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Rappaport posted:I think they're OK-ish in BG2 where most weapon types get some good item, but in BG1 it's bone-headed stupid. Originally swapping Khalid for Minsc was just fine, because Minsc could just wield the same +2 long sword as Khalid did, but nooooo, can't have that now. Of course there's Stupifier in the EE, but they even nerfed that too, the buggers I think Khalid actually does in the EE.
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Jul 23, 2023 20:57
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I have an old version of the EE game, but looking at it Khalid at level 1 has 2 pips in long sword, a pip in axes and a pip in long bow. Dunno how he is if you recruit him later, or if Beamdog changed it in the newer versions, though.
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Jul 23, 2023 21:12
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The problem with a lot RPGs now is that there is often no way to evaluate the relative strength of a monster before getting stomped by it. It was a rubbish game in so many ways, but at least the grandaddy RPG, EverQuest, had a /consider system where a player could get an idea of a creature's strength from a long distance: grey was trivial, red was 'you will die'. Of course, this system didn't totally apply the same way to dragons and other raid targets and, on one memorable occasion, I had a huge red dragon aggro on me from half a zone away during a poorly-timed lag spike. It did not work out well for me.Jay Rust posted:Narrow proficiencies suck Agreed. I like that, later, they made it so that martial classes could use any weapon at no penalty but could be extra good at something for modest bonuses... as opposed to a dedicated fighter/ranger/paladin/barbarian who was a beast with, say, a long sword but somehow ineffectual with a two-hander.
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Jul 23, 2023 21:35
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Especially frustrating with arbitrary "exotic" weapons. Oh yeah, master of a long sword but get a katana in hand and just don't know what the heck to do with it, which side do you even hold so confusing
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Jul 23, 2023 21:46
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I like the way Warhammer Fantasy's tabletop RPG does it: unless you're talking about special magical weapons, there are Hand Weapons (one handers) and Great Weapons (two handers), and that is it. Katana, mace, axe, doesn't matter.
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Jul 23, 2023 21:53
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Rappaport posted:I have an old version of the EE game, but looking at it Khalid at level 1 has 2 pips in long sword, a pip in axes and a pip in long bow. Dunno how he is if you recruit him later, or if Beamdog changed it in the newer versions, though. Aha, you're right, I just checked my unmodded backup install with NearInfinity. What I get for always playing with three trillion mods installed. And for the record Ajantis does indeed start with Bastard Sword proficiency.
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Jul 23, 2023 22:11
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I am going to go back in time and change how exotic weapons work, where if you do not have the special training for that specific weapon then it is just treated as the same as the closest normal weapon. Like the example of the katana just being a weird longsword, or a spiked chain being a...spiked club?
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Jul 23, 2023 22:36
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What the gently caress is a 1h longsword in these games even meant to be? A bastard sword was already specifically a sword short/light enough that it could be wielded in one hand if needed, in comparison to the longer, heavier longsword that was held in two hands. Having 1h longsword and bastard swords as two different proficiencies just makes no sense. I don't like narrow proficiencies in general but I can see a certain logic in like, the fighting style you'd use with a katana being functionally different from a long straight sword, which would have a distinct fighting style again from something like a scimitar. Flail being distinct from mace kinda makes sense too, less so mace being distinct from club and warhammer though. But bastard swords and 1h longswords are like, the same thing. voiceless anal fricative fucked around with this message at 22:42 on Jul 23, 2023 |
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Jul 23, 2023 22:39
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bike tory posted:What the gently caress is a 1h longsword in these games even meant to be? A bastard sword was already specifically a sword short/light enough that it could be wielded in one hand if needed, in comparison to the longer, heavier longsword that was held in two hands. Having 1h longsword and bastard swords as two different proficiencies just makes no sense. The D&D terms for those weapons are extremely inaccurate. The Longsword in D&D is what sword experts today would call an arming sword, while the Bastard sword is what they would call a longsword. They actually get it close to right in 5e now, with the longsword being able to be wielded in one or two hands.
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Jul 23, 2023 22:45
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Ajantis, Coran, Khalid, Minsc and Shar-Teel all had 2 pips in large swords at level 1. The warrior-type outliers who could use the bastard sword +1/+3 vs shapeshifters or the sword of the Balduran but didn't join your party with 2 pips for it already were Kagain and Kivan. Blame Tutu/BGT/EE.
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Jul 23, 2023 22:53
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Is there some compelling reason that Kagain and Korgan were different characters, rather than the same guy all the way through?
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Jul 23, 2023 22:59
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Kagain has an illegal 20 Con score, but the other vanilla BG2 characters also break the rules such as Aerie's classes or Edwin's amulet, so  That said, Kagain wasn't much of a character aside from whining all the time.
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Jul 23, 2023 23:00
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Torquemada posted:Is there some compelling reason that Kagain and Korgan were different characters, rather than the same guy all the way through? All the companions in BG1 except for Imoen were the tabletop DnD characters of the various developers at Bioware and Black Isle.
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Jul 23, 2023 23:02
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sweet geek swag posted:The D&D terms for those weapons are extremely inaccurate. The Longsword in D&D is what sword experts today would call an arming sword, while the Bastard sword is what they would call a longsword. They actually get it close to right in 5e now, with the longsword being able to be wielded in one or two hands. Sword typing is hard because contemporaneously you just had a sword; you didn't really go to the general store and say "show me your finest 1h long swords" or "Zigfrid, teach me the secrets of 2h great swords." You just had rich guys working with artisans to create and maintain swords with a hilt and blade length of a personal liking and within ability of the smith and when you're done you're just telling people "check out my awesome sword" (pronounced sword).
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Jul 23, 2023 23:03
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Rappaport posted:Kagain has an illegal 20 Con score, but the other vanilla BG2 characters also break the rules such as Aerie's classes or Edwin's amulet, so Aerie is Avariel. They're allowed to be cleric/mage.
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Jul 23, 2023 23:03
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Suspicious posted:Aerie is Avariel. They're allowed to be cleric/mage. Sure, but Avariel isn't a race CHARNAME can choose, so her chart just says elf and elves can't have that combo Bhaal dammit 
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Jul 23, 2023 23:05
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bike tory posted:What the gently caress is a 1h longsword in these games even meant to be? A bastard sword was already specifically a sword short/light enough that it could be wielded in one hand if needed, in comparison to the longer, heavier longsword that was held in two hands. Having 1h longsword and bastard swords as two different proficiencies just makes no sense. The long sword as it's used in modern fantasy is basically the expensive arming sword of centuries gone by, but nobody knows the term 'arming sword' anymore. The long, one-handed, cruciform two-edged sword has been so long iconic to the genre that if one were to call a long sword an arming sword and a bastard sword/claymore/zweihander/flamberge a long sword it would probably tank sales and piss off a bunch of loud, sad-arse nerds on a forum somewhere.
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Jul 23, 2023 23:14
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Torquemada posted:Is there some compelling reason that Kagain and Korgan were different characters, rather than the same guy all the way through? I mean, the names are similar and they're both evil dwarves, but the flavor of evil seems a bit different. Korgan is a bit of a psycho and Kagain is more selfish and restrained. There's no way you could put them in the same game, but I could see a scenario where Korgan was Kagain, but then morphing him into a new character after the way he was written doesn't mesh well with the guy in BG1 (a crotchety old dude in a back alley shop in Beregost).
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Jul 23, 2023 23:18
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The most frustrating part is that seemingly Gygax at least genuinely thought he had incredible knowledge of arms and armor and put that into his work, but I guess he really just knew a bunch of terms for polearms Also it is weird that any characters moved from 1 to 2 other than Imoen honestly, especially remembering they were all tabletop characters
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Jul 23, 2023 23:20
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Very few of the characters (that you can't recruit) from BG1 end up in a good spot in BG2 Ajantis - murdered by Abdel Adrian Montaron - murdered by harpers Faldorn - murdered by Jahera, cernd or Abdel Xzar - can be murdered Quayle - bumming around a circus Garrick - down and out in the temple district Tiax - (justifiably) incarcerated Can't remember if any of these guys have cameos... Alora, Eldoth, Coran, Safana, Skie, Kivan, Branwen, Xan, Yeslick and Shar-teel
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Jul 23, 2023 23:30
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mitochondritom posted:Very few of the characters (that you can't recruit) from BG1 end up in a good spot in BG2 Unless this is what you mean, Ajantis is killed by the PC in BG2 as part of Firkraags quest. His death to Abdel Adrian in the books is not consistent with the games. Safana and Coran are part of a minor questline in the woods areas that open up after you get out of the Underdark. Coran canonically lives and goes on to be one of the high-ups in Baldur's Gate. The others don't have any cameos.
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Jul 23, 2023 23:44
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In vanilla, you meet Coran and Safana near the end of the game, but everyone should just install the Coran BG2 mod because he is a hose of death! efb 
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Jul 23, 2023 23:46
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I think Branwen and Xan are in the BG2 tutorial.
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Jul 23, 2023 23:49
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Korgan and Kagain are wholly different characters other than being evil dwarf fighters, but I guess those all look the same to some people. Xan and Branwen narrate the BG2 tutorial and teach you how to cast spells. I dunno if it even exists in the Enhanced Editions, but it's technically a cameo. Siege of Dragonspear gives every party member a couple of goodbye lines (including the ones you meet again immediately afterwards), which is as much closure as you're gonna get, I figure. Of the ones I've brought, Kivan and Yeslick retire from adventuring because they've gotten their revenge and helped you get yours, while Xan and Shar-teel retire from dungeon-delving because they hate it and feel that they've repaid you by the end of the game. Skie also gets a whole subplot in the campaign. Also I think the only one who has any reason to be in Athkatla is Ajantis, who was Keldorn's squire and investigating the Sword Coast as part of his proving quest for the Order.
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Jul 24, 2023 01:00
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Is Ranger/Thief a valid multiclass and if so, which races can be one?
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Jul 24, 2023 02:01
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It is not. Multiclassing is limited to being some combination of fighter, mage, thief and cleric, with the specific exceptions of ranger/cleric and fighter/druid.
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Jul 24, 2023 02:11
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Vargatron posted:Is Ranger/Thief a valid multiclass and if so, which races can be one? I wish. I hate that MC and DC combinations are hard-coded. I would love to play a druid/thief; so much synergy there. Zulily Zoetrope posted:It is not. Multiclassing is limited to being some combination of fighter, mage, thief and cleric, with the specific exceptions of ranger/cleric and fighter/druid. Also illusionist, for my gnomies.
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Jul 24, 2023 04:39
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Chairchucker posted:My brother once designed his own spellcaster AI scripts; it was mostly stuff like, if you don't have stoneskin, immediately cast stoneskin, if you see an enemy with these protections, remove them, etc etc. They were pretty decent tbh. I probably wouldn't use it, but that's pretty cool. Did he do it back in the day, or was this more recent?
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Jul 24, 2023 05:38
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Vargatron posted:My main complaint was that the encounter is in a low level area for seemingly no reason. Pretty much every other CRPG I played is paced so you can basically handle anything an area can throw at you once you get there. But it seems like Kingmaker just likes to throw extremely powerful enemies at you at random. That would make sense from a replayability perspective, but the main quest is also on a timer so I feel like any kind of backtracking would make me potentially fail. That encounter got me the first time too, and I played it twice before I realized I was out of my league. I think it's a great encounter, though. Just the fact that it looks like a "free" rest made me suspicious, and then there are all the dead bodies. I still fell for it, but it was my fault and I don't mind that sort of thing. I did come back later in that playthrough to kill the bastard though.
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Jul 24, 2023 05:47
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I don't know how anyone puts up with having a fighter as their Bhaalspawn. My current run is a CE Barbarian (complete with Shao Kahn voice pack that I chopped up myself), Kagain, Viconia, Montaron, Edwin and Baeloth. I've gotten to Baldurs Gate but unlike previous runs I feel like I'm petering out because gameplay is just right click to smack thing and occasionally opening with barbarian rage so his brain doesn't get muddled first. Last year I ran with a Blade which despite bard spell progression sucking in BG1 posed some interesting tactical moments and the year before I did Kensai dual classed to thief so I got to enjoy exploding people with quarterstaff backstabs. Maybe I should've gone with a fighter dual-classed to cleric so I have more buttons to push. Or maybe it's time to move up from core D&D rules to the next difficulty so I have reason to burn through the plethora of spells and potions I accumulate and never use.
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Jul 24, 2023 08:12
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bike tory posted:What the gently caress is a 1h longsword in these games even meant to be? A bastard sword was already specifically a sword short/light enough that it could be wielded in one hand if needed, in comparison to the longer, heavier longsword that was held in two hands. Having 1h longsword and bastard swords as two different proficiencies just makes no sense. it's a sword that's longer than a shortsword
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Jul 24, 2023 09:18
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DeadButDelicious posted:I don't know how anyone puts up with having a fighter as their Bhaalspawn. My current run is a CE Barbarian (complete with Shao Kahn voice pack that I chopped up myself), Kagain, Viconia, Montaron, Edwin and Baeloth. I've gotten to Baldurs Gate but unlike previous runs I feel like I'm petering out because gameplay is just right click to smack thing and occasionally opening with barbarian rage so his brain doesn't get muddled first. Last year I ran with a Blade which despite bard spell progression sucking in BG1 posed some interesting tactical moments and the year before I did Kensai dual classed to thief so I got to enjoy exploding people with quarterstaff backstabs. Maybe I should've gone with a fighter dual-classed to cleric so I have more buttons to push. I've still never beat the game. Last I tried I was talking about it in this thread and went fighter/mage because that seems fun and flexible, but with a full party you just level so insanely slowly and it turns it i really like some of the mage party members so I fell off it again I still feel like I should play it and beat it... someday
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Jul 24, 2023 11:44
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DeadButDelicious posted:I don't know how anyone puts up with having a fighter as their Bhaalspawn. My current run is a CE Barbarian (complete with Shao Kahn voice pack that I chopped up myself), Kagain, Viconia, Montaron, Edwin and Baeloth. I've gotten to Baldurs Gate but unlike previous runs I feel like I'm petering out because gameplay is just right click to smack thing and occasionally opening with barbarian rage so his brain doesn't get muddled first. Last year I ran with a Blade which despite bard spell progression sucking in BG1 posed some interesting tactical moments and the year before I did Kensai dual classed to thief so I got to enjoy exploding people with quarterstaff backstabs. Maybe I should've gone with a fighter dual-classed to cleric so I have more buttons to push. I mean presumably you’re also controlling the spellcasters in your party? What difference does it make if you have 5 npc mages and 1 pc fighter versus 4 npc mages 1 npc fighter and 1 pc mage?
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Jul 24, 2023 12:38
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Weird Pumpkin posted:I've still never beat the game. Last I tried I was talking about it in this thread and went fighter/mage because that seems fun and flexible, but with a full party you just level so insanely slowly and it turns it i really like some of the mage party members so I fell off it again You could try Fighter/Cleric. Pray to your god, get high on godjuice, then go cave some doppelganger skulls in with your war hammer. Choose a Dwarf, get 19 Con, grab the Tome nice and early (for 20 Con), find some sick armour and be the Bonus lmao points if you get 18 Strength, too, so that by the end of BG1, when you cast Draw Upon Holy Might, you're breaking bones with 24 Strength or so. For a Turn, anyway.
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Jul 24, 2023 12:59
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Jay Rust posted:I mean presumably you’re also controlling the spellcasters in your party? What difference does it make if you have 5 npc mages and 1 pc fighter versus 4 npc mages 1 npc fighter and 1 pc mage? Naturally I'm controlling the spellcasters, but we're still at BG1 so outside of using the cheese rings to stock up on magic missile and sleep magic spells have to be rationed carefully, and that'll also be true going in to SoD, and your point is correct I think it's just the feeling that I made a dud Bhaalspawn without anything really interesting (to me) to do outside of right-click to smash. it was also getting a bit tedious because the healing potions in BG1 suck and I'm resting to drat much. Having said that today I've cleaned out Baldurs Gate of sidequests so maybe I was in a funk.
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Jul 24, 2023 13:20
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Maybe this is somewhat tangential, but I'm near to the end of SoA with my archer CHARNAME in my latest run, and I think it's been a fun ride. Looking at CHARNAME's info page, they're responsible for 18% of the party's XP and 22% of the kills. And apparently CHARNAME killed Thaxll'ssillyia, so that's nice. However, our MVP is Korgan, with 31% of party XP to his name  I am running with two mages, so there's some microing to do if I feel like it, but it really does seem like just letting Korgan hit things in the face until they keel over is a valid strategy a lot of the time. I once ran a half-orc berserker up to the Underdark in BG2 but then kind of ran out of steam. It does seem a bit more fun to dual to a mage or something like that which is not an option for half-orcs, rather than being the party's Korgan. Archers are absolute murder-beasts in BG1 and apparently do pretty OK with SoA too.
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Jul 24, 2023 13:49
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Even if you're dealing with a higher difficulty level or SCS, a lot of BG is solved before and in the first 10 seconds of fighting by prebuffs and an initial disable salvo. Solo/duo type conduct might include more button presses as you need to Commandos your way through certain encounters but I wouldn't necessarily call them good button presses. More buttons to hit and reasons to hit buttons has been a problem Bioware has been trying to solve their entire existence and it's alternately lead to BG2 mage battles, Mass Effect, Dragon Age 2 but also Mass Effect 2 so it's hard to say if buttons are good or not.
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Jul 24, 2023 14:32
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every encounter should be engaging and surmountable, but also there should be a smattering of trash encounters that I can snooze my way through to feel like a badass, and there shouldn't be so many of either type that I get frustrated dealing with them, nor so few that I will derisively refer to the game as a walking simulator also I personally refuse to grind or develop a consistent pre-buffing routine, points on which other players may well differ I don't understand why that seems to be so hard.
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Jul 24, 2023 14:50
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I do have a hard time with casting protective/empowering spells when you get beyond a couple. I am sure pro players do a dozen in Baldur's Gate too but I basically designed my Wrath of the Righteous party to require as few buffs as possible to get by after Kingmaker felt like you needed a dozen spells to start every fight by the end
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Jul 24, 2023 15:24
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I like to play a solo sorc a lot and make myself less lonely by summoning some skeletons and then cracking open some boys with the cold ones. Then I get mordenkainens swords and planetars and stop summoning skeletons. You get the complexity of having a party while hogging all the xp for yourself like a glutton.
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