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Mr. Wiggles posted:#1 flaw is dealers still charging 40k for base models. Probably yeah lol. I think most of the mechanical bits of the Maverick are a known quantity at this point. I don't think the 2.0 Ecoboost suffered issues to the degree of the 1.0 and 1.5 4cyl. Maybe carbon buildup is an issue later on? Their hybrid powertrains seem to be good as well.
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Oct 3, 2023 18:20
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Yeah Ford hybrid powertrain has been very reliable.
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Oct 3, 2023 18:22
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:Yeah Ford hybrid powertrain has been very reliable. Does this extend to the newer ones integrated with the 10spd transmission in the F150s? I thought the hybrid powertrain that was in the Fusions and Maverick was somehow licensed from Toyota?
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Oct 3, 2023 18:27
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Twerk from Home posted:Does this extend to the newer ones integrated with the 10spd transmission in the F150s? I thought the hybrid powertrain that was in the Fusions and Maverick was somehow licensed from Toyota? Not licensed, Ford's design used ideas patented by Toyota so they did a patent swap (Toyota got free access to some of Ford's diesel patents in exchange). As far as the integrated setup on the F150, Explorer and Aviator goes, I haven't heard much about it good or bad.
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Oct 3, 2023 18:36
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Some early build Mavericks are getting caught up with a lot of recalls which probably isn't too surprising for a first year Ford. Bigger ones are before July '22 need to have the curtain airbags replaced. Also the hybrids pre-April '22 specifically have issues with the battery cable's underhood terminal soldering potentially failing leaving it dead at startup (there's a CSP to replace these, but while all affected are supposed to be replaced then dealerships are saying they can only do so when it fails). There's a larger issue of the Chihuahua Engine Factory had some issues with their machining processing operations which means engines produced before September '22 have a statistically elevated increase of engine failure. This resulted in an earlier recall to remediate conditions for fire in case of a catastrophic engine failure although Ford had some instances of failure+fire even after that. So there's currently an outstanding recall with no remedy yet to do something for those with engines prior to the affected date. Otherwise there's been a few PCM/other module updates to address some spurious emissions CEL. Some have complained vocally about the blended braking at low speed and ICE/EV transition but most are getting those rolled into the CEL update procedure.
darnon fucked around with this message at 20:50 on Oct 3, 2023 |
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Oct 3, 2023 20:47
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May be sounding like a broken record here, but i am dumbfounded by the price of vehicles right now. Minimum wage hasn't moved since 2018. Prices in Canadian dollars, which also hasn't moved for the most part. Mazda 3: 2018: $16,000 2024: $24,200 Corolla: 2018: $17,554 2024: $26,265 F-150 2018: $25,699 2024: $46,055 2024 Ranger: $38,480 2024 Maverick: $32,600
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Oct 3, 2023 21:00
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Powershift posted:May be sounding like a broken record here, but i am dumbfounded by the price of vehicles right now. Its loving insane. And each and every year like clockwork I await the article or website mention of "price of car ____ is going up _____ for model year ___" Ive been on the fence about a X3 for like 3 years, and with 0 new features or anything to show for it, the car has ballooned like $5K in cost. Same with the C8. It was what $60K at launch? Now I think after the latest "price of car ____ is going up _____ for model year _24__" its going to be almost $68K this year. TO START! The cost of the feature that raises the car up 2 inches so you don't destroy the front bumper is now $2600. Meaning it doubled! Im slowly watching my dream built inch closer and closer to crossing over $100K Meanwhile work is like "here is a pizza. you matter." I have no idea how people are doing this poo poo. It has to be taking on a shitload of debt and just watching it all burn down.
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Oct 3, 2023 22:07
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Powershift posted:May be sounding like a broken record here, but i am dumbfounded by the price of vehicles right now. I mean, trim levels matter so some of these comparisons may be off. Vehicles are very expensive, but the Corolla is not going to start at $26k right now anyways But it’s close  and nothing on dealer lots is usually MSRP anyway, an MSRP factory order would be like pulling teeth
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Oct 3, 2023 23:08
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Inner Light posted:I mean, trim levels matter so some of these comparisons may be off. Vehicles are very expensive, but the Corolla is not going to start at $26k right now anyways I see the corolla starting at $26,164 on toyota.ca? Or were you saying that they would start way higher than that because there would be no base model?
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Oct 3, 2023 23:20
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Franco Caution posted:Same with the C8. It was what $60K at launch? Now I think after the latest "price of car ____ is going up _____ for model year _24__" its going to be almost $68K this year. TO START! Yeah, C8 Corvette in Canada 2020: $69,998 2023: $78,924 2024: $90,825 GM saw dealers gouging and instead of smacking them down, they took their cut. It is all part of the larger frustration of companies making a larger profit selling to 100 people at $1000 per item than 10,000 people at $10 per item, and so many basic rear end things becoming luxuries. I'll obviously never own a new car, but the new market becoming so corrupted has a ton of knock-on effects on used markets. Our used market has also been gutted by a free flow of vehicles to a used car market with 10 times our population and considerably stronger wages, and it's not like functioning public transit has been built out as an alternative.
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Oct 3, 2023 23:30
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TheBacon posted:I see the corolla starting at $26,164 on toyota.ca? Or were you saying that they would start way higher than that because there would be no base model? Please disregard that, I read it too quickly and misread the Canadian bit, I apologize as I believe is customary
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Oct 4, 2023 00:54
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Inner Light posted:Please disregard that, I read it too quickly and misread the Canadian bit, I apologize as I believe is customary I apologize as well. I think having the same currency name as the world reserve currency and our largest trading partner allows some of the imbalance. Nobody knows what a peso is worth, but Amazon gets away with paying warehouse workers $17/hour in the US and Canada whether that's $17 USD or $12.40 USD after exchange.
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Oct 4, 2023 01:12
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Franco Caution posted:Its loving insane. And each and every year like clockwork I await the article or website mention of "price of car ____ is going up _____ for model year ___" Own nothing and be
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Oct 4, 2023 03:26
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I paid almost 40k out the door for a loving civic si. That’s with a couple thousand in dealer markup of course but every dealer I talked to had the same deal; it’s insane and every day I kick myself for ever selling my 2017 gti which I bought new for mid 20 something and that’s what they cost on the used market, 6 years later
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Oct 4, 2023 15:44
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To get a new version of my ten year old truck would cost about 90% more lol Derp, wrote the math wrong at first but still moist turtleneck fucked around with this message at 15:59 on Oct 4, 2023 |
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Oct 4, 2023 15:51
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ADINSX posted:I paid almost 40k out the door for a loving civic si. That’s with a couple thousand in dealer markup of course but every dealer I talked to had the same deal; it’s insane and every day I kick myself for ever selling my 2017 gti which I bought new for mid 20 something and that’s what they cost on the used market, 6 years later In my brain "about $40k" is what a BMW 335i or something costs. I guess I'm about 15 years out of date: https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/a15150788/2007-bmw-335i-coupe-road-test/ quote:BMW isn't charging much more for the turbocharged 335i. With a base price of $41,295
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Oct 4, 2023 15:59
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My brain is still “9000 and below: economy car, 15,000-20,000 nice sedan, 30,000+ luxury car”
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Oct 4, 2023 16:04
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poo poo's pretty crazy. Sure there's "inflation" but a) salaries haven't increase as much as inflation and b) cost of new and used cars is a factor in CPI calculation so it's tautological anyway
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Oct 4, 2023 16:05
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I really do want to know what the $130,000 Nissan 400Z actually sold for: https://www.roadandtrack.com/news/a40850471/nissan-z-dealer-markup/
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Oct 4, 2023 16:19
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Twerk from Home posted:I really do want to know what the $130,000 Nissan 400Z actually sold for: https://www.roadandtrack.com/news/a40850471/nissan-z-dealer-markup/ If it sold at all.
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Oct 4, 2023 17:29
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euphronius posted:My brain is still “9000 and below: economy car, 15,000-20,000 nice sedan, 30,000+ luxury car” A classic car baseline was using the lowest spec fiat. Before the euro it was ten million lira, afterwards it was eight thousand euros and now it's eighteen thousands.
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Oct 4, 2023 18:39
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euphronius posted:My brain is still “9000 and below: economy car, 15,000-20,000 nice sedan, 30,000+ luxury car” Same I had an exchange with someone about six months ago that went something like "Teslas are priced like luxury vehicles, the model 3 and Y are averaging $55,000 per unit" "That's because the average car is $47,000 now" "Yeah but they're pricing and marketing them like luxury cars" "The average Tesla sells for $8,000 more than the average car. Doesn't seem like a lot of premium considering it's a market leader EV  "I haven't checked but I did see a news alert on my phone recently that Tesla has a base option model Y for $44k. UAW seems to have gotten the memo, they're doing some saber rattling small strikes to, I guess, get ready for big negotiations to get a slice of the fat profits pie automakers have been reaping the last couple years. One report said they were targeting 40% wage increase.
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Oct 4, 2023 18:45
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they have a good argument for the 40%, the CEOs get bumps like that while they tell the union workers that there's just no money in the budget for a raise there was someone that had been paid the same amount every year from 2016-2023 because they needed to "make sacrifices" to keep the oem afloat "Dawnya Ferdinandsen builds transmissions for Chevy Silverados and other trucks at a GM plant in Ohio. This summer, she was earning $27 an hour - the same as what she was making when she was hired in 2016. While CEOs enjoy their luxury watches and second homes, she says, workers like her face tough choices." "GM last year disclosed that Mary Barra's compensation was 362 times that of the median worker at GM"
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Oct 4, 2023 18:56
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Twerk from Home posted:In my brain "about $40k" is what a BMW 335i or something costs. I guess I'm about 15 years out of date: https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/a15150788/2007-bmw-335i-coupe-road-test/ Same. I was even interested in the type r until I reached out to a dealer who told me they’d be happy to sell me a bright blue one for sixty thousand dollars out the door…. A sixty thousand dollar civic
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Oct 4, 2023 19:06
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I saw a Range Rover sport today and cannot fathom why they are pivoting to Lozenges As A Design Language. Just gonna think about the 90s Discovery and weep.
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Oct 4, 2023 19:18
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moist turtleneck posted:they have a good argument for the 40%, the CEOs get bumps like that while they tell the union workers that there's just no money in the budget for a raise I can't even pretend to keep up with american wages, 27 dollars an hour and there are tough choices? I my world that's some crazy amount of money if you work a regular 8 hours a day, 5 days a week.
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Oct 4, 2023 19:39
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His Divine Shadow posted:I can't even pretend to keep up with american wages, 27 dollars an hour and there are tough choices? I my world that's some crazy amount of money if you work a regular 8 hours a day, 5 days a week. That’s 56k a year base. Not the thread for it but yeah. 56k in 2016 dollars is about 72k in 2023 dollars.
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Oct 4, 2023 19:46
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His Divine Shadow posted:I can't even pretend to keep up with american wages, 27 dollars an hour and there are tough choices? I my world that's some crazy amount of money if you work a regular 8 hours a day, 5 days a week. That's gross income, pre-tax, so they're taking home less. Median rent in the US is more than $2,000/mo and you're paying more than that in any city you've ever heard of: https://www.rent.com/research/average-rent-price-report/ The median used car payment is more than $500/mo now and new is much higher, of course. Childcare is more than $1000/mo anywhere in the country and dramatically higher in cities. You don't get to live a middle class American life with a house, car, and kids for $27/hr.
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Oct 4, 2023 19:47
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His Divine Shadow posted:I can't even pretend to keep up with american wages, 27 dollars an hour and there are tough choices? I my world that's some crazy amount of money if you work a regular 8 hours a day, 5 days a week. Two words. Healthcare Costs Two other words. Childcare Costs
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Oct 4, 2023 19:48
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His Divine Shadow posted:I can't even pretend to keep up with american wages, 27 dollars an hour and there are tough choices? I my world that's some crazy amount of money if you work a regular 8 hours a day, 5 days a week. It's better than some jobs but remember people in factories put their bodies on the line and it's easy to end up with injuries (chronic and acute) which can easily reduce your quality of life and years available to keep working. The number of people who make it to standard retirement age while doing this kind of is low. OBAMNA PHONE fucked around with this message at 20:32 on Oct 4, 2023 |
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Oct 4, 2023 19:56
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Here's some interesting perspective from more than 40 years ago: https://www.nytimes.com/1981/06/03/business/gm-and-ford-press-uaw-on-labor-costs.htmlquote:Now the union, which has given up more than $1 billion in pay concessions to assist the Chrysler Corporation, is hunkering down to defend its gains against efforts by the Ford Motor Company and the General Motors Corporation to lower their labor costs. That $20/hr in the year 1981 that labor was costing Ford is more than $70/hr inflation adjusted to now.
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Oct 4, 2023 20:14
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And there's probably a whole lot less of it now with automation.
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Oct 4, 2023 20:34
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euphronius posted:My brain is still “9000 and below: economy car, 15,000-20,000 nice sedan, 30,000+ luxury car” same
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Oct 4, 2023 20:49
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bull3964 posted:And there's probably a whole lot less of it now with automation.
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Oct 4, 2023 21:01
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ilkhan posted:More production volume too. Wouldn't be surprised if the headcount was actually up. It’s not and its continuing diminishment is a source of great concern to the UAW
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Oct 4, 2023 21:20
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Does UAW have a long term plan for maintaining union employment headcount Nothing in particular is coming to mind
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Oct 4, 2023 21:44
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Sorry if this has been discussed but Im an idiot, and I was thinking of renting something on Turo for the first time. Dealerships dont have poo poo for stock for C8 Corvettes and this is the first gen I haven't officially owned or driven. Sure why not, I can just pay $170 dollars and rent one for a day on Turo. Drive it around town, see how I like it, and I dont even need to talk to 1 sales person! "Im guessing the cost of the rental includes what I need. I mean sure, they probably try to sell you extras you can decline, but my insurance and CC covers any deductible or additional coverage I need, you know, like how it works when I rent an actual rental car." <--Words spoken by an idiot. So I get towards the end of the check out. "Oh its not actually $170 anymore , its $180 now for the rental." Fine. Whats this? A Trip fee for 28% on top of the actual rental. gently caress that sucks, but fine I guess, Ill continue. Another 28% fee, this time for a "Protection Plan"? Nah I'm good, I already confirmed with my CC and my insurance policy Im covered on both. Let me just hit Decline on that bad boy and move on to reserving this beast. Nope! MANDATORY. "This trip requires you to purchase a protection plan through Turo to limit your out-of-pocket costs in the rare event of damage to XXXXXX vehicle." Maybe its just this person. Ill try one of the other 3 C8s. Nope , same exact message on the other 2. So now if I were to proceed, the estimated cost ballooned almost 60% and requires almost $1K deposit to boot. Good poo poo. How could I be so blind and dumb and think this would be any different from Air B&B, Uber Eats, Door Dash with their add ons and fees? Back to driving my 1/18 scale C8 back and forth on my desk. Vroom Vroom!
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Oct 4, 2023 23:41
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His Divine Shadow posted:I can't even pretend to keep up with american wages, 27 dollars an hour and there are tough choices? I my world that's some crazy amount of money if you work a regular 8 hours a day, 5 days a week. 27 bucks an hour is crap esp when just having a roof over your head has bulleted up in the last 5 years And C-suite pay keeps going up while real workers get jack poo poo
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Oct 4, 2023 23:46
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Franco Caution posted:Sorry if this has been discussed but Im an idiot, and I was thinking of renting something on Turo for the first time. Has Hertz not added the C8s yet? Does this mean that Hertz is currently Corvette-less? They sold a ton of C7 Z06es just before they went bankrupt: https://jalopnik.com/hertz-just-dumped-a-bunch-of-cheap-z06-corvettes-onto-t-1843521667  I don't follow the Corvette market, did the C8 push down C7 Z06 prices? How much cheaper than $60k are they now?
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Oct 4, 2023 23:48
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Basically we’re still mentally living in the 1980s where having 80k per year is considered serious money. But when you factor how wages have been tracking with inflation and productivity increases the reality is far more dire. A 75k salary in 2013 when adjust for inflation is like 115k today. We’ve decided as a society that there’s no budget for wage increases and all the gains should go to shareholders. Henry Ford was an antisemitic piece of poo poo but he had the right idea, if your own employees can’t afford the cars they’re building that is a problem and they should get paid more until they can.
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Oct 4, 2023 23:51
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