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Sep 29, 2023 14:02
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Sep 29, 2023 14:05
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That's going to be an actual nightmare. Only part that bugs me is the rail supports having different collision boxes when rotated.
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Sep 29, 2023 14:10
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I don't like the elevated rail graphics, they look too twiggy. Need to add like a concrete or steel bar underneath the center at least.
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Sep 29, 2023 14:17
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Atlanta simulator.
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Sep 29, 2023 14:20
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Hell yeah
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Sep 29, 2023 15:32
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At last, grade separation. By allah the most merciful, I can finally build junctions that make sense rather than just throwing signals everywhere and hoping it works.
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Sep 29, 2023 15:41
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I hate 2d 3d on principle so I will be changing my stance to no purchase. Only partially kidding. I do think I'll end up only using them for minimized contention junctions. Flying your rail over your base is gauche.
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Sep 29, 2023 15:41
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I was going to say that ottd works fine without signals or curve on tunnels and bridges. But that grade separated station exit/entrance is really cool.
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Sep 29, 2023 15:59
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I’ve got two spots on Nauvis in my current SpaceEx embark where I’ll gladly take Gauche as a penalty for being able to roll over some thoughtless placements from 60-80 hours ago. On that topic I took a look at Space logistics and reluctantly decided that if it’s cargo rockets the mod expects then it’s cargo rockets I should probably use. I still refuse to do anything trickshit with them, so everything getting a rocket lift gets its own full rocket, with its own launch silo set to send another anytime the receiving pad is down to zero of whatever it’s handling. This has resulted in the highest-traffic rocket link sending 5k barrels of water at a time to the waterless but oil-rich world where my Vulcanite comes from, so that the sulfur can keep flowing to the Vulcanite processes. Also barrel recycling there means there’s a ludicrous amount of steel plates just chilling in its logistics, I might eventually set up a rocket lift to the Nauvis platform for that stuff. I’ve got cryonite slush going to Nauvis so eventually I can convert that area over to making ice to send instead, and do the barrel melting into the biggest logistics net in the system. LonsomeSon fucked around with this message at 16:10 on Sep 29, 2023 |
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Sep 29, 2023 16:02
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VictualSquid posted:I was going to say that ottd works fine without signals or curve on tunnels and bridges. The station setup was my first thought for this. I’d love this for my in-progress giga base.
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Sep 29, 2023 16:05
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This rules. Factorio intersections never really clicked for me and I just blueprint my rail system but I can blast out an OpenTTD junction with my eyes closed. Some people are speculating there might be some kind of LTN-type functionality being added too, which would also rule. In the train bridges post there are stations using stack filter inserters, stations with multiple lamps, and trains that change color as they leave.
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Sep 29, 2023 16:35
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I'm pretty sure you won't be able to walk on the elevated tracks, but I hope I'm wrong.
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Sep 29, 2023 16:40
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LonsomeSon posted:I’ve got two spots on Nauvis in my current SpaceEx embark where I’ll gladly take Gauche as a penalty for being able to roll over some thoughtless placements from 60-80 hours ago. Getting basic space sensors working with reporting and acting on the outpost inventory is almost mandatory, I don't know how people can play/beat it without it. You don't *have* to autolaunch but just auto-filling the rocket with what's needed is such a huge quality of life change. Bhodi fucked around with this message at 16:44 on Sep 29, 2023 |
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Sep 29, 2023 16:41
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KillHour posted:I'm pretty sure you won't be able to walk on the elevated tracks, but I hope I'm wrong. Not OSHA. Not OSHA at all.
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Sep 29, 2023 16:54
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KillHour posted:I'm pretty sure you won't be able to walk on the elevated tracks, but I hope I'm wrong. Run over by train deaths increase 5000%
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Sep 29, 2023 16:55
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Wonder what happens if you are riding a train and get out on an elevated track.
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Sep 29, 2023 16:55
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My plan is to do Enrichment on the ground and launch full rockets of whatever to the space platform, where everything will eventually be built. I’ve got enriched copper -> molten copper -> ingots -> copper plate operating already and the iron installation is just waiting on machines and modules to be finished up there. Each should, if my math and hookups are right, be able to fully task out a space manufactory turning ingots into 80/s plates. Going to need to establish barreled crude and water rocketry into Nauvis orbit and I think that’s going to stand in for steel processing up there until a few more sets of science packs come online, then rare minerals and stone. Cryonite and Immersite are already being lifted on rockets from a third planet, as well as Iridium which I haven’t used yet. I have found it worthwhile to establish a rocket construction capacity on each of the out-planets (one is so short on copper that I’m probably going to be setting up a rocket link for that shortly), versus shipping packed sections via rocket. The fact that some of the sections are reusable is a pretty nice bonus, I don’t think the platform’s rocket works has needed to run for most of the time since automated cryonite and immersite started. The real big deal is that I’ve been running this whole thing off the same set of 12 red circuit assemblers feeding really huge buffers and sending heaps of all three flavor circuits on every rocket to anywhere. When I went to sleep last night I had just determined that the only remaining need for my 24 new red circuit assemblers was to put new coal patches on the train network so that my logistics-feeding plastic plants go back into action. Brand-new 45/s copper plate lines are feeding that bad boy instead of it being crudely tied in to the initial factory’s copper distribution. Once that’s up it’s RCUs for days to feed my nuclear artillery manufacturing (we’ve already got almost enough to keep the rockets going but I need 40 RCUs every 12s just for the artillery-shell modernization program). LonsomeSon fucked around with this message at 17:09 on Sep 29, 2023 |
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Sep 29, 2023 17:07
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VictualSquid posted:I was going to say that ottd works fine without signals or curve on tunnels and bridges. Not sure I'd say that TTD's straight-only tunnels and bridges work fine, they're just a limitation of the time that we've learnt to live with after 30 years. Anyhow, this is neat but I also don't really think that Factorio's flat junctions are much of a problem in practice. What slightly irks me is that the water reflections don't really survive being foregrounded that much. They were an ok hack for the occasional bot, but for the bridges and bridge supports it just looks weird.
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Sep 29, 2023 17:35
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LonsomeSon posted:My plan is to do Enrichment on the ground and launch full rockets of whatever to the space platform, where everything will eventually be built. I’ve got enriched copper -> molten copper -> ingots -> copper plate operating already and the iron installation is just waiting on machines and modules to be finished up there. Each should, if my math and hookups are right, be able to fully task out a space manufactory turning ingots into 80/s plates. Can't use prod modules in space, so you should make everything that does not need to be made in space on the ground.
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Sep 29, 2023 17:36
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Tamba posted:Can't use prod modules in space, so you should make everything that does not need to be made in space on the ground. I will not. There’s not a level of pixel resource expenditure which is too much to pay for simplification so I can see at a glance what’s up anywhere in the system.
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Sep 29, 2023 17:45
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KillHour posted:I'm pretty sure you won't be able to walk on the elevated tracks, but I hope I'm wrong. They mention that if they went with tunnels you'd need a way to get in there to debug trains or fix them etc. It would make some sense that the same applies for elevated rails. Though I could see them cheating and just letting you enter/leave the trains from ground level I guess. Those guard rails make it look like Rollercoaster Tycoon to me.
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Sep 29, 2023 17:56
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Something that just struck me: if you look at the shot with the island, there isn't an obvious way in which it was built. Between that and the prior FFF statement that they are working to make sure everything can be done without your physical presence, I wonder if construction trains are becoming a thing. Would be a nice addition to have a special roboport car that can pull construction materials from adjacent cargo cars. Also, it seems quite likely to me that we are getting some sort of vanilla refueling solution. That's really the only part of current train mechanics that is really lacking, there's no single good solution to fueling trains, and I don't see any refueling in any of the screenshots in this update. K8.0 fucked around with this message at 18:08 on Sep 29, 2023 |
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Sep 29, 2023 17:58
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Elevated rails has been a long time coming. Really looking forward to this!
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Sep 29, 2023 18:02
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Xerophyte posted:Anyhow, this is neat but I also don't really think that Factorio's flat junctions are much of a problem in practice. The nullius base my friends and I are working on disagrees with you
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Sep 29, 2023 18:08
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Bhodi posted:Cargo rockets are the intended midgame solution before you unlock spaceships. After playing through completely I really think the cargo cannons need a modification pass, they are too limited to be that useful - you need to send cargo rockets with the rocket parts needed to send back rockets of materials anyway so you might as well barrel or send the solid ice chunks or slush or whatever. Cargo rockets have uses through the entire game (general outpost supply) but cannons don't and I think one way of making them useful would be allowing them to send fluids. that would make them useful into the late game and fill a useful niche. Spaceships are deep into the tech tree, are much more fiddly to automate, aren't anywhere near as fast, and are a UPS hog, so they only really end up being useful for specialty items like the Sun/Asteroid probe data as well as Naquitite simply because the fuel costs and lack of local supply make even nearby deep space fields awkward for pure cargo rocket logistics. Space Elevators are the ideal because they basically link the two surfaces but they only work planet <-> orbit so it's mostly for getting all the liquids and processed goods from your main planet up to your space base. Technically Arcochests are the absolute best inter-surface transportation option but they're also buried in the endgame after you've already basically won and costs 20 arcospheres each time.
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Sep 29, 2023 18:10
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VostokProgram posted:The nullius base my friends and I are working on disagrees with you I did nullius without trains. Fear me.
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Sep 29, 2023 18:11
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KillHour posted:I'm pretty sure you won't be able to walk on the elevated tracks, but I hope I'm wrong. https://forums.factorio.com/viewtopic.php?f=38&t=108952&start=20 kovarex posted:You can't [walk on train bridges]. biters also can't walk it. kovarex posted:Player can exit/enter elevated trains fine. (It would be quite annoying otherwise)
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Sep 29, 2023 19:08
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VostokProgram posted:The nullius base my friends and I are working on disagrees with you I'm sure that's true, but if you're modding then all bets are off. You could also mod in better trains so that flat rail networks work well for longer, or worse trains so that rail network are a challenge in vanilla; whatever floats your boat.
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Sep 29, 2023 19:10
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I actually like delivery cannons more than cargo rockets for most things you can use them with. Their power consumption is still way under the level you need to worry about as soon as you have nuclear set up, for increased throughput you can always just copy/paste another one, and you don't have to sit around waiting for a whole rocket to fill up. I still set up parts rockets and a mixed-cargo logistics-loaded rocket for every surface cause you have to move stuff you can't cannon, but I'm always a little irritated when I have to launch it at like 70/500 because I urgently need one specific thing without really needing anything else. Single-item rockets are useful for getting the exotic materials off the other planets and back to Nauvis, but I haven't really needed them to get anything from Nauvis to an outpost.
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Sep 29, 2023 19:48
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K8.0 posted:Something that just struck me: if you look at the shot with the island, there isn't an obvious way in which it was built. Between that and the prior FFF statement that they are working to make sure everything can be done without your physical presence, I wonder if construction trains are becoming a thing. Would be a nice addition to have a special roboport car that can pull construction materials from adjacent cargo cars. Which makes it so a train is really a boat now on water worlds 
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Sep 29, 2023 19:57
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Since delivery cannons have limits on what they can send and you continually need packed rocket parts, nuclear/fusion fuel, and maybe water/water ice on established colonies, it’s just easier to only maintain a robust rocket supply system than that and also a cannon system on the side when the difference is rocket fuel and parts you were making anyway. i would heavily recommend against setting up rocket factories on remote outposts and just sending the rocket parts because over time you unlock efficient alternate recipes using materials from other outposts. But you do you i’m not telling you how to have fun, might be a bummer if you didn’t know though
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Sep 30, 2023 13:21
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Eventually I’ll be using and distributing Iridium and then sometime after that will want to change over to Iridium rocket sections, it could be dozens or tens of hours in-game until then. The setup which works right now and keeps working until it gets updated is superior to a more-efficient one that isn’t in place, and all that.
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Sep 30, 2023 14:58
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I played only once before and bounced off after making my initial setup really over-fiddly -- lot of belt splitters and attempting to load balance goods on one base rather than just overproducing, if I remember right -- and I recently felt like trying again. I've gotten to the point where I can build railroads and it's time to start looking outside my initial base for resources, but when I drive to the massive coal or iron patch or the oilfield I found and wall them off, I just look at it and go "but why". Before, I always had a concrete Next Thing I was working towards being able to create, but now I look at what I'm unlocking in the tech tree and it all seems like more of what I can already do rather than a signpost of "hey, start building up for this". I went initial start->automation->wall off and defend base->car->trains and now, um... I don't know. I guess I'd like to move to solar panels and accumulators for my power source, so, batteries is the next thing, and sulfur gas is the next thing I need to make batteries, so it's oil time? I'd also like to start moving from my ramshackle first base to a properly planned setup where all the resources get mined and processed at the bigger deposits I'm finding, then shipped over by railroad to a centralized building facility, but that is a lateral move that'll stall me on the tech tree while I'm doing it, so I'm not sure it's a good idea yet. I don't think it's at all a coincidence that this is exactly the point the tutorial leaves off at. Can someone just give me a nudge towards where my goals ought to be, or is this feeling a part of the experience and I should do whatever and it'll become clear later? CapnAndy fucked around with this message at 20:41 on Oct 3, 2023 |
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Oct 3, 2023 20:38
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Oil is for sure the next thing, I’m still not a huge fan of dealing with oil refining. Automate production of chemical labs For Sure, you’re eventually going to have several blocks of them. First thing is to get batteries and plastic cranking, those two are going to be key for making the next round of stuff. In general the science packs are supposed to be a guideline for progression, they’re made out of things which you Should Be building layouts for at their stage in the tree. Automate the blue juice and have your science labs drink it! You want to hook up your big remote patches with trains because then you don’t have to think about iron or coal again for hours unless you want to. If you don’t feel like you’re using enough to justify the extra intake, you have to use more resources. Expand your labs and all of your old science builds.
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Oct 3, 2023 20:47
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Oil would be the good next step, you can get flamethrowers up if you’re playing with biters and it gives you access to non-coal power because you’ll need acid to get batteries for solar or uranium for nuclear. Longer term you’ll likely want construction bots to allow you to stamp down subfactories rather than hand placing everything.
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Oct 3, 2023 20:49
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CapnAndy posted:I don't think it's at all a coincidence that this is exactly the point the tutorial leaves off at. Can someone just give me a nudge towards where my goals ought to be, or is this feeling a part of the experience and I should do whatever and it'll become clear later? "I have 99 problems and a lack of things to do ain't one" is basically the meat of Factorio. The devs intentionally made it so you can tackle several different things in different orders, depending on what happens to be the most interesting / easiest / pressing at the moment. You'll eventually need to do almost all of it, but bumbling your way through is perfectly fine. Embrace the chaos.
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Oct 3, 2023 20:54
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CapnAndy posted:I played only once before and bounced off after making my initial setup really over-fiddly -- lot of belt splitters and attempting to load balance goods on one base rather than just overproducing, if I remember right -- and I recently felt like trying again. Other guys gave you excellent advice but I'll throw in my 2 cents. For what's next, I let the science guide me. I'll produce 'x science per minute' (usually 120 as it is 2x the base ratio numbers given in the factorio cheat sheet) and all my production is based on what that needs. For production of base materials, I build based on belts. I'll build a module to fill 1 yellow belt with whatever product (whether it be plates or green chips or plastic) and then when that isn't enough, do another of the same thing to make it 2 yellow belts. Of course that will expose your weak link in supplying whatever is needed to make that item, so then you get to go fix that. I tend to build a bus-base where I only build on one side of the bus so that when I need more copper plates, I can just add more to the bus and I'm done. Eventually you upgrade to red belts instead of adding a 2nd yellow belt, and then upgrade the modules from filling a yellow belt to filling a red.
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Oct 3, 2023 20:58
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Thank you all for the help.LonsomeSon posted:In general the science packs are supposed to be a guideline for progression, they’re made out of things which you Should Be building layouts for at their stage in the tree. Automate the blue juice and have your science labs drink it! Hooking up the remote patches with trains makes sense, but I need to get coal to them all so I can fuel the burners -- although I literally just thought right now that instead what I ought to do is mine all the coal in its patch and then build all the burners right there next to the coal, then I can ship in the raw ore to the coal patch and pick up the refined iron, copper, and stone at the same stop. uPen posted:Longer term you’ll likely want construction bots to allow you to stamp down subfactories rather than hand placing everything.
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Oct 3, 2023 21:19
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CapnAndy posted:Long term I definitely want robots. Can I ever get robots who'll bring stuff from one location to another, or bring me stuff? I just want to set up a central "pick up everything right here" location with a bunch of boxes rather than running all over the base when I need a resupply. That is exactly what Logistics bots are for. If you can't currently make blue packs, but have red and green, you just need to find it in the tech tree and research whatever leads to it and then research the blue packs. You can do grey (black) military science and/or blue science after red/green depending on your priorities.
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Oct 3, 2023 21:21
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