Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Post
  • Reply
Mederlock
Jun 23, 2012

You won't recognize Canada when I'm through with it
Grimey Drawer

Asterite34 posted:

I'm not super up to date on my Planescape lore, which outer plane has robot dinosaurs? Because that's where I wanna go when I die now

Probably one of the material planes that are :krad:


:synpa:

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010

College Slice

Tias posted:

how long would the list have to be? :D

I'm looking for around 50-100 for nice variety, if you've got PayPal I would be up to paying you to this for me. :) We can discuss the details via pm if you are.

Yusin
Mar 4, 2021

Asterite34 posted:

I'm not super up to date on my Planescape lore, which outer plane has robot dinosaurs? Because that's where I wanna go when I die now

The Gatetowns appearntly project an aura of influence that make the local flora and fauna more like the planes they are connected to. So if some Dinosaurs lived near the gate to Mechancus long enough they may turn into constructs.

Verisimilidude
Dec 20, 2006

Strike quick and hurry at him,
not caring to hit or miss.
So that you dishonor him before the judges



DMs: how do you handle rogues hiding in the middle of melee combat?

I have a player who wants to play a stealthy rogue melee combatant. He's a bit used to how rogues operate in BG3, where you can hide based on vision cones. Reading the hiding rules, it seems like you can't hide in plain sight. You need something obscuring you in some way, such as darkness or cover. You can't merely be "behind" the enemy, and out of their immediate vision.

How do you handle this kind of situation?

homeless snail
Mar 14, 2007

I think the question is, why are they trying to hide? Is it to get sneak attack? Because you don't need to be hidden to trigger sneak attack. Otherwise yeah, hiding means physically hiding yourself generally, not just out of one person in particular's sight.

Vargatron
Apr 19, 2008

MRAZZLE DAZZLE


Verisimilidude posted:

DMs: how do you handle rogues hiding in the middle of melee combat?

I have a player who wants to play a stealthy rogue melee combatant. He's a bit used to how rogues operate in BG3, where you can hide based on vision cones. Reading the hiding rules, it seems like you can't hide in plain sight. You need something obscuring you in some way, such as darkness or cover. You can't merely be "behind" the enemy, and out of their immediate vision.

How do you handle this kind of situation?

They either need to break line of sight with the enemy, or have a particular feat or background trait which allows them to use allies as cover. They would do a stealth check contested by the monster's perception check to see if the hide is successful or not. You may have to rule depending on the nature of cover. In my games, I let people hide behind objects 3 feet or more in height or in darkness if they are outside of an enemy's range of vision.

Kaal
May 22, 2002

through thousands of posts in D&D over a decade, I now believe I know what I'm talking about. if I post forcefully and confidently, I can convince others that is true. no one sees through my facade.

Verisimilidude posted:

DMs: how do you handle rogues hiding in the middle of melee combat?

I have a player who wants to play a stealthy rogue melee combatant. He's a bit used to how rogues operate in BG3, where you can hide based on vision cones. Reading the hiding rules, it seems like you can't hide in plain sight. You need something obscuring you in some way, such as darkness or cover. You can't merely be "behind" the enemy, and out of their immediate vision.

How do you handle this kind of situation?

The Swashbuckler Rogue was designed for this issue explicitly. If they haven’t already chosen a class, I’d suggest pushing them in that direction. Otherwise, the rules on hiding are vague and it’s really up to the DM. To my mind, the intention is that hiding should require more than mere distraction - it isn’t super flanking.

quote:

In combat, most creatures stay alert for signs of danger all around, so if you come out of hiding and approach a creature, it usually sees you. However, under certain circumstances, the GM might allow you to stay hidden as you approach a creature that is distracted, allowing you to gain advantage on an attack roll before you are seen.

If they want to be a melee stealth rogue without swashbuckler, I’d suggest offering maps with lots of torches to douse and pillars to hide behind. That way they can interact with the environment and justify hiding in a way that doesn’t suggest every attack is a potential surprise attack.

HellCopter
Feb 9, 2012
College Slice

Verisimilidude posted:

DMs: how do you handle rogues hiding in the middle of melee combat?

I have a player who wants to play a stealthy rogue melee combatant. He's a bit used to how rogues operate in BG3, where you can hide based on vision cones. Reading the hiding rules, it seems like you can't hide in plain sight. You need something obscuring you in some way, such as darkness or cover. You can't merely be "behind" the enemy, and out of their immediate vision.

How do you handle this kind of situation?

If he's doing it for the advantage, consider letting him use the Steady Aim optional feature. Rouges getting their sneak attack damage is part of the class that they're expected to get on most of their hits, not a secret bonus.
If he's doing it because he wants to feel like a cool Rouge, then sure when he asks "is there anything to hide behind" throw him a bone and put a shrubbery or waist-high wall nearby. I wouldn't let him hide in plain sight. There are other features for that.

Staltran
Jan 3, 2013

Fallen Rib
While there are optional facing rules in the DMG, I wouldn't recommend using them. Even if you did use them, they'd make hiding for melee rogues kind of pointless—creatures can't see into their rear arcs with the facing variant, so the rougue would have advantage just by walking behind the enemy, no need to hide... and then on their turn the enemy could do the same thing to the rogue. I'd say you're best off just requiring the rogue to hide behind something. Might consider letting them run out of cover and move up to the enemy to attack and get the advantage from being hidden, though.

e: And definitely let them use Steady Aim too, even if you're not using the rest of Tasha's for whatever reason. It's more situational for melee, but oh well.

NeurosisHead
Jul 22, 2007

NONONONONONONONONO

Staltran posted:

I wouldn't call 1200 gp a minimal expense up to, I dunno, level 15 at the earliest. Also I'm pretty sure it's 3000 gp. But even if you can get them for 1200 (the hard part is finding 61 sleep scrolls to buy in the first place, of course), that means you're not upcasting, which means they're 5d8. In order for all sleep spells to roll high enough 61 times in a row 50% of the time, each spell needs to succeed at least ~98.9% of the time. For 5d8, that means the fiend needs to have 12 hp or less. Do you really want to pay 1200 gp to effectively do 11 damage (and heal the fiend for 11 too, I guess)? Even if there's still about a 38% chance (for 11 hp) the fiend will be awake for at least one round?

This got me thinking about treasure, and I realized that I've never actually looked at the DMG guidance for treasure, just given it out however seemed appropriate. Groups have a hoard, individuals have some pocket change and their equipment, etc. It's never been a problem in my games, but I sort of think of PC's in 5E as more like grimdark low fantasy action heroes, rather than the high fantasy swords & sorcery types I thought of in previous editions (or any game set in Faerun). That's probably due to bounded accuracy rules leading to less progressive +++ on your gear over time, and the ceiling on dice rolls coming down as a result.

The DMG posted:

You can hand out as much or as little treasure as you want. Over the course of a typical campaign, a party finds treasure hoards amounting to seven rolls on the Challenge 0–4 table, eighteen rolls on the Challenge 5–10 table, twelve rolls on the Challenge 11–16 table, and eight rolls on the Challenge 17+ table.

So if the party is say, 8th level (a level at which they can't cast planar binding but getting a scroll of it is totally conceivable), we'll call that 7 rolls for 0-4 and 9 for 5-10 since they're halfway to 10. Just for raw averages, that comes to 36,085 gp, without accounting for art objects and gems. Party of 5 PCs splitting evenly, that's 7,217 gp each. If your players haven't been interested in expensive downtime like building a stronghold or buying magic items they might have a lot of cash kicking around by the DMG's standards!

Mederlock
Jun 23, 2012

You won't recognize Canada when I'm through with it
Grimey Drawer
Also, check the DMG for the Optional rules on Facing page 252, which is the closest official rules to how BG3 handles it. If it's not a rule you want to implement, then that idea is simply not relevant to your game.

An important factor to keep in mind for BG3 style combat, is that the system is heavily influenced by the combat engine from their earlier games Divinity Original Sin 1 and 2, and it's also modified to fit in with a definitionally more restricted medium, being a video game and all. So while there are some modifications and new rules that are worth looking at bringing into D&D, not all of them are going to be anywhere close to balanced in the much more unrestricted and open tabletop side of the game.

I assume that an entity's perception is an amalgamation of their hearing, vision, understanding of 3D space and object permanence, and gut feeling/intuition. While they can't see behind them per se, they can hear sounds, and then turn their head freely to look around them and see what's happening, so someone can't just walk behind you, crouch down and say they're hiding and then completely surprise you. They also understand that if something runs past them, that there is now a hostile entity behind them and they'll be trying to keep tabs on the threat. On top of all of that, if there are multiple enemies, they'll be calling out approaching threats to each other as they see them as free actions. So I personally wouldn't use BG3's vision cone concept for determining whether someone can Hide in combat.

If their target was more of a construct with a fixed means of vision and sensing or something by themselves, or their vision was directly obscured by an object, ie. The player ducks into thick underbrush, hides, and then does a lap around the bushes to attack from another angle, then I would allow it in those situations, provided they could get back to the enemies when they choose to do their attack within one turn's worth of movement.

Staltran
Jan 3, 2013

Fallen Rib

NeurosisHead posted:

This got me thinking about treasure, and I realized that I've never actually looked at the DMG guidance for treasure, just given it out however seemed appropriate. Groups have a hoard, individuals have some pocket change and their equipment, etc. It's never been a problem in my games, but I sort of think of PC's in 5E as more like grimdark low fantasy action heroes, rather than the high fantasy swords & sorcery types I thought of in previous editions (or any game set in Faerun). That's probably due to bounded accuracy rules leading to less progressive +++ on your gear over time, and the ceiling on dice rolls coming down as a result.

So if the party is say, 8th level (a level at which they can't cast planar binding but getting a scroll of it is totally conceivable), we'll call that 7 rolls for 0-4 and 9 for 5-10 since they're halfway to 10. Just for raw averages, that comes to 36,085 gp, without accounting for art objects and gems. Party of 5 PCs splitting evenly, that's 7,217 gp each. If your players haven't been interested in expensive downtime like building a stronghold or buying magic items they might have a lot of cash kicking around by the DMG's standards!

Oh, the players will definitely end up with a bunch of gold if you don't give them ways to spend it. But I'd imagine it's a rare campaign where you can find sixty sleep scrolls for sale while not having other magic items for sale. Xanathar's prices uncommon magic items at 1d6 hundred gold (quite affordable later) and rare magic items at 2d10 thousand gold, which is... a lot even in tier three. (Also a pretty dramatic jump—nonconsumable magic items cost on average 350 for uncommon, 11000 for rare, 35000 for very rare, and 325000 for legendary. I get why legendary items would be super expensive if you manage to find one for sale, but rares costing as much as 31 uncommons?). But even if you make rares more reasonably priced, if they're widely available your players should be easily able to spend their money.

(And if 1st level scrolls are sold in bulk, you'd probably be more interested in things like Longstrider, Cure Wounds, Mage Armor, etc., stuff you'd like to cast pretty often out of combat but probably don't want to spend a slot on. Maybe some rituals too so you don't need to pause for 10 minutes in a dangerous area.)

(Of course, the best money sinks are various vanity projects but that tends to require some player initiative/buy in.)

Kaal
May 22, 2002

through thousands of posts in D&D over a decade, I now believe I know what I'm talking about. if I post forcefully and confidently, I can convince others that is true. no one sees through my facade.
Video games also offer a lot more concrete feedback for vision / hiding / stealth than a pen and pencil game. A mechanically complex system is fun when a computer is running the numbers, but it’s less fun when facing comes down to arbitrary hex movement, constant dice rolls, or pure theater of the mind.

Sandwich Anarchist
Sep 12, 2008
I have a new player with a degenerative disease that makes it very hard for him to see clear enough to read. He needs to use a magnifying app on his phone to read his character sheet. Any suggestions on things I could to make the game more accessible for him?

Mederlock
Jun 23, 2012

You won't recognize Canada when I'm through with it
Grimey Drawer
This is the link to a Discord server for players with impairments

https://discord.gg/dapD8upQGr

In the Accessible-Resources channel, they have links to a word document and an excel sheet for a 5e character sheet that their phone or tablet should be able to massively magnify/zoom in on so they can see it with more ease.

Yusin
Mar 4, 2021

Another Planescape thing, this time the Dozen Ascendent Factions, and some details about them.

https://www.dndbeyond.com/posts/1577-download-now-12-sigil-faction-recruitment-posters

YggdrasilTM
Nov 7, 2011

I'm Just drink and I wanted to Say that I loving love RPG in general and DnD in particular.

whydirt
Apr 18, 2001


Gaz Posting Brigade :c00lbert:
Hi Just Drink, I’m Dad

El Fideo
Jun 10, 2016

I trusted a rhino and deserve all that came to me


YggdrasilTM posted:

I'm Just drink and I wanted to Say that I loving love RPG in general and DnD in particular.

This rap verse has terrible flow.

imagine dungeons
Jan 24, 2008

Like an arrow, I was only passing through.
I’m just drink and I’m here to say
I love rpg in a major way
D&D feels real good
Playin in my neighborhood

stratdax
Sep 14, 2006

I just finished up at a free 2.5 hour drop in session at my local games and comics store. I haven't played in decades. The DM had already prepared some characters & had dice to use. Pretty fun, the most fun for me was definitely when the models and maps came out and we had a battle. The "using creativity to solve problems (like wagons stuck in a river)", and "talk to the innkeeper to find out some information" parts definitely didn't speak to me as strongly. ie, the actual roleplaying. Does this mean a year from now I'll have spent $2000 on warhammer figures? lol
They're having short 4 session campaigns coming up, not sure I'll be able to commit but I bought a Player's Handbook anyway. And just as a thank you for hosting the session.

stratdax fucked around with this message at 00:36 on Sep 24, 2023

Pollyanna
Mar 5, 2005

Milk's on them.


stratdax posted:

Does this mean a year from now I'll have spent $2000 on warhammer figures?

Probably. :v:

Lamuella
Jun 26, 2003

It's like goldy or bronzy, but made of iron.


stratdax posted:

Does this mean a year from now I'll have spent $2000 on warhammer figures?

Possibly. Twenty figures isn't that many.

Hieronymous Alloy
Jan 30, 2009


Why! Why!! Why must you refuse to accept that Dr. Hieronymous Alloy's Genetically Enhanced Cream Corn Is Superior to the Leading Brand on the Market!?!




Morbid Hound

Lamuella posted:

Possibly. Twenty figures isn't that many.

They go on sale?

BigRed0427
Mar 23, 2007

There's no one I'd rather be than me.

Is there anything else out there that's similar to DnD Beyond for putting all the Books and resources have in one spot and easy reference? I'm not pumping money into Beyond unless there's a way to tell it what physcial books I already own.

Mederlock
Jun 23, 2012

You won't recognize Canada when I'm through with it
Grimey Drawer

stratdax posted:

I just finished up at a free 2.5 hour drop in session at my local games and comics store. I haven't played in decades. The DM had already prepared some characters & had dice to use. Pretty fun, the most fun for me was definitely when the models and maps came out and we had a battle. The "using creativity to solve problems (like wagons stuck in a river)", and "talk to the innkeeper to find out some information" parts definitely didn't speak to me as strongly. ie, the actual roleplaying. Does this mean a year from now I'll have spent $2000 on warhammer figures? lol
They're having short 4 session campaigns coming up, not sure I'll be able to commit but I bought a Player's Handbook anyway. And just as a thank you for hosting the session.

Alternatively You can play Warhammer on Tabletop Simulator and not bankrupt yourself. :sun: For a game like WH40K.. unless your yearly income is fabulous enough to afford a crazy amount of minis and time spent painting and paying for painting supplies, it's just not a game I'd recommend to play physically

You can also find (or start!) A D&D group that explicitly focuses more on combat encounters. The game is based on and revolves around a Wargaming rules core, after all. You could definitely do a military campaign focused on fighting off a hobgoblin invasion(think LOTR uruk-hai / super-goblins with Roman legionary tactics), have your party start off as a recon party or something and have them work their way up to being the defenders of X Town.

Or, an explicit old-school style dungeon crawl campaign might satisfy you too, with less of an emphasis on traps and more on fighting baddies.

Lamuella
Jun 26, 2003

It's like goldy or bronzy, but made of iron.


BigRed0427 posted:

Is there anything else out there that's similar to DnD Beyond for putting all the Books and resources have in one spot and easy reference? I'm not pumping money into Beyond unless there's a way to tell it what physcial books I already own.

What I'll say delicately is "not legally". The issue is how to verify physical ownership.

Yusin
Mar 4, 2021

BigRed0427 posted:

Is there anything else out there that's similar to DnD Beyond for putting all the Books and resources have in one spot and easy reference? I'm not pumping money into Beyond unless there's a way to tell it what physcial books I already own.

Beyond does Physical Digital Bundles now.

Dexo
Aug 15, 2009

A city that was to live by night after the wilderness had passed. A city that was to forge out of steel and blood-red neon its own peculiar wilderness.
It is trivial to find places that have the entirety of whats been released for 5E.

Pollyanna
Mar 5, 2005

Milk's on them.


I think Hasbro has enough money as-is.

Arione
Aug 19, 2013

by Athanatos

Lamuella posted:

What I'll say delicately is "not legally". The issue is how to verify physical ownership.

Well with 40k, ever book comes with a serial code that you redeem to get it on the app. shrink wrap the drat books like they do and stick one time serials in them

HermitSupplier
Sep 19, 2023
Vampire the Masquerade does a similar thing. Should be standard practice across the industry honestly

homeless snail
Mar 14, 2007

I think they like people thumbing through the books in the store so they don't want to shrink them.

Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles
Alternatively you could put the codes behind the counter in the shop and have the cashier give you your voucher when you buy. Or set up things so the receipt prints the code.

Neither's a perfect solution (staff could steal the PDF codes, not every shop may have a till that can print the right kind of receipt), but both methods were used by video game stores at different points so they're potential solutions, if shops don't want to do shrink-wrap.

Lamuella
Jun 26, 2003

It's like goldy or bronzy, but made of iron.


Scratch-off with a code is how a lot of academic publishers do it.

My issue was more how you establish ownership for books someone already owns, not for ones they are currently buying.

nelson
Apr 12, 2009
College Slice
Getting both the physical book and the online content is a bit like getting the collectors edition in video games. You don’t need both. If you want both pay for both.

gurragadon
Jul 28, 2006

You don't need both, but I don't see it like collector's edition's because you're just getting the same thing in two formats, not extras. It's not essential but it's a nice bonus that would encourage me to buy physical copies because I like reading the AP and lore books straight through in print, but at the table it's usually easier to have pdf copies.

Funzo
Dec 6, 2002



My issue is that it is possible to get the physical book bundle with access on DnD Beyond, but only if you buy direct from WoTC. If you want the alt art cover, which is only available from retailers, you're out of luck and have to buy it twice. I'd much rather see them go to the same route that GW did and just sell shrink-wrapped books with a code. Send out extra "store copies" if you want people to be able to leaf through the book in game stores.

Dienes
Nov 4, 2009

dee
doot doot dee
doot doot doot
doot doot dee
dee doot doot
doot doot dee
dee doot doot


College Slice

Lamuella posted:

Scratch-off with a code is how a lot of academic publishers do it.

My issue was more how you establish ownership for books someone already owns, not for ones they are currently buying.

A receipt?

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Pollyanna
Mar 5, 2005

Milk's on them.


Reading through the halfling section of the PHB and finding it eerily accurate to my pet halfling rogue OC, right down to how I played her in BG3. :shittypop: Maybe I absorbed these ideas from other media or something.

Pollyanna fucked around with this message at 15:02 on Sep 26, 2023

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply