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It's hard to impress upon someone how seriously "zombies don't run" was taken at the time, lol. Totally absurd discourse.
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Aug 1, 2023 20:22
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Not all who run are alive...  
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Aug 1, 2023 20:31
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HUNDU THE BEAST GOD posted:It's hard to impress upon someone how seriously "zombies don't run" was taken at the time, lol. Totally absurd discourse. Same thing with "Jason doesn't run!!" complaints about the Friday the 13th reboot. He was sprinting all over the place in 2, 3, and 4.
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Aug 1, 2023 21:14
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Chairman Capone posted:I just want to say that even if the Ultimate Edition had been released theatrically, I don't think it would have changed things one bit. After Man of Steel, people's brains were broken about Snyder, and him then bringing a Frank Miller-inspired Batman into it was just fuel to the fire. Im not sure I agree. I think while it was always going to be a divisive movie, the UE would have at least helped ameliorate some of the criticisms against it. The way it elaborates on both Supermans and Batmans grievances, and the less frantic editing in particular would have made the movie less confusing to a significant chunk of the audience, and that's two of the big (legitimate) complaints I heard from the non-insane contingent. People are a lot less forgiving and way more nitpicky of movies they don't like, and most people that give the UE an honest chance think it's at least an improvement over the theatrical. Like I think it still would have made nerds mad, but I don't think people would have dunked on it as hard if they released the complete movie instead of three quarters of one.
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Aug 1, 2023 21:15
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HUNDU THE BEAST GOD posted:I thought I couldn't make Dawn of the Dead as a straight remake because the movie is social commentary and so I wanted to make a comment on the comment, you know what I mean? This was such a great interview, because after years of engaging in Sucker Punch discourse with the film's critics, it makes me feel good to read some words coming from Snyder himself that straight up affirms everything I've been saying/arguing for in favor of the film.
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Aug 1, 2023 21:19
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HUNDU THE BEAST GOD posted:It's hard to impress upon someone how seriously "zombies don't run" was taken at the time, lol. Totally absurd discourse. Equally stupid is the "infected aren't zombies" argument. Like, cordyceps or Rage virus make them not zombies because the explanation is biological. Are they former-humans who've been turned into feral, ego-less bodies who swarm together and kill everything? Are healthy people worried about being bitten and subsumed by the horde? They're zombies. I'm convinced it's an outgrowth of the absurd tactical realism that a particular audience puts on zombie stories. They aren't just horror/action genre exercises, they become some weirdo personal statement for this deeply self-serious group of (mostly male) viewers to obsess over - over "what they'd do," or "what the characters should've done," or "what the rules are." Suddenly changing some parameter feels like cheating or stacking the deck in a game, because these aren't stories with characters or themes, they're a kind of survivalist fantasy football for libertarians. I'd guess there's strong overlap of the dudes breathlessly raging over zombie media, and dudes who earnestly call normal people NPC's and watch Andrew Tate kind of poo poo.
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Aug 1, 2023 21:35
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I didn't realise that it was Dawn of the Dead that spawned all the "ZOMBIES DON'T RUN!!!" poo poo. For some reason, I always thought that was in response to 28 Days Later (which one came first?) poo poo, the Resident Evil remake gave you crimson heads in 2002, and those fuckers were fast
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Aug 1, 2023 23:21
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Aces High posted:I didn't realise that it was Dawn of the Dead that spawned all the "ZOMBIES DON'T RUN!!!" poo poo. For some reason, I always thought that was in response to 28 Days Later (which one came first?) 28 Days Later was the one that got more heat for not being a "real" zombie movie, because it empowered some people to try to gatekeep genres at the time. Never mind examples like Return of the Living Dead, which has zombies that run, think, strategize, and, most terrifyingly, can't be killed by any method (at most becoming infectious dust when they are burned or exploded). I think today the only real criticism I have of 28 Days later is that I'm glad the Filmed in Shittycam trend died out.
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Aug 1, 2023 23:30
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Roth posted:Return of the Living Dead would destroy their minds. The first zombie in the first "zombie" (ghoul) movie ever Night of the Living Dead tries to open the car door, picks up a rock to throw to break the window and then runs after the car as it rolls down the road. It doesn't start shambling until the other zombies show up. The "last" new zombie shown, the daughter, picks up a weapon and uses it against her mom. The complaints have *never* made sense.
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Aug 2, 2023 00:29
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Yeah, I remember the Zombie Purity Squad going with "28 Days Later doesn't count, they're merely infected" and not willing to hear any counterclaims about NOTLD, Return, etc., then really blowing their collective stack when Dawn '04 came out. It was very "Not My Superman" of its time.
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Aug 2, 2023 00:58
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McCloud posted:Im not sure I agree. I think while it was always going to be a divisive movie, the UE would have at least helped ameliorate some of the criticisms against it. The way it elaborates on both Supermans and Batmans grievances, and the less frantic editing in particular would have made the movie less confusing to a significant chunk of the audience, and that's two of the big (legitimate) complaints I heard from the non-insane contingent. Yea agreed here. Obviously it’s impossible to look into that alternate universe where it happened but don’t forget there was a good deal of hype and record presales for the movie before it released. The bad word of mouth and poor reviews almost certainly added to the big drop offs and from there I feel like you get a spiral effect where stories about how poorly it’s doing cause more people to decide to give it a skip. It’s probably crazy to claim it would have definitely crossed a billion but conversely it’s easy to imagine how a slightly better second weekend and less doom and gloom helps it out a decent amount.
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Aug 2, 2023 01:18
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28 Weeks Later... is really under-appreciated in the horror / zombie canon. It's a remarkably effective sequel and Juan Carlos Fresnadillo deserved to have a more prolific career.
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Aug 2, 2023 01:20
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I think the main reason the zombie purity poo poo had such staying power was because romero himself was fully on the "zombies don't run" train by the time it was a pop culture thing, and whenever people brought up the zombies in Night he'd just snap back with a comment about how, obviously, he hadn't gotten poo poo figured out by then
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Aug 2, 2023 01:21
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Beavis still made lots of money but it doesn't matter, anymore than popularity does who the gently caress cares about that poo poo All that matters for a movie is that it's good
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Aug 2, 2023 01:21
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Timby posted:28 Weeks Later... is really under-appreciated in the horror / zombie canon. It's a remarkably effective sequel and Juan Carlos Fresnadillo deserved to have a more prolific career. Yeah, it's a solid film I was unfamiliar with the director, but he's got two films coming out: The Sword in the Stone (Disney live-action remake) and Damsel (Millie Bobbie Brown vehicle).
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Aug 2, 2023 01:25
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Timby posted:28 Weeks Later... is really under-appreciated in the horror / zombie canon. It's a remarkably effective sequel and Juan Carlos Fresnadillo deserved to have a more prolific career. I remember at the time reading someone say it was an Alien / Aliens type contrast between 28 Days and 28 Weeks, and I gotta agree. I don't think I ever wanted more sequels but it is kinda surprising that those two don't seem to get much love anymore.
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Aug 2, 2023 02:19
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Bogus Adventure posted:Not all who run are alive... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bGqs4b5RiH0
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Aug 2, 2023 02:21
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I should rewatch 28 Weeks, I haven’t seen it since it came out. I remember nothing really living up to that opening scene, though. It makes sense given that I later learned that Boyle directed the opening bit. I saw 28 Days Later at a drive in at the height of the pandemic and it definitely still is effective.
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Aug 2, 2023 02:58
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Name Change posted:28 Days Later was the one that got more heat for not being a "real" zombie movie, because it empowered some people to try to gatekeep genres at the time. Never mind examples like Return of the Living Dead, which has zombies that run, think, strategize, and, most terrifyingly, can't be killed by any method (at most becoming infectious dust when they are burned or exploded). The only three movies that come to mind as having been filmed on “lovely” cameras on purpose are 28 Days Later (all time classic, beautiful looking), Inland Empire (incredible movie, also looks great) and Dog Soldiers (this may have been more of a budget thing but it looks pretty dang good and is a lot of fun). Can you give an example of a movie shot on these kinds of cameras with intent where it was a bad thing?
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Aug 2, 2023 03:30
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Blood Boils posted:Beavis still made lots of money but it doesn't matter, anymore than popularity does who the gently caress cares about that poo poo This is absolutely true, on the other hand if you want to tell a story across half a dozen very expensive movies, someone's going to have to pony up the cash and it helps if you can promise them a return on their investment Of course the Snyder films' problem wasn't that they didn't make money, it was that they didn't make MCU money eta: I think a lot of the negative reaction to MoS and BvS was down to DC fans wanting a big sprawling colourful cinematic universe like the MCU was shaping up to be, with lots of room for all their favorite characters (hell, I was one of them at the time) and Snyder's films just weren't that. Clipperton fucked around with this message at 03:38 on Aug 2, 2023 |
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Aug 2, 2023 03:34
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I wonder how much of it was the MCU specifically and how much was the assumption that since ZS's films made money but were also kind of love-them-or-hate-them, that a more middle-of-the-road approach would be more profitable.
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Aug 2, 2023 03:40
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Timby posted:28 Weeks Later... is really under-appreciated in the horror / zombie canon. It's a remarkably effective sequel and Juan Carlos Fresnadillo deserved to have a more prolific career. Cinematography falls off a cliff after the opening scene. The early Bourne "move the camera everywhere and don't focus on anything" works in that scene due to subtext, and then stops working after when it's in scenes that are outside perspective and you literally can't establish things. Also I haaaate CinemaSins things but, ugh, the premise of containment is so ridiculously stupid that it's really hard buying into the early points. I can't help but see the movie going through hoops to create the drama which is unfortunate.
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Aug 2, 2023 03:44
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Schwarzwald posted:I wonder how much of it was the MCU specifically and how much was the assumption that since ZS's films made money but were also kind of love-them-or-hate-them, that a more middle-of-the-road approach would be more profitable. An assumption that was quickly borne out when the decidedly middle-of-the-road Wonder Woman made as much money as BvS did with half the budget. At that point the writing was definitely on the wall
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Aug 2, 2023 03:51
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Babysitter Super Sleuth posted:I think the main reason the zombie purity poo poo had such staying power was because romero himself was fully on the "zombies don't run" train by the time it was a pop culture thing, and whenever people brought up the zombies in Night he'd just snap back with a comment about how, obviously, he hadn't gotten poo poo figured out by then The kids in the gas station ran and were hyperactive in Dawn too. That was so obviously Romero trying to hype himself up and get more money for future movies that it's ridiculous that the early Internet bought into it.
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Aug 2, 2023 03:55
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28 weeks has the epic double fakeout scare scene... a dude is doing guard duty, everything's a little too quiet, you know 100% something scary is coming... and BAM!!! it's his friend banging on a window to prank him, ok, you got me, let's move along, everything quiets down and you know something actually scary is gonna happen... and WHAM!!!!! it's the friend loving pranking him again. I couldn't help but respect the sheer audacity of it.
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Aug 2, 2023 05:02
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I will never forget my sense of excitement when that scene from the 28 weeks later trailer did not happen and something very different happened instead.
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Aug 2, 2023 05:31
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I love, love, love 28 Weeks Later. Days is great, but the sequel's on a whole other level.
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Aug 2, 2023 05:47
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IIRC correctly, I'm not sure the ShittyCam was a real stylistic choice in 28 Days Later. They shot it on digital in the early 2000s, they used guerilla filmmaking stuff to zoom in and get shots of abandoned London and such, they specifically chose digital because it was point and shoot and they didn't have time to get setups. Again, this is all from recollection. I remember thinking it looked like pastel muddy junk even when it was new.
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Aug 2, 2023 06:00
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It'll still be 28 weeks till I say I'm sorry
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Aug 2, 2023 06:21
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I think "choice" implies that they could've done anything else. I think it was a function of the budget and circumstance more than anything. It does look cool though.
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Aug 2, 2023 07:23
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Blood Boils posted:Beavis still made lots of money but it doesn't matter, anymore than popularity does who the gently caress cares about that poo poo https://twitter.com/gregsilverman/status/1686034340323667968 Snowman_McK posted:Lindsay Ellis is generally pretty good at analysing and thinking about film, ...arguable
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Aug 2, 2023 07:41
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Lindsay Ellis made the legal system research the Omegaverse for a case, so I'll always have a soft spot for her. Some judge out there will never be able to sleep without fear of a "knotting" nightmare popping into their subconscious.
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Aug 2, 2023 07:49
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A True Jar Jar Fan posted:It goes back to Dawn of the Dead but yeah, going by a lot of reactions at the time it literally didn't matter what was in the film, minds were made up about it in advance. It’s hard to agree with this, based off of my own experience. I loved MoS and was so disappointed by theatrical cut of BvS. Excising half of the manipulations taking place broke the logical narrative for me. The whole sequence that sent Superman to being investigated hardly made any sense as shown as well.
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Aug 2, 2023 10:51
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ghostwritingduck posted:It’s hard to agree with this, based off of my own experience. I loved MoS and was so disappointed by theatrical cut of BvS. Excising half of the manipulations taking place broke the logical narrative for me. The whole sequence that sent Superman to being investigated hardly made any sense as shown as well. I had pretty much the same experience. Was left pretty baffled by the BvS theatrical plot and for a while was very much on board the "Snyder is a hack" train. Then someone on here convinced me to watch the Ultimate Edition and I did a complete 180. I kinda wonder what the longterm consequences would be if WB hadn't sliced BvS' theatrical cut to ribbons to fit in more screenings.
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Aug 2, 2023 11:08
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I was sort of on the Snyder is a hack train up until the meme that he's an objectivist/MOS is an objectivist film started going round where I started thinking "wait that makes no loving sense"
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Aug 2, 2023 12:36
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I enjoyed but didn't really like BvS theatrical when I saw it because it was just so baroque and felt like a fever dream. It reminded me of some of the more fun one-shot comics/Elseworlds I've read. The Ultimate Edition kind of loses this due to all the connecting strands being in there but it does make me "like" it more, if that makes any sense.
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Aug 2, 2023 12:46
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Name Change posted:
The cinematography of 28 Days Later is beautiful despite the poor video technology used to capture it. I really wish I could see a an alternate reality version shot on 35mm because I love that movie overall.
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Aug 2, 2023 12:58
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ghostwritingduck posted:It’s hard to agree with this, based off of my own experience. I loved MoS and was so disappointed by theatrical cut of BvS. Excising half of the manipulations taking place broke the logical narrative for me. The whole sequence that sent Superman to being investigated hardly made any sense as shown as well. That's a reasonable reaction though, I'm talking about people who were (and often still are) blood curdling furious about the movies. There's no version they were going to like.
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Aug 2, 2023 14:20
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It would be interesting to see a hypothetical theatrical cut of BVS that had a lot more time put into it or even some other connective stuff to more effectively construct it as a dreamlike flick and not just a very choppy one like it came off as to me. I like the idea of like, the entire first act of the movie being a "dream" from the opening until Bruce wakes up the second time after seeing The Flash in his post apocalyptic armor. Like he was just in a haze this whole time since the world was introduced to Superman.
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Aug 2, 2023 14:28
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Megaman's Jockstrap posted:IIRC correctly, I'm not sure the ShittyCam was a real stylistic choice in 28 Days Later. They shot it on digital in the early 2000s, they used guerilla filmmaking stuff to zoom in and get shots of abandoned London and such, they specifically chose digital because it was point and shoot and they didn't have time to get setups. Again, this is all from recollection. I remember thinking it looked like pastel muddy junk even when it was new. I am mostly poking fun at it by calling it ShittyCam, but using a low-res digital camera was a deliberate stylistic choice and it's a bit silly to say that Danny Boyle just accidentally used a prosumer-tier digital camera. The washout in the often dark sets creates a situation where your mind is meant to fill in the gaps of what's not on screen. That works to an extent. I think where it falls apart is that it looks terrible on HD and the "guerrilla" filmmaking aspect rings false to me, nothing about the movie feels guerrilla (what does this even mean here?) except the low res camerawork. They shut down Westminster Bridge ffs. If one feels differently, to each their own. DeimosRising posted:The only three movies that come to mind as having been filmed on “lovely” cameras on purpose are 28 Days Later (all time classic, beautiful looking), Inland Empire (incredible movie, also looks great) and Dog Soldiers (this may have been more of a budget thing but it looks pretty dang good and is a lot of fun). Can you give an example of a movie shot on these kinds of cameras with intent where it was a bad thing? There was some odds and ends stuff that aped it at the time a bit (Isolation comes to mind but it might be because I watched a bad transfer of it on Shudder). I think digital being "new" (at least to mainstream stuff) led to some experimental choices like this that just aren't done very often now. It comes across to me as "of its time," like the early 2000's aggressive use of color filtering.
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Aug 2, 2023 17:49
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