Star Citizen: $48,000 is only $334/month for 12 years

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Video Games > Star Citizen: $48,000 is only $334/month for 12 years

dr_rat: Jun 4, 2001

BigglesSWE posted:

Starfield isn�t released yet so I guess it�s theoretically possible that everyone who pre-ordered will get a jpg. with the words �dreams� scribbled on it instead of a game but I doubt it.

Bethesda's obviously just being playing the 30 year long con. All four hundred or so staff all already have plane tickets to non-extradition countries. They'll disappear like tears in a stream never to be heard from again.

(they slipped $50's to all the reviewers who cliaim they have "advanced copies" to play a long. Were dealing with criminal geniuses here, they have every angle figured).

# ? Aug 22, 2023 08:14

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# ? Jun 5, 2024 21:29

Bushboy2000: Jul 19, 2022

Only Kindness posted:

In the latest St*rf**ld scandal news, apparently the main menu is too sparse.

()

One of the early access reviewers, playing now, said "... once you start playing StarField, you wont give a gently caress about the main menu.... " 🤣

Bugs are supposedly fairly minimal as well 😳

We won't really know until we get our hands on it, here's hoping though 🙏

# ? Aug 22, 2023 09:55

Midnight Voyager: Jul 2, 2008; Lipstick Apathy

TheDeadlyShoe posted:

i mean, its fine, but its also pretty low effort.

space game X4 uses panning in-engine scenes with spaceships flying around
top-rated Baldur's Gate 3 uses a fantasy city view that transitions (when the player clicks) into a scene of an adventuring party descending into a hellish dungeon

both are pretty effective at setting the mood

And people already modded that transition out because it's annoying the tenth time you launch the game.

# ? Aug 22, 2023 10:41

Sandweed: Sep 7, 2006; All your friends are me.

Bushboy2000 posted:

One of the early access reviewers, playing now, said "... once you start playing StarField, you wont give a gently caress about the main menu.... " 🤣

Bugs are supposedly fairly minimal as well 😳

We won't really know until we get our hands on it, here's hoping though 🙏

Bethesda giving out copies early to reviewers, I thought they stopped doing that.

# ? Aug 22, 2023 11:15

NoNotTheMindProbe: Aug 9, 2010; pony porn was here

Sandweed posted:

Bethesda giving out copies early to reviewers, I thought they stopped doing that.

The review embargo lifts a week before the release date so Todd must be feeling confident.

# ? Aug 22, 2023 11:28

lobsterminator: Oct 16, 2012

I've tried to avoid Starfield info as much as possible. The mainmenugate has been impossible to avoid. I hope they add lots of useless visual elements to the menu before launch! It's very important to have clutter!

# ? Aug 22, 2023 11:41

Veotax: May 16, 2006

Sandweed posted:

Bethesda giving out copies early to reviewers, I thought they stopped doing that.

They meddled with the idea around Doom 2016, but after they completely hosed the marketing on that game and made it look like poo poo in previews (the first time we got a look at what the game really is was when Nvidia posted an un-cut gameplay video of a late-ish arena), I guess they decided they did need reviews around launch and went back to giving press early access.

So yes, Bethesda does give out early copies, other than the one time they tried it for like a few months.

# ? Aug 22, 2023 11:49

holtemon: May 2, 2019; Dancing is forbidden

lobsterminator posted:

I've tried to avoid Starfield info as much as possible. The mainmenugate has been impossible to avoid. I hope they add lots of useless visual elements to the menu before launch! It's very important to have clutter!

Yeah I was gonna play this but if the main menu doesn't have a store page link or calendar of events I'm not even gonna bother

# ? Aug 22, 2023 12:41

dr_rat: Jun 4, 2001

Also what's with having all the menu items in simple easy to understand English?

Everyone knows menu items should be random symbols that you have no idea what they do until you click on them. They should also all be in random separate parts of the screen and blend soothingly into the menu screen background so as not to annoying stand out so you might accidentally discover that they are an menu item.

# ? Aug 22, 2023 12:50

Randalor: Sep 4, 2011

Listen, if my main menu isn't just a psychedelic kaleidoscope of ever-shifting shapes and colors, with loud random noise and the only way to tell if I've found a menu option is that it plays a noise that's lost in the cacophony of light and sound, is it even a main menu?

If it doesn't play a 2+ hour unskippable cutscene every time I try to start, how do I know the developers even care about the game quality?

# ? Aug 22, 2023 12:55

lobsterminator: Oct 16, 2012

Starfield main menu items could be placed inside a scrollable container. Would make it much more impressive, like SC elevators.

# ? Aug 22, 2023 13:01

holtemon: May 2, 2019; Dancing is forbidden

Starfield dev Pete Hines just confirmed planets will be fully explorable too lol

# ? Aug 22, 2023 13:10

Mustache Ride: Sep 11, 2001

Y'all ready for Star Citizen pt2: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/bholland/unc-pathfinder-taking-storytelling-to-the-next-level

# ? Aug 22, 2023 13:15

Arc Light: Sep 26, 2013

lobsterminator posted:

Starfield main menu items could be placed inside a scrollable container. Would make it much more impressive, like SC elevators.

What's truly impressive that with only 19 years to improve upon the concept, SC managed to make that look less polished than the interactive control panels in Doom 3 (2004)

And probably less functional than the interactive displays in the excellent Prey 2017, which were interactive to such a degree that the player could use a Nerf gun to hit touchscreen pixels from a distance.

I wonder what fresh innovation from 2010 they'll bring into the SC 2030 alpha build.

# ? Aug 22, 2023 13:22

jarlywarly: Aug 31, 2018

Veotax posted:

They meddled with the idea around Doom 2016, but after they completely hosed the marketing on that game and made it look like poo poo in previews (the first time we got a look at what the game really is was when Nvidia posted an un-cut gameplay video of a late-ish arena), I guess they decided they did need reviews around launch and went back to giving press early access.

So yes, Bethesda does give out early copies, other than the one time they tried it for like a few months.

Was this the one where they got someone to play it who had never played an FPS before to demo it?

# ? Aug 22, 2023 14:18

trucutru: Jul 9, 2003; by Fluffdaddy

Arc Light posted:

And probably less functional than the interactive displays in the excellent Prey 2017, which were interactive to such a degree that the player could use a Nerf gun to hit touchscreen pixels from a distance.

Pfft. SC displays are so interactive that you could approach a chariot, zoom in on its control panel from the outside, and be able to interac with it.

# ? Aug 22, 2023 14:19

Veotax: May 16, 2006

jarlywarly posted:

Was this the one where they got someone to play it who had never played an FPS before to demo it?

Don't think so. There was some embarrassing gameplay footage that Polygon put out, that looked like it was someone who had no idea how to play and FPS, that that was Polygon being stupid, not Bethesda.

Bethesda hosed up by having all the E3 demos and such being played in a way where the game looked like a crappy slow and tense horror shooter or whatever, where you had to constantly use glory kills and the chainsaw, and not what Doom 2016 actually was.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QiinO9JPUGw&t=145s

And then they spent all their time on marketing the multiplayer that no one cared about.

# ? Aug 22, 2023 14:43

Thoatse: Feb 29, 2016; Lol said the scorpion, lmao

https://i.imgur.com/QoNZMmR.mp4

# ? Aug 22, 2023 16:30

lobsterminator: Oct 16, 2012

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ek3I6_9c58E

# ? Aug 23, 2023 07:35

i am a moron: Nov 12, 2020; "I think if there’s one thing we can all agree on it’s that Penn State and Michigan both suck and are garbage and it’s hilarious Michigan fans are freaking out thinking this is their natty window when they can’t even beat a B12 team in the playoffs lmao"

Bethesda really pulling out the stops to convince people this won�t be trash huh

# ? Aug 23, 2023 12:19

dr_rat: Jun 4, 2001

I think Starfield's likely to be the normal bethesda janky fun, but man am I not excited by any CGI trailers these days.

Anything other than actual gameplay footage I just turn off.

# ? Aug 23, 2023 12:34

Rotten Red Rod: Mar 5, 2002

i am a moron posted:

Bethesda really pulling out the stops to convince people this won’t be trash huh

I interpret it more as Microsoft's marketing being way more flashy and savvy than anything Bethesda has ever been able to do on their own.

# ? Aug 23, 2023 14:29

Sardonik: Jul 1, 2005; if you like my dumb posts, you'll love my dumb youtube channel

Let's loving goooo! (In two months, after the launch issues are ironed out and the basic QOL mods have been made)

# ? Aug 23, 2023 14:39

MarcusSA: Sep 23, 2007

Sardonik posted:

Let's loving goooo! (In two months, after the launch issues are ironed out and the basic QOL mods have been made)

Na it�s gonna be good at launch. The review copies people have gotten are getting really great comments so far.

The reviews are gonna be great for this.

# ? Aug 23, 2023 14:41

dr_rat: Jun 4, 2001

The one game where random things on a table actually have a reason to randomly start floating and there not even going to.

Blaspheme!!!

# ? Aug 23, 2023 14:45

Randalor: Sep 4, 2011

Sardonik posted:

Let's loving goooo! (In two months, after the launch issues are ironed out and the basic QOL mods have been made)

I mean, Bethesda games are fine at launch, and that's when you get the funnier bugs and glitches. It's on gamepass, so I'll give it a go at launch, but I don't know if I would shell out full retail at launch for it.

# ? Aug 23, 2023 14:46

Mirificus: Oct 29, 2004; Kings need not raise their voices to be heard

quote:

I don't see this as any type of argument, I don't follow the logic. Invent a different scenario based upon nothing, presume that scenario must be the case because we haven't heard anything recently to argue against the premise. Why would they even try to refute such a premise if they know they covered the subject, and they have no idea that someone might think up such a thing?

Why would they make such a huge change to their plans, the interview where Chris talked about it happened after all the main story elements were set in stone, ie after the 2015 mocap shoot. We all know they don't endlessly repeat information they've already given us, unless there is a change.

We know they expanded the original story of Squadron 42 both because Chris told us, and because the vertical slice mission is set in a star system that was a $4 million stretch goal - after the original Squadron 42 pitch on Kickstarter. Why would I assume they've taken stuff out while they've been busy adding more stuff?

How far do we go back? 1 year, 2 years? Should we doubt everything more than 2 years old if it's not in the game today, just to suit those who may have a generally negative view? Why not go the whole hog and just presume they've dropped Squadron 42 altogether, they haven't mentioned it in person for about 9 months. Plenty of time to change their minds.

How do we square such scepticism with the fact that Chris has told everyone that if they reach a certain part of Squadron 42 you get 'the badge' to own an F8C Lightning in the PU? Don't we assume that if that changed CIG might expect people to be disgruntled about it?

Struggling to see where such a notion might spring from: Those advertising posters in UEE Naval uniform in the alpha release of the game that say 'Service Guarantees Citizenship' might they not have been quietly taken out?

Absence of [recent] evidence is not evidence of absence. Conspiracy theories are just that, theories.

I recently learned that those who were noisily insisting for years that <a certain anticipated feature> had been dropped completely from the game were just plain wrong, and some of them saying it knew it was wrong even while they were insisting on it. Why do I know? Because it was them I got the evidence of it's continued development from. But hey, they could still have dropped it (again?) in the meantime, who knows? It's not a slam dunk.

Who should I trust? Some guy on the interwebz with a theory or Chris, and Erin who I also spoke to in person about what I mentioned above? I'll leave it to each to make up their own mind... only time will tell.

If the subject comes up I'll put my case to the best of my knowledge, let others make their case and the reader can decide.

This is my advice to anyone: If you get the opportunity go and ask them yourself if it matters to you more than the next ship you want to know about. They get pretty chatty in person and they seem to like it when someone doesn't ask the same questions for the 50th time that day. Pay attention to who you are talking to, the director of community content won't be able to tell whether or when the mech suit will make it into the game. You can find out a few things you thought must be a deep dark secret, turns out, they aren't they just never bothered to mention them publicly or they thought we already knew. Like, the Terra Nova system was going to be the first system in PU, and Terra Prime the first landing zone not Stanton, but they changed their minds when procedural planet tech became a reality, Stanton had more diversity to incrementally test the new tech - apparently. Courtesy of Jared... because I asked, what happened to all the work on Terra Prime?

It's been only 2 years since Tony Zurovec told everyone that virtual AI NPC's have a continuing history log attached to them, and that was the reason for having a running backend simulation of the game universe as well as the live game so that AI NPC's didn't just go into stasis when not spawned in on a DGS around players, why should players have any less in a game planned to have full persistence and character progression? What Chris, Erin and Tony have said consistently makes sense to me taking the aims of the project as a whole, what others might think makes less so.

# ? Aug 23, 2023 16:45

Popete: Oct 6, 2009; This will make sure you don't suggest to the KDz
That he should grow greens instead of crushing on MCs; Grimey Drawer

My advice is to show up at CIGs office, ask some random dev a question which you will hold as 100% pure irrefutable fact for the next 5 years.

# ? Aug 23, 2023 17:13

Mirificus: Oct 29, 2004; Kings need not raise their voices to be heard

quote:

It does fit the sandbox genre, however where it goes beyond the sandbox MMO genre is the plan for the living breathing universe populated with active AI. As is usual for CIG they don't want to go with the standard form of AI and a faked background economy and lore they want to create a whole new type of AI and a universe that is self-sustaining and continually changing. Tony Zurovec explained it very well in his presentation, it's too expensive to keep tens of thousands of active goal orientated AI in live server memory and if they aren't in memory then they can't do anything - that is one of those hard facts of life you just can't ignore, data written on a hard drive doesn't change.

You can't manually script tens of thousands of NPC's unless they are all doing easily repeatable predictable behaviours - this would be the standard approach. How many games have free roam NPC's using their own vehicles and using public transport? Working toward their own goals? The current NPC's are running on legacy CryEngine logic via Subsumption, that's why they are static in a location, it's the same type of scripted NPC logic you find in all other games. Ironic isn't it? They want Star Citizen to be made like other games, yet the features of those games technology that remain in Star Citizen are their biggest source of complaint.

Sir Isaac Newton said "If I have seen further it is because I have stood on the shoulders of giants", while he was sarcastically mocking a rival scientist who was short in stature, it's still a truism, very little innovation comes all at once, it is a step by step process and hardly anyone could envision the changes Newton's work would have on the world, until it did. CIG are taking the step by step process.

Innovation takes time, frustrating, annoying and at times even boring though it may be it's the innovation that people will notice and remember. We have been through the content drought doldrums before while they work on underlying tech, we have heard people say they would never achieve what they plan, they still say it about things that are actually in the game - but they did achieve those things.

There's a reason other game studios don't do this type of stuff, venture capitalists, publishers and investors are even more susceptible to frustration, impatience and boredom than players.

We paid for, and signed up for, a different approach to game making, this is it, and there's no one else trying it at this scope and scale.

Those who use words like 'nothing', 'never', impossible' are only telling you the limit of their imagination. They aren't even being accurate about the current state of progress in many cases. They struggle to understand the difference between a locally stored game save on their hard drive giving the impression of persistence for a single player game and a massive cloud based game save of all the events in a whole game universe, and all the players in it.

They say they have the right to criticise and complain, which they do, but if they can't be accurate in their assessment of progress or understand why it has to be this way how much validity should we give their assessment of progress? Read through the comments on this thread, some are clearly not up to speed either with the aims of the project or even the current progress of it. They certainly don't seem to understand the limitations of the games they keep touting as better examples.

None of them have produced anything that benefits a single player, let alone advanced the player experience, and with such a negative attitude it's very unlikely they ever will. It's up to the individual who they choose to give their ear to - the builders building your house, or the guy at the gate telling them how to build a house when he hasn't seen the plans and has never so much as built a garden shed in his life.

If it frustrates some, if they can't wrap their head around why it has to be this way then surely it's best to just go play other games and come back periodically to see progress. Take some time to learn about the limitations of other games so that when they do see that progress they can understand the significance of it. Some just want 'a' game, but some of us wanted more... judging by the success of the project I'd say those who wanted more seem to be in the driving seat, if someone doesn't like where it's going, or it's not going fast enough for them they can get off the bus and walk around for a while, they're more than welcome to come back further down the line because unlike other games your ticket is a lifetime ticket to ride even if they upgrade the service.

# ? Aug 23, 2023 17:27

Fil5000: Jun 23, 2003; HOLD ON GUYS I'M POSTING ABOUT INTERNET ROBOTS

How do any of you read his posts without your eyes unfocusing and your brain sliding out of your ears

# ? Aug 23, 2023 17:30

Popete: Oct 6, 2009; This will make sure you don't suggest to the KDz
That he should grow greens instead of crushing on MCs; Grimey Drawer

CIG is doing that thing again where they send some devs to Gamescom to wander around and make it look like they are attending as a vendor participant.

# ? Aug 23, 2023 18:05

disposablewords: Sep 12, 2021

Fil5000 posted:

How do any of you read his posts without your eyes unfocusing and your brain sliding out of your ears

My brain can't decide which ear to slide out of, unfortunately.

# ? Aug 23, 2023 18:07

Mirificus: Oct 29, 2004; Kings need not raise their voices to be heard

Mirificus posted:

https://twitter.com/RobertsSpaceInd/status/1164128209476210688
https://twitter.com/RobertsSpaceInd/status/1164181350989127681
https://twitter.com/RobertsSpaceInd/status/1164493909495558144
https://twitter.com/RobertsSpaceInd/status/1164541709805662208

https://twitter.com/RobertsSpaceInd/status/1693664159508971823

# ? Aug 23, 2023 18:36

Viscous Soda: Apr 24, 2004

holtemon posted:

Other game devs are commenting about how if the main menu is sparse that it means that the Starfield devs just don't care about their game

It's pretty silly honestly but I think this is the biggest drama/concern about Starfield right now lol

edit: More details in this if you're interested

Wow, this is like the phrenology of video games. In any event, if it allows me to avoid a 3 second loading time to access the main menu, sparse is fine for me.

# ? Aug 23, 2023 18:45

Mellow_: Sep 13, 2010

SC fans getting upset at another space game being made is one of the most ridiculous things to me.

You like space games? They're making another space game? Cool! You have an opportunity to find another space game you can enjoy. Maybe you'll have a great time!

Alas, that can't happen. Each new space game is a competitor to my cult game.

It feels like they're stuck in a sunk-cost fallacy when it comes to other space games.

# ? Aug 23, 2023 19:25

Mellow_: Sep 13, 2010

i am a moron posted:

Bethesda really pulling out the stops to convince people this won�t be trash huh

It's hard to tell if you're a SC fanatic or just have sour grapes about prior Bethesda bullshit

# ? Aug 23, 2023 19:29

Tippis: Mar 21, 2008; It's yet another day in the wasteland.

Viscous Soda posted:

Wow, this is like the phrenology of video games. In any event, if it allows me to avoid a 3 second loading time to access the main menu, sparse is fine for me.

Compare �rushed and did not care�.

�i.e. a sparse aesthetic that suggests that someone actually thought about what show be on the screen, in contrast with some supposed �cared and put thought into it� (which is what Hines worked on):

�i.e. where you throw a whole bunch of junk on top of a busy background to create a jumbled mess. Because you care.

# ? Aug 23, 2023 19:33

MarcusSA: Sep 23, 2007

Trying to criticize the main menu of a game seems like the weakest of attempted owns lol.

Like the fact that the person even wrote it out is pretty cringe.

# ? Aug 23, 2023 19:36

i am a moron: Nov 12, 2020; "I think if there’s one thing we can all agree on it’s that Penn State and Michigan both suck and are garbage and it’s hilarious Michigan fans are freaking out thinking this is their natty window when they can’t even beat a B12 team in the playoffs lmao"

Mellow_ posted:

It's hard to tell if you're a SC fanatic or just have sour grapes about prior Bethesda bullshit

no, it really isn�t

Edit: what a weird way to phrase that too. I don�t have sour grapes about anything, Bethesda makes bad games and another non gameplay trailer in the lead up to release being posted in the SC thread as if it isn�t something CIG would do if they could actually manage to make a game is ironic

i am a moron fucked around with this message at 19:42 on Aug 23, 2023

# ? Aug 23, 2023 19:39

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# ? Jun 5, 2024 21:29

Thoatse: Feb 29, 2016; Lol said the scorpion, lmao

Fil5000 posted:

How do any of you read his posts without your eyes unfocusing and your brain sliding out of your ears

I instascroll past his insufferable screeds and if he says anything stupid enough to be funny someone that did read it will reduce that in a single sentence in a reply

# ? Aug 23, 2023 19:40

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