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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:- It is blowing my mind that there are multiple people in this thread who think the show is writing Olivia Colman's character as a hero. Nick Fury’s been a real rear end in a top hat this whole series so far and while they’ve been having Talos (and his skrull wife) yell at him with legit criticism, I don’t really think they’re pulling off a “morally gray protagonist” angle very well. It’s very hands-off. Edit: Oh yeah, Nick also held the guy’s son by gunpoint which made me feel icky too. I thought the writers could have come up with a smarter plan than that. It’s entirely uninteresting. JazzFlight fucked around with this message at 00:50 on Jul 6, 2023 |
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Jul 6, 2023 00:45
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JazzFlight posted:…but the show has our protagonist in this episode shoot a guy in the knee and then the other hero shoots the guy in the chest. I think it’s been pretty pro-torture as long as it’s against terrorists in the “24 Jack Bauer” fashion. The entire show has been very obviously portraying Fury as burned out and screwing up constantly. Every episode has had a major disaster caused by Fury losing it and being an rear end in a top hat who refuses to listen or accept blame. Talos also gets violent and loses control when his daughter is involved. Shooting the guy explicitly prevents him from telling them the information they need. It is not a successful interrogation. They eventually get the code without torture and did not need to do it.
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Jul 6, 2023 00:48
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I don’t think this show is some brilliant dissection of Nick Fury’s character and if that’s what they’re aiming to do, they’ve seriously screwed up. It’s been making me hate him and wonder why this idiot was so highly regarded in the MCU before this point.
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Jul 6, 2023 00:52
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JazzFlight posted:I don’t think this show is some brilliant dissection of Nick Fury’s character and if that’s what they’re aiming to do, they’ve seriously screwed up. It’s been making me hate him and wonder why this idiot was so highly regarded in the MCU before this point. That is the point. Fury is supposed to be washed up and you are supposed to hate him. He is a jerk to Talos constantly and has literally screwed up their missions because of his pride and lack of trust in every single episode. He is extremely unsympathetic. The A plot for literally every single episode so far has been "things go bad because Fury wasn't prepared/too proud/washed up/not listening and being a jerk." This is giving me extreme flashbacks to when people were upset and asking, "Why are they making Walt evil for no reason all of a sudden?" during season 4 of Breaking Bad. Edit: The show is not subtle about it either. It is sledgehammering the audience by having characters basically explicitly say, "This is your fault Nick Fury. You are not as good as you once were and your character flaws are endangering everyone around you. Your character arc needs to result in personal change if you are going to successfully resolve the plot." in every episode. Talos is very explicitly the most sympathetic character and Fury just randomly abuses him in over-the-top ways for no reason to really hammer home that he is not a good person right now. Leon Trotsky 2012 fucked around with this message at 01:02 on Jul 6, 2023 |
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Jul 6, 2023 00:57
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The stuff with the guy and his son was confusing. Had they replaced the human kid with his Skrull kid or was he just really deep cover?
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Jul 6, 2023 01:00
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Talos is very explicitly the most sympathetic character and Fury just randomly abuses him in over-the-top ways for no reason to really hammer home that he is not a good person right now. Eh I don't know about that. Talos is basically just Fury. He also loves torturing and killing and loving everything up. Every Skrull he comes across tells him how much of a fuckup he is including his own daughter. The overall story is basically 2 old dudes loving up, repeatedly
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Jul 6, 2023 01:04
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koolkal posted:Eh I don't know about that. Talos is basically just Fury. He also loves torturing and killing and loving everything up. Every Skrull he comes across tells him how much of a fuckup he is including his own daughter. Talos does not love torturing. The entire second episode was about how much he hates killing and violence. He has an extended scene where he mopes that Fury shot the guy who was strangling him to death because he wanted to resolve it peacefully. The only times he gets violent are when his daughter is threatened. This is explicit in the text of the show and not even subtext. All the Skrulls that call him a failure call him that for being too weak, conciliatory, and compassionate at the expense of their species.
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Jul 6, 2023 01:07
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Talos does not love torturing. The entire second episode was about how much he hates killing and violence. He has an extended scene where he mopes that Fury shot the guy who was strangling him to death because he wanted to resolve it peacefully. The only times he gets violent are when his daughter is threatened. This is explicit in the text of the show and not even subtext. He straight up executes a prisoner. That's war criminal levels of killing lmao And the first episode has him just start beating on a dude that's already held at gunpoint!
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Jul 6, 2023 01:17
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Heh - I just found out why I thought I recognised Charlayne Woodard, who plays Fury's Skrull wife. She also played Sam Jackson's mother in Unbreakable and Glass.
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Jul 6, 2023 01:18
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I get that Fury being an incompetent rear end in a top hat is the point. It's just not what I wanted to see out of a whole show about Nick Fury. Imagine going to a Spider Man where he doesn't shoot webs, crawl walls, or talk poo poo?
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Jul 6, 2023 01:18
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It's been 15 years. "It's not like it is in the comics" is not a valid criticism of the MCU anymore.
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Jul 6, 2023 01:27
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live with fruit posted:It's been 15 years. "It's not like it is in the comics" is not a valid criticism of the MCU anymore. This is silly. Marvel Comics have been around since literally World War 2. The MCU kept having Stan Lee do cameos until he died, because he was freaking old. There's a lot of, let's say cultural baggage, behind the franchise.
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Jul 6, 2023 01:35
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live with fruit posted:It's been 15 years. "It's not like it is in the comics" is not a valid criticism of the MCU anymore.
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Jul 6, 2023 01:36
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Rappaport posted:This is silly. Marvel Comics have been around since literally World War 2. The MCU kept having Stan Lee do cameos until he died, because he was freaking old. There's a lot of, let's say cultural baggage, behind the franchise. And some characters have changed a lot. The MCU is just another version of the story. LividLiquid posted:Are you talking to me here? As a jumping off point.
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Jul 6, 2023 02:13
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live with fruit posted:Is his plan to destroy the planet or just to eradicate humans? Eradicate humans, but its explicitly stated in the first episode Skrulls aren't affected by radiation, and by extension neither is their native produce. Thats why they are chilling in Chernobyl. If they irradiate the Earth, humans dies and Skrulls inherit. No word on what the denizens of New Asgard think about this plan yet, or if any Skrull has accounted for eliminating their primary source of income (tourism).
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Jul 6, 2023 02:17
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live with fruit posted:And some characters have changed a lot. The MCU is just another version of the story. I've never read a single comic with Nick Fury in it aside from the original Ultimates trade, which I hated, so what I wanted out of a Nick Fury show was actually seeing him being an incredible spy and/or head of a spy agency. The idea of "what if Nick Fury wasn't a great spy anymore" would've meant a gently caress if we'd ever actually seen him be one. But we haven't. We're told he is. Even if we just flashed back to when he was an incredible spy or head of S.H.I.E.L.D. in this show a few times, that would sell the whole "look how far he's fallen" thing rather a lot better than what they've done, which is so obtuse that there isn't even a consensus on that even being the tack the show is even taking.
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Jul 6, 2023 02:36
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live with fruit posted:And some characters have changed a lot. The MCU is just another version of the story. Sure, but your specific complaint was that we were not permitted to critique a version of the story based on what has been in the comic books before, because it's been 15 years. I contend that that is a silly view-point. They re-vamped Thanos, for example, and I guess bringing Mistress Death into the MCU at that point would've been difficult, but it still fundamentally alters his character from nihilist supreme to an eco-terrorist. If we can't discuss the merits of both versions, as you put it, then what is the point? Similarly, if they make von DOOM into something other than Reed Richards's old dorm-mate and ruler of Latveria, I will complain, even if it has been 15 years and it's just another version of that story. von DOOM, and Reed, are iconic Marvel characters spanning back way further than 15 years, and it should not be a surprise to anyone that they have fans who have certain expectations. If you think those expectations are out of date, since it has been 15 years, OK, but other people will not agree with your assessment.
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Jul 6, 2023 02:38
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Oof. This is feeling like a show that nobody wanted to make. An obligation-filming, like Kenobi / Book of Boba, or Mac and Devin Go to High School. I wonder if that's actually the case, or whether there were the bones of a good show here but rewrites - and changes due to changes in other upcoming MCU thingies - scuppered what potential it had. Whoever here said something like "Why would I want to watch a show about Nick Fury being incompetent and a douche?" - Yeah mate, me too. 
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Jul 6, 2023 03:01
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No way Gi'ah is dead, mostly due to you don't kill your biggest new star in episode 3, and that the trailer for the series shows her in scenes that haven't happened yet. I realized the biggest problem is that Ben Mendelssohn isn't in every scene, when he's in it, its going to be good. Also Gravik poo poo talking Churchill was great.
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Jul 6, 2023 03:06
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I have no idea why Nick Fury holding some random human kid hostage worked to disarm a skrull impersonator. Are they saying when a skrull gets the memories, they also get the sentiment? Mendelssohn is the only thing keeping my interest at this point. I was never a fan of Fury, comics or movies, but he's downright repellent in this series so far.
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Jul 6, 2023 04:17
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swickles posted:No word on what the denizens of New Asgard think about this plan yet, or if any Skrull has accounted for eliminating their primary source of income (tourism). Same reason no one has said “Gravik, Carol Danvers is from Earth, do we have a plan in case she takes any of this extermination of humans poo poo personally?” I mean, that better be one hell of a Super-Skrull machine. Hell, if it makes them tough enough to stand up to Carol? Forget crappy-rear end Earth, take over the Kree homeworld. What did Carol do after she stopped the Kree War, actually? The show flat out says Fury and Danvers were going to find another planet, and Fury can’t travel faster than light and breathe in vacuum. Fury screwed up with r/relationships drama, okay, but it feels like we should know why Carol didn’t handle this.
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Jul 6, 2023 04:38
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Man, this show is just...bad at spycraft, bad at cleaning, bad at existential threats. I mean, who shoots down an airliner with giant UNITED NATIONS on the side with a nuke? Also, did the entire budget pay for Samuel L. Jackson's fake eye and Skoda's? It looks really cheap, especially when the event that killed 2,000 civilians looked like a weekend cultural affair in the park with a few dozen people.
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Jul 6, 2023 05:00
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Three episodes in and nothing has really happened. They are building up to... super skrull vs skrull war machine? IDGI this all could have happened in one episode. twistedmentat posted:is dead, mostly due to you don't kill your biggest new star in episode 3, and that the trailer for the series shows her in scenes that haven't happened yet. Don't watch the first three episodes of Silo if you feel that way 
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Jul 6, 2023 05:31
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Parkingtigers posted:It also featured the worst submarine set ever, and a two key launch system where the keys are both turnable by a single person. So loving bad. Ninurta posted:Man, this show is just...bad at spycraft, bad at cleaning, bad at existential threats. I mean, who shoots down an airliner with giant UNITED NATIONS on the side with a nuke? but they didn't so what was the point dingo with a joint posted:An obligation-filming, like Kenobi / Book of Boba Like this show has a lot of dumb writing and talking but at least it's got a couple of decent actors in it. BOBF was entirely coasting on "what if Boba Fett, (the famous star war), but on your TV?? airing live from The Volume"
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Jul 6, 2023 06:48
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Ninurta posted:It looks really cheap, especially when the event that killed 2,000 civilians looked like a weekend cultural affair in the park with a few dozen people. Killed 2000 people, but Fury and everyone were walking around fine afterwards. If they'd said this was one of a dozen bombings, it would make sense, but that would require 
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Jul 6, 2023 06:59
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Boba Fett had the train heist and a good Mando episode though.Megillah Gorilla posted:Killed 2000 people, but Fury and everyone were walking around fine afterwards. Wasn't it meant to be a dirty bomb too?
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Jul 6, 2023 07:24
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I don't see why it's incumbent on us to find the Skrulls a homeworld when humans are like the galactic version of Sentinel Islanders. Tell them they can have Mars but they're in charge of the details. They're a space empire, they'll figure something out.
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Jul 6, 2023 08:41
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The best scene so far was the alien shapeshifting reptile man tucking into a Full English because it reminded me of the mundane things you'd get in a Doomlord story (a creepy alien dude sent to judge and kill humanity but instead liked it here and preferred to chill out watching soaps with his landlady and her son).
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Jul 6, 2023 10:15
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Fozzy The Bear posted:Three episodes in and nothing has really happened. They are building up to... super skrull vs skrull war machine? I think that is a major problem with any kind of serialized TV these days, things that could take a single episode take 3. Strange New Worlds shows you can do a complete story in about an hour with just about everything. There's a concept I call "showing the drive" which a tv show feels the need to show how everything happened, how did they get across town? When did they eat?; and so on. There are things you don't need to see, and people shouldn't be such pendants to go "how did he go from new york to london?" in a world where air travel exists. These shows seem to need to show everything. Ya, two people driving somewhere is a good place to have some dialog, but they keep doing it. Eventually we're gonna see Fury get his mojo back and he's gonna put on the eyepatch and you know poo poo's going to go down, but its going to be like the second last episode. This should have been episode 2 and ended with that. Also how the hell is an old man going to fight Super Skrulls? Have they been hiding that Carol and Shang-Chi are gonna show up on the show? Or is this going to be one of those things where someones passionate speech will fix things? I think one of the fustrating things is that Secret Invasion, the comics, was this massive, huge event that involved everyone, but here they are trying to do something on a similar scale, but with an extremely small cast of characters, most of them being new. This should have been an film. I've heard Silo starts off strong but drops real fast.
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Jul 6, 2023 18:39
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twistedmentat posted:I think one of the fustrating things is that Secret Invasion, the comics, was this massive, huge event that involved everyone, but here they are trying to do something on a similar scale, but with an extremely small cast of characters, most of them being new. This should have been an film. It was a huge event that involved everyone, that is true. It's just you also got the bad part of that in the comic where the main event itself was quite poo poo, the best stuff happened in side comics (that if you were reading in isolation from the big event stuff, suddenly got interrupted by the event stuff) and it just devolved into a big brawl with an accompanying meaningless death and a lead in to the next status quo for the next year like they always do, which is kinda the comics equivalent of the big blue laser into the sky the movies often devolve into. I think a TV show is the ideal canvas for a Secret Invasion thing, like basically just a compressed Battlestar Galactica could have been the template. Or something with that slightly psychedelic sci-fi style the old comics used to have, in the vein of the Prisoner but in a modern setting (they would never do something like this, I know). Whatever they did, they just should have had done something with Nick Fury and the Skrulls just a little bit before this show started. As for how Nick Fury could potentially fight Super Skrulls? Well he could just pull out a big gun like the one Coulson shot Loki with but even bigger. They're running out of time for the Samuel L Jackson Nick Fury to ride a hover bike through a wall and jump off it while firing laser pistols in each hand for sure. thebardyspoon fucked around with this message at 19:16 on Jul 6, 2023 |
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Jul 6, 2023 19:00
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twistedmentat posted:I've heard Silo starts off strong but drops real fast. It picks up during the last few episodes. The main problem is (spoilers for the first episode) that it kills the main characters in the first episode. And the replacement spends most of the season being infuriatingly unlikable.
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Jul 6, 2023 19:07
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LividLiquid posted:I get that Fury being an incompetent rear end in a top hat is the point. It's just not what I wanted to see out of a whole show about Nick Fury. Presumably this whole show is a 24-style version of How Nicky Got His Groove Back. Bonus points if Nick has to gently caress and/or kill somebody played by Taye Diggs.
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Jul 6, 2023 19:14
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:That is the point. Fury is supposed to be washed up and you are supposed to hate him. Finally, an inspiring superhero story.
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Jul 6, 2023 19:18
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Oasx posted:It picks up during the last few episodes.
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Jul 6, 2023 23:18
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Everyone posted:Presumably this whole show is a 24-style version of How Nicky Got His Groove Back. Bonus points if Nick has to gently caress and/or kill somebody played by Taye Diggs. One Bond or Indiana Jones-style fun prelude of him being awesome (in or out of flashback, say, to before the blip) before the plot beings proper and we see him actually be the person he no longer is, and this would all mean something.
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Jul 6, 2023 23:41
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How is Nick Fury gonna battle a super skrull? Im guessing there's gonna be a battle between 2 super skrulls, the good one(Talos or Gi'ah) wins by beating gravik, then sacrifices themselves to destroy the machine and end the super skrull program.
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Jul 7, 2023 00:01
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He's gonna pull out his eye and reveal its a secret syringe and inject himself with Da Serum and punch someone
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Jul 7, 2023 00:11
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StrugglingHoneybun posted:How is Nick Fury gonna battle a super skrull? Im guessing there's gonna be a battle between 2 super skrulls, the good one(Talos or Gi'ah) wins by beating gravik, then sacrifices themselves to destroy the machine and end the super skrull program. I would assume a lot of Skrulls die and/or become friendly but Gravik and the leftovers escape to space for season 2.
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Jul 7, 2023 00:16
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It all happens at the same time that Captain Marvel shows up in New Jersey. She just pops over to England, kills Gravik and we're off to The Marvels.
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Jul 7, 2023 00:47
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live with fruit posted:It all happens at the same time that Captain Marvel shows up in New Jersey. She just pops over to England, kills Gravik and we're off to The Marvels. The Marvels being slated to come out after this show, and having promotional stuff like trailers already out for it, make this show so much worse.
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Jul 7, 2023 00:52
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