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Favourite Pokémon type?
This poll is closed.
Plain 6 3.17%
Hot 7 3.70%
Wet 15 7.94%
Green 11 5.82%
Shocking 2 1.06%
Cold 3 1.59%
Punchy 7 3.70%
Poisonous 4 2.12%
Brown 7 3.70%
Bird 11 5.82%
Weird 17 8.99%
Gross 11 5.82%
Solid 2 1.06%
Scary 8 4.23%
Dragon 5 2.65%
Creepy 18 9.52%
Mech 33 17.46%
Pink 22 11.64%
Total: 189 votes
[Edit Poll (moderators only)]

 
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Infinitum
Jul 30, 2004


Khanstant posted:

got a click bait with some bad news about the sims. the next version will be free and not replace 4

My favourite Sims fact is that actual artists and bands will re-record their songs in Simlish for the game.

And if you're someone like me who doesn't play or know much about the Sims, you might be thinking I'm making that fact up

No no.

Actual artists and bands will re-record their songs while speaking made up gibberish.

And not just indie artists and bands, but international megastars will do it
https://sims.fandom.com/wiki/Songs_in_Simlish

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OdykyKHBqI8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxyW6AJ-yIk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uyGJjOlFGrU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FVAVmXgrUp4

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homeless snail
Mar 14, 2007

you missed the best one
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JMRGUH6sUEs

Waffleman_
Jan 20, 2011


I don't wanna I don't wanna I don't wanna I don't wanna!!!


The best part is how this is very specifically the original version with the slur.

Also

https://twitter.com/max_oats/status/1701999163808928127?t=nuggzIp8kWOhQDUZDzJnVQ&s=19

Hogama
Sep 3, 2011
There's probably a little more leeway for vocal pronunciation in Simlish than other languages.

Waffleman_
Jan 20, 2011


I don't wanna I don't wanna I don't wanna I don't wanna!!!

And yet

Ra ta da

homeless snail
Mar 14, 2007

Waffleman_ posted:

The best part is how this is very specifically the original version with the slur.

Also

https://twitter.com/max_oats/status/1701999163808928127?t=nuggzIp8kWOhQDUZDzJnVQ&s=19
the coolest thing about sentis is, afaik it doesn't do poo poo out of the box which is kinda what you'd expect from a neural network library, its just a framework to train nns and ship them with your game (and they do thankfully, run locally on your computer and not some cloud bullshit). yet they are selling it specifically as, AI generated dialogue and text to speech and all this poo poo

that's because they're also opening an AI model store, so when you buy all the assets for your asset flip game you can also buy a dialogue model someone's already trained on all the fantasy books they stole from libgen or whatever. in a matter of months, this poo poo is going to be in every bad unity game lmao

Waffleman_
Jan 20, 2011


I don't wanna I don't wanna I don't wanna I don't wanna!!!

That is if there are even bad unity games anymore.

homeless snail
Mar 14, 2007

on the other side they also have unity muse, which is their editor AI tool, where you can ask it to generate a 5x5 room and randomly populate it with all the assets you bought

Waffleman_ posted:

That is if there are even bad unity games anymore.
I don't think the runtime fee stuff really bothers the asset flip community. if theyre even making enough per game to hit the threshold, they're still coming out ahead

Vermain
Sep 5, 2006



homeless snail posted:

the coolest thing about sentis is, afaik it doesn't do poo poo out of the box which is kinda what you'd expect from a neural network library, its just a framework to train nns and ship them with your game (and they do thankfully, run locally on your computer and not some cloud bullshit). yet they are selling it specifically as, AI generated dialogue and text to speech and all this poo poo

that's because they're also opening an AI model store, so when you buy all the assets for your asset flip game you can also buy a dialogue model someone's already trained on all the fantasy books they stole from libgen or whatever. in a matter of months, this poo poo is going to be in every bad unity game lmao

much like how blockchain democratized scamming, generative AI models are going to democratize kusoge. you love to see it

Khanstant
Apr 5, 2007
recording your song in simlish is probably really fun.

homeless snail posted:

on the other side they also have unity muse, which is their editor AI tool, where you can ask it to generate a 5x5 room and randomly populate it with all the assets you bought

I don't think the runtime fee stuff really bothers the asset flip community. if theyre even making enough per game to hit the threshold, they're still coming out ahead

who buys these kinds of games?

exquisite tea
Apr 21, 2007

Carly shook her glass, willing the ice to melt. "You still haven't told me what the mission is."

She leaned forward. "We are going to assassinate the bad men of Hollywood."


If I had a terrible Unity asset flip game on Steam I wouldn't charge two dollars for it. I would charge a million dollars. You only need one!

homeless snail
Mar 14, 2007

most of the real asset flip games I'm aware of (as opposed to good games that happen to use a lot of asset store assets) seem to be streamer bait, and then idk, children or viewers of streamers that have bad taste buy them. there's a pair of brothers in japan that make these kinda crude asset flip horror games that somehow became japanese streamer + vtuber staples, and they're at the point where they can churn a new one of these out every two months
https://store.steampowered.com/bundle/12139/Chillas_Art_Complete_Pack/

Ineffiable
Feb 16, 2008

Some say that his politics are terrifying, and that he once punched a horse to the ground...


I think this is the main chat for the unity bullshit.

So realistically, if they do go through with this, what is going to happen?

Any dev's with games in the work will just have accept that they're gonna make less profit per game? (too much money at stake, can't just cut development or switch engines)

Anyone with a game already out is gonna have to either take their games off or just keep it up for sale and hope they don't gt charged too much (I mean I assume they're still gonna make enough per sale to cover it, it's just gonna suck having to pay another bill)

Any project that is still early on is likely to switch to a new engine/developers won't trust unity going forward (because even if they walk everything back, developers are just not gonna trust this anymore)

Did I miss any realistic outcomes?

happyhippy
Feb 21, 2005

Playing games, watching movies, owning goons. 'sup
Pillbug

Ineffiable posted:

Did I miss any realistic outcomes?

Steam and Epic Games go 'we're not hosting your games any more' and Unity u-turn it within 24 hours.

Vermain
Sep 5, 2006



homeless snail posted:

most of the real asset flip games I'm aware of (as opposed to good games that happen to use a lot of asset store assets) seem to be streamer bait, and then idk, children or viewers of streamers that have bad taste buy them. there's a pair of brothers in japan that make these kinda crude asset flip horror games that somehow became japanese streamer + vtuber staples, and they're at the point where they can churn a new one of these out every two months
https://store.steampowered.com/bundle/12139/Chillas_Art_Complete_Pack/

i think chilla's art games sit firmly in the category of good games that use a lot of assets, IMO; the brothers clearly understand how to milk a lot of eeriness out of the disparate assets and manage to get a lot of atmosphere out of simple filters and lighting tricks. it's creative low budget roger corman stuff as opposed to, say, the slaughtering grounds

homeless snail
Mar 14, 2007

Ineffiable posted:

I think this is the main chat for the unity bullshit.

So realistically, if they do go through with this, what is going to happen?

Any dev's with games in the work will just have accept that they're gonna make less profit per game? (too much money at stake, can't just cut development or switch engines)

Anyone with a game already out is gonna have to either take their games off or just keep it up for sale and hope they don't gt charged too much (I mean I assume they're still gonna make enough per sale to cover it, it's just gonna suck having to pay another bill)

Any project that is still early on is likely to switch to a new engine/developers won't trust unity going forward (because even if they walk everything back, developers are just not gonna trust this anymore)

Did I miss any realistic outcomes?
my prediction is, they'll probably walk it back to a regular revenue based royalty at this point even though riccitiello has spent the last 10 years loudly declaring thats intrinsically evil, as a concept. and then everyone is annoyed about it but accepts it because they have too much invested in unity

for the majority of people the runtime fee wouldn't be that big a deal in practice, if it wasn't collected in the most insane possible way, but also its totally obvious they didn't think about any of the edge cases where people get hosed extremely hard by it in a way that makes unity look malicious. straight up 5% of revenue like epic ends up being a lot more fair and reasonable even if most people would end up paying less at 20 cents per unit (per install is an insane fantasy and is not going to happen)

they're gonna have to collect more license fees somehow, they're hemorrhaging money (especially since the IPO) and they get gently caress all from the the current seat fees but also its totally impractical for them to keep hiking them, so some kind of royalty is their only option. they can't afford to walk that back all the way

Ineffiable
Feb 16, 2008

Some say that his politics are terrifying, and that he once punched a horse to the ground...


It has to be clear to developers that even if somehow this is walked back, they can't trust unity anymore so they're just gonna jump ship eventually. I'm just concerned how much impact we might see on already released games.

homeless snail
Mar 14, 2007

easier said than done tbh. and for a lot of people, there really aren't viable alternatives to unity

haveblue
Aug 15, 2005



Toilet Rascal

Ineffiable posted:

Any dev's with games in the work will just have accept that they're gonna make less profit per game? (too much money at stake, can't just cut development or switch engines)

Whether you can migrate your game to a new engine is a very case-specific question. If you haven't started actually producing code/content yet, migration is relatively easy. If you have 10% of a game built in Unity, you may decide it's worth it to cut your losses and start over. If you have 90% of a game built in Unity, you're probably stuck with it.

quote:

Anyone with a game already out is gonna have to either take their games off or just keep it up for sale and hope they don't gt charged too much (I mean I assume they're still gonna make enough per sale to cover it, it's just gonna suck having to pay another bill)

Unity has at this point been forced to back down to only charging people based on installs that happen after the policy comes into effect, so it's likely (not certain) that they aren't going to suddenly send multi-hundred-thousand-dollar invoices to long-tail Unity games that got a ton of installs in say 2018 and very few today. And that's if they don't change the policy further.

quote:

Any project that is still early on is likely to switch to a new engine/developers won't trust unity going forward (because even if they walk everything back, developers are just not gonna trust this anymore)

This is very likely. Unity as a brand is radioactive now, industry voices will tell each other to avoid it and no one who does any research will sign a new contract.

The wild card option is that it goes to court, which could in theory result in Unity being ordered to never do this ever again. If that happens, and there's a complete cleanout of leadership, maybe they can start to rebuild trust.

Waffleman_
Jan 20, 2011


I don't wanna I don't wanna I don't wanna I don't wanna!!!

Also I suspect some of the bigger devs and publishers will simply say "I'm not paying that" and Unity will probably back down instead of having to defend it in court

Mzbundifund
Nov 5, 2011

I'm afraid so.
I wonder what the odds of a court case are. Probably zero if they back off, but if they dig in their heels they’re going to have to fight a tag team of Microsoft, Epic, and Valve, and, uh, good luck with THAT

Volte
Oct 4, 2004

woosh woosh

haveblue posted:

Unity has at this point been forced to back down to only charging people based on installs that happen after the policy comes into effect, so it's likely (not certain) that they aren't going to suddenly send multi-hundred-thousand-dollar invoices to long-tail Unity games that got a ton of installs in say 2018 and very few today. And that's if they don't change the policy further.
They were never going to charge for installs prior to 2024, the only change they did was that repeatedly reinstalling the program on the same computer doesn't count now (they claim, offering no specifics on how they'll even know)

homeless snail
Mar 14, 2007

like, unity has been on an obvious decline for years now, particularly since the IPO, but there's so much personal and institutional investment in unity, and pipelines built around unity assets in particular, and spaces where unity is just kind of the defacto monopoly, that most people using unity would rather build around its deficiencies than switch engines. if it actually goes through, there's going to be a lot of people doing the calculus of the cost of staying in unity vs the cost of switching, and deciding that its still cheaper to work in unity

Vermain
Sep 5, 2006



i think the only real loss in terms of new developers to unity would be indie devs who don't want to risk getting stuck in a margin where they suddenly have to pay out the nose (e.g. the demonschool guys), but i have to imagine that's a relatively small part of unity's licensee base, and the alternatives (UE, godot, gamemaker) don't have nearly the same amount of built-up support for smaller developers in terms of tutorials, assets, etc. that unity does

it's kind of like how OW2 has a lot about it that absolutely sucks, but if you want to play an arcade hero shooter then it's like, that or loving paladins

The 7th Guest
Dec 17, 2003

i dont understand this but somehow PS+ has a game pass quality month

quote:

PlayStation Plus Extra and Premium | Game Catalog

NieR Replicant ver.1.22474487139… | PS4
13 Sentinels: Aegis Rim | PS4
Sid Meier's Civilization VI | PS4
Star Ocean The Divine Force | PS4, PS5
Sniper Ghost Warrior Contracts 2 | PS4, PS5
Odin Sphere Leifthrasir | PS4
Unpacking | PS4, PS5
Planet Coaster: Console Edition | PS4, PS5
This War of Mine: Final Cut | PS5
Cloudpunk | PS4, PS5
Contra: Rogue Corps | PS4
Tails Noir | PS4, PS5
Call of the Sea | PS4, PS5
West of Dead | PS4
Star Ocean: Integrity and Faithlessness | PS4
PAW Patrol The Movie: Adventure City Calls | PS4, PS5

PlayStation Premium | Classics

Star Ocean First Departure R | PS4
Star Ocean: Till the End of Time | PS4
Star Ocean: The Last Hope – 4K & FHD Remaster | PS4
Dragon's Crown Pro | PS4

i mean except for contra rogue corps

i guess they had to have a good month after jacking up the price though

Nitrousoxide
May 30, 2011

do not buy a oneplus phone



Vermain posted:

i think the only real loss in terms of new developers to unity would be indie devs who don't want to risk getting stuck in a margin where they suddenly have to pay out the nose (e.g. the demonschool guys), but i have to imagine that's a relatively small part of unity's licensee base, and the alternatives (UE, godot, gamemaker) don't have nearly the same amount of built-up support for smaller developers in terms of tutorials, assets, etc. that unity does

it's kind of like how OW2 has a lot about it that absolutely sucks, but if you want to play an arcade hero shooter then it's like, that or loving paladins

I think no one would be interested in starting up a new Unity project when they are pulling absolutely batshit stuff like this. Even if they walk it all the way back to where they started they will have turned their brand radioactive to any dev.

Ineffiable
Feb 16, 2008

Some say that his politics are terrifying, and that he once punched a horse to the ground...


The 7th Guest posted:

i dont understand this but somehow PS+ has a game pass quality month

i mean except for contra rogue corps

i guess they had to have a good month after jacking up the price though

Its a great month if you love Japanese games. Hopefully they'll keep adding lots of stuff.

haveblue
Aug 15, 2005



Toilet Rascal

homeless snail posted:

if it actually goes through, there's going to be a lot of people doing the calculus of the cost of staying in unity vs the cost of switching, and deciding that its still cheaper to work in unity

Maybe if you had any confidence that the numbers and fee structure will never change, but unity is doing their best to destroy that confidence right now and other platforms are willing to guarantee that you do not face that kind of uncertainty

Khanstant
Apr 5, 2007

homeless snail posted:

easier said than done tbh. and for a lot of people, there really aren't viable alternatives to unity

Reminds me of every time I'm mad at Illustrator or Photoshop and they come out with a new update with a bunch of bullshit I don't want and leaving 20 years old problems in. You technically have alternatives but also not really.

homeless snail
Mar 14, 2007

Khanstant posted:

Reminds me of every time I'm mad at Illustrator or Photoshop and they come out with a new update with a bunch of bullshit I don't want and leaving 20 years old problems in. You technically have alternatives but also not really.
drat dude but the gimp is free

Adam Bowen
Jan 6, 2003

This post probably contains a Rickroll link!

Ineffiable posted:

I think this is the main chat for the unity bullshit.

So realistically, if they do go through with this, what is going to happen?

Any dev's with games in the work will just have accept that they're gonna make less profit per game? (too much money at stake, can't just cut development or switch engines)

Anyone with a game already out is gonna have to either take their games off or just keep it up for sale and hope they don't gt charged too much (I mean I assume they're still gonna make enough per sale to cover it, it's just gonna suck having to pay another bill)

Any project that is still early on is likely to switch to a new engine/developers won't trust unity going forward (because even if they walk everything back, developers are just not gonna trust this anymore)

Did I miss any realistic outcomes?

The way they've handled this is incredibly scummy, but let's be real about the impact here. It's $2,000 a year for unity pro, after which anything that makes over $1,000,000 AND over 1,000,000 installs costs 2 cents per install . Spring another $1,000 a year for Unity enterprise and the fees are cut in half. If you're pulling in $200,000+ revenue on a single game you're not going to be using the free tier of Unity. Who is an extra penny per install going to hurt?

edit: I misquoted the fee arrangement, my bad. Worst case scenario is an extra 12 cents per install which is obviously much higher than 1 cent but still absolutely nothing unless you're selling your games for $1-$2 and somehow also making millions of dollars on them.

Adam Bowen fucked around with this message at 20:50 on Sep 13, 2023

Hwurmp
May 20, 2005

Adam Bowen posted:

The way they've handled this is incredibly scummy, but let's be real about the impact here. It's $2,000 a year for unity pro, after which anything that makes over $1,000,000 AND over 1,000,000 installs costs 2 cents per install . Spring another $1,000 a year for Unity enterprise and the fees are cut in half. If you're pulling in $200,000+ revenue on a single game you're not going to be using the free tier of Unity. Who is an extra penny per install going to hurt?

gently caress off

DalaranJ
Apr 15, 2008

Yosuke will now die for you.

I guess the answer is no, RGG is not doing more directs than Nintendo. They certainly seem like they’re competing on it.

RBA Starblade
Apr 28, 2008

Going Home.

Games Idiot Court Jester

Adam Bowen posted:

The way they've handled this is incredibly scummy, but let's be real about the impact here. It's $2,000 a year for unity pro, after which anything that makes over $1,000,000 AND over 1,000,000 installs costs 2 cents per install . Spring another $1,000 a year for Unity enterprise and the fees are cut in half. If you're pulling in $200,000+ revenue on a single game you're not going to be using the free tier of Unity. Who is an extra penny per install going to hurt?

edit: I misquoted the fee arrangement, my bad. Worst case scenario is an extra 12 cents per install which is obviously much higher than 1 cent but still absolutely nothing unless you're selling your games for $1-$2 and somehow also making millions of dollars on them.

Ok Mr. Riccitiello

Khanstant
Apr 5, 2007

homeless snail posted:

drat dude but the gimp is free

That's definitely one of the technical alternatives but not reallys. Last I checked GIMP couldn't even open PSDs without just losing information.

homeless snail
Mar 14, 2007

Adam Bowen posted:

The way they've handled this is incredibly scummy, but let's be real about the impact here. It's $2,000 a year for unity pro, after which anything that makes over $1,000,000 AND over 1,000,000 installs costs 2 cents per install . Spring another $1,000 a year for Unity enterprise and the fees are cut in half. If you're pulling in $200,000+ revenue on a single game you're not going to be using the free tier of Unity. Who is an extra penny per install going to hurt?

edit: I misquoted the fee arrangement, my bad. Worst case scenario is an extra 12 cents per install which is obviously much higher than 1 cent but still absolutely nothing unless you're selling your games for $1-$2 and somehow also making millions of dollars on them.
I don't think you're entirely wrong but, pro is $2,000 per seat, you don't necessarily need to buy a license for every person on your team but that stacks up, you don't need to be that big of a team to have a 5 figure license fee, and big studios are easily in the 6 figures. as for who it hurts, anyone that makes a mobile game with a lot of installs and a little bit but not that much income, with average revenue per user less than 20 cents. which is, a lot of unity's user base

Waffleman_
Jan 20, 2011


I don't wanna I don't wanna I don't wanna I don't wanna!!!

https://twitter.com/PlayStation/status/1702049745554772126?t=z-vb9f9nfxqbK_UHUsykQQ&s=19

Steve Yun
Aug 7, 2003
I'm a parasitic landlord that needs to get a job instead of stealing worker's money. Make sure to remind me when I post.
Soiled Meat
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=?embed?a_lu152g5aM

Steve Yun fucked around with this message at 21:25 on Sep 13, 2023

Shinjobi
Jul 10, 2008


Gravy Boat 2k

Adam Bowen posted:

The way they've handled this is incredibly scummy, but let's be real about the impact here. It's $2,000 a year for unity pro, after which anything that makes over $1,000,000 AND over 1,000,000 installs costs 2 cents per install . Spring another $1,000 a year for Unity enterprise and the fees are cut in half. If you're pulling in $200,000+ revenue on a single game you're not going to be using the free tier of Unity. Who is an extra penny per install going to hurt?

edit: I misquoted the fee arrangement, my bad. Worst case scenario is an extra 12 cents per install which is obviously much higher than 1 cent but still absolutely nothing unless you're selling your games for $1-$2 and somehow also making millions of dollars on them.

You can say "its not that bad" all you want but anyone who changes the terms of the contract already signed and also tries to go retroactive with it as well cannot and should not be trusted with anything. It's a poison pill, and not one you can cough back up.

It's one of those things you just don't do unless drat near 100% of your user base shrugs and goes "hahaha I mean yeah we had a pretty sweet deal before, we gotta admit."

That doesn't happen, typically.

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Barry Convex
Sep 1, 2005

Think of the good things, Pim! The good things!

Like Jesus, candy, and crackerjacks! Ice cream and cake and lots o'laffs!
Grandma, Grandpa, and Uncle Joe! Larry, Curly, and brother Moe!

Focus on previously announced third-party titles sounds pretty underwhelming, but we'll see. guess Monster Hunter World 2 will be announced somewhere else?

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