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What exactly are the ethics rules when a lawyer is being paid for by another defendant?
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Jul 31, 2023 20:58
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Lammasu posted:What exactly are the ethics rules when a lawyer is being paid for by another defendant? Generally it's to be avoided if you're an ethical attorney who cares about keeping his license. In theory those concerns can be avoided if everyone signs the right waivers and follows protocols. This never really works.
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Jul 31, 2023 21:08
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But Trump and his circle have just the best lawyers. Just the best.
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Jul 31, 2023 21:15
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 DeO already lied; it seems like adding him as a defendant simply includes all those involved with the alleged destruction, or attempted destruction, of evidence under subpoena. Sure one can always flip, but what would be the plea: Guilty of perjury, 3yr prison, versus accessory to destruction of property 1yr prison. (I'm inventing those sentences). Seems less like "flip please" and more like "have another count and it costs us nothing to list another defendant". (In fact last week I was wondering if they extended the indictment because the WA grand jury wasn't ready.  )T is on Tollbooth Special claiming the indictment is coming any day, which matches the statement from F Willis, and the schedule that was announced months ago. Last indictment was preceded by T leaking it, so with luck it will be this week. Tuesdays are good days for indictments; right?
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Jul 31, 2023 22:17
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Those guys are probably looking to go to
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Jul 31, 2023 23:17
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:Generally it's to be avoided if you're an ethical attorney who cares about keeping his license. Trump is leaving a trail of disbarments in his wake, isn't he?
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Jul 31, 2023 23:17
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Lammasu posted:Trump is leaving a trail of disbarments in his wake, isn't he? Yes, several of his former attorneys have been disbarred already.
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Jul 31, 2023 23:25
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gregday posted:Looking forward to his lawyer arguing that his “Never saw nothing” answer in DOJ interviews is not a lie because actually, it’s a double negative and he saw tons of poo poo. Posted this in the RWM thread but it works here also The 6pm guy on WGOP had a novel idea today. He said there's a possible defense for Trump because "he listened to his lawyers". Guy admitted Giuliani was wrong for the most part but tried to paint Donald as the victim because everything he learned about Dominion machines and all that was his attorneys telling him that and not something that Trump declared on his own. I know that "ineffective counsel" can be a defense except, in this case, we know that's full of poo poo because Trump got on TV and Tweeted crying about rigged elections well before the polls even opened. The funniest part was the host saying that "You never know, Donald Trump could throw those lawyers under the bus", THe best and brightest ones I imagine. Yeah, radio guy, Trump MIGHT throw someone under a bus if it saves his rear end. It would be a first.
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Aug 1, 2023 00:30
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Ineffective counsel is not a defense in criminal matters.
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Aug 1, 2023 00:34
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And if Trump did say that his lawyers essentially told him to break the law then the prosecutors get to pierce the veil using his own statements as probable cause that they're involved in furthering a crime.
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Aug 1, 2023 00:46
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BiggerBoat posted:Posted this in the RWM thread but it works here also This is not so much Ineffective Assistance of Counsel as it is a sort of play for Reliance on Advice of Counsel. Reliance can sometimes work in a criminal case because it makes it harder for the prosecution to establish the mens rea element of the charges. That assumes, of course, that you were being relatively forthcoming with your lawyer(s) and were acting on a good faith interpretation of their reasoned legal advice. If your actions have already triggered the Crime Fraud exception you may have trouble making that argument.
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Aug 1, 2023 00:51
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It's also bullshit because the only person that told him he could keep classified documents was the jack rear end from Judicial Watch.
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Aug 1, 2023 00:52
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There was a thing about Trump and some of his lawyers making drat sure some of the other lawyers wouldn’t have a full picture of their shenanigans which is not the best optics to be had if you want to play the victim of bad lawyering.
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Aug 1, 2023 01:07
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BiggerBoat posted:Posted this in the RWM thread but it works here also The way I understand it is that in order for you to claim you relied on counsel you have to give up the documents and other evidence showing you relied on counsel which means no more attorney client privilege. So, uh, yeah, I’d bet money that for every Giuliani telling trump to “ignore the rules, it’s fine”, there’s 8 others going “no that’s illegal you will go to jail”.
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Aug 1, 2023 01:14
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BiggerBoat posted:Posted this in the RWM thread but it works here also That is some sovereign citizen bullshit, there was no evidence that the election was stolen and the only people that were claiming it was were known cranks, advice of council is not running around until you find an coked up, drunk and mentally ill guy that happened to be admitted to the bar to tell you what you want to hear.
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Aug 1, 2023 01:15
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Michigan prosecutors charge Trump allies in felonies involving voting machines, illegal ‘testing’quote:A former Republican attorney general candidate and another supporter of former President Donald Trump have been criminally charged in Michigan in connection with accessing and tampering with voting machines after the 2020 election, according to court records.
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Aug 1, 2023 21:16
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🚨 Aw poo poo here we go again 🚨
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Aug 1, 2023 21:50
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cr0y posted:🚨 Aw poo poo here we go again 🚨 He’s probably lying about that too. 
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Aug 1, 2023 22:01
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https://twitter.com/cspan/status/1686481710840487936?t=2JEsQFG2309Xs4a_HWmwaA&s=19
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Aug 1, 2023 22:06
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Trump's been indicted over the attempted coup. e: clarified that this was Trump we were talking about
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Aug 1, 2023 22:36
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cr0y posted:🚨 Aw poo poo here we go again 🚨 WHY DIDNT THEY CHARGE ME FOR MY CRIMES 2.5 YEARS AGO??
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Aug 1, 2023 22:38
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Edward Mass posted:Trump's been indicted over the attempted coup. four charges for obstruction, attempted election fraud, blah blah blah the coup stuff is folded into the obstruction elements full indictment: https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.dcd.258149/gov.uscourts.dcd.258149.1.0_1.pdf conspiracy to defraud the us, conspiracy to obstruct an official proceeding, obstruction of an official proceeding, and conspiracy against rights i think that last one is the reconstruction era law and people are going to be telling you, technically accurately, that it potentially carries the death penalty if anyone died in the attempt (up to five people did)
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Aug 1, 2023 22:43
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it's not quite as much of a slam dunk and nowhere near as funny as "i, donald trump, am showing you, unnamed witness, these illegal documents which are very illegal" but the indictment's still a good read
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Aug 1, 2023 22:46
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Google Jeb Bush posted:four charges for obstruction, attempted election fraud, blah blah blah That's his third indictment, right? There's still at least Georgia and probably some other criming I'm forgetting about. He's been a very hard working crime president.
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Aug 1, 2023 22:48
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Somewhere, out there, a lot of people who work for the DoJ are getting absolutely tanked right now.
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Aug 1, 2023 22:50
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georgia's on basically the same topic but is state charges, which mostly matters if please god no he wins the election and tries to pardon himself well, and just in being another bite at the apple in case of perpetual hung juries. I personally tend to side with "jurors hang for political reasons less than you'd think" but the odds certainly ain't zero when it's a trumpist potentially keeping literally Donald Trump out of the federal slammer.
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Aug 1, 2023 22:51
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All I really want is for donny "dj" trump to die in jail. That can't be too much to ask for, can it?
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Aug 1, 2023 22:52
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For the law-knowers: are the co-conspirators listed in the indictment necessarily also being charged, or is it just "hey we know what you did, assholes"?
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Aug 1, 2023 22:56
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Time to update the crime calendar.
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Aug 1, 2023 22:57
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Timmy Age 6 posted:For the law-knowers: are the co-conspirators listed in the indictment necessarily also being charged, or is it just "hey we know what you did, assholes"? i don't think anyone knows whether they'll be charged separately but, reading this, i would certainly rather not be in their shoes right now lol
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Aug 1, 2023 22:58
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Google Jeb Bush posted:it's not quite as much of a slam dunk and nowhere near as funny as "i, donald trump, am showing you, unnamed witness, these illegal documents which are very illegal" but the indictment's still a good read Nothing will ever be as funny as that
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Aug 1, 2023 23:01
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It's my birthday, an indictment would make it 
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Aug 1, 2023 23:02
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Alctel posted:Nothing will ever be as funny as that  
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Aug 1, 2023 23:03
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My goal for my indictment reading is to figure out if Rudy is Co-Conspirator 1, 2, 3, 5, or 6. Money's on 6 but 3 is a strong contender.
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Aug 1, 2023 23:08
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Reports are that the case is assigned to Judge Tanya Sue Chutkan, an Obama appointee who has come down like a ton of bricks on the J6ers who have come before here (handing down sentences in excess of what the prosecution was asking for in some cases). Kind of the mirror opposite from that chudge her drew in Florida. Chutkan is a black woman, so I'm sure Trump will have a lot to say about that.
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Aug 1, 2023 23:08
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Live stream is starting. 2min statement, no questions... ps Well 3min, but wow what a speaker, a bit nervous at first but shrug. Basically summarized the charges, attack was unprecedented, fueled by lies, targeting a bedrock function of our country; thanked the law enforcements on January 6th, they defended our country, institutions, and principles. "Investigation of other individuals continues". In this case, "will seek speedy trial... indictment is an allegation... innocent until proven guilty" &c. PhantomOfTheCopier fucked around with this message at 23:20 on Aug 1, 2023 |
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Aug 1, 2023 23:11
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I want to know which one Boris Epstyn is
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Aug 1, 2023 23:12
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Tayter Swift posted:My goal for my indictment reading is to figure out if Rudy is Co-Conspirator 1, 2, 3, 5, or 6. Money's on 6 but 3 is a strong contender. Probably #1
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Aug 1, 2023 23:14
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when they announce that there will be no questions, is it a general rule that the reporters who still shout questions are uninformed, or that they're hoping for a super longshot that provokes a reaction?
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Aug 1, 2023 23:18
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wrap it up, trumpailures
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Aug 1, 2023 23:18
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