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Pieces of Peace posted:WoL's very thin amount of menace applied to Tosh made the eventual requirement to choose between him and Nova have a very unpleasant "sinister criminal black man versus attractive 'noble' white woman" element, especially farcical when they're both former dominion assassins turned against it. The real reason he's suspicious is because voodoo dolls are not actually related to voodoo and that's how you know he's an infiltrator or other less than recommendable personage. Also because it's always a treat to see the game twist itself into making each and every of Jim's poorly thought out decisions right, retroactively if necessary. Also, and furthermore, vanadium already exists and isn't an alloy, mister science guy, who I must now suspect of being another infiltrator.
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Jul 16, 2023 20:32
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painedforever posted:Flying Tanks! AEROGAVINS!!! yes I know it's technically not a tank
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Jul 16, 2023 20:40
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I mean, flying tanks exist. They're called attack helicopters.
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Jul 16, 2023 22:08
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You know, I never questioned that Tosh might be part of a "criminal element" or whatever, but I think that's because the game already told me Tychus is hiding something right from the start. Tosh is a Ghost, so of course he's effectively a hyper criminal. I'd almost liken him to the "oh boy, here I go killing again" guy from Rick and Morty. Sure, he's doing stuff for his own reasons, but Tychus isn't telling us why Moebius keeps hiring us so 
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Jul 16, 2023 22:42
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SIGSEGV posted:The real reason he's suspicious is because voodoo dolls are not actually related to voodoo and that's how you know he's an infiltrator or other less than recommendable personage. Apparently the reason why he's all into voodoo is because his grandma thought his psionic abilities were voodoo-related and then they got tossed out of his hometown because people got afraid of his "weirdness".
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Jul 16, 2023 23:31
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Props to going for the Goliath upgrades - I agree that the units are fun and cool and it'll be good to see them outside of their mission, but they do need their upgrades. I kinda wish their mission was less Void Ray-heavy and more Colossus-heavy, as those absolutely toast Marines while still being vulnerable to the Goliath's air attack. Also Spartan Company are a good AA panic button.
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Jul 17, 2023 00:01
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I was gonna wait until the decision actually comes up, but yeah let's say broadly the way Wings handles player choice is extremely mediocre. Some of the choices are, hm, slightly more blatantly awful than others though and you are all talking about the worst! I don't know if they had no confidence in their writing, no confidence in their players, or no confidence in general but ... wings' story has so, so many bad parts. I also to this day don't understand how they built a campaign designed to let you spotlight new units on acquiring them and then making those units poo poo in their showcase missions. How???? Bliz found a way.
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Jul 17, 2023 03:33
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 We are getting everyone's favorite tank.
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Jul 18, 2023 14:39
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Unit Spotlight: Goliath
My boy... look what they've done to my boy... Goliaths now cost an extra 50 minerals and an extra supply, severely limiting how many you can cram into your army. The cost boost means that they now have to compete with three Marines on DPS so they fall behind on damage, and an upgraded Marauder has identical defensive stats and can be backed by Medics, so they can't keep up as a frontline tank. That's not to say that they're out and out bad like, say, Reapers, Hellions, and Firebats, mind you. They have a decent bit of punch and their Armory upgrades gives them their old dedicated anti-air niche from Brood War. They're just... mid. Something you field for funsies because you're bored of having a Marine/Marauder/Medic death ball rolling over every mission. Also, their new sounds loving suck. Armory Upgrades:  Multi-Lock Weapons System
At the very least, Goliaths get a fun armory upgrade. Being able to shoot two things at once is a rather powerful tool, effectively giving them 33 DPS in ideal conditions, and it has a reasonable cost.  Ares-Class Targeting System
The Targeting System also features an AI that can better predict the paths of moving targets, letting the Goliath's Autocannons hit ground targets from a greater distance. With this, there are exactly two units that can outrange a Goliath's missiles, and one of them is ours. The boost to ground range also helps the Goliath stay behind the easily healable Marauders, cutting down on attrition. Mercenary: Spartan Company  A remnant from the defeated UED expeditionary force, the Spartans now use their advanced equipment to provide support to the highest bidder.
Cheap to buy and you don't need to tech up to a Factory if you're going bio. Honestly, Mercs in general are good to buy just because you can easily splash them into any army. Field Manual Artwork 
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Jul 18, 2023 14:42
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I wonder why they went away from the over hangy guns from 1. Readability? They don't look terrible but they seem comparatively pretty beefy and generic now
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Jul 18, 2023 15:51
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Goliaths were always my favorite Terran unit in SC1. I was sad when I realized they aren't used in SC2 other than the Terran campaign. Hordes of stompy boys was the best way to win a campaign map for me as a dumb kid
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Jul 18, 2023 15:58
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Per Blizzard's early videos about SC2, I think the idea is that goliaths were cut because Blizzard wanted a more mobile, aggressive style of play and felt that goliaths contributed to what they perceived as a static, slow-moving style of play.
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Jul 18, 2023 16:03
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Another interesting thing to note about the Goliath is that it has a bunch of model variations. There's several different paint jobs on the cockpit that can pop up at random. I don't remember if that happens in the campaign, and it's hard to tell looking at the screenshots from above, but it's pretty noticeable in the editor.
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Jul 18, 2023 16:31
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Goliaths aren't in multiplayer, so it must do that in campaign if it happens at all.
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Jul 18, 2023 16:40
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Tenebrais posted:Goliaths aren't in multiplayer, so it must do that in campaign if it happens at all. Swan gets goliaths in co-op too, but the variations have been in since wings. But yeah, if it's not in the campaign the randomized paint jobs are cut content they left in the editor.
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Jul 18, 2023 17:44
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FoolyCharged posted:Swan gets goliaths in co-op too, but the variations have been in since wings. But yeah, if it's not in the campaign the randomized paint jobs are cut content they left in the editor. Nova also gets goliaths in co-op, and hers are pretty dang useful since in my experience she's usually using her barracks cooldown on ghosts and goliaths are a good flex pick that can work against any target, plus they have Nova's lockdown missiles if you're facing Terran or Protoss.
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Jul 18, 2023 17:47
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Yeah it's interesting comparing Swann's Goliaths to the WoL Goliaths. Swann's have more HP, longer range, and most crucially no longer suffer from the insane choice of being 3 supply.
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Jul 18, 2023 18:01
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Looks like they do get the different paint jobs in the campaign. This guy on reddit found them hunting campaign achievements. It's also got a pic. https://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/8lqhd1/awesome_art_detail_on_goliaths/ Cythereal posted:Nova also gets goliaths in co-op, and hers are pretty dang useful since in my experience she's usually using her barracks cooldown on ghosts and goliaths are a good flex pick that can work against any target, plus they have Nova's lockdown missiles if you're facing Terran or Protoss. Yeah, but Nova gets a big model change as opposed to variable reskins.
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Jul 18, 2023 18:02
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The old Goliath design was cooler, in my opinion.
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Jul 18, 2023 20:00
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Been lurking while following the LP but just emerged to say the old SC1/Broodwar Goliath voice line for being built is seared into my brain. And I have a pretty bad memory in general! "Goliath online."
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Jul 18, 2023 20:02
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BisbyWorl posted:Field Manual Artwork Wow they didn't even care enough about Goliaths to scrawl something funny on their page. Plus now they just look like something out of Battletech, which while not really a bad thing, is entirely too grounded for Starcraft. E: Goliaths were always something that I desperately wanted to like, but swarms of Marines were just too good (and delightfully splattery). They ended up being basically a resource dump if everything else was operating at capacity. (I was not a multiplayer person.) Felinoid fucked around with this message at 20:08 on Jul 18, 2023 |
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Jul 18, 2023 20:05
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Did Paul Verhooven threaten to sue or something? Why did they move away from the ED209 aesthetic from BW?
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Jul 18, 2023 20:36
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I'm not very enthused about the model. The SC1 was... not better, but I liked it better. It looked more bulbous, sorta fit in with the overall aesthetic better. Are Terrans better as a bio army as compared to SC1?
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Jul 18, 2023 21:17
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Terran Bio Balls are insanely powerful in the campaign and can stomp it into the ground even on Brutal. In multiplayer I know they also used to be a massive threat, though I have no idea if that is still the case.
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Jul 18, 2023 21:50
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BisbyWorl posted:Field Manual Artwork I could absolutely make this in MegaMek.
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Jul 18, 2023 21:56
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It looks like what the inner sphere would call a MAD-ARC
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Jul 18, 2023 22:42
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BisbyWorl posted:Field Manual Artwork  Battletech would like a word.
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Jul 18, 2023 22:46
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I like the dong-gun that's just there for flavor.
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Jul 18, 2023 23:48
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Calax posted:
It's kind of Mad Dog-ish, but it looks a bit more... I dunno, like a smaller Light Mech. Can't quite remember which one, but it's like a small Argus.
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Jul 18, 2023 23:50
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Mathing it out in my head, a Battlemech based on that design would be an undergunned deathtrap unless it was upscaled considerably. If kept at its current size, it'd have multiple small, ammo-dependent weapons, leading to anemic damage output and a tendency to explode violently when shot. Swap the autocannons for lasers and you'd probably have something workable though. Can keep the crotch-gun as a CT machinegun for flavor.
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Jul 18, 2023 23:51
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Bloody Pom posted:Mathing it out in my head, a Battlemech based on that design would be an undergunned deathtrap unless it was upscaled considerably. If kept at its current size, it'd have multiple small, ammo-dependent weapons, leading to anemic damage output and a tendency to explode violently when shot. Sucking absolute poo poo and being poorly considered is the natural state of most canon Battletech designs, though, which is part of why the games are often so trivial, because a player given the same tonnage to toy with can usually create a far more efficient and purpose-built death machine.
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Jul 18, 2023 23:53
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Honestly just the scale alone puts it in Protomech territory, and those things are an affront to reason and sensibility of the highest order 
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Jul 18, 2023 23:57
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Bloody Pom posted:Mathing it out in my head, a Battlemech based on that design would be an undergunned deathtrap unless it was upscaled considerably. If kept at its current size, it'd have multiple small, ammo-dependent weapons, leading to anemic damage output and a tendency to explode violently when shot. Two autocannons of some description, two LRM racks, maybe a flamer if you want to nod to the scrapped original design from SC1. Sounds to me like an Archer and a Rifleman had a drunken one-night stand and this popped out.
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Jul 19, 2023 00:01
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Cythereal posted:Sounds to me like an Archer and a Rifleman had a drunken one-night stand and this popped out. So a Jagermech, basically.
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Jul 19, 2023 00:11
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Cythereal posted:Two autocannons of some description, two LRM racks, maybe a flamer if you want to nod to the scrapped original design from SC1. You can do a pretty reasonable Introtech version at 50 tons with 2 LAC/5 (only technically not-Introtech), 2 LRM-10s, 4 total tons of ammo, moving 4/6 and 7.5 tons of armor. Honestly would not be a bad fire support mech in 3025.
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Jul 19, 2023 01:53
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painedforever posted:I'm not very enthused about the model. The SC1 was... not better, but I liked it better. It looked more bulbous, sorta fit in with the overall aesthetic better. There are two fundamental changes between BW and SC2 that make Terran bio significantly better: 1) You can have more than 12 units in a control group. 2) Pathfinding is indescribably so much better. You can have 40 marines and medics on one control group (and they even added an "All Army" key if you don't want to use control groups!), and amove around. As long as you know some basic micro tricks (e.g., don't walk your marines into a big AoE zone; don't just move command into the enemy), Terran bio is basically the best all-around composition that is fairly simple to produce and control in all of SC2. This is true even current professional multiplayer. Late game fights are pretty complex, but the composition doesn't change from its core. ed: This thread got me to try to polish off the campaign achievements. Let's see if I can get through them all. Except 500k Lost Viking, gently caress that one.
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Jul 19, 2023 05:43
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There's one other big change for bio: It heals at range. That means pretty much zero downtime for your healers in battle keeping dudes in the fight. No more hoping the medic can waddle over in time to save that marine.
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Jul 19, 2023 07:52
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Synastren posted:ed: This thread got me to try to polish off the campaign achievements. Let's see if I can get through them all. Except 500k Lost Viking, gently caress that one.
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Jul 19, 2023 14:51
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500k lost Viking is pretty easy actually, if you have a macro to auto-tap space for you while it’s held down.
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Jul 19, 2023 14:55
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Synastren posted:There are two fundamental changes between BW and SC2 that make Terran bio significantly better: I'd add a third thing, which is that to compensate for them being much easier to use, spellcasters are significantly weaker in SC2. No more Dark Swarm or Plague, and while Psi-Storm is still around it's much weaker. Spellcasters are a big threat to bio in BW so this makes life a lot easier for them.
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Jul 19, 2023 15:38
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