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Build diversity. Not game type diversity
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Oct 5, 2023 18:23
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Arione posted:How do yall nut all over the palce for diablo 2, and its literally one spammed skill forever, but complain about "muh lack of skill diversity" in Diablo 4? i really enjoy this game but the endgame is nonexistent. you beat everything as is very easily and run out of things to do by like level 80, which doesnt take long to get to
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Oct 5, 2023 18:25
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Theres something juicy about getting items in d2 that just doesn't exist in d4. Making that first mf sorc and then kitting out your uber character and then a barb or an amazon depending on if your bot finds a grandfather or a windforce first? A delightful time
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Oct 5, 2023 18:40
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flashman posted:Theres something juicy about getting items in d2 that just doesn't exist in d4. Making that first mf sorc and then kitting out your uber character and then a barb or an amazon depending on if your bot finds a grandfather or a windforce first? A delightful time Yeah when I was like 7 I always played a character until I found a sick item for another class then I leveled up that class to use the sick item. I was too stupid to bot tho. Would like for that type of thing to go on here
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Oct 5, 2023 18:42
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When an item drops in D4 endgame there is a 99.9% chance that it means pointless busywork rather than an upgrade, so it's almost never exciting to see an item drop. They've already implemented a coarse loot filter (everything below ancestral rare drops as mats in WT4) so now we just need to be able to customise it. Even a simple checklist of which affixes I care about per slot and then only show me items where min 3/4 of those affixes are present would remove the vast majority of tedious loot comparing, and would make it actually exciting when an item gets past the filter. Also it would be nice if we could switch between filtered items dropping as mats or gold
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Oct 5, 2023 18:43
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flashman posted:Theres something juicy about getting items in d2 that just doesn't exist in d4. Making that first mf sorc and then kitting out your uber character and then a barb or an amazon depending on if your bot finds a grandfather or a windforce first? A delightful time Ah yes, botting, the highest point of engaging gameplay
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Oct 5, 2023 18:44
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I had fun trying to get uniques in D2R because you had a guaranteed way to get them (the cube) and when you equipped them they genuinely felt more powerful, at least for a few levels. Even if your drops were shite, you were always at least working your way to a guaranteed upgrade.
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Oct 5, 2023 18:44
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flashman posted:Theres something juicy about getting items in d2 that just doesn't exist in d4. Making that first mf sorc and then kitting out your uber character and then a barb or an amazon depending on if your bot finds a grandfather or a windforce first? A delightful time D2 true endgame: pindlebot.
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Oct 5, 2023 18:45
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Time posted:Yeah when I was like 7 I always played a character until I found a sick item for another class then I leveled up that class to use the sick item. I was too stupid to bot tho. Would like for that type of thing to go on here A selection of unique items that were great for making instantly powerful alt characters (without the onerous lvl requirements that we deal with in d4) would go a long way to making the end game loop less boring
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Oct 5, 2023 18:46
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Tarnop posted:When an item drops in D4 endgame there is a 99.9% chance that it means pointless busywork rather than an upgrade, so it's almost never exciting to see an item drop. They've already implemented a coarse loot filter (everything below ancestral rare drops as mats in WT4) so now we just need to be able to customise it. Even a simple checklist of which affixes I care about per slot and then only show me items where min 3/4 of those affixes are present would remove the vast majority of tedious loot comparing, and would make it actually exciting when an item gets past the filter. Also it would be nice if we could switch between filtered items dropping as mats or gold They said they significantly upped gold drops to compensate for fewer trash items. You can also do a jury-rigged item filter in the new patch by using the search feature to search for affixes you want on the items you pick up and dumping those that the filter doesn't highlight.
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Oct 5, 2023 18:46
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the changes look good, hopefully the next season won't just be doing the challenges and quitting comparing D2 and D4 endgame is comparing apples and oranges. D2 can be played offline with static maps, and is a small enough game that you can actually think about completing a grail before you die some day. that is to say you could actually "complete" D2, whereas the whole point of always online seasonal games like D4 is that you can't
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Oct 5, 2023 18:46
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flashman posted:A selection of unique items that were great for making instantly powerful alt characters (without the onerous lvl requirements that we deal with in d4) would go a long way to making the end game loop less boring been saying they need to make all classes have the breadth of build defining uniques that druid has. was so fun to play a build and wait for one of the uniques to drop that changed the way the class worked
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Oct 5, 2023 18:47
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flashman posted:A selection of unique items that were great for making instantly powerful alt characters (without the onerous lvl requirements that we deal with in d4) would go a long way to making the end game loop less boring If one of the problems is that upgrades are so rare after a certain point, then how would making it so you never find a single upgrade ever improve that aspect?
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Oct 5, 2023 18:47
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Tarnop posted:When an item drops in D4 endgame there is a 99.9% chance that it means pointless busywork rather than an upgrade, so it's almost never exciting to see an item drop. They've already implemented a coarse loot filter (everything below ancestral rare drops as mats in WT4) so now we just need to be able to customise it. Even a simple checklist of which affixes I care about per slot and then only show me items where min 3/4 of those affixes are present would remove the vast majority of tedious loot comparing, and would make it actually exciting when an item gets past the filter. Also it would be nice if we could switch between filtered items dropping as mats or gold I think we need a fundamental change in the unique items. There arent enough, and the ones we do have generally suck. Legendaries are just rares with additional ( and movable) affixes. But they did say we can farm uber uniques come season 2, now we just need more of them. Given the inventory size we wont see charms or runes make a comeback. The inventory size is too small with items taking up 2 blocks each, we dont have inventory tetris like we used to. I guess runes could be a pop up window, not actually shown on the gear like in D2, but still, too many runes and not enough boxes.
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Oct 5, 2023 18:47
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flashman posted:A selection of unique items that were great for making instantly powerful alt characters (without the onerous lvl requirements that we deal with in d4) would go a long way to making the end game loop less boring D2 uniques absolutely have level requirements, you're smoking crack
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Oct 5, 2023 18:48
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Arione posted:I think we need a fundamental change in the unique items. There arent enough, and the ones we do have generally suck. Legendaries are just rares with additional ( and movable) affixes. But they did say we can farm uber uniques come season 2, now we just need more of them. Next patch they are revamping (almost) all unique items. They just said "more useful fixed stats" and "updated powers," so not really a clear indicator of how much more useful they will be, though.
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Oct 5, 2023 18:49
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hawowanlawow posted:the changes look good, hopefully the next season won't just be doing the challenges and quitting in all the years that ive played D2, I've never played offline single player other than to dick around and hack the game, which made it instantly boring. I only ever really played live ladder, and thats going back to 99.
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Oct 5, 2023 18:50
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:They said they significantly upped gold drops to compensate for fewer trash items. I missed the bit about increased gold drops, that's a good change. Filtering in the stash is definitely possible but it still doesn't fix the feeling that dropping loot is about as exciting as dropping a stack of papers on the way to the filing cabinet
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Oct 5, 2023 18:50
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Arione posted:Ah yes, botting, the highest point of engaging gameplay Can't play 24 hours a day man
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Oct 5, 2023 18:54
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Arione posted:D2 uniques absolutely have level requirements, you're smoking crack Yes, d2 uniques have set level requirements based on the item itself, a good system in comparison to d4 what level is the guy who found it lol A bit of a moot point regardless, because making the uniques good is step one
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Oct 5, 2023 18:55
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Arione posted:in all the years that ive played D2, I've never played offline single player other than to dick around and hack the game, which made it instantly boring. I only ever really played live ladder, and thats going back to 99. well maybe you should try an offline character and check off uniques you find on a grail tracker until you catch em all. it's fun and it's always there to pop back into when you don't feel like playing whatever the new hotness is. pretty chill when the maps are static and you can blast bosses or pit runs
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Oct 5, 2023 18:56
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:If one of the problems is that upgrades are so rare after a certain point, then how would making it so you never find a single upgrade ever improve that aspect? I wouldn't be sifting through an inventory of loot after every map, for starters
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Oct 5, 2023 18:57
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Tarnop posted:I missed the bit about increased gold drops, that's a good change. Rare quality loot has never been exciting....
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Oct 5, 2023 18:57
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:If one of the problems is that upgrades are so rare after a certain point, then how would making it so you never find a single upgrade ever improve that aspect? I mean there's a bunch of item slots so just because you find a windforce doesn't mean you are done gearing up
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Oct 5, 2023 19:00
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flashman posted:Yes, d2 uniques have set level requirements based on the item itself, a good system in comparison to d4 what level is the guy who found it lol That was a patch because nerds were crying that they were seeing drops many levels below them
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Oct 5, 2023 19:00
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Enjoying ARPGs should be a diagnostic criteria for the DSM, basically.
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Oct 5, 2023 19:00
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You can tell D4 pre-Season 2 is in a good state when the only way to defend it against being worse than 20 year old games is to make poo poo up in bad faith.
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Oct 5, 2023 19:01
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Arione posted:That was a patch because nerds were crying that they were seeing drops many levels below them huh? on release every item I found level req was the level of my character, now it caps based on wt iirc. why blame people other than the designer for poor design decisions
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Oct 5, 2023 19:03
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Arione posted:That was a patch because nerds were crying that they were seeing drops many levels below them 
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Oct 5, 2023 19:06
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Vic posted:lol i’m just trying to help. is a bad system that can be easily circumvented. some people aren’t for whatever reason and aren’t able to explain how or why. if you’ve got any constructive feedback though i’m all ears
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Oct 5, 2023 19:06
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harrygomm posted:i’m just trying to help. is a bad system that can be easily circumvented. some people aren’t for whatever reason and aren’t able to explain how or why. if you’ve got any constructive feedback though i’m all ears Eh it's just muscle memory training, I build it up with new desired stats on each new character in an ARPG. My eyes glaze over and I just go down line by line and mark it as junk as soon as I see two suboptimal passives. If you don't have it, i.e. you play an ARPG once a decade when a new Diablo releases, then you're gonna go slower and actually read each item. Degenerates like me play Grim Dawn and PoE in our free time.
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Oct 5, 2023 19:09
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harrygomm posted:i’m just trying to help. is a bad system that can be easily circumvented. some people aren’t for whatever reason and aren’t able to explain how or why. if you’ve got any constructive feedback though i’m all ears My feedback is you're too sweet, and thank you for offering help.
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Oct 5, 2023 19:12
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Is there another stream today? Edit - phew. I'm glad the hardcore news was fake
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Oct 5, 2023 19:18
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Next patch they are revamping (almost) all unique items. They just said "more useful fixed stats" and "updated powers," so not really a clear indicator of how much more useful they will be, though. They did this in S1 and most of them still suck, so I'm kind of skeptical, but hopefully they make more useful non-druid uniques.
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Oct 5, 2023 20:18
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Actually more excited to D4 in a couple weeks than I was leading up to launch to be honest.
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Oct 5, 2023 20:28
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GoGoGadgetChris posted:Is there another stream today? that's what I thought the 90 posts in this thread were about
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Oct 5, 2023 20:51
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Didn't they say that affixes are going to be ordered a certain way now? That should at least cut down on some of the more finnicky management since it will be a lot easier to glance at the first line or two, see that it has no crit dmg or whatever and junk it. Far cry from fixing itemization but absolutely a step in the right direction.
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Oct 5, 2023 21:09
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Aspects all sharing the same icon across categories is a big "put it back in the oven" thing. I could look at an inventory and know what all the items are based on their sprite in previous games.
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Oct 5, 2023 21:16
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GoGoGadgetChris posted:Is there another stream today? 10/10, so next week Clocks posted:Didn't they say that affixes are going to be ordered a certain way now? That should at least cut down on some of the more finnicky management since it will be a lot easier to glance at the first line or two, see that it has no crit dmg or whatever and junk it. Far cry from fixing itemization but absolutely a step in the right direction. yeah i thought that got put in in 1.1.4 or whatever is active now but they also talked about it during the stream, so some kind of further refining with 1.2 or whatever i think Vic posted:Aspects all sharing the same icon across categories is a big "put it back in the oven" thing. I could look at an inventory and know what all the items are based on their sprite in previous games. i think they said they’re changing some kinda icon changes for something. but yeah seeing the in world sprite for an archon plate drop or one of the unique armor icons/sprites is a core part of good loot feel imo
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Oct 5, 2023 22:03
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also thinking about it, uber duriel will be dropping uber uniques and takes a while to get the parts to summon him or whatever. however they said he’ll be easier than uber lillith. i wonder if they’ll bump or change her loot table because outside of the yardstick measuring and title, it seems like it wouldn’t be worth farming like duriel
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Oct 5, 2023 22:28
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