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River_Bed_[1268]: Turn 2 Yukiko frowned pensively as she wove her Shadow Hawk between a large butte to the north and a muddy crater to the south. The mech handled well, even in a simulation. Much as she appreciated her old Panther, she had to admit that the Hawk was superior in many respects. Its greater speed was a blessing, and its thicker armour was sure to prove useful in the battles ahead. Its jumping ability was slightly inferior to her old mech, and it lacked the enhanced firing circuits that made point blank shots more accurate, but those were drawbacks she could live with. If an enemy closed the distance with her, the Shadow Hawk’s battle fists would take care of them. As Yukiko rounded the butte, she saw that the Fusiliers were moving up as well. Etienne’s Griffin was out in front, strutting out into the open even though it would give the gathered mechs of Sable Lance clear shots at him. Without missing a beat, he opened fire on Jenna’s Wolverine, the azure whip of his PPC lashing through the air. He missed, but the manoeuvre was so brazen that Yukiko almost admired him for it. Almost. Jenna responded immediately, attempting to bracket the Griffin with her own lasers. The distance was too great, however, and the lethal red beams passed harmlessly on either side. Etienne made a ‘come on’ gesture with his Griffin’s left hand before feathering his jump jets, clearly intending to leap over the riverbed. Yukiko sighed and took aim. Given the choice, she would have preferred to ignore Etienne’s Griffin entirely until the very end. She would have let him stew in his own juices, stoking his frustration by making a show of hunting other, lesser targets. Even if he scored a hit on her, or opened a channel to mock her, or even simply appeared on her viewscreen, she would not even acknowledge his existence. There were many ways to humiliate someone, but making them feel worthless by ignoring all of their efforts was the ultimate insult. If you wanted to deny a person, to negate them absolutely, to reduce them to a state of abjection, that was the way to do it. It was how Yukiko’s own father had tried to break her, after the beatings and verbal abuse had failed, and it had very nearly succeeded. As the Griffin began its ascent Yukiko opened fire. The ravening blue beam of her PPC flew over the Griffin’s shoulder, but a couple of her LRMs managed to tag it in the leg. First blood to her, if that even meant anything in a simulated battle. A burst of static sounded as Etienne opened a channel to her. “Knock it off, knock-off!” he griped. “Piss off before I show you what a real Griffin can do!” Yukiko ignored his pathetic mockery and calmly waited for her weapons to re-arm. The Shadow Hawk 2K had indeed earned the moniker of a poor man’s Griffin, but that was fine by her. After all, if Etienne lost to an inferior copy of his own mech, how much greater would his disgrace be?    Weapons fire for Gladiator GLD-4R (Player): -Fires PPC at Hunchback HBK-4H (Fusiliers); needs 11, rolls 7: Misses! Weapons fire for Shadow Hawk SHD-2K (Player): -Fires PPC at Griffin GRF-1N (Fusiliers); needs 10, rolls 5: Misses! -Fires LRM-5 at Griffin GRF-1N (Fusiliers); needs 10, rolls 10: 2 Missiles Hit! Griffin GRF-1N (Fusiliers) takes 2 damage to Right Leg, 16/18 Armour remaining. Weapons fire for Trebuchet TBT-5S (Player): -Holds fire! Weapons fire for Wolverine WVR-6M (Player): -Fires Large Laser at Griffin GRF-1N (Fusiliers); needs 9, rolls 8: Misses! -Fires Medium Laser at Griffin GRF-1N (Fusiliers); needs 11, rolls 7: Misses! -Fires Medium Laser at Griffin GRF-1N (Fusiliers); needs 11, rolls 4: Misses! -- Weapons fire for Commando COM-2D (Fusiliers): -Holds fire! Weapons fire for Griffin GRF-1N (Fusiliers): -Fires PPC at Wolverine WVR-6M (Player); needs 9, rolls 6: Misses! -Fires LRM-10 at Wolverine WVR-6M (Player); needs 9, rolls 6: Misses! Weapons fire for Hornet HNT-152 (Fusiliers): -Holds fire! Weapons fire for Hunchback HBK-4H (Fusiliers): -Fires AC/10 at Wolverine WVR-6M (Player); needs 11, rolls 4: Misses! Weapons fire for Sentinel STN-3KA (Fusiliers): -Fires Large Laser at Shadow Hawk SHD-2K (Player); needs 13, rolls 6: Automatic Miss! Weapons fire for Wolverine WVR-6R (Fusiliers): -Fires AC/5 at Trebuchet TBT-5S (Player); needs 14, rolls 5: Automatic Miss!  No melee attacks this turn!  Gladiator GLD-4R (Player) gains 12 heat, sinks 12 heat and is now at 0 heat. Shadow Hawk SHD-2H (Player) gains 14 heat, sinks 14 heat and is now at 0 heat. Trebuchet TBT-5S (Player) gains 2 heat, sinks 2 heat and is now at 0 heat. Wolverine WVR-6M (Player) gains 15 heat, sinks 14 heat and is now at 1 heat. -- Commando COM-2D (Fusiliers) gains 1 heat, sinks 1 heat and is now at 0 heat. Griffin GRF-1N (Fusiliers) gains 16 heat, sinks 12 heat and is now at 4 heat. Hornet HNT-152 (Fusiliers) gains 2 heat, sinks 2 heat and is now at 0 heat. Hunchback HBK-4H (Fusiliers) gains 5 heat, sinks 5 heat and is now at 0 heat. Sentinel STN-3KA (Fusiliers) gains 10 heat, sinks 10 heat and is now at 0 heat. Wolverine WVR-6R (Fusiliers) gains 3 heat, sinks 3 heat and is now at 0 heat.   Commando COM-2D (Fusiliers) is moving through mud; must make a piloting test to avoid becoming bogged down. 6 (Base) – 1 (Mud) = 5, rolls 7: Succeeds! Hornet HNT-152 (Fusiliers) is moving through mud; must make a piloting test to avoid becoming bogged down. 5 (Base) – 1 (Mud) = 4, rolls 3: Fails! Hornet HNT-152 (Fusiliers) gets stuck in Hex 1009!  Player Status  Enemy Status   Special Abilities: -Toughness: Grants bonus to consciousness rolls. -Small Pilot: Negates ‘Cramped Cockpit’ penalties. Primary Objectives: -Defeat the First Decimis Fusiliers (0/6) Secondary Objectives: -Humiliate Etienne Decimis (100,000 C-Bill reward) Next Orders Due: Saturday 16th 9:00PM GMT. Scintilla fucked around with this message at 11:09 on Sep 13, 2023 |
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Sep 13, 2023 08:27
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I'm gonna turn the Hornet into scrap metal if nobody else wants it  e: Actually, alternative idea, get in the Griffin's face, dump some SRMs into it and then shove it into the mud  e2: Man I am spoiled for choice here, I can get in the face of three of their mechs, two with bad move mods, and unload at point-blank range. Bloody Pom fucked around with this message at 11:22 on Sep 13, 2023 |
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Sep 13, 2023 10:19
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Guns off the field, even if it is a hornet (IMO)
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Sep 13, 2023 12:36
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Captain Foo posted:Guns off the field, even if it is a hornet This, and also I think going after the Griffin is a bad idea because it’s got backup in the form of a Hunchback. If you get into point blank range or melee with the Griffin, the Hunchback as an opportunity to blast the poo poo out of you with all it’s weapons. The wrath of a Swayback is a hefty price to pay to take a swing at a Griffin with +3 evasion.
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Sep 13, 2023 16:22
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Most of you can get around 1016/0915 and cut LOS from the GRF/HBK and slam the Hornet. You'll be open to fire from the Wolverine, but should cut off everyone else. Just make sure you clear the lvl2 in 1112 to get LOS to the Hornet. The TBT could get besides 1112 and get up close while staying covered.
Amechwarrior fucked around with this message at 19:19 on Sep 13, 2023 |
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Sep 13, 2023 19:17
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Gladiator I can't get LOS to the hornet so thinking of going to 2219 to bully the Sentinel instead. That'll expose me to some fire from the Griffin and Hunchie but I think the range and TMM should keep me safe. Thoughts?
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Sep 13, 2023 19:46
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I was thinking the same thing but the sentinel is on +2, I don't think I've got the movement to get LOS on the hornet and get a meaningful chance to hit, I could take a long range shot at the enemy wolverine but that's also pretty suboptimal But I'm also bad at numbers
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Sep 13, 2023 19:49
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Slavvy posted:I was thinking the same thing but the sentinel is on +2, I don't think I've got the movement to get LOS on the hornet and get a meaningful chance to hit, I could take a long range shot at the enemy wolverine but that's also pretty suboptimal A while back I was struck by the thought of 'how much difference is a +/-1 in battletech anyway, since 2d6 is a sliding scale around 7 being common, and ran the numbers through anydice.  Tldr, about 8-13% per +-. but up to 16% if it crossed the sweet spot zone. (the % number on the left is how common that roll in particular is, so it goes up or down by that amount; if you want the per-shot difference there, if you want the combined odds use the red # for  percentages)
TheParadigm fucked around with this message at 20:07 on Sep 13, 2023 |
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Sep 13, 2023 20:03
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TheParadigm posted:A while back I was struck by the thought of 'how much difference is a +/-1 in battletech anyway, since 2d6 is a sliding scale around 7 being common, and ran the numbers through anydice. *nodding seriously while understanding nothing*
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Sep 13, 2023 20:54
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Also the QS guide doesn't seem to explain how jump jets work at all, I wouldn't mind trying to engage the sentinel at close range by jumping over the mud but idk how jumping works wrt movement and accuracy etc
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Sep 13, 2023 20:57
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Slavvy posted:Also the QS guide doesn't seem to explain how jump jets work at all, I wouldn't mind trying to engage the sentinel at close range by jumping over the mud but idk how jumping works wrt movement and accuracy etc Off the top of my head, you can jump 5 tiles and you don’t have to worry about changing facing or directions while moving. I’m pretty sure you can freely choose a direction to face after jumping, you gain heat (I don’t know how much. One for each tile maybe?) and you gain the same evasion you would get from walking or running an equivalent number to squares +1. The penalty for shooting is +3 unless you have Jumping Jack. I didn’t have a jumper during my mission so I didn’t bother to ask
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Sep 13, 2023 21:20
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Slavvy posted:*nodding seriously while understanding nothing* 6+ and below: easy shots 7+ slightly more than a 50% chance ToHit 8+ slightly worse than a 50% chance ToHit 9+ and above: risky shots
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Sep 13, 2023 21:22
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Trebuchet After weighing my options, I'm going to move up to 1012 and give the Hornet a really bad day. Also puts me in a good position to flank around behind the Hunchback and Griffin if they keep advancing. Moving to 1011 would give me a higher move mod but also put me in LOS of the Hunchback e: Never mind, I have enough MP that I can do some weird zig-zagging to get to 1012 while still moving 5 hexes. Puts my back to the Griffin but I think he might be fixated on our Shadow Hawk based on the fluff. Bloody Pom fucked around with this message at 21:56 on Sep 13, 2023 |
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Sep 13, 2023 21:34
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glwgameplayer posted:Off the top of my head, you can jump 5 tiles and you don’t have to worry about changing facing or directions while moving. I’m pretty sure you can freely choose a direction to face after jumping, you gain heat (I don’t know how much. One for each tile maybe?) and you gain the same evasion you would get from walking or running an equivalent number to squares +1. The penalty for shooting is +3 unless you have Jumping Jack. Ok so I'm trying to combine this and this: PoptartsNinja posted:6+ and below: easy shots And I'm just not getting it. Where are these numbers coming from and what does the + mean? If I've got a +3 penalty for jumping and I'm firing on the sentinel which has a +2 bonus for moving does that put me at +5...?
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Sep 13, 2023 21:53
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Slavvy posted:Ok so I'm trying to combine this and this: Take your pilot's gunnery skill (4) then add your own movement penalty and the target's move mod. Then add the range penalty (+2 for medium range, +4 for long range). Tl;dr you're pretty likely to whiff any shots taken at the Sentinel.
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Sep 13, 2023 21:58
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Slavvy posted:Ok so I'm trying to combine this and this: Your skill + penalty for your movement + range penalty + any other penalties + target move mod = target number you need to equal or beat on 2d6 to hit. So Gunnery 4 + jumping 3 + short range 0 + target move 2 = 9 to-hit. I'm probably looking at 9 to 11s as well. The average mechwarrior is not a terribly good shot.
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Sep 13, 2023 21:58
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There's a reason why banking your experience is so important in a campaign like this. Sure, you could get that fancy SPA that will come in handy in a very niche situation. Or you could improve your gunnery skill and gain the ability to pull off some truly improbable shots. Nothing will put the fear of God in you like a 2/3 Clanner with pulse lasers.
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Sep 13, 2023 22:01
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Bloody Pom posted:Take your pilot's gunnery skill (4) then add your own movement penalty and the target's move mod. Then add the range penalty (+2 for medium range, +4 for long range). Thanks, this matches what my gut told me. Realistically my only other option (besides not shooting at all this turn, yuck) would be sniping at the wolverine from 1216, which if I'm working it out right would put me at needing to roll 7 to hit with the LL? Which in XCOM terms based on the chart posted earlier puts me at around a 50/50 chance to hit.
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Sep 13, 2023 22:12
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Slavvy posted:
Anything you try and do in Battletech (Shooting, standing up, avoiding getting stuck in the mud, punching) needs you to roll 2 six sided dice. You always want to roll the required number or higher, and because of the probability of different combinations on the two dice, the closer you get to 12 the lower your chance of success is. So people being like "Needs 8+ to hit" means you need to roll 8 or higher.
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Sep 13, 2023 22:23
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Scintilla posted:Okay, so I'm running the turn and the mud hexes don't seem to be forcing PSRs for getting bogged down, despite page 60 of TacOps saying they should. I've done some experimenting and they still cost 1 extra MP to enter and inflict a penalty on seatbelt checks for any unit standing in them. I've loaded up some other maps for further testing, and their mud hexes don't work either (though swamp hexes still do for some reason).
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Sep 14, 2023 04:33
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I'm so in a MechWarrior sort of mood. I want to jumpjet onto 1316, take a shot at the Hornet, and then jump elsewhere during the next turn.
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Sep 14, 2023 04:41
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Slavvy posted:Thanks, this matches what my gut told me. Realistically my only other option (besides not shooting at all this turn, yuck) would be sniping at the wolverine from 1216, which if I'm working it out right would put me at needing to roll 7 to hit with the LL? Which in XCOM terms based on the chart posted earlier puts me at around a 50/50 chance to hit. Sorry, I thought you knew the basics! Otherwise I would have been more verbose Remember, move modifier(yours) are based on the movement type(+0 stand still, +1 walking, +2 running, +3 jumping) while the incoming fire is based on how far you moved. If you reverse walk to 2119, for example, you can unload on the Sentinel at range 6: This would mean: gunnery 4 + medium range all weapons(2) + 1 walked +2 Target move mod = 9's. This would block line of sight to everyone but the sentinel and griffin, but your own to-get-hit #'s would be lower in return. Don't knock sniping though! Being able to shoot targets at medium when its their long or too long to shoot is a considerable advantage! This is also why cover is important: most forest/terrain obstacles you can get in add +1 for incoming fire but not outgoing. If you ran to 1318 (behind the hills to the left) and get in the shrubs, be able to shoot the wolverine on the left at range 12, (so, gunnery 4 + running 2 + 4 long range +1 TMM = 11's. The other wolverine shoots back with its AC5 at medium range ( gunnery 5 + running 2 + medium range 2 + 1 TMM(yours, for hexes moved) + 1 terrain =11's). This isn't a great move, but its an okay example of trading fire and limiting your exposure. Their gun engages at a better range modifier Gwaihir posted:Anything you try and do in Battletech (Shooting, standing up, avoiding getting stuck in the mud, punching) needs you to roll 2 six sided dice. You always want to roll the required number or higher, and because of the probability of different combinations on the two dice, the closer you get to 12 the lower your chance of success is.
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Sep 14, 2023 04:55
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Slavvy posted:Also the QS guide doesn't seem to explain how jump jets work at all, I wouldn't mind trying to engage the sentinel at close range by jumping over the mud but idk how jumping works wrt movement and accuracy etc Honestly, the Quickstart guide skips over a lot of things, to the point where it's actually slightly useless. It's why I included a separate primer that covers most of the stuff it leaves out, including how to use jump jets and a section on how accuracy is calculated.
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Sep 14, 2023 06:25
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Foxfire_ posted:Gudrun frowned at the yellowing "MekTek" label on the simulator command console. It was also starting to come away in the corners, unusual for even a decades old simulator system. Peeling the label revealed the horrible truth lurking underneath: Quikscell.
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Sep 14, 2023 12:15
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Gladiator Going to 2219 and shooting the Sentinel as previously mentioned.
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Sep 14, 2023 22:55
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BattleTech doesn't have shoving attacks, does it? Run at the Griffin, and shove him into the mud behind him? I mean, he's right there.
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Sep 14, 2023 23:04
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painedforever posted:BattleTech doesn't have shoving attacks, does it? It does, but you can't fire with any of your arm weapons if you want to push somebody. Also, pushing someone with a +3 move mod while only having piloting 5 is a losing prospect. And that's not even taking the Hunchback into account. Bloody Pom fucked around with this message at 23:41 on Sep 14, 2023 |
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Sep 14, 2023 23:35
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Well are you the shoving robot or the pushing robot?
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Sep 14, 2023 23:51
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 I mean, charging is also a thing but that's an even riskier prospect with a relatively green pilot. Besides, we're here to train up rookies and humiliate their haughty CO, not be needlessly flashy and potentially make asses of ourselves.
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Sep 15, 2023 00:01
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I'd recommend sticking to the regular types of violence before starting the exotic types, the regular types are the regular types because they work fairly well. On the other hand, going to hard for a humbling resulting in overextension and poor rolls leading to a humbling defeat would be thematic and entertaining.
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Sep 15, 2023 00:03
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TheParadigm posted:Sorry, I thought you knew the basics! Otherwise I would have been more verbose Ok thanks for this, the bit I was missing was the fact that the target you're shooting at has defence based on movement distance rather than movement type Scintilla posted:Honestly, the Quickstart guide skips over a lot of things, to the point where it's actually slightly useless. It's why I included a separate primer that covers most of the stuff it leaves out, including how to use jump jets and a section on how accuracy is calculated. Fully didn't notice this, sooo much better than the QS guide! I'm now thinking I should reverse to 1319 and fire my LL at the sentinel, it seems like my best chance of a hit and puts me out of LOS of the hunchback and griffin, I'm not particularly worried about the ac5 on the other wolverine. Otoh moving to 2119 seems like it would give me more chance to hit but also increases the possibility of taking flanking fire so I'm not sure Slavvy fucked around with this message at 00:13 on Sep 15, 2023 |
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Sep 15, 2023 00:09
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Probably a better idea to turn around and take a shot at that flanking Wolverine then. I'm just tagging everyone.
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Sep 15, 2023 03:34
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Slavvy posted:I'm now thinking I should reverse to 1319 and fire my LL at the sentinel, it seems like my best chance of a hit and puts me out of LOS of the hunchback and griffin, I'm not particularly worried about the ac5 on the other wolverine. This is one of the picky things about reverse movement: that move won't do what you want, and you also can't reverse elevation changes. (veteran players correct me if i'm wrong, is it just uphill thats disallowed?) 1319 doesn't have line of sight to the sentinel due to vertical height. 2214, the hill the sentinel is behind, is height 1 so you can shoot over the cover(there might be a +1 to hit involved, i forget, but there's definitely a chance of damage to the legs hitting the hill instead); if you move down to -1 elevation yourself then its definitely blocked. 1418, one hex short, does have vertical line of sight, but you're exposed to alot more fire there. The reason for this is mechs are 2 height, so 1 height difference you can shoot over. If its easier to imagine, You can think of 1 height terrain as your friendly video game Chest High Walls.
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Sep 15, 2023 03:47
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Friendly reminder to always check with Scintilla/this thread if you've got LOS to your target if you're not sure. I took shameless advantage of this and did better for it.
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Sep 15, 2023 05:50
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TheParadigm posted:This is one of the picky things about reverse movement: that move won't do what you want, and you also can't reverse elevation changes. (veteran players correct me if i'm wrong, is it just uphill thats disallowed?) Right I see, I was thinking of it as half cover and didn't realize I would effectively be a level below and unable to see I think I'm going to jump to the hex adjacent to the sentinel, 2214, and hope I can get lucky. We do need to reduce the guns in the field, and I'll be completely hidden from the other mechs by the hill afaict. If the sentinel stops to take a steady shot at me from close range, he's very likely to eat poo poo the next turn. Hopefully this doesn't backfire spectacularly! E: how much heat does jumping generate? Slavvy fucked around with this message at 10:39 on Sep 15, 2023 |
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Sep 15, 2023 10:33
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Slavvy posted:E: how much heat does jumping generate? 1 per hex jumped. Jump 3 hexes, 3 heat, 4 hexes, 4 heat etc.
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Sep 15, 2023 10:47
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iirc, 1 per hex min 3. You can get up to +4 heat without penalty. 5 is -1 mp!
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Sep 15, 2023 10:56
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Right so firing the two ML's and SRM after jumping five hexes should put me at 2 heat build up when all is said and done, that seems reasonable
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Sep 15, 2023 11:00
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TheParadigm posted:you also can't reverse elevation changes. This is correct, unless something huge happened in the errata you can't back up or down elevation changes.
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Sep 15, 2023 14:11
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^ idly curious, when the wolfhound backed down the hill and failed a PSR ending in blowing his own leg off in vipers of somerset was that a house rule for movement, or something like coming up with a way to handle a not-actually-legal movement order? regardless it's still a top-tier battletech moment from that thread
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Sep 15, 2023 14:50
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