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I mean, given today's tech, it's crazy that every interaction with a 24th century computer isn't authenticated with biometrics. Hell, by that point, display tech should be advanced enough to the point where holograms render displays completely unreadable to anyone not authorized. Little censor bars projected in front of your eyes when you try to read a display.
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Sep 10, 2023 19:01
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bull3964 posted:I mean, given today's tech, it's crazy that every interaction with a 24th century computer isn't authenticated with biometrics. They're wierdly halfway there. Like, they mention in TNG that all use of consoles identify the user and log them, and there's another bit where an attacker has to use an unconscious security officer's hand to activate his combadge.
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Sep 10, 2023 19:12
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And of course Disco had that oh-so-secure "breath-print" authorization thing on the door to the mushroom forest. 
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Sep 10, 2023 21:57
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After the DS9 season 2 ender "Jem'Hadar" physically introducing some of the Dominion, I move on to: S3-1 & 2, The Search: Holy poo poo these move a mile a minute. The Defiant is introduced (immediately using its cloaking device inside the Alpha Quadrant, thereby 'defying' one of the main conditions the Romulans put on the Federation for getting to use it), gets its rear end kicked, the Dominion wants peace? Causes trouble on the station! Funny enough, while I was reminding myself that the audience wasn't supposed to know yet that it was actually Odo's people that are the Founders, I'd plum forgotten that most of these episodes take place in a bullshit Founder sim. So, when Dax and O'Brien show up all like "yeah no the Founders totally want peace", I was thinking "wait, did I forget when they were replaced by Changelings for a bit? And did they really pull that stunt twice, later again with Bashir?" Then Eddington and Nechayev seem totally compromised, T'Rul seemingly gets killed, the Wormhole gets blown up, and oops - it was all a dream. Awful resolution, but it's easy to forgive, knowing this sets up so much great action for the next few seasons. I was really sorry that they didn't keep T'Rul around. I like Martha Hackett a lot, and the Romulans as characters have rarely been explored beyong being glowering jerks on viewscreens. It would've been cool having a Romulan around on DS9, maybe initially concerned entirely with keeping prying eyes away from the cloaking device on the Defiant, but gradually thawing and granting a bit of insight into Romulan society.
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Sep 10, 2023 22:19
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bull3964 posted:I mean, given today's tech, it's crazy that every interaction with a 24th century computer isn't authenticated with biometrics. IIRC one of Okuda's technical manuals literally says that LCARS authenticates you by fingerprint and a few other metrics every time you touch the panel, they just never actually used that in the show
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Sep 10, 2023 22:24
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Kesper North posted:IIRC one of Okuda's technical manuals literally says that LCARS authenticates you by fingerprint and a few other metrics every time you touch the panel, they just never actually used that in the show They do when the episode where the kid from Robocop 2 blows up that Oberth class. They specifically show him he couldn’t do anything (he thinks he pressed a button on the bridge) that would harm the ship because he wouldn’t have access.
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Sep 10, 2023 22:40
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Kesper North posted:IIRC one of Okuda's technical manuals literally says that LCARS authenticates you by fingerprint and a few other metrics every time you touch the panel, they just never actually used that in the show This also completely explains why every console was full of exploding rocks!
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Sep 10, 2023 22:45
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jeeves posted:This also completely explains why every console was full of exploding rocks! I just thought it was because you needed little chunks of planet all over the ship for artificial gravity. Was that wrong?
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Sep 10, 2023 23:11
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claw game handjob posted:I just thought it was because you needed little chunks of planet all over the ship for artificial gravity. Was that wrong? Add some tachyons in there and it all just makes sense!
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Sep 11, 2023 01:00
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davidspackage posted:After the DS9 season 2 ender "Jem'Hadar" physically introducing some of the Dominion, I move on to: I don't think it's the same as a dream resolution at all because it does matter what happens. It's just exactly the same as the red dwarf episodes "back in the red" where kinda the same thing happens. Yea it's a simulation, but what happens in the simulation affects a resolution to an issue in the real world
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Sep 11, 2023 01:40
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Man, the opening to Generations has a whole bunch of "hey, it's that actor" bit parts. Tim Russ, Glenn Morshower, and Jenette Goldstein all play various unnamed bridge officers.
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Sep 11, 2023 02:06
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Does anyone know why some characters' uniforms change partway through Generations? I know about the whole thing where they scrapped the planned new uniforms and had to use existing ones. What I don't get is why, for example, Riker is wearing a TNG style uniform early in the movie and then switches to the DS9 style a few scenes later.
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Sep 11, 2023 02:47
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Lord Hydronium posted:Does anyone know why some characters' uniforms change partway through Generations? I know about the whole thing where they scrapped the planned new uniforms and had to use existing ones. What I don't get is why, for example, Riker is wearing a TNG style uniform early in the movie and then switches to the DS9 style a few scenes later. The TNG uniforms were scuffed to poo poo after 5 seasons of use on TV, and it was visible on 35mm film. They'd already delayed and reshot a bunch of stuff to get rid of the dodgy movie uniforms and didn't have the budget to go back and do them again, so they just said gently caress it, left the shots with them in, hoped no-one would notice, and threw a bunch of DS9 uniforms on anyone who's TNG uniform was knackered for the rest of the shoot. For bonus points, they couldn't tailor the DS9 uniforms since they were needed like the next week for DS9, hence none of them really fitting properly. Riker's especially, Jonathan Frakes and Avery Brooks are definitely not the same shape.
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Sep 11, 2023 08:01
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davidspackage posted:I was really sorry that they didn't keep T'Rul around. I like Martha Hackett a lot, and the Romulans as characters have rarely been explored beyong being glowering jerks on viewscreens. It would've been cool having a Romulan around on DS9, maybe initially concerned entirely with keeping prying eyes away from the cloaking device on the Defiant, but gradually thawing and granting a bit of insight into Romulan society. Mega agreed, one of DS9's greatest missteps not keeping her around.
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Sep 11, 2023 12:17
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McSpanky posted:Mega agreed, one of DS9's greatest missteps not keeping her around. martha hackett was kinda busy later on lol
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Sep 11, 2023 12:56
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DavidCameronsPig posted:The TNG uniforms were scuffed to poo poo after 5 seasons of use on TV, and it was visible on 35mm film. They'd already delayed and reshot a bunch of stuff to get rid of the dodgy movie uniforms and didn't have the budget to go back and do them again, so they just said gently caress it, left the shots with them in, hoped no-one would notice, and threw a bunch of DS9 uniforms on anyone who's TNG uniform was knackered for the rest of the shoot.
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Sep 11, 2023 13:34
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F_Shit_Fitzgerald posted:It's typical of Starfleet to learn a lesson and then promptly forget it (see also: Data singlehandedly being able to lock down the ship, something never demonstrated again). Until Picard season 3!
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Sep 11, 2023 16:55
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WhiteHowler posted:Until Picard season 3! No no, "the entire fleet is dead in water because enemy hacked into our for some reason open network and disabled everything that is connected to it" was already in Picard season 2 episode 1! So it has happened at least two times before it happens third time in Season 3 
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Sep 11, 2023 18:59
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Arivia posted:martha hackett was kinda busy later on lol Yeah because she didn't have a regular gig on DS9!
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Sep 11, 2023 22:34
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McSpanky posted:Yeah because she didn't have a regular gig on DS9! They passed on her already, T'Rul was a consolation prize after she didn't get to be Jadzia Dax!
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Sep 11, 2023 22:36
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New Ground: I've not mentioned an important thing about TNG season 5 that I think bears a passing mention. I think Picard's jacket outfit is really neat looking. I bring this up because I don't have much to say about the episode. There's a nice bit where Worf's smiling as the teacher tells him what a brat Alexander is. The b-plot (SPACE WARP SURFING BRAAAAH), which as usual intersects with the a-plot for MAXIMUM EXCITEMENT is a bit dumb and only generates moderate excitement at best. It's a status quo change to have Worf saddled with his kid, but other than that, nothing special. Hero Worship begins with them arriving at a place called "The Black Cluster". It's blue. Still, it's goddamn satisfying hearing Patrick Stewart say "The Black Cluster" with his Patrick Stewart voice. He's also directing this one. He did In Theory (aka "Tee Hee, Ha Ha, Oh Data, HORRID DEATH) too, which I didn't notice at the time. Anyway, because this loving show cannot resist doing things in twos, it's another child focused episode where a strong member of the main cast lifts a heavy object off said child. The difference here was, I liked Timothy and I felt sad for him. Child actors really are a crapshoot, aren't they? That one shot of him, after the main crisis of the episode has been averted, sitting in with all the smiling, singing faces, looking depressed, that got to me. "I would gladly risk feeling bad at times if it also meant I could taste my dessert" is a hell of a tragi-comic Data line. Good one. Fair due, Troi seems to be stepping up her game. Maybe she'd make a better child psychologist.
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Sep 12, 2023 00:40
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The climax of "Hero Worship" owns. Everyone is briefly shocked when Data says to drop the shields, but it only takes a moment to realize that frickin Data would never say something like that without a good reason, so they do it. No melodrama, no "wtf is wrong with you, you must be crazy" forcing Data to override the computer or any bullshit like that, just pure trust and professionalism saving the day.
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Sep 12, 2023 02:00
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It plays in stark contrast to "modern" storytelling where they create stakes with a timeline, but then feel the need to waste time with character stuff that could be talked about later, deflating the stakes. If that scene was modern Trek. Data: "Drop the shields." Picard: "Mr. Data, you have always been one of my finest officers and I would trust your judgement to the end of my career and I think everyone in the bridge would agree that we are perfectly fine putting our lives in your hands. Mr. Worf drop the sh" The Enterprise explodes.
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Sep 12, 2023 02:15
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MuddyFunster posted:I think Picard's jacket outfit is really neat looking.  Picard's bomber jacket is awesome.MuddyFunster posted:Anyway, because this loving show cannot resist doing things in twos, it's another child focused episode where a strong member of the main cast lifts a heavy object off said child. The difference here was, I liked Timothy and I felt sad for him. Child actors really are a crapshoot, aren't they? That one shot of him, after the main crisis of the episode has been averted, sitting in with all the smiling, singing faces, looking depressed, that got to me. That kid has my official award for Star Trek's Least Annoying Child Actor. (Whether or not this category includes Wil Wheaton depends on my mood.) MuddyFunster posted:Fair due, Troi seems to be stepping up her game. Maybe she'd make a better child psychologist. When she's written well, Troi can be a fantastic character. Unfortunately, she wasn't written well terribly often.
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Sep 12, 2023 02:49
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I was just thinking today how lucky or smart it was for DS9 to kill off Damar at the end. I can't imagine the baggage of letting the fascist dictator liberate his people from a legit foreign invader bent on their destruction.
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Sep 12, 2023 02:52
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Who ended up in charge, any known characters?
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Sep 12, 2023 03:03
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Atlas Hugged posted:I was just thinking today how lucky or smart it was for DS9 to kill off Damar at the end. I can't imagine the baggage of letting the fascist dictator liberate his people from a legit foreign invader bent on their destruction. I think a lot of what makes DS9 great is pretty much pure luck, but I don't doubt for a second that this was an intentional and smart writing decision. You can't wrap up that character in any other way that doesn't come across as explicitly gross, and the way the writing room went overboard with Dukat made it clear that they weren't interested in rehabilitating the genuinely fascist Cardassians. Damar was revolutionary enough to tear down the Cardassia that allied with the Dominion, but not revolutionary enough to build a better one. He is an unusually complex character for Star Trek, even for DS9.
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Sep 12, 2023 03:07
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He's also on an endless sugar rush from all that Karo syrup
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Sep 12, 2023 03:56
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Last night I threw on TNG S1 because I wanted some background noise and goodness gracious is it frontloaded with stinkers. Some brief thoughts: Encounter at Farpoint: Okay for a pilot. Has some of the weirdness you might expect from one. The first half is mainly concerned with Q and the second half is mainly concerned with Farpoint so if you know the behind-the-scenes that it was a one-hour episode stretched to two you can really tell. The Naked Now: Didn't Gene Roddenbery not want to tie TNG to TOS too tightly? Maybe it wasn't such a good idea to redo a TOS episode as the second broadcast episode of the series then. Also, there's one scene where Beverly calls out Geordie for not acting like himself and I had to say "he's been on-screen for all of five minutes in the series so far, how should the audience know how he's supposed to act?" Also, the first episode where Wesley saves the ship (after majorly contributing to its being put in danger in the first place). Code of Honor: The episode where the aliens of the week are racist caricatures of pre-colonial Africans. Also there's one bit I had forgotten about where Riker compares them to Native Americans after they kidnap Tasha so yay for bonus racism. I did like the scene where Geordie was trying to explain jokes to Data which was the on-screen start of their friendship. The Last Outpost: The episode where the aliens of the week are anti-semitic caricatures. The best part of the episode was that it reminded me about Star Trek: Resurgence, which was really good and everyone who likes 90s Trek should play, since one of the characters from this episode plays a major part in it. Where No One Has Gone Before: Definitely the best episode since the pilot, but it's another Wesley-heavy one in a way that kind of sneaks up on you until it hits you like a brick (The Traveller's speech near the end where he goes on about how special Wesley is). Lonely Among Us: Somehow I had never seen this episode before? Either that or it was so inconsequential I completely forgot about it. Data hamming it up as Sherlock Holmes was at least funny. I can see why people didn't like TNG when it first came out. If this is all I had to go on I'd probably drop it like I dropped Discovery after the second episode.
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Sep 12, 2023 04:11
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Got to "Defiant" in my DS9 watch, and that's probably got to be one of my favorite episodes of the series. Just a really good thriller that picks up on a very important yet oddly underused bit of TNG lore. Riker gets a clone in that original episode and then he's not written out or killed off, he just leaves to do his own thing. There's been another Riker running around for a couple years, it would be weird if they hadn't followed up on it. The episode also has some interesting things to say about terrorism and both Kira's and the Maquis' relation to it in a way that feels like it could only have been made pre-9/11. Frakes does a great job playing both versions of Riker, and the insecurity and relative lack of self-assuredness in Tom comes across well even through his bluster. And the sideburn reveal, can't forget that. Also in retrospect this is probably one of the most consequential episodes in the series; the Orias fleet they spot is the one that will later attack and be destroyed by the Dominion, which will lead to the collapse of the Obsidian Order and takeover of the Detapa Council, which leads to the Klingon invasion, which leads to Cardassia allying with the Dominion, which leads directly to the Dominion War. Lord Hydronium fucked around with this message at 04:24 on Sep 12, 2023 |
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Sep 12, 2023 04:19
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Mr.Radar posted:I can see why people didn't like TNG when it first came out. If this is all I had to go on I'd probably drop it like I dropped Discovery after the second episode. Season 1 of TNG averaged out to something like a 10.4 in the Nielsen ratings, which was fire for a syndicated series back then. It's difficult to overstate just how different audience expectations were in 1987.
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Sep 12, 2023 06:02
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Yeah, TNG was stupidly successful from the start. It was huge.
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Sep 12, 2023 06:15
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imo hardcore trek nerds are harsher on TNG's first season than... just about everyone else I've introduced Star Trek to more people than I can count over the years, and I'm universally ashamed enough of the early seasons of TNG that I usually tell people to just skip them or try to give curated lists or whatever. And you know what? Almost everyone who actually gives the show a shot ends up thinking the first season is fine. I remember arguing with a friend years ago that she couldn't have possibly found Encounter at Farpoint tolerable because come on
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Sep 12, 2023 06:23
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Its been fun seeing that effect happen in real time with the newer shows. Lower Decks' first few episodes were generally received fine, with the rest of the season really improving, but now that a bit of time has passed they're the worst things ever and I've seen people suggest they should go back and redo them from scratch. Its fascinating.
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Sep 12, 2023 06:33
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zoux posted:Who ended up in charge, any known characters? 
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Sep 12, 2023 10:26
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Yeah there's like a whole exchange in if not his final appearance than his second to last appearance and it's clearly implied that he's going to hate it and hate that it will never be the Cardassia he loved, but it has to be done.
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Sep 12, 2023 11:07
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Those first few episodes of TNG are definitely a pretty big hurdle, but they've also been overstated. Once you're past those it's mostly an okay-to-good season, even though it has a weird vibe to it. And in hindsight that weird vibe is kind of fascinating. The characters aren't as likeable yet, but if any Trek series actually gets by more on plot and cool sci-fi stuff than the characters themselves, it's TNG. (I'm not saying it has the least likeable characters, I'm saying it's the one that most succeeds at not being character-driven.) Sir Lemming fucked around with this message at 11:14 on Sep 12, 2023 |
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Sep 12, 2023 11:09
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Looking past the show finding its footing, the characters not QUITE being there yet (except maybe Data, Brent Spiner nails it from scene one) and the handful of obviously terrible episodes, I found TNG season 1 a fairly decent start and if nothing else, the production design is great. I was always warned not to start from there, but I took it as a challenge. If I can sit through season 3 of TOS multiple times, I can tolerate anything. The low expectations really got surpassed. Season 2, I'm a lot less forgiving, but man does it really skyrocket after that. McSpanky posted:The climax of "Hero Worship" owns. Everyone is briefly shocked when Data says to drop the shields, but it only takes a moment to realize that frickin Data would never say something like that without a good reason, so they do it. No melodrama, no "wtf is wrong with you, you must be crazy" forcing Data to override the computer or any bullshit like that, just pure trust and professionalism saving the day. It's funny, tying this back to the earlier seasons, I'd often heard about Roddenberry's "no conflict" edict that the writers hated, but it felt like there was conflict all the time. Meanwhile, there's loads of good moments like this in later seasons that express that idea much better.
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Sep 12, 2023 13:23
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Atlas Hugged posted:Yeah there's like a whole exchange in if not his final appearance than his second to last appearance and it's clearly implied that he's going to hate it and hate that it will never be the Cardassia he loved, but it has to be done.
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Sep 12, 2023 13:43
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MuddyFunster posted:Looking past the show finding its footing, the characters not QUITE being there yet (except maybe Data, Brent Spiner nails it from scene one) and the handful of obviously terrible episodes, I found TNG season 1 a fairly decent start and if nothing else, the production design is great. I was always warned not to start from there, but I took it as a challenge. If I can sit through season 3 of TOS multiple times, I can tolerate anything. The low expectations really got surpassed. Yeah, this matches my overall feelings for the series. I was just taken aback a bit by those first couple of episodes, particularly the third and fourth since those have aged especially badly. And yeah, I do find the production design really interesting compared to what I remember of later 90s Trek, they're doing great work with what they have. One thing I did notice is how small the sets feel now that I'm seeing them in HD, especially compared to the enormous sets in SNW. (I wonder if designing for 2.4:1 encourages bigger sets since you can fit more of them in the frame in every shot.) Edit: also, my reaction might be colored a bit because my parents were firmly in the "TNG is not real Trek" camp for the first couple of years before they grudgingly grew to like it. Mr.Radar fucked around with this message at 15:29 on Sep 12, 2023 |
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Sep 12, 2023 15:25
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