a small handful of theories as to how it could work as a mood stabilizer, and none of those have managed to isolate a specific receptor pathway or pharmacologic interaction. The side effects and dangers are, on the flip side, much better documented.
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Jul 3, 2023 20:31
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| # ? May 30, 2024 23:55 |
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Mozi posted:as far as scientific theories go evolution is pretty great and has such massive explanatory power it's a little bit ridiculous to try to undermine it by calling it such Lamarque’s cultural evolutionary theories are the main opposition. They actually do a better job of explaining the weird edge cases of Darwinian evolution if you can ignore the massive general cases where it is provably incorrect
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Jul 3, 2023 20:31
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