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Meowywitch
Jan 14, 2010

Fight for all that is beautiful in the world


Any poison swamps?

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Triarii
Jun 14, 2003

Meowywitch posted:

Any poison swamps?

None that I've found, come to think of it. Some developers just don't understand how to design a game right.

Though there's one area that uses poison gas clouds to define the borders of the map, and walking into them causes your character to double over and instantly start vomiting a comically huge stream of green goop. Like, my dude, why was all that in you. What you been eating

kazil
Jul 24, 2005

Derpmph trial star reporter!

word is Armored Core will be nothing but poison swamps

Morpheus
Apr 18, 2008

My favourite little monsters
Speaking of Remnant (but the first one, since I never got very far in it), the bosses in that game also bug me, especially as a solo player. So far, every single one has been decent, except that they all summon additional enemies in their fights. So as a solo player, it's a real goddamn struggle to keep up with the waves of enemies while the boss is chasing you down and also you're getting hit repeatedly, can be a real pain in the rear end.

There are skills that allow you to summon allies, like flying skulls, and while going solo they are 100% required, which is dumb. They're also a little unbalanced, as they make some fights almost too easy, as they can just pepper the boss with attacks while I take on the minions and don't have to engage with the fight half as much as normal. Of course I'm not particularly far in the game, so maybe this changes, but I'm just finding those summons to be near-essential to not have a miserable time. Or, of course, actual friends to play with but the guy I usually play with already beat it on PC :(

Bussamove
Feb 25, 2006

Remnant 2 bosses have too much poo poo happening at any given time, or one extremely bullshit mechanic that’ll kill you instantly if you get caught out in it either by design or just the sheer amount of damage it does.

I’m looking at you Eye of the Custodian, and your blue bullets of death along with cover that will drop seemingly at random, often while I’m hiding behind you from said blue bullets.

Triarii
Jun 14, 2003

Bussamove posted:

Remnant 2 bosses have too much poo poo happening at any given time, or one extremely bullshit mechanic that’ll kill you instantly if you get caught out in it either by design or just the sheer amount of damage it does.

I’m looking at you Eye of the Custodian, and your blue bullets of death along with cover that will drop seemingly at random, often while I’m hiding behind you from said blue bullets.

Yeah that's one of the attacks I was thinking of. I actually thought it was like an enrage mechanic at first, where the boss just insta-kills you if you take too long to beat it because that attack vaporizes you so quickly.

Bussamove
Feb 25, 2006

Triarii posted:

Yeah that's one of the attacks I was thinking of. I actually thought it was like an enrage mechanic at first, where the boss just insta-kills you if you take too long to beat it because that attack vaporizes you so quickly.

The annoying thing is it’s always the feeling of “one mechanic too many”. Remove that and the fight is still engaging and difficult, just without feeling like you got hosed over. Almost every boss fight is like that, save for a couple that do feel like good fights as they are.

In a Soulsborne the solution to dying too quickly would be invest some levels in health, but in Remnant health increases are very finite and very underwhelming.

Just… tone it down one step, guys.

Post poste
Mar 29, 2010

kazil posted:

word is Armored Core will be nothing but poison swamps

Armored Core has always had poison swamps.
Embrace death, Raven.

Owl Inspector
Sep 14, 2011

Triarii posted:

A lot of the bosses in Remnant 2 are reminding me of a complaint I had with Noita - they tend to kill you so instantaneously that you don't even have a chance to be stressed out about being low on health and near death, ironically making the game less intense in a way. It makes me appreciate how tightly tuned fromsoft games are, where the bosses hit hard but leave you alive to try to heal, which leads to you starting to panic as your resources dwindle and you see your impending death approaching. Meanwhile Remnant is just splat, dead, respawn. I've upgraded the capacity of my estus-equivalent a bunch but I don't know what the point is because I hardly ever survive hits to actually use it.

it lets you stack damage reduction to extremely high levels and unfortunately it feels like they designed everything above the first difficulty around the expectation that you do that. on difficulty 2 of 4, I can just get instantly downed by most bosses with what feels like moderate investment in survivability. I would understand that on the highest difficulty but on this one I really feel like I should be allowed to take 1 hit with the health trait maxed and medium armor


different complaint: There are several equippable trinkets and an entire class that just make you get more exp/money instead of contributing to a useful build. They feel required anytime you aren't specifically struggling (the game is insanely stingy with basic money) and if the devs didn't think it was unbalanced to get resources at that rate then they should just be the default instead of making me waste my class or equipment on things that aren't fun or interesting to use.

Doctor Spaceman
Jul 6, 2010

"Everyone's entitled to their point of view, but that's seriously a weird one."

Inspector Gesicht posted:

Metroid Prime Remaster:

The game shows its age most in that the world is broken into long linear levels with few shortcuts and no real hubs. We really do owe the Soul series for improving the art of backtracking.

There's also no in-game checklist for tanks, missiles, and power bombs collected despite that being a thing in the last two metroid releases.

Also, this game turns into garbage in the mines.

Souls kinda gave up on interesting backtracking after the first one.

CJacobs
Apr 17, 2011

Reach for the moon!
Nearly every boss in Remnant 2 spawns adds, and then the boss itself keeps attacking you. You're also attacked by hordes of 15-20 enemies every minute or so no matter where you are or what you're doing. They just spawn from nowhere. I want to like this game but it's so exhausting.

Brazilianpeanutwar
Aug 27, 2015

Spent my walletfull, on a jpeg, desolate, will croberts make a whale of me yet?
Shadows of forbidden gods is strategy game where you play as (a selection) of evil gods and the goal is to awaken your sleeping god using minions on the map to cause chaos.

I like the game….but i don’t know what the gently caress i’m doing at any given time,everything is poorly worded and the map is largely static with just (terrible) portraits moving from place to place.

It could really benefit from some visual and audio cues (there are none).

Inspector Gesicht
Oct 26, 2012

500 Zeus a body.


Doctor Spaceman posted:

Souls kinda gave up on interesting backtracking after the first one.

There is stuff like the last level of DS3, the grand archive. A giant library and only one bonfire with so many paths doubling back to it.

Philippe
Aug 9, 2013

(she/her)
Stormveil Castle is also incredible for backtracking and opening up shortcuts to the bonfire.

Last Celebration
Mar 30, 2010
Realizing there was only the one bonfire in the archives was pretty cool when I got to the end and realized that’s what the deal was. Corpse run kinda sucked though, wasn’t even hard, it’s just that the elevators need to go at Mach speed for what they’re asking.

Speaking of, man, I don’t mind eating poo poo a million times trying to learn Orphan of Kos in Bloodborne, but the run being this super uneventful run combined with an elevator to the arena sucked my enthusiasm out of retrying. Which is a shame, because it’s a great fight, you just get frazzled when the retry entails eating time wasting. Statues of Marika are the best innovation a SoulsBorne’s ever had.

BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.

Doctor Spaceman posted:

Souls kinda gave up on interesting backtracking after the first one.

And the first one locked out fast travel til like 1/3 or 1/2 way into the game and most players found it to be a slog, including myself. It was sort of novel at the time and set the game apart as Brutally Difficult but I quit my NG+ run simply because I didn't feel like backtracking. Getting cursed and having to go all the way back to that ONE merchant loving sucked.

I do agree that the loop arounds were very well done though and liked that feeling when you came out of a door and recognized a certain area.

Nuebot
Feb 18, 2013

The developer of Brigador is a secret chud, don't give him money

Doctor Spaceman posted:

Souls kinda gave up on interesting backtracking after the first one.

The secret is that backtracking in Dark Souls was never interesting or fun no matter how many shortcuts you opened and just giving me the power to warp to bonfires from the start of the game is infinitely better than making me have to walk my rear end through dark root garden another god damned time.

Jokerpilled Drudge
Jan 27, 2010

by Pragmatica

Nuebot posted:

The secret is that backtracking in Dark Souls was never interesting or fun no matter how many shortcuts you opened and just giving me the power to warp to bonfires from the start of the game is infinitely better than making me have to walk my rear end through dark root garden another god damned time.

the shortcuts take too long to open in ds1, the connectedness everyone creams themselves over doesn't even exist for much of the game

sephiRoth IRA
Jun 13, 2007

"Science is not only compatible with spirituality; it is a profound source of spirituality."

-Carl Sagan
I'm replaying DS1 and some of the boss runs are no fun, most recently Seath. It's not an especially hard run from an enemy perspective but I always freak out on the bridges and I hate those stupid clams. Just leave me the gently caress alone, dudes, I'm trying to kill your boss or whatever! We're comrades!

Nuebot
Feb 18, 2013

The developer of Brigador is a secret chud, don't give him money

Jokerpilled Drudge posted:

the shortcuts take too long to open in ds1, the connectedness everyone creams themselves over doesn't even exist for much of the game

It's not even that connected! Only like a handful of chunky areas areas connect to each other in a way that matters, otherwise it's just branching paths to gently caress you. From firelink you can either go to the asylum, which is a dead end, to the catacombs which lead to the giant's tomb two thirds through the game which is a dead end, new londo which connects to the dark root basin and valley of the drakes, or to the undead burg which connects to dark root basin, lower burg if you have the master key and undead parish - which you later get a shortcut to as well. The undead parish connects to firelink via an elevator, the lower burg and dark root basin which connects to the undead burg, new londo and valley of the drakes. Lower undead burg connects to the undead burg, undead parish and the depths which connect to blight town which branches off to the Great Hollow leading to the ash lake and a dead end, the valley of the drakes or the demon ruins which, at the end of the game, opens up to lost izalith and a dead end. Sen's Fortress just leads to anor londo which branches off to either painted world or duke's archives at the end of the game which linearly leads to the crystal caves and a dead end.

Maybe I missed a shortcut to mention, but all of the connected nature of Dark Souls is based entirely around how much and how many times you want to walk through dark root basin. The valley of drakes doesn't even have a boss or anything, it's just a lovely little transition area.

Gerblyn
Apr 4, 2007

"TO BATTLE!"
Fun Shoe

BiggerBoat posted:

Getting cursed and having to go all the way back to that ONE merchant loving sucked.

I remember I got cursed once while going down the big tree, and I just couldn't get out at all. I abandoned the run and made a note to never go down the tree again before getting Magic Teleportation Bowl, because gently caress that.

Nostradingus
Jul 13, 2009

Star Wars Episode 1 Racer: it's not as fun as it was when I was 10

Mamkute
Sep 2, 2018
Resistance Fall of Man: The big guys with the cannons are boring bullet sponges.

BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.

sephiRoth IRA posted:

I'm replaying DS1 and some of the boss runs are no fun

None of them are fun and I'm glad the games gradually knocked that poo poo off

Phigs
Jan 23, 2019

I love how some people used to defend the boss runs and then they went away and nobody seemed to miss them or be upset that they're gone.

To be fair the boss runs did add something, they made you better learn and engage with the zone you were running through. But the overall impact was negative in mine and a bunch of other people's opinions and I think everyone else just quietly came to agree when they were served with a game that didn't have them.

marshmallow creep
Dec 10, 2008

I've been sitting here for 5 mins trying to think of a joke to make but I just realised the animators of Mass Effect already did it for me

BiggerBoat posted:

None of them are fun and I'm glad the games gradually knocked that poo poo off

In demon souls to a certain extent the run is the boss and the actual boss is just an elaborate gimmick that isn't actually that hard. Especially the swamp levels.

As the bosses got harder and the boss fights became the point, yeah, removing the run was the right choice.

Owl Inspector
Sep 14, 2011

BiggerBoat posted:

None of them are fun and I'm glad the games gradually knocked that poo poo off

:yeah:

Gaius Marius
Oct 9, 2012

Boss runs are good

credburn
Jun 22, 2016
President, Founder of the Brent Spiner Fan Club
What's a boss run?

mycot
Oct 23, 2014

"It's okay. There are other Terminators! Just give us this one!"
Hell Gem

credburn posted:

What's a boss run?

It's when there's a significant trek between the boss and the nearest checkpoint/bonfire, so for every shot at the boss you have to haul rear end all the way over there and deal with all the respawned enemies first.

kazil
Jul 24, 2005

Derpmph trial star reporter!

credburn posted:

What's a boss run?

about $3

Opopanax
Aug 8, 2007

I HEX YE!!!


Not much what's a boss run with you?

KingSlime
Mar 20, 2007
Wake up with the Kin-OH GOD WHAT IS THAT?!
I liked boss runs, it added atmosphere especially with how impacting it was to play my first souls game and exist in that environment

But I also like convenience. Both approaches are cool imo

Triarii
Jun 14, 2003

It doesn't have to be a proper "boss run", but I value having a moment to wind down and reflect between each attempt at a boss. Some games go the other direction and have you restart at a checkpoint right IN the boss fight, which makes all my attempts blur together and turns the whole experience into mush in my brain (also the lack of any penalty for dying means I tend to stop trying and just mash buttons until I luck into a win).

Captain Hygiene
Sep 17, 2007

You mess with the crabbo...



I'm the exact opposite, there's almost nothing you can do to make me more frustrated than put anything in the way of me restarting a boss fight. I'll even get angry at five seconds of dialogue beforehand if I have to restart the boss enough times :arghfist::saddumb:

Byzantine
Sep 1, 2007

Boss runs are awful except when you've played enough that the enemies are no longer a threat so you get to style on them for how they bullied you.

Morpheus
Apr 18, 2008

My favourite little monsters

marshmallow creep posted:

In demon souls to a certain extent the run is the boss and the actual boss is just an elaborate gimmick that isn't actually that hard. Especially the swamp levels.

As the bosses got harder and the boss fights became the point, yeah, removing the run was the right choice.

Going back to play the remake after not playing the game since it first released was so strange because of this. The bosses were more varied and in many cases more like puzzles than the typical boss fights that they became later in the series, and the levels themselves could be drat hard, like the second level of the storm world, which took me so long that getting to the boss itself was a relief.

Sally
Jan 9, 2007


Don't post Small Dash!

Mamkute posted:

Resistance Fall of Man: The big guys with the cannons are boring bullet sponges.

throw more hedgehogs

Sally
Jan 9, 2007


Don't post Small Dash!
legit resistance gives you a weapon wheel. drop your big guns on the big guys.

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BioEnchanted
Aug 9, 2011

He plays for the dreamers that forgot how to dream, and the lovers that forgot how to love.

Captain Hygiene posted:

I'm the exact opposite, there's almost nothing you can do to make me more frustrated than put anything in the way of me restarting a boss fight. I'll even get angry at five seconds of dialogue beforehand if I have to restart the boss enough times :arghfist::saddumb:

"Don't you get it Sora? Kairi's heart rests within you!"
"Don't you get it Sora? Kairi's heart rests within you!"
"Don't you get it Sora? Kairi's heart rests within you!"
"Don't you get it Sora? Kairi's heart rests within you!"
"Don't you get it Sora? Kairi's heart rests within you!"
"Don't you get it Sora? Kairi's heart rests within you!"
"Don't you get it Sora? Kairi's heart rests within you!"
"Don't you get it Sora? Kairi's heart rests within you!"
"Don't you get it Sora? Kairi's heart rests within you!"
"Don't you get it Sora? Kairi's heart rests within you!"

Then you finally beat the fucker.

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