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One of my nearby theaters has been showing Studio Ghibli movies recently, and I took the opportunity to see Nausicaä of the Valley of the Wind yesterday afternoon and Laputa: Castle in the Sky this evening. - Goddamn, Squaresoft really copied off Miyazaki's homework on the aesthetics, didn't they? Right down to the chocobos! If you're gonna steal, steal from the best. - Speaking of, the robot doing a sequence from the first Terminator film upon waking up was pretty sick. I'm less confident that elements of Laputa's design are derived from The Empire Strikes Back, but it seems likely, especially some bits with Pazu when he's hanging from the underside of the castle. - I wonder when they stopped doing the "zoom-in" shots in their films; there are a few in Nausicaä and at least one in Laputa, and they all look really goofy. - Jesus Christ the body count in Laputa is high given how much more geared toward young kids it seems compared to Nausicaä (which feels more like it's geared to preteens or teenagers). They don't dwell on the mass death at all, but dang. - I was curious and looked up some critic rankings of these films, and they consistently put Laputa ahead of Nausicaä. I agree that it has the advantage on humor, world design, and scope, but I just loved the story and emotional intensity of Nausicaä and personally preferred it. Nausicaä's desperation to keep the baby Ohm out of the lake of acid, even after being shot, even as a herd stampedes toward them, even as her own foot is burning, was such a powerful moment to me.
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Jul 11, 2023 03:02
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Interesting you mention world design; I always felt like the world of Nausicaa felt a lot richer and more interesting. The visual design in Laputa's world is amazing but in a slightly style over substance way. Since Nausicaa was drawn from Miyazaki's much longer-form manga series there's a lot more to draw from though. Personally I prefer Laputa as a movie though; it's just a lot of fun but simultaneously spectacular, whereas Nausicaa is a bit ponderous and not always in a meaningful way. And not just Squaresoft copied Miyazaki, lol. I've been wondering how to articulate this, but I've... weirdly kind of soured on Miyazaki's stuff, not because it isn't amazingly done, but just that it's been so completely overwhelmingly influential for a couple of generations of artists and we are so utterly saturated with Ghibli-derivative designs these days.
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Jul 11, 2023 03:13
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Pixeltendo posted:I can see it gently caress, I haven't put poo poo in speech yet!
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Jul 11, 2023 03:35
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Castle in the Sky is the one Miyazaki directed movie I don’t really like. The villain is just a bad guy. Usually Miyazaki movies have the villains be more complicated.
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Jul 11, 2023 03:40
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I kind of hate Laputa for how casual the ending is. Sheeta being chased by the dude with a pistol is amazing, but everything being wrapped up so cleanly afterwards was deflating.
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Jul 11, 2023 04:24
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Ccs posted:Castle in the Sky is the one Miyazaki directed movie I don’t really like. The villain is just a bad guy. Usually Miyazaki movies have the villains be more complicated.
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Jul 11, 2023 04:26
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Yeah, Castle in the Sky’s villain feels very real. Half the time in Ghibli movies the villain will act like a villain the entire time but then say one thing at the very end where you’re like “oh I guess they weren’t so bad”. Muska (heh, the name) is just a real dickwad who sucks and it works very well for the story.
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Jul 11, 2023 04:30
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mycot posted:The (human) main character's design in Mars Needs Moms needs to be seen to be believed. that is Sid the sloth if he were human
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Jul 11, 2023 06:14
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mycot posted:The (human) main character's design in Mars Needs Moms needs to be seen to be believed. Heavy rain remade??
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Jul 11, 2023 06:32
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The only good to come out of Mars Needs Moms was that it did so badly that they canceled the remake of Yellow Submarine that Zemekis was threatening to do. (I say this as someone who loved Polar Express and Beowulf despite many… weird choices)
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Jul 11, 2023 06:34
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I wish we got that Yellow Submarine Zemeckis movie.
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Jul 11, 2023 07:08
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surf rock posted:
Games continuously look to Mononoke in particular for anything regarding magical forests under attack by black gooey industrialization or horse riding heroes with a hosed up arm like Zelda Tears of the Kingdom. This game that was announced recently is so on the nose that they just decided to combine the wolf and the deer spirit into one character. https://twitter.com/nomadastudiobcn/status/1661470245100613632?s=20 Breath of the Wild and Tears of the Kingdom feel like a nice mix of both Laputa and Mononoke. Moss covered robots, floating ruins, forest children, and creepy human/deer hybrids. Sourdough Sam fucked around with this message at 07:45 on Jul 11, 2023 |
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Jul 11, 2023 07:37
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Watched to animated movies: Nimona Nice to see a movie where the morale is that sometimes it's not enough to change the person on top but maybe the entire system is rotten. I also liked how the flashback raised even more questions It made Nimona's origin even more confusing. She's definitely not human, only pretending to be sometimes. But the movie doesn't say exactly what she is. Did Gloreth really vanquish Nimona as an adult or is it all just an exaggeration of what happened when they were kids? The Fantastic Mr. Fox I really liked how the movie really leaned into the weirdness of the situation. Animals behaving like humans is weird? Let's make it weirder by giving them jobs and establish that there is animals that behave like animals. Talking animals is weird? Let's make it weirder by establishing that humans and animals can understand each other. The puppets are weird? Let's make it weirder by giving them fur that ripples unnaturally and focus on their weird facial expression.
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Jul 11, 2023 09:38
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Macaluso posted:Butt Ugly Martians looks better. Mars Needs Moms was part of that horrible weird motion capture era of animation that consisted of like Polar Express, A Christmas Carol and Tintin (people seem to go to bat for Tintin but I don't get it, I think that movie is so ugly). And now I'm wondering if Butt Ugly Martians started out as someone calling the renders butt-ugly and they decided to roll with it. I have a soft spot for that show. The entire premise is literally about blowing off work and lying to your lovely imperialist boss about it.
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Jul 11, 2023 10:57
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Ghost Leviathan posted:And now I'm wondering if Butt Ugly Martians started out as someone calling the renders butt-ugly and they decided to roll with it. We don′t really want a war / I just want a hoverboard / We don't want to conquer Earth / I just want to fill my GIRTH The theme song is more relatable as an adult.
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Jul 11, 2023 12:28
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The Great Burrito posted:The only good to come out of Mars Needs Moms was that it did so badly that they canceled the remake of Yellow Submarine that Zemekis was threatening to do. (I say this as someone who loved Polar Express and Beowulf despite many… weird choices) I liked Beowulf. Definitely ugly, but to its benefit imo.
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Jul 11, 2023 15:14
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Ccs posted:Castle in the Sky is the one Miyazaki directed movie I don’t really like. The villain is just a bad guy. Usually Miyazaki movies have the villains be more complicated. Castle is probably my 3rd or 4th favorite, but I can't complain whenever Mark Hamill's the villain.
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Jul 11, 2023 16:27
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Every so often the universe conspires to remind me that Welcome To Marwen was a film that existed. Thanks Zemeckis!
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Jul 11, 2023 17:04
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Nightmare Cinema posted:Castle is probably my 3rd or 4th favorite, but I can't complain whenever Mark Hamill's the villain. Honestly I think Hamill's better at playing villains than he is protagonists Larryb fucked around with this message at 06:07 on Jul 12, 2023 |
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Jul 11, 2023 20:15
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Bananaquiter posted:Was the flashback the totality of the history between the town/Gloreth and Nimona? Because they made a big deal about the monster breathing fire, and Nimora coincidentally breathing fire, and that never even happened. For the town to base its whole existence on this one incident and for Nimora to hold a 1,000 year grudge seems like an overreaction on both sides. yeah I know it's not meant to be taken literally, but still Sivart13 posted:I did find this part lacking, it's hard to draw a direct line between what happened in the village and full armor Gloreth statue in the center of town. Either the myth of Gloreth got big-time distorted in 1000 years, or there's a years-long monster war in there that's hard to visualize. The bigots in this film that directly looks you in the face and says "I am a Trans allegory" do not need to be proportionally wronged by the person they then go on to vilify for the film to make sense. gently caress's sake.
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Jul 11, 2023 22:15
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*Confusedly watches Roots* hang on a second, White Americans built an entire society around brutalizing black people for... existing? This seems like an overreaction, it could never happen.
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Jul 11, 2023 22:29
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Sivart13 posted:I did find this part lacking, it's hard to draw a direct line between what happened in the village and full armor Gloreth statue in the center of town. Either the myth of Gloreth got big-time distorted in 1000 years, or there's a years-long monster war in there that's hard to visualize. Personally I thought the flashback and ending and the action scene that had been shown in the trailer were good but otherwise the overall movie ended up feeling a little bit generic somehow, and I wonder if it would have had better pacing if it was either shorter or longer or something mystes fucked around with this message at 23:20 on Jul 11, 2023 |
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Jul 11, 2023 23:16
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Sivart13 posted:I did find this part lacking, it's hard to draw a direct line between what happened in the village ... mystes posted:I wonder if it would have had better pacing
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Jul 12, 2023 04:44
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it's functionally a fairy tale I don't think you really need to overthink the logistics of 'stay within the walls' which is a fairly standard trope and why doesn't rapunzel just tie her hair to something and climb down herself??? why didn't the seven dwarves bury snow white six feet under??? The 7th Guest fucked around with this message at 05:43 on Jul 12, 2023 |
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Jul 12, 2023 05:40
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The 7th Guest posted:it's functionally a fairy tale I don't think you really need to overthink the logistics of 'stay within the walls' which is a fairly standard trope I mean, she kind of does in the Disney version
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Jul 12, 2023 06:08
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Tangled kinda explained why Rapunzel never left her room too, it's because of her terrible mom. It's funny, years and years ago when that movie was new a common complaint was that it was boring that Mother Gothel was 100% evil and it would have been better if she had real affection for Rapunzel at some point. Now I feel like people would find that kind of refreshing lol
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Jul 12, 2023 06:12
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mycot posted:Tangled kinda explained why Rapunzel never left her room too, it's because of her terrible mom.
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Jul 12, 2023 06:21
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mycot posted:Tangled kinda explained why Rapunzel never left her room too, it's because of her terrible mom. Actually a lot of the takes that I saw were the opposite, that she was a terrifying villain because she was so accurate to how real abusive parents behave. Also ironically disney did give her a backstory, and it made her EVEN WORSE in the TV show. BioEnchanted fucked around with this message at 07:50 on Jul 12, 2023 |
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Jul 12, 2023 07:45
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It's a perfectly valid lesson for kids that some people are assholes for absolutely no reason.
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Jul 12, 2023 09:04
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BioEnchanted posted:Actually a lot of the takes that I saw were the opposite, that she was a terrifying villain because she was so accurate to how real abusive parents behave. Also ironically disney did give her a backstory, and it made her EVEN WORSE in the TV show. I also seem to remember some folk on this site being confused that she was acting villainous.
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Jul 12, 2023 09:20
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Das Boo posted:It's a perfectly valid lesson for kids that some people are assholes for absolutely no reason. Eh, usually real people are assholes for good reasons, or for bad reasons (even just "I enjoy the noise puppies make when I kick them"), absolutely no reason at all is quite rare.
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Jul 12, 2023 09:39
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YggdrasilTM posted:Eh, usually real people are assholes for good reasons, or for bad reasons (even just "I enjoy the noise puppies make when I kick them"), absolutely no reason at all is quite rare. Yeah, usually people are assholes because of things like abuse, socioeconomic reasons and so on. Teaching people that assholes are assholes for no reason is removing the incentive for trying to make the rear end in a top hat quit being assholes,
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Jul 12, 2023 09:47
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Slyphic posted:The director could have been well aware that there was no threat, there could have been knights that performatively patrolled finding nothing, making up war stories. That would've been a very different character and story, though - it's a key part of the director that she actually believes, that she's inherited the hate. The way hate is taught and transmitted is one of the major themes of the movie, one that wasn't in the book. In that, yeah, it's like what you said, the institute has no history with Nimona, they're a military-industrial complex building up weapons and things' for power against other nations and performatively using the threat of monsters and villains to justify it. But it seems like they deliberately changed that to incorporate the new themes and allegories. The movie is a lot more focused in general about its message and the trans allegory and is more conscious about what it wants to say - the original book is an unconscious allegory about the trans experience written by a trans man who didn't know he was a trans man yet and was just trying to get out feelings he didn't know how to handle and his need to scream against the world. It's remarkably cohesive about that in light of things, but it's understandable why they changed stuff, like Nimona slaughtering huge amounts of people during her rampage and having killed lots of people in the past and genuinely being a bit of a monster (admittedly as a result of being tortured into one), and her rejecting Ballister at the end of the fight. That's all good stuff about the frustration and pain she has with the world, but not really what you want when you're thinking about it as a trans message. MikeJF fucked around with this message at 10:08 on Jul 12, 2023 |
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Jul 12, 2023 09:55
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MikeJF posted:The movie is a lot more focused in general about its message and the trans allegory and is more conscious about what it wants to say - the original book is an unconscious allegory about the trans experience written by a trans man who didn't know he was a trans man yet and was just trying to get out feelings he didn't know how to handle and his need to scream against the world. Didn't know that. Was the original author involved much in the creation of the movie?
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Jul 12, 2023 10:57
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Alhazred posted:Yeah, usually people are assholes because of things like abuse, socioeconomic reasons and so on. Teaching people that assholes are assholes for no reason is removing the incentive for trying to make the rear end in a top hat quit being assholes, True, but it also means you don't get to teach the lesson that "some people are irredeemable and you need to understand that it's okay to want to have nothing to do with them" rather than "if you don't get along with someone, it's up to you to find the good in them and change them". That was one of the key takeaways of one of the early MLP episodes that made me take note of that show's didactics. e: and https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kzRyEI00PXc Data Graham fucked around with this message at 11:56 on Jul 12, 2023 |
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Jul 12, 2023 11:29
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Nobody is irredeemable. The point is more that is not your job to do it and you shouldn't suffer for thos. Unless they are literally paying you to do it. Also. Everyone can have a change of heart. But not everyone WILL have a change of heart. YggdrasilTM fucked around with this message at 12:21 on Jul 12, 2023 |
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Jul 12, 2023 12:17
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True, I thought of that hedge some minutes later but you beat me to the edit
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Jul 12, 2023 12:59
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Breetai posted:Didn't know that. Was the original author involved much in the creation of the movie? Yeah there's several behind the scenes videos with him in it. He brings up some of the changes in those videos
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Jul 12, 2023 13:02
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Data Graham posted:True, but it also means you don't get to teach the lesson that "some people are irredeemable and you need to understand that it's okay to want to have nothing to do with them" rather than "if you don't get along with someone, it's up to you to find the good in them and change them". But "it's not your job to reform an rear end in a top hat" is a completely different message from "some are assholes for no reason". One is perfectly valid and the other is perfectly stupid.
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Jul 12, 2023 13:02
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Macaluso posted:Yeah there's several behind the scenes videos with him in it. He brings up some of the changes in those videos I'm definitely going to look for the original books then, I'd really like to see the differences in the story as produced while his egg was cracking vs. after he worked out who he was.
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Jul 12, 2023 13:11
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