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SirSamVimes posted:edit: It's really funny to me how some devs have responded to how amazing BG3 is by saying that you can't expect other devs to step up and actually make good games, larian are witches or something. The trick is they can't say the quiet part out loud because a man with a gun is standing two feet to their right if they say anything on Twitter while visibly being a studio dev. The quiet part being that, yeah, we actually can't expect this kind of quality from most studios, they're not out here calling Larian names or something. They're quietly pleading with people on Twitter to realize that Larian had six years, two massively successful prior games and an already really good engine for exactly the game they were building and a decade of experience with it. Not to mention multiple years of feedback. Most devs are lucky to get three years in a complete vacuum with no feedback at all. Is that, you know, great? No, it sucks rear end and even if it didn't always result in games as good as BG3 we should probably stop institutionally working video game devs to death on ridiculous schedules that basically haven't changed for most teams since the early 2000s. But it does mean those devs aren't wrong.
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Aug 14, 2023 04:01
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Wish there was an option to never to talk my companions. The number of times I've accidentally talked to someone instead of moving or selecting something is nuts.
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Aug 14, 2023 04:09
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SirSamVimes posted:For some reason being nice to him at all makes him think he is in a romance with you so when I ended up getting with the character I actually wanted to, he got huffy at me. I think I hit the right combination with Gale. He did the PUA routine of teaching me magic, then I clearly turned him down. After that he invited me to look at the stars and that conversation was just being sad about his ex wanting him to kill himself, but you know what, he has friends now so maybe life is worth living. It was very sweet.
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Aug 14, 2023 04:15
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 The only weapons I need are these muscles
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Aug 14, 2023 04:16
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There's an dialogue option in CK3 to tell someone who tried to seduce you to gently caress off, and nobody ever better even think of trying that again, thereby excluding you from future seduction attempts. It's apparently a great relief for IRL women who are sick of being pestered for sex every few seconds. ...I wonder if BG3 needs that option?
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Aug 14, 2023 04:17
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Serephina posted:There's an dialogue option in CK3 to tell someone who tried to seduce you to gently caress off, and nobody ever better even think of trying that again, thereby excluding you from future seduction attempts. It's apparently a great relief for IRL women who are sick of being pestered for sex every few seconds. Yes please, I don't want to deal with all this horny nonsense in my murder simulator.
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Aug 14, 2023 04:18
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deep dish peat moss posted:BG3 is a cool game (I have a lot of nagging complaints about it) but I'm always going to be eternally curious how much lower its sales/playercount would be if they didn't lean extra hard into horniness. It is a legitimately good game underneath the horniness but the horniness is the part that even still dominates a lot of the discussion being had about the game among casual gamers, and telling each other horny stories is what a lot of modern D&D groups are all about, so I think the extreme horniness is what let them capture all of the non-"core" gamers who otherwise wouldn't play CRPGs and just want horny animated media to interact with. While a goon spending an eternity being obsessed thinking about how horny those dang video games are these days is not exactly surprising, I don't believe it translates to sales on that scale quite simply as all that. What I bet it more likely is, aside from the game being very good with marketing and a trusted team behind it obviously, is that the party members and characters in general are very well-liked and written. When people talk about games like say, the old Baldur's Gate games, it is pretty universally the characters and primarily party members that people reminisce about rather than the fights or the quests. From my experience fandoms live and die on the strength of the characters and their interactions when it comes to character-focused RPGs like this, and while being able to bang them in-game and not just in fanfiction is welcome to many, it does require people actually caring about said characters to begin with. The higher amount of sexual content is no doubt having people talking, just like 2B's rear end had people talking about Nier Automata on a scale they likely wouldn't have otherwise, but the vast majority of people are not going to buy or recommend a full-price game solely because of it unless the actual game is worth buying and playing for its actual main merits.
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Aug 14, 2023 04:18
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gamers horny, huh? well I'll be
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Aug 14, 2023 04:26
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I play BG3 for the articles
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Aug 14, 2023 04:41
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fez_machine posted:I play BG3 for the articles
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Aug 14, 2023 05:04
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fez_machine posted:Steam Thread: I play BG3 for the articles
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Aug 14, 2023 05:08
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Orv posted:The trick is they can't say the quiet part out loud because a man with a gun is standing two feet to their right if they say anything on Twitter while visibly being a studio dev. This whole argument is so annoying because it's all like... completely speculative. Nobody is actually saying that other devs are lazy compared to Larian, but people are worked up over the fact that someone in the future is going to do that. And, like... BG3 is good, but it's not the be-all end-all of CRPGs or anything. It feels like it's another iteration on what that studio has been doing since Divinity Original Sin in 2014. It has a lot of the same UI problems, and still has way too many fiddly pieces of loot to sort through in every container. It's not some diamond-cut masterpiece that nobody can ever live up to, it's just another game from a studio that makes games like this. Where was all this hand-wringing around Elden Ring? I guess it's just people using this as an excuse to bemoan the state of the video game industry, but it just strikes me as very silly and disingenuous.
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Aug 14, 2023 05:11
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It's fascinating because I know BG3 had been in EA for a long time and I love CRPGs but I never bothered with 3 because I didn't like the encounter design in D:OS2 (why even have an element system when 'demon blood lit on fire' is the standard in half the fights) and 5e is a very mediocre RPG combat system. Some of my closest friends are huge D&D/CR fans and they've been playing it but never mentioned anything aside from the game being very good.
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Aug 14, 2023 05:20
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Begemot posted:Where was all this hand-wringing around Elden Ring? Literally the same thing happened when Elden Ring came out. Devs said don't expect this to be the new norm, people freaked out. It's also really not speculative at all, the last decade has had more and more devs talk about how it goes in the industry. E: Though granted I want to say the devs who spoke out on the Elden Ring point were a bit less diplomatic about it. Orv fucked around with this message at 05:24 on Aug 14, 2023 |
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Aug 14, 2023 05:21
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Begemot posted:This whole argument is so annoying because it's all like... completely speculative. Nobody is actually saying that other devs are lazy compared to Larian, but people are worked up over the fact that someone in the future is going to do that. It's also not "lazy devs" people should be angry at. It's the publishers, the venture capital, the bullshit producer notes that these creatives have to deal with. That's the difference between them and Larian, they just can't say that.
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Aug 14, 2023 05:26
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Begemot posted:Where was all this hand-wringing around Elden Ring? It did happen with Elden Ring. Which led to images like this being made 
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Aug 14, 2023 05:26
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Warning: Our game contains sick-rad kick flips.
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Aug 14, 2023 06:17
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Orv posted:The trick is they can't say the quiet part out loud because a man with a gun is standing two feet to their right if they say anything on Twitter while visibly being a studio dev. Wasn't the whole conversation started by one of the devs on Space Warlord Organ Trading Simulator? Because, yes, small indie devs in particular are not going to be competing with Larian on scale. Begemot posted:This whole argument is so annoying because it's all like... completely speculative. Nobody is actually saying that other devs are lazy compared to Larian, but people are worked up over the fact that someone in the future is going to do that. Honestly, I don't think that's true. I think a lot of devs get poo poo about how their games don't have XYZ of massive AAA games.
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Aug 14, 2023 06:21
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Is anyone really going to be comparing Indie RPGMaker Game to BG3? I thought the comparisons are going to be reserved for something like when Elder Scrolls 6 comes out and is inevitably way worse and has less features.
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Aug 14, 2023 06:32
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I urge people to read the last few pages of the Pillars of Eternity thread which just had this discussion https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3856099&userid=0&perpage=40&pagenumber=882
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Aug 14, 2023 06:35
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mycot posted:Is anyone really going to be comparing Indie RPGMaker Game to BG3? I thought the comparisons are going to be reserved for something like when Elder Scrolls 6 comes out and is inevitably way worse and has less features. I mean, sane people will only compare AAA/AA stuff to BG3 but have you met the internet?
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Aug 14, 2023 06:48
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Leal posted:It did happen with Elden Ring. Which led to images like this being made Entirely deserved, some of the moaning during the Elden Ring version was of this convo came from Open World Game devs who had worked on Ubisoft-style games. sour grapes lol KazigluBey fucked around with this message at 08:40 on Aug 14, 2023 |
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Aug 14, 2023 08:25
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The elden ring version of it was funnier because at least one of the angry devs was tweeting about how it's a bad game for lacking the things in that mock screenshot, not just tweeting that it set unrealistic expectations. edit: here it is:  https://www.gamerbraves.com/horizon-and-ubisoft-game-developers-lock-twitter-accounts-after-posting-bitter-elden-ring-tweets/ The guy complaining about the UI is a Ubisoft UI designer, the woman complaining about the graphics is a graphics programmer on the LEGO games, the guy complaining about quest design is a quest designer for Horizon: Zero Dawn/Forbidden West. deep dish peat moss fucked around with this message at 09:13 on Aug 14, 2023 |
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Aug 14, 2023 09:06
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Aug 14, 2023 09:24
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Ubisoft developers have no right to criticize anything. They haven't made anything that's not garbage in decades. It would only be funnier if a Bethesda developer did the same.
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Aug 14, 2023 09:28
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darkly ironic lol
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Aug 14, 2023 09:32
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deep dish peat moss posted:The elden ring version of it was funnier because at least one of the angry devs was tweeting about how it's a bad game for lacking the things in that mock screenshot, not just tweeting that it set unrealistic expectations. They're not complaining??? They're saying Elden Ring is excellent and that all their work on Ubisoft stuff has been wasted because Elden Ring is so good without all the stuff they are employed to do
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Aug 14, 2023 10:21
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Huh. I guess I hadn't thought of it that way when I've seen that image before. "My life is a lie" really could be them them stating that what they do is less important to the perceived quality of games than they thought. I guess I'm so irony poisoned that I interpreted it differently. Now I'm not sure what to think.
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Aug 14, 2023 10:26
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fez_machine posted:They're not complaining???
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Aug 14, 2023 10:35
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"Reviewers don't give a flaming poop about UX" shows he didn't get it at all. The issue isn't that UX is less important than he thought, the issue is that many people perceive the Ubisoft approach to UX as terrible:
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Aug 14, 2023 10:43
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That assumes he thinks his job is to make games better. I could easily believe he thinks his job is to make number go up. I mean, it's definitely why Ubisoft employ... well everyone they employ.
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Aug 14, 2023 10:46
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fez_machine posted:They're not complaining??? they're clearly being salty about their lovely games getting owned by elden ring, and that the stuff they're paid to work on sucks rear end and doesn't matter
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Aug 14, 2023 10:46
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actually i take the last bit back, their work does matter. it makes the games worse.
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Aug 14, 2023 10:48
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Even Ubisoft games have parts that are extremely well done, but I assume the management is the part in the hierarchy that insists on putting them into tired franchises.
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Aug 14, 2023 10:52
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Speaking of Elden Ring. Does anyone else also hate it when they stop using numbers for the sequels for no reason?   
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Aug 14, 2023 10:52
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What do you mean, Elden Ring is clearly a prequel?
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Aug 14, 2023 10:58
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Things from established Open World Design that Elden Ring could have learned from and used to their benefit:   Can't believe people uncritically praised the game and called it GOTY when it was missing such core design pillars... And now people are doing the same with Baldur's Gate III?! Slap in the face to decades of AAA luminaries.
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Aug 14, 2023 10:59
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Jack Trades posted:Speaking of Elden Ring.
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Aug 14, 2023 11:10
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Jack Trades posted:Speaking of Elden Ring.
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Aug 14, 2023 11:13
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KazigluBey posted:Things from established Open World Design that Elden Ring could have learned from and used to their benefit: If you can't use a credit card to trivialize challenges and skip progress, then can it even be called AAA?
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Aug 14, 2023 12:01
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