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https://www.cbc.ca/news/multi-lineup-listing/ravi-kahlon-fall-housing-legislation-1.6982618quote:Three key pieces of legislation set to become law sometime this fall included additional tools for municipalities to enforce compliance with short-term rental rules, financial support for property owners who want to build secondary suites and new laws that will allow secondary suites on properties across the province currently zoned for only single-family homes. Wow. How effective. Considering the provincial NDP has the most number of landlords in the legislature, it is no surprise that this is feckless.
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Sep 29, 2023 19:08
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Double posting because I found this pre-COVID 2020 Change.org petition featuring comments from landlords:quote:I am signing this petition because I am a landlord and so are my parents. My parents had the most horrible tenant a few months ago. It took so much work to get him out. He got away with not paying rent, utilities, and breaking every rule on the lease. My dad ended up in the hospital twice due to the stress caused by this individual. This individual sat back laughing. The RTB and our current laws allow loosest to take advantage of people. quote:I was a landlord for 10 years. It was brutal then and that was before legislation went waay too far in support of renters. In 10 years we had 2 good tenants between them, they didn't last more than a year. Landlords need to be able to maintain overall control of their property. Renters should indeed have rights but those rights should not exceed those ultimately responsible, the property owners!! It is their investment! quote:Tenants have ALL the rights and landlords ALL the regulations. Bad tenants make it really difficult for the good tenants that are looking for a home. At some time previously, landlords must have been taking advantage of tenants or the RTB rules wouldn't be so unfair to landlords now. Tenants need repercussions for not following rules, like landlords do. Maybe you don't get free rent when you don't vacate the property when you have been properly served an eviction. quote:It's ridiculous that we can only raise the rent by 2% when interest rates are going up by 100%, and strata fees, property taxes and insurance are not standing still, either. Also we need better protection than to have to wait months if we have a tenant who doesn't pay rent or damages. We need to be able to evict immediately. Fair is fair. This is a highly stressful occupation because of the way the BC government is screwing down on landlords. I have considered selling out and I'm sure some are doing so because the system is not set up fairly to both sides. quote:Problem tenants must be dealt with swiftly or more small landlords will refuse to rent out their suites because of liability insurance issues and it’s just not worth it. landlords are disgusted with the government”s intervention into our houses by charging us with the empty home tax. We bought and paid for our homes over 25 years and now the government is holding us ransom for their inept handling of the housing crisis, TOO LITTLE TOO LATE quote:Tennents have to many rights now quote:I don't think a landlord should go bankrupt because the system doesn't protect or prevent tenants from gaming the system with no repercussions. Bad behavior by tenants is being rewarded by free rent. Good behavior by landlords is rewarded with financial constraints and ruin. It's asymmetrical and unfair and needs to change quote:I am a small landlord and have been thinking about stopping quote:Landlords are rental housing provider in Canada. If landlord’s legal rights can’t be protected by law just as much as the tenant gets, there will be more conflict between the two parties. Landlords need justice. Interest rate increase doesn’t have a limit, why the BC government limited rental rate increase? We need change! quote:We follow the Residential Tenancy Act, lawfully award possession of our property and the Supreme Court of BC without any consideration of the law, the landlord or the "Act" gives the tenant 60 more days. We are fed up with corruption and one sided rights for tenants only. We are definitely getting out of the rental property. Thanks to the Supreme Court overwriting the law. quote:We are in the process of selling our rental as there's not enough protection for landlords What I love is that I looked up a few of the names and one of them ended up being followed by the former Premier and a few NDP MLAs.
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Sep 29, 2023 19:22
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If you want to enrage these people, simply suggest that they sell, like you would with any other unprofitable investment.
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Sep 30, 2023 08:26
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qhat posted:If you want to enrage these people, simply suggest that they sell, like you would with any other unprofitable investment. It's like wiping your rear end with silk, I love it. But, yeah, that's what I don't get. Investments were never meant to be mints; there's always risk, and in the case of property, carrying costs and work involved.
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Oct 1, 2023 00:45
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I had this “sounds like you want to sell” conversation with the owner of a rental unit lately and they reacted like I had proposed imprisoning her. “But I shouldn’t have to!”
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Oct 1, 2023 00:56
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Subjunctive posted:I had this “sounds like you want to sell” conversation with the owner of a rental unit lately and they reacted like I had proposed imprisoning her. “But I shouldn’t have to!” "So you want a solution that makes you money with no effort or risk, and everyone else is just supposed to arrange their lives to make that happen, drat the consequences?" I'm so sick of dealing with people that pathologically self-centered.
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Oct 1, 2023 01:03
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PT6A posted:"So you want a solution that makes you money with no effort or risk, and everyone else is just supposed to arrange their lives to make that happen, drat the consequences?" “I paid the down payment! I’m an investor! I am doing the hard part!”
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Oct 1, 2023 01:13
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PT6A posted:"So you want a solution that makes you money with no effort or risk, and everyone else is just supposed to arrange their lives to make that happen, drat the consequences?" "I paid my fair share"
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Oct 1, 2023 01:16
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Subjunctive posted:I had this “sounds like you want to sell” conversation with the owner of a rental unit lately and they reacted like I had proposed imprisoning her. “But I shouldn’t have to!” Same person who will hang on too long and sell at the worst time.
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Oct 1, 2023 03:33
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Don’t forget the classic belief that the home will wink out of existence the moment they sell it. “I provide desperately needed housing! My tenants would be homeless!”
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Oct 1, 2023 06:24
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I think a lot of it is because 1. Average people don’t understand risk vs reward, 2. There truly is no other investment available to the average person that you can lever up 10x on, 3. Lack of any financial education. It’s just another example of people mistakenly thinking they’ve figured out how to make a lot more money for free, the idea of risk is completely alien to them and only people who invest in the stock market or whatever should be the ones who go bankrupt. Just last week I was having a conversation with my sister who went on a long winded rant about how house prices weren’t going up and everyone’s losing money, and I mentioned briefly that stocks were up over the past year you could diversify into that, and the response was dismissive like I’ve just suggested they join an MLM or Bitcoin ponzi or something. Ultimately you can’t help people, just make the best decisions you can for you and laugh at the naked people when the tide goes out.
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Oct 1, 2023 08:51
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qhat posted:Ultimately you can’t help people, just make the best decisions you can for you and laugh at the naked people when the tide goes out. That's fine as long as the naked people aren't able to convince the government to give them your money.
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Oct 1, 2023 15:00
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tagesschau posted:That's fine as long as the naked people aren't able to convince the government to give them your money. I’ve given up trying to convince people otherwise. Even if someone were to give me the key to their finances and let me manage it for them, I’m not a financial professional, I’d only be risking my friendships to even try. People in general, even usually smart people, are too stupid when it comes to money, all you can do is look out for yourself and maybe your very close family (spouse, dependents), there’s always ways to protect yourself from losing your shirt when everyone else is. qhat fucked around with this message at 16:18 on Oct 1, 2023 |
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Oct 1, 2023 16:07
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qhat posted:I’ve given up trying to convince people otherwise. Even if someone were to give me the key to their finances and let me manage it for them, I’m not a financial professional, I’d only be risking my friendships to even try. People in general, even usually smart people, are too stupid when it comes to money, all you can do is look out for yourself and maybe your very close family (spouse, dependents), there’s always ways to protect yourself from losing your shirt when everyone else is. That's been a tough row to hoe the last decade. People with marginal intelligence standing on their high horse levereged to the tits looking like geniuses. For the good of society we need to see these folks learn the stove can get hot. It's not even just housing, proper market cycles are healthy. A certain percentage of people should be losing their jobs and business should fail occasionally too. Purgatory Glory fucked around with this message at 17:32 on Oct 1, 2023 |
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Oct 1, 2023 17:12
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Landlords have tax deductions for mortgage interest as well as depreciation. The risk of interest rates is unusual in Canada, as mortgages are typically on a 5 year cycle compared to the US where you can get a fixed rate for 30 years. Any landlord complaining about mortgage interest deserves what they get for not recognizing the exposure to upward interest rate changes. Some tenants are bad, it still comes back to laziness of the landlord in choosing tenants, or not setting the rent to a market clearing price that gives you a choice of good tenants. I would like to see a federal registry of rental properties to catch tax cheats.
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Oct 1, 2023 20:36
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Yeah there’s nothing you can really have sympathy with landlords about. The entire systems seems setup for them to succeed and yet they still somehow manage to gently caress it up.
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Oct 1, 2023 21:59
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Lain Iwakura posted:https://www.cbc.ca/news/multi-lineup-listing/ravi-kahlon-fall-housing-legislation-1.6982618 Between this, CoV's fiddling at the edges attitude toward zoning liberalization, and the timid targets that the Province has imposed on the Naughty List cities, I think it's getting pretty safe to say that given that we're seeing no real urgency for remarkable change, that nothing will improve for the immediate future at all and things will only continue to get worse in British Columbia. This Fall session was supposed to be the Big Announcement of housing policy action under Eby and there really hasn't been much here. They had that big report of recommendations from housing experts and we're still not seeing policy come out of that. When you consider that new governments generally front load their big change, political capital spending policies, then this is pretty depressing because this seems like some nothingburger weak stuff. The best thing I can say about the housing targets is that they will meaningfully shake some of the absolute most nimbyist small towns on that list (ie. Oak Bay), and should spur them toward change, but the targets seem overly status quo for the larger cities such as Vancouver. The one bit of good news we've got recently is that Victoria got a big fat zero applications and zero interest in their ~missing middle~ multiplex policy, and instead of shrugging their shoulders, they actually went back and revised it to make it more liberal so that someone might actually build something. Was camping this weekend with someone who manages housing projects on the construction side. They basically threw up their hands at the notion of anything improving and noted that for them all they do is build ultra premium single family homes because it's literally the only thing that it's possible to make money on, and the margins have only shrunk narrower as the years have gone on. Bottom line is that there's barely money to be made building apartments, let alone ~affordable~ apartments, so no one does it. They didn't seem terribly excited by the new multiplex stuff. It seems like GST tax cut on apartments should help make marginal projects flip to becoming profitable as it's basically just cutting the costs on builders, but seems like there's gonna need to be more here for anyone to have a look.
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Oct 2, 2023 18:02
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More on the Metro Vancouver fee drama. This is hilarious. Really shows how deeply unseriously the Mayors currently consider the issues. Top priority remains keeping taxes low at all costs. quote:Ottawa halts housing funding to Metro Vancouver over increased development fees I remain baffled by Burnaby Mayor Hurley's assertion that the same taxpayers shouldn't have to pay over and over for infrastructure. The fact is that even if there was zero growth at all, all these amenities, billion dollar sewer plants and such, would still eventually wear out and need replacement. There will always need to be constant and increasing revenue raising to maintain the same level of service we have now.
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Oct 2, 2023 18:16
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Is this the city version of condo boards keeping fees low to appease everyone and then suddenly having to come up with millions to fix the roof they've been ignoring?
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Oct 2, 2023 18:30
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odiv posted:Is this the city version of condo boards keeping fees low to appease everyone and then suddenly having to come up with millions to fix the roof they've been ignoring? pretty much except cities have tried to paper it over by raising money with new development so it would be like if your condo board kept building new units with higher fees than the existing units
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Oct 2, 2023 18:32
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Femtosecond posted:More on the Metro Vancouver fee drama. This is hilarious. Hey we were planning to use that money to subsidize existing homeowners!
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Oct 2, 2023 19:27
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Cold on a Cob posted:pretty much except cities have tried to paper it over by raising money with new development so it would be like if your condo board kept building new units with higher fees than the existing units Yeah it's like your condo board saying we're going to keep strata fees unsustainably low by forcing any new resident to the building to have to pay 20k extra to move in. I mean it's only fair, they're new and powerless.
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Oct 2, 2023 21:04
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it's almost as if this is the inevitable outcome of circumstances where local politicians don't get (re)elected on a platform of raising property taxes in order to properly finance infrastructure (new or replacement) or other services, especially after decades of deficient senior governmental funding trust not the doctors, for the sweet shop owners will give us all we need Hubbert fucked around with this message at 21:45 on Oct 2, 2023 |
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Oct 2, 2023 21:42
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Femtosecond posted:More on the Metro Vancouver fee drama. This is hilarious. Seriously what is this garbage about "same taxpayers paying over and over again"? Yeah, that's called living in a place and paying your share of what's necessary to keep it from falling to pieces. Consider that HAF money is taxpayer money coming from the "same taxpayers over and over again" to pay for growth but I guess that's okay to take. Why do Canada and Ontario keep coming to me for income taxes? Very unfair. New immigrants should have to pay the equivalent of what I've paid over the last 30 years to be let in the country.
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Oct 3, 2023 14:16
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Fidelitious posted:Why do Canada and Ontario keep coming to me for income taxes? Very unfair. New immigrants should have to pay the equivalent of what I've paid over the last 30 years to be let in the country. Keep that idea north of the border please. We'd probably adopt that down here.  I love that Hurley could literally be a quoted talking point out of a Strong Towns video or Not Just Bikes, for how badly growth-funded infrastructure planning works in the long run. Jesus Christ.
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Oct 3, 2023 19:22
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More braindead ideas from ABC: https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/vancouver-affordable-housing-raise-rents-1.6985794 quote:Vancouver city staff are proposing an increase in the rates for moderate income rental housing as part of a strategy to build more affordable homes, but a former city councillor says the initiative is just a way for developers to make more money. This is some galaxy brained poo poo.
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Oct 4, 2023 16:53
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Lain Iwakura posted:More braindead ideas from ABC: :taps forehead: If we set affordable rates to market rates, we have 100% affordable housing!
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Oct 4, 2023 20:52
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Lain Iwakura posted:More braindead ideas from ABC: The worst part is that those are actually "cheap" for the current market. Honestly I think so many people in Vancouver right now are one eviction away from an unrecoverable debt spiral and/or outright homelessness. But conversely, it isn't possible to actually build new rental housing for lower rents than the current (utterly unaffordable) market, whether that's for-profit or not. It just isn't a problem that has a market-based solution.
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Oct 5, 2023 00:37
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If you don’t have to profit on the enterprise, why couldn’t you build rental housing to target those sub-market rates?
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Oct 5, 2023 00:46
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Subjunctive posted:If you don’t have to profit on the enterprise, why couldn’t you build rental housing to target those sub-market rates? Because the cost of land and construction mean it's literally impossible without subsidies. The non-profits who have built rental at the "moderate income" rates mentioned are creating buildings that are half that and half "low end of market", which means rents about 50% higher than the "moderate income" ones. Those are buildings with units that are very spare, with just about every corner being cut already. And those were built at the land and construction costs of four years ago. The present is three working professionals sharing an 800sqft 3BR, or a family of five in a 700sqft 2BR. The near future is bunkhouses and kids sleeping in bathtubs again like in the 50s.
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Oct 5, 2023 01:46
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Lead out in cuffs posted:Because the cost of land and construction mean it's literally impossible without subsidies. The non-profits who have built rental at the "moderate income" rates mentioned are creating buildings that are half that and half "low end of market", which means rents about 50% higher than the "moderate income" ones. Those are buildings with units that are very spare, with just about every corner being cut already. And those were built at the land and construction costs of four years ago. Right, but housing doesn’t have to make money if you aren’t trying to generate profits. It’s like saying that the fire department loses money—it doesn’t “lose money”, it uses money to provide a social good. It is possible to have subsidies! We have had many kinds of them for developers and such in history!
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Oct 5, 2023 01:51
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Lead out in cuffs posted:The near future is bunkhouses and kids sleeping in bathtubs again like in the 50s. One kid in a bathtub? Luxury. You can fit like 6 kids to a chest of drawers.
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Oct 5, 2023 02:39
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Don't worry, Canadians! We're not the worst place in the OECD to find housing. https://www.theguardian.com/society/2023/oct/05/england-worst-place-in-developed-world-to-find-housing-says-report At least according to this report: https://www.hbf.co.uk/documents/12890/International_Audit_Digital_v1.pdf I now live in Scotland, not England, but when I did live in a mid-sized English city up until 2020 this did not reflect the reality I experienced, with plenty of housing available at pretty reasonable rental rates (at least compared to living in a comparably-sized Canadian city) and all my middle class friends owning decently large houses. Way worse than the EU? yeah, for sure; worse than Canada, even including all of the small towns and rural communities? That I find hard to believe. MeinPanzer fucked around with this message at 12:29 on Oct 5, 2023 |
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Oct 5, 2023 12:27
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A 47-year mortgage? They're out there — and even longer ones could be coming whole article isn't really new to anyone keeping up with this topic but this part really stuck out: quote:About one out of every five home loans at three big Canadian banks are now negatively amortizing, which happens when years get added to the payment term of the original loan because the monthly payments are no longer enough to cover anything but the interest. makes me wonder what would happen if we had jingle mail and more rental stock here
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Oct 5, 2023 13:12
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Every time I read stuff like that I get a little confused because I was sure mortgage regulations didn't allow for things like 40+ year amortizations or mortgages that are negatively amortizing. I get it of course, they will do as much as possible to not have people lose their homes because no one wants to deal with that, just seems a bit surprising.
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Oct 5, 2023 13:33
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Roughly put, you can't sign a new mortgage for over 30 years, but you can renew and extend your current one. So basically you're beholden to whatever rate/terms your bank wants to set if you don't qualify for a new mortgage (ie can't pass the stress test). Problem for the bank is they still have to deal with the lovely extended mortgage on their books which imbalances their books.
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Oct 5, 2023 13:50
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Fidelitious posted:Every time I read stuff like that I get a little confused because I was sure mortgage regulations didn't allow for things like 40+ year amortizations or mortgages that are negatively amortizing. IIRC it's like, you can't *sign* a mortgage that at the time of signing is negatively amortizing or longer than 30 years but if you sign a variable rate mortgage with a fixed payment and rates go up a ton then until you have to renew the choice for the bank is to either extend your amortization temporarily or have it go into the negative (because of the agreed upon fixed payment) but when you renew in 3-5 years if you can't qualify at 25 or 30 years again and can't make up the difference in a lump sum payment to get the principal down to where you can then lol goodbye house.
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Oct 5, 2023 13:54
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MeinPanzer posted:Don't worry, Canadians! We're not the worst place in the OECD to find housing. I was just in the UK for the past two weeks and I heard a lot from people getting worried that houses aren’t selling, or at the very least prices aren’t going up. On top of that, my sister is in an extremely precarious debt situation (two mortgages, credit card debt, etc) but still somehow afloat. All anecdotal etc and not representative sample by any means, but I did get the feeling there was real tension in the air, like things were a hair away from getting much worse very quickly. If that’s true for the UK then I’m sure it would be true for Canada too.
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Oct 5, 2023 15:32
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Mr Luxury Yacht posted:IIRC it's like, you can't *sign* a mortgage that at the time of signing is negatively amortizing or longer than 30 years but if you sign a variable rate mortgage with a fixed payment and rates go up a ton then until you have to renew the choice for the bank is to either extend your amortization temporarily or have it go into the negative (because of the agreed upon fixed payment) but when you renew in 3-5 years if you can't qualify at 25 or 30 years again and can't make up the difference in a lump sum payment to get the principal down to where you can then lol goodbye house. Not many mortgagors are going to be able to come up with the requisite balloon payment, which means they bought more house than they could afford. Looks like a lot of that frequently touted demand wasn't real to begin with.
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Oct 5, 2023 15:43
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Plus I'm told the average Canadian does not have a friendly Saudi princes that will buy them out at absurdly inflated valuations. Sad!
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Oct 5, 2023 16:21
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