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TT, no offense, but I am especially not reading that one
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Jul 27, 2023 03:00
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the barbie discourse will continue until morale improves
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Jul 27, 2023 03:01
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I was a child who destroyed my Barbies — popping Ken’s head off and cutting Barbie’s hair. I was constantly losing Barbie’s accessories; I even colored on her face. My older sister, Jessie, played with hers meticulously — the world neat and tidy and everything, every cup and tiny perfume bottle kept where it should be. I wasn’t allowed to play with her Barbie collection. Not that it stopped me — I was entranced with the perfection of Jessie’s Barbie world. But that never stopped me from destroying mine. Barbie is a toy with which girls can create their own worlds and then destroy them. Paradise built and lost in every reenactment. Barbie director Geta Gerwig has noted the connection, calling Barbie’s world the inverse of the creation myth. “Barbie was invented first. Ken was invented after Barbie, to burnish Barbie’s position in our eyes and in the world. That kind of creation myth is the opposite of the creation myth in Genesis,” Gerwig said. In Vox, movie critic Alissa Wilkinson adroitly points this out, analyzing the world of the Barbie movie as an Eden ruined by the knowledge of death. I want to “yes, and” Wilkinson here. Because, as with Biblical Eve, there are two creation myths for Barbie. One is that Barbie was inspired by the German doll Lilli, who became an idealized Aryan pinup for soldiers. The other is that Barbie inventor Ruth Handler created the doll for her daughter, to inspire her. Barbie is both sex doll and a child’s play. The lurid and the holy, existing side-by-side. Similarly, the book of Genesis recounts two creation myths. The first chapter of Genesis describes man and woman being created at the same time. The second chapter describes God creating a woman from the rib of the first man in order to give him a helper. The two creation myths have launched myths of their own. In a Medieval Jewish text, the Alphabet of Ben Sira, the first woman, Lilith, was kicked out of Eden because of her sexual appetite and because she asserted her equality with Adam. Lilith then became a demon — a kidnapper of children, a murderer of men. The myth of Lilith found its footing in the Middle Ages, as feudal systems disintegrated and religious powers sought to keep hold. In these tellings, Lilith transformed from dark, tempting beauty to snaggle-toothed hag. In some tellings, Lilith collects the spilled sperm from the bedsheets of copulating couples and turns it into demons. In other accounts, she is the Queen of the Underworld, only vanquished by the establishment of the kingdom of God on Earth. In still others, she’s a succubus who rapes men at night and turns their offspring into demons. The journalist and filmmaker Lilly Rivlin wrote about Lilith in Ms. magazine in 1972, reclaiming her as a symbol of feminine power and connecting her to the divine goddesses and spirits mythologized by ancient gynocentric communities. Rivlin wrote that she’d always been repelled by the myth of Eve, calling her “that submissive blonde creature wiled by a snake, falling for a line.” In the article, Rivilin followed Lilith back through history, finding her in Gilgamesh and finally connecting her to an Assyrian spirit of the wind. She writes, “In following Lilith backward through time, I had sought a female archetype which is creative and self-liberating. I found the wind. My journey ended at the beginning — only the wind, moving upon the void (containing nothing and everything in it).” Containing nothing and everything is what Barbie is expected to do. So, too, are women. In the movie, America Ferrera’s character perfectly captures this ambivalence with a monologue that begins, “It is literally impossible to be a woman. You are so beautiful, and so smart, and it kills me that you don’t think you’re good enough. Like, we have to always be extraordinary, but somehow we’re always doing it wrong.” It’s that speech that (spoiler alert) eventually saves the Barbies. As Barbie says in the movie, "By giving voice to the cognitive dissonance required to be a woman under the patriarchy, you've robbed it of its power” — and they are freed. If only it were that easy. Gerwig both wants to have it all and knows she can’t. She’s getting away with everything in a pink capitalistic machine, but she knows that the capitalist machine is what got us here. “Things can be both/and,” Gerwig has said. “I’m doing the thing and subverting the thing.” Of course, as Jessica DeFino notes in her newsletter “The Unpublishable,” you can’t be the thing and subvert the thing. Capitalism is what sells movies. You can’t be successful at making a movie without also being successful at capitalism. And if you want your movie to subvert capitalism, you have to be so good at it that they let you do it, which means money. Which means capitalism. We want our subversive Liliths in a world of Eves. So much is expected of us. We have so little to give. We have to do it all. We can do so little. We expect a blockbuster film by a female director (still so rare in Hollywood) to do everything. The movie wants to do everything. It has ambitions and hopes, too. And yet — as Gerwig winks at us through Ferrera’s monologue — it can’t do it all. It knows it can’t; it’s held down by the realities of life, and money, and, and — everything. But it’s trying. But, in a country where gender identity is increasingly policed and the rights of people with uteruses are being gutted, is trying enough? There are more ways to be a woman than being a Lilith or an Eve. More ways to exist than just Barbie or Ken. In fact, that is what a lot of America’s “culture wars” are about — criminalizing the ways people express gender through bans on affirming care for trans youth, bans on drag shows, and book bans that target LGBTQ-themed books, even as more and more people identify as LGBTQ and find other ways to live and exist outside the heteronormative stranglehold. I saw the Barbie movie in a theater in Iowa City on Thursday night. The showing was filled with middle-aged Midwestern women all dressed in pink. In the bathroom after, we all talked about how we cried during Ferrera’s monologue. One woman announced she wanted it tattooed on her labia. Another woman joked that if she did, no man would ever see it because they so rarely put their faces down there. Wine tipsy. Teary-eyed. We all felt seen by a movie that is both too much and not enough. A movie as deranged and complicated and tied to the machine as we all are. It wasn’t everything. But it was something. And in that moment, something was enough. There have been many essays and articles and opinions about Barbie this summer. Barbie is feminist. Barbie is not feminist enough. Barbie is ruining women. Barbie is ruining capitalism. Barbie is saying something important. Barbie isn’t saying enough. Barbie is too woke. Barbie is making fun of the wokes. Barbie. Barbie. Barbie. Barbie is the perfectly imperfect vessel of our rage and our fears, so often destroyed by children in play. That plasticine locus of our anxieties and dreams. Barbie can’t save us. But also Barbie can’t destroy us. She contains nothing. She contains everything.
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Jul 27, 2023 03:02
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DR FRASIER KRANG posted:I'm not gonna watch either of these movies just because gently caress em just lol if you pay to beta test movies on release. wait for directors cut.
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Jul 27, 2023 03:05
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Ok, so: Matrix references. Lots of Matrix references. The movie takes place inside the mind of the character Gloria, a Mattel employee. Gloria lives in "the real world", which is not the actual real world, but "reality" as depicted in what's explicitly a 'meta' advertisement starring various Hollywood actors. In other words, "Gloria" is actually America Ferrera, playing herself, playing Gloria - the fictional mascot who is set to become the new face of the Mattel company. This is how the movie cushions its messages: first by saying it's only a toy commerical, then by saying that it's all just this one person's silly fantasy within the commercial. So, don't be fooled; we need to interrogate exactly those premises. But, given that we already agree that corporations are bad, any criticism of the film comes down to our ability to examine Gloria as she invents Flamin' Hot Cheetos unironically reenacts the "Lisa Lionheart" storyline from that ancient Simpsons episode. Like, where are Trans Ken, Wheelchair Ken, etc.? That's a rhetorical question, because the answer is simply that Gloria didn't think about that. It wouldn't fit into her conception of the Barbie brand, where Ken is (or should be) a vehicle for cisgendered girls* to safely confront harassment and microaggressions through parody. The "Kendom" thing clearly reveals that Gloria has no clue what kids actually like, outside her wheelhouse of "Barbie, but Weird Twitter". No way are Kendom products actually selling that much, even as ironic purchases. In fact, isn't it kinda odd that there are effectively no children in the movie at all? *The film's 'colourblindness' on such issues as trans rights leads to some odd scenes, like when Gloria makes Doctor Barbie stand up and... express generic criticism of tropes in romantic comedies? The elephant in the room is that Mattel wouldn't dare make Ken even subtly transphobic. --- None of the Barbies belong to anybody, strictly speaking. All of the doll characters are actually 'the idea of a doll', existing in Gloria's unconscious fantasy world. Gloria specifically has this fantasy because she's heavily, heavily invested in the Barbie brand - like, fanatical to such a degree that she got herself a job at the company, and gets in a high-speed car chase when she hears of Barbie coming to the real world. Meanwhile, the goal of the Will Ferrell character is to prevent Gloria's ostensibly-unmarketable "dark" ideas from spreading to potential customers. So, whatever hint of a collective dimension to the fantasy world, this is strictly Gloria's show. That's the response to Mat Cauthon's post, as it happens: Barbieland isn't a utopia or a dystopia, because it isn't an actual society - or at least not anything recognizably human. The idea-doll characters are immortal and don't actually do things like eat or whatever. Their status is determined by the degree to which they are "good ideas": both Gloria and the diegetic filmmakers ranking them in terms of their marketability or something. --- Ken doesn't bring patriarchy to Barbieland. Barbieland is a fantasy realm that was already entirely controlled and sustained by Mattel and Warner Bros Discovery (whose HQ is conspicuously visible from the Mattel boardroom's window). This means that it was always an outgrowth of the patriarchy in "the real world". That's the Matrix analogy they're going for, with Barbie obviously in the role of Tom Anderson/Neo. Unlike the Matrix, though, there's no functional economic system within the simulation. Ken just says "the abstract concept of patriarchy is good", then suddenly has a flatscreen TV because that phrase memetically infected the cartoon president. Barbie The Movie is consequently neither anti-men nor anti-patriarchy. It's straightforwardly in favor of the patriarchy, albeit in a moderate-centrist way. Gloria advocates for gradualism, probably gets a promotion within her male-dominated company, and indulges in harmless power-fantasies on the side. 'I can be an astronaut, and bully a dickless Ryan Gosling!' --- Yeah the movie is, like, astonishingly straight given the subject matter. But it makes sense! I initially thought it was a total cop-out that the 'leftist' straw-girl calls Barbie a fascist. Like, she calls the innocent character a fascist, and makes her cry, while leveling no such criticism at the Mattel company (or WB, for that matter). It's like going to Disneyland and insulting the mascots. Imagine if the character instead turned to the camera and called David Zaslav a fascist - or dissed the actual Mattel CEO (Ynon Kreiz, apparently). Obviously, she would never be allowed to do this. But then, in the end, the moral of the movie is pretty much directly stated: Barbie the character is a fascist, and that's okay because girls deserve escapist power fantasies too. We're gonna oppress the Kens, but in a funny way, because it's not real. --- A quirk of the movie’s logic is that it says there’s actually nothing wrong with Kendom and Ken’s behaviour, because it’s just another silly power fantasy that we enjoy with irony. All that’s ultimately at stake is that the fantasies are, inexplicably, mutually exclusive: Mattel will stop making Barbie toys because Kendom is popular, saddening adult fans of Barbie. Of course, in actual reality, Mattel would simply release Kendom as a parallel joke product line for the exact same target market as this feature film. --- As an overt advertisement for a Barbie toys, the film is specifically marketing Barbie dolls to different age demographics along the narrative’s progression. Barbie is first sold as a sincere power fantasy for young children, then as an ironic power fantasy for teens (“dark and weird”). Finally, there’s the tricky part: a proposed return to sincerity with a “I Am Barbie” messaging for adults, where Barbie the character is understood as a person and has therefore, all along, been conflicted and suffering. --- Because Barbieland is specifically Gloria's doll-rated fantasy, Kendom is her distorted image of what "boy culture" is like. This is why it's totally out of touch and based on stuff like: a young Sylvester Stallone, cowboy toys, 90s beer commercials, karate bandanas, Matchbox 20, Bill Clinton, the musical 'Grease'.... --- In the same way that Barbie is specifically Gloria's Barbie, the unstated implication of the film is that there are Barbielands generated by anyone heavily invested in the "Barbie" brand. Since Gloria's Barbieland is purely imaginary, it also includes toys that Gloria is aware of but hasn't necessarily owned or played with. Some of the toy-concepts, as we see from her sketches, are products that don't even exist - but that she invents for herself. That's the entire plotline of Barbie getting anxiety. And, later, it's why Kendom happens: it's Gloria's weird idea of if what happens Barbie if the character 'fails' and the brand is somehow 'overtaken by boys'. Gerwig helpfully explained the joke in an interview. Asked why she included a joke about #ReleaseTheSnyderCut, she replied: "I don't even really know. I knew Zack Snyder's Justice League was a thing, but I didn't know the contours, all the ins and outs. ... And I think that was the point: it was like Barbie had a vague knowledge of it, and then - all of a sudden, in a certain state - it really meant a lot to her. And then it went away." -Greta Gerwig, edited for grammar & clarity Like Gerwig herself, none of the characters in the film have actually seen Justice League, and they consequently hold no actual opinion of it. Gloria is only vaguely aware of it as "a boy thing", and the citizens of Kendom behave accordingly. It's like in Solaris, when Kelvin interrogates this copy of his wife, and he realizes that she is sourced entirely from his memories. She is only Kelvin's distorted, incomplete idea of his wife.
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Jul 27, 2023 03:19
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Cuttlefush posted:Mighty Max movie Everything I hear about that show is metal and 'how the gently caress did they get away with that in a kids show' though I imagine it doesn't hold up that great besides Though lol it has the same ending as The Dark Tower
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Jul 27, 2023 05:35
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I hope the mighty max movie makes the dragon Island set I have in my closet worth some money
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Jul 27, 2023 05:38
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I had the shark, and it was fuckin awesome.
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Jul 27, 2023 05:39
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Wraith of J.O.I. posted:movies coming in the wake of barbie's success......... hope greta is doing the oppenheimer face reading this : ) Give me some He-Man slop and I'll think about it depending on who's starring
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Jul 27, 2023 05:40
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What about a Swat Kats movie Or Centurions
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Jul 27, 2023 05:45
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you know what toy movie owns is not quite humanquote:Dr. Jonas Carson (Alan Thicke) creates[2] an android that looks just like a human teenage boy, and he "adopts" him as his son and as an older brother to Becky (Robyn Lively), who names him Chip. After the Carsons move to a new town, Chip (Jay Underwood) is enrolled in high school alongside Becky. Dr. Carson also goes to the high school, having filled a vacancy as a science teacher, which allows him close range to see how Chip interacts with others. trailer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K8ItRuWemw4 full: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M8HE7IT7g2M mawarannahr has issued a correction as of 05:55 on Jul 27, 2023 |
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Jul 27, 2023 05:52
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Ghost Leviathan posted:Everything I hear about that show is metal and 'how the gently caress did they get away with that in a kids show' though I imagine it doesn't hold up that great besides i remember watching that in elementary school and it was pretty hosed up for its time
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Jul 27, 2023 05:58
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Ghost Leviathan posted:I had the shark, and it was fuckin awesome. I had that and the big lava dude 
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Jul 27, 2023 06:06
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loquacius posted:https://twitter.com/nkulw/status/1684332168724488193?t=rrcj5aMKBhf-QtMbtO01HQ&s=19 dog they made that movie. it's called death to smoochy and it's rear end
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Jul 27, 2023 06:10
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Grapplejack posted:dog they made that movie. it's called death to smoochy and it's rear end go gently caress yourself (i haven't seen it since 2002) i think we had a big discussion on smoochy about a year ago and people that dove in for the first time said it's pretty mediocre
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Jul 27, 2023 06:12
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loquacius posted:https://twitter.com/nkulw/status/1684332168724488193?t=rrcj5aMKBhf-QtMbtO01HQ&s=19 Death to Smoochy already exists and is perfect tho
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Jul 27, 2023 06:17
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Teriyaki Hairpiece posted:I did Barbenheimer on Sunday and it was fuckin awesome DR FRASIER KRANG posted:I'm not gonna watch either of these movies just because gently caress em ☯️
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Jul 27, 2023 06:21
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i say swears online posted:go gently caress yourself (i haven't seen it since 2002) it's pretty bad and danny devito has no technical ability as a director
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Jul 27, 2023 06:23
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yeah it's a solid C-
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Jul 27, 2023 06:58
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gradenko_2000 posted:What about a Swat Kats movie Swat Kats would be some awesome bullshit. Just the absolute limits of kid-friendly fare with jets and explosions. No moral except that every problem can be solved by two idiots in an over-armed fighter jet, also maybe get the rights to Uncle Grandpa for the stinger.
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Jul 27, 2023 07:34
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death to smoochy rules. what the gently caress is wrong with you animals
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Jul 27, 2023 07:58
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Some Guy TT posted:Raissa Az Zahra, 21, of Jakarta, Indonesia, shares that sentiment. She found the movie’s themes to be personally relatable, and she said she believes it can help audiences who haven’t experienced womanhood, such as men or young children, better understand women’s perspectives. they have a jakarta method for women now i see
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Jul 27, 2023 10:09
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war on dudes is getting really hosed up
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Jul 27, 2023 10:12
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Some Guy TT posted:the barbie discourse will continue until morale improves So, I saw Barbie. Without question, this is a woke propaganda piece of a movie that is disguised to be seemingly innocent, unassuming, and a faithful depiction of Barbie. But given all the official trailers, marketing strategy, and that it uses the Mattel property Barbie–of all things–it is so far from it. Well, in any case, it is what it is, and there is no denying that. I could not help but notice some of the moviegoers who got to watch this movie with their friends or family, and the look of confusion, irritation, consternation painted on their faces by what they had just seen after this abysmal movie was over. How could the producers even have logically expected an otherwise reaction? Barbie is the world’s most recognized doll and so many girls from past and current generations love playing with their collection of Barbie dolls. It is connected to their youth and formative years. For many generations, the Barbie doll has been a well-loved toy in their young lives, and many who are now adults have turned to collecting Barbie dolls as a hobby, and a way of reconnecting with their childhood memories. But in this movie, I really do not know how the young moviegoers can comprehend it without going into some form of analysis, introspective thinking, and trying to dissect in their own little way what Barbie exactly stands for in this day and age when you have writers and filmmakers who can’t decide whether they love or hate Barbie. And that indecisive dichotomy and ambiguous approach only serve to confuse, upset, and frustrate this age demographic. In this movie, they put Barbie through the wringer and put her in some uncomfortable situations here, and she was “educated” once she crossed into our own world. WTF!!! Is this what you do to the human incarnation of the world’s most beloved doll? This should have been called “Barbie in a Woke World” because that is what it is. This movie would have been so much better if it had taken the moviegoers into the world or reality of Barbie and stayed there instead of pulling her out of her own wondrous world only to force her to conform and adjust to the new norms and expectations that exist now in a lot of places in different countries. For me, in an effort to slide in and insert a ton of socio-political themes through woke propaganda into this movie, it really hurt its fun factor and enjoyability. How in the realm of fantasy even can a movie entitled Barbie, which is supposed to be a live version of it, be so twisted and distorted into such a contortion of ugliness? If this movie had been made in the 1990s or even the early to mid-2000s, it would not have turned out in this manner, for sure. At least you would have had filmmakers and writers who are real fans of the doll and would want to put out a movie that is as entertaining and enjoyable as it can possibly be without radically changing the mythos that surrounds the Barbie doll. Go watch it and you would feel the same as to how they have destroyed and erased the mystique that the Barbie doll has had for so many generations! It is terribly upsetting that the fictional onscreen character based on a most beloved toy line that Margot Robbie portrays here could not be more woke than she can be by the end of the movie. And that saddening result would infuriate a lot more people to see what Barbie has been turned into here. I refer to parents who now will have a lot of explaining to do–and not even know what and how to say it– to their own little princesses at home what has happened to their Barbie. Little girls’ dreams to be like their beautiful Barbie doll, shattered. Can you imagine if there was a live-action movie of another beloved toy line anytime soon? I bet they would all end up waking up or being the complete opposite of themselves. I mean, how many more toys, how many cartoons, and how many childhood memories must be ruined like this again? This particular movie called Barbie should serve as a wake-up call for all the remaining normal, level-headed, discerning, talented, and young writers and filmmakers that they should always respect the mystique, lore, and legend of these timeless toys not only for the past generations that played with them but also for the current and future ones. Now, let us get to the positives of this movie Barbie. The first is Margot Robbie. She is one of the most famous actresses in the world; that is why casting her to be the lead here was the right choice. Second is the marketing strategy, which was brilliant, although ultimately it was misleading. How I wish it fulfilled its promise as to what Barbie was going to be in her own solo movie. Third is the production design; the sets are fantastic, appealing to the eyes, and colorful in the world of Barbie. Fourth is that Margot Robbie was laser-focused when it came to her dialogue, monologues, and more emotional scenes. Fifth is that there were a few laughs here and there. However, these five given positives are not enough to save Barbie from being a terrible movie. This wokeness in Hollywood movies has to stop. It is not normal at all. A lot of movies with the promise to be great, memorable, and enjoyable for everyone have been wasted because of the woke movement in Hollywood. A minimum of 100 million dollars was spent to make this movie. Barbie had a lot of potential only to be ruined by writers with a woke agenda in their minds. Add Barbie to that list of casualties of the woke movement in movies. Do I recommend watching it? Absolutely not.
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Jul 27, 2023 10:30
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I think everyone that calls things woke should be dropkicked
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Jul 27, 2023 11:41
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There is zero analysis in that review too, they just think it's woke and that makes them mad and that's the sum total. I can't even tell if they have the Barbie tradwife delusion because they don't go into enough detail about exactly what was woke about it to be sure.
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Jul 27, 2023 12:15
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They do seem to be under the impression that this movie was for kids (who don't have Barbies) rather than for millennials and xers (who did)
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Jul 27, 2023 12:18
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loquacius posted:They do seem to be under the impression that this movie was for kids (who don't have Barbies) rather than for millennials and xers (who did) wait, did they stop selling barbies years ago or something?
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Jul 27, 2023 12:21
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loquacius posted:TT, no offense, but I am especially not reading that one
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Jul 27, 2023 12:26
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ScootsMcSkirt posted:wait, did they stop selling barbies years ago or something? Nah they're just not as ubiquitous as they once were
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Jul 27, 2023 12:27
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I guess I don't have numbers on that but the target audience of the movie is absolutely grown women who were into Barbie when they were little and are into feminism now Anyway, https://twitter.com/kvetchkween/status/1684298951418171393?t=-cqpy-bRB7yH8B-rRx1qlg&s=19 Had to buy my daughter Suicidal Barbie, she was throwing a fit in the store and wouldn't leave without it
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Jul 27, 2023 12:29
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JCO is right.
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Jul 27, 2023 12:31
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ArmZ posted:JCO is right.
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Jul 27, 2023 12:46
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death to smoochie is a better movie than oppenheimer and barbie combined(obviously) edit: just to zero in on this further: daylight 1996 is probably not as good as barbie or oppenheimer Jokerpilled Drudge has issued a correction as of 12:54 on Jul 27, 2023 |
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Jul 27, 2023 12:49
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The Barbie Delusion
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Jul 27, 2023 12:55
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never a Gacha Barbie & probably never a Visual Novel Barbie or MMO Barbie or MOBA Barbie which would be too painful a mirror held up to 21st century US & the actual games of many girls & women.
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Jul 27, 2023 12:58
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in Daylight, Viggo plays a character who is basically some kind of advertising mogul Elon Musk. A large explosion caused by a carjacker leads to a dozen people being trapped in what I think is called the Holland Tunnel. Stallone is the hero of our story but before he can get there Viggo promises to use his expert rock climbing and leadership ability to get everyone out of the tunnel. He dies when a bunch of scrap falls on him and explodes like 30 minutes into the movie. The bad guys in the movie are those who want to open up the tunnel to ease traffic verdict: Daylight is socialist
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Jul 27, 2023 12:59
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When I went to see Barbie almost the entire audience was teenaged girls, wonder if they enjoyed it.
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Jul 27, 2023 12:59
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loquacius posted:I guess I don't have numbers on that but the target audience of the movie is absolutely grown women who were into Barbie when they were little and are into feminism now 
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Jul 27, 2023 13:02
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hazardous waste technician barbie confined space entry barbie enhanced interrogation barbie
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Jul 27, 2023 13:39
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