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Arist posted:I really don't get preferring 3's Social Links. They are underwritten to the extreme. Like half the ranks consist of exactly one minor interaction or piece of information being learned, followed by "Your relationship is stronger now!" Say what you will about the other games' Social Links, but they generally actually sit with the characters for more than a few lines. I mostly prefer FeMC's SLs, because the new ones actually had good stories and/or character development. Or you get to get second-hand embarrassment at watching some poor girl fall for Kenji of all people, and everyone else basically goes 'oh honey no'.
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Oct 17, 2023 15:31
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Zulily Zoetrope posted:I don't think there's inherently any issue with having party members be social links. You just gotta write them to be stories that can advance on their own track regardless of the character's headspace in the main plot, which most of them do. Half the side stories are just also kind of boring and unimportant, but there's no reason they have to be. if you make them s links then you either end up with a link story that is completely incongruous with their character in the main story, or you have to mandate that they receive no character development in either so that they match
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Oct 17, 2023 16:11
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A small thing but I liked how the team was the fool link in 3 and 4, only completing and starting judgement right at the end.
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Oct 17, 2023 16:12
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cock hero flux posted:if you make them s links then you either end up with a link story that is completely incongruous with their character in the main story, or you have to mandate that they receive no character development in either so that they match Not necessarily
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Oct 17, 2023 16:13
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You absolutely can, you just need to have consequences for failure. We have examples of this from the Devil Survivor games which also have Social Links (or something similar) but they're based on the plot and characters can permanently die.
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Oct 17, 2023 16:19
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I'm at the last month in P3P, is it worth it to do all the test doors? Seems like there's quite a few to get through. I love this game but I have never had the patience in the past to get this far.
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Oct 17, 2023 17:20
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Not really unless you want a challenge
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Oct 17, 2023 17:24
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FlimFlam Imam posted:I'm at the last month in P3P, is it worth it to do all the test doors? Seems like there's quite a few to get through. I love this game but I have never had the patience in the past to get this far. no
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Oct 17, 2023 17:24
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cock hero flux posted:if you make them s links then you either end up with a link story that is completely incongruous with their character in the main story, or you have to mandate that they receive no character development in either so that they match No, you don't. Take Yukari, for example; her plot role deals with her relationship with SEES and her father, while her social link deals with her social/school life and her relationship with her mother. Both develop and flesh out her character while being able to run on separate tracks.
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Oct 17, 2023 17:44
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ApplesandOranges posted:unfortunate forced harem Of course there's the infamous Hashino interview on this subject.... But to be a bit fairer to the developers, P3 was the first game to feature social links and also considering mechanics like Reverse/Broken I think it was intended more as a "sim" system than something intended to be 100% completed; there wasn't yet the ingrained mindset of a lot of players who feel that they need to max all social links during one playthrough. I have the feeling that they intended for, and encouraged players to choose to max only one of the girl social links in one playthrough, especially with the other mechanics like Reverse/Broken S Links that would punish you mechanically for two-timing etc. At least I think that's how I approached it when playing the game when it first came out. Obviously it's still a dumb design decision. Also I kind of like stuff like the social links reversing; while it's an "annoying" mechanic, much like stuff like the characters saying "I have to study for exams today, I can't go to Tartarus" and such it makes the characters feel more autonomous like real people and not just following whatever the player wants them to do. (AI controlled party was still a bridge too far though). While the overall plot of P3 is by far my least favorite in the series, I do think that it handled character development better than any other game in the series. Even though the party S. links were a bit superfluous and the timing was a bit contrived with "it's character development season, time for back to back persona awakening scenes", it did ratchet up the drama in a nice way (desperately needed in P3's thin plot) I still greatly prefer it to the approach that 4 and 5 took. anakha posted:I still wanna know what happened between 4 and 5 to send him into hiding on the dark web after being on top of the world as the Billy Mays of Japan. Who knows but I'm sure they did it just to fit in with the theme of most of the game's characters being outcasts living on the margins of society. Probably should have replaced him with a new character though.
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Oct 17, 2023 18:50
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I agree that party member Social Links being gated behind certain events is probably the least worst option.
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Oct 17, 2023 19:12
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Despite having the biggest cast, P3 also felt like it handled character development time way better than P4 or P5. Fuuka kinda gets left out and Koromaru doesn't actually get much because he's a dog, but then you still have 6-7 party members with actual arcs and spaced out well enough in the story that they don't feel like 'oh uhh here's that one month with their development, okay we're done now'.
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Oct 17, 2023 19:19
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Ehhh, Junpei and Yukari get that but most of the cast is kind of flat for a lot of the game. What I will say about 3 is that it's the only game whose story gets better in its third act instead of mostly just less fun, but that's partially because the story doesn't really get going for a very long time.
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Oct 17, 2023 19:23
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Aww man, Last Surprise doesn't play in regular battles if you're ambushing everyone. I was looking forward to that.
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Oct 18, 2023 03:42
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I get that Last Surprise is fantastic and absolutely a classic, but all P5R offers is a second, distinct, battle theme that is also incredible. ...should've thought twice, walked on thin ice, now your game's overrrr (hey!) it's time to boogie down (hey!)...
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Oct 18, 2023 03:53
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Arist posted:Ehhh, Junpei and Yukari get that but most of the cast is kind of flat for a lot of the game. What I will say about 3 is that it's the only game whose story gets better in its third act instead of mostly just less fun, but that's partially because the story doesn't really get going for a very long time. It's more that the game doesn't really ignore them for months at a time (Ken and Shinjiro are late joiners so they're already basically being set-up for their confrontation). Mitsuru can be a bit spotty at times but Akihiko gets the early meetings with Shinji, then (ugh) Operation Babe Hunt, and then Shinji joins the team. P4 largely ignores Chie (and to an extent Rise and Yukiko) especially after Naoto joins other than a few jokes. P5 did Ann/Yusuke/Haru dirty but at least it has Strikers to make up for it.
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Oct 18, 2023 04:37
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Zulily Zoetrope posted:I get that Last Surprise is fantastic and absolutely a classic, but all P5R offers is a second, distinct, battle theme that is also incredible. Okay, but if you got an ambush and all out attack in the original game you could easily time it so the battle ended on "You'll never see it comiiiiiing", which was awesome.
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Oct 18, 2023 10:10
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The thing is I feel lile Last Surprise feels better as an ambush theme since that's what the lyrics are talking about, you didn't see them coming. While Take Over is more about the PT in general so it would fit better as the general battle theme.
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Oct 18, 2023 12:03
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You will never, ever hear the general battle theme though, so it makes sense to put the new theme as the ambush one.
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Oct 18, 2023 12:13
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Last Surprise is also about turning the tables on an enemy who thinks they have the superior position, so I feel like it could also be a theme for when the enemy ambushes you, but that means you'd hear it like 3 times in a playthrough because it's trivial to get the drop on enemies in P5, even in Vanilla (and I've heard it's even easier in Royal).
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Oct 18, 2023 12:14
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This wouldn't be a problem if they just put a setting in the options menu to set the battle theme. Strikers does it!
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Oct 18, 2023 12:16
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You do actually hear the normal battle theme for like the minibosses in Palace that you can't actually ambush, like Mot in Futaba's Palace that turns you into rats.
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Oct 18, 2023 12:19
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Admiral H. Curtiss posted:This wouldn't be a problem if they just put a setting in the options menu to set the battle theme. Strikers does it!
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Oct 18, 2023 12:21
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We might see those changes in P3R, who knows.
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Oct 18, 2023 12:28
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Speaking of which... And Chihiro takes back the forehead crown from Haru.
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Oct 18, 2023 17:26
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I figured they were going to, but it still sucks that we're keeping all those crappy social links. (Statement does not include Bebe)
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Oct 18, 2023 22:14
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They've added some more info about Theurgy-related stuff, images of the gang in their new drip, backgroundless headshots of the social links: https://p-ch.jp/news/11763/ The social stats are still knowledge, charm, and guts. I guess the protagonist is just innately dextrous, diligent, and kind. Junpei's gauge builder: Land crits Junpei's passive trait: Increased crit rate and crit damage Junpei's Theurgy move: Burst Swing - Single target slashing damage that ignores defenses Yukari's gauge builder: Heal people Yukari's passive trait: Halves SP cost of heals Yukari's Theurgy move: Cyclone Arrow - Single target wind damage that ignores defenses And we already know Mitsuru's gauge is "casting Marin Karin".   Very much looking forward to hearing Bebe speak. Edit: It just occurred to me from this screenshot that Bebe's personal pronoun when he speaks Japanese is the same that a Samurai in the 1800s would use to say "I". miasmacloud fucked around with this message at 02:04 on Oct 19, 2023 |
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Oct 19, 2023 01:57
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miasmacloud posted:They've added some more info about Theurgy-related stuff, images of the gang in their new drip, backgroundless headshots of the social links: https://p-ch.jp/news/11763/ Yeah that is Bebe's gimmick
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Oct 19, 2023 02:07
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miasmacloud posted:They've added some more info about Theurgy-related stuff, images of the gang in their new drip, backgroundless headshots of the social links: https://p-ch.jp/news/11763/ Also confirmed Fusion Spells are the protag's Theurgy. Still not clear whether we need the Personas on the team or unlock them or X, but it should use the same bar as the rest I guess?
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Oct 19, 2023 10:07
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miasmacloud posted:Edit: It just occurred to me from this screenshot that Bebe's personal pronoun when he speaks Japanese is the same that a Samurai in the 1800s would use to say "I". To be fair to Bebe, at least one teacher will smite anybody who'd correct him.
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Oct 19, 2023 11:06
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I wonder if there's any way to make Innocent Sin more challenging? Challenging and interesting, preferably, but either way. Like, sticking to your original Personas would probably be challenging but it also sounds boring as hell. Seriously, I really do prefer IS to EP in almost every way with the sole exception of actually playing it since EP improved the gameplay considerably. It's still not good but it's more fun due to increased challenge and other little additions.
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Oct 19, 2023 18:21
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OG personas don't make it hard, I basically played that way my first time purely out of lack of desire to fuse poo poo if I didn't need to. Turns out I never needed to. Keep two of your guys dead, don't use healing fountains, use poor compatibility personas, don't buy equipment or items, Speedrun it. Probably a lot of other ideas.
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Oct 19, 2023 19:02
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I hope every caper has a wind-up party afterwards at a buffet.
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Oct 20, 2023 02:03
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SyntheticPolygon posted:Naoki and Hisano are the best ones Both these are great and contribute to my general feeling that the non-party P4 S-Links are significantly better than the non-party P5 ones.
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Oct 20, 2023 03:59
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https://twitter.com/persona_central/status/1715064892720308367?s=46&t=OlByiBLgO5fvKE1jFm-gMQ Text version: Voice actors for the Gekkoukan student Social Link characters in Persona 3 Reload. #P3R - Kenji Tomochika (VA: Joe Zieja) - Nozomi Suemitsu (VA: Paul Castro Jr.) - Kazushi Miyamoto (VA: Mark Whitten) - Yuko Nishiwaki (VA: Shelby Young) - Chihiro Fushimi (VA: Kelly Baskin) - Keisuke Hiraga (VA: Griffin Burns) - Bebe (VA: Jeff Berg) Also Bebe’s lines will no longer have a heavy French accent (probably because you have to hear him speak now).
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Oct 20, 2023 04:51
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ApplesandOranges posted:Also Bebe’s lines will no longer have a heavy French accent (probably because you have to hear him speak now). Boooooooo!
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Oct 20, 2023 07:02
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=li5pPkBdyXI Akihiko trailer.
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Oct 24, 2023 05:25
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Gonna have to get used to the new VA, it's definitely a noticeable shift from the old VA. It's also weird because I keep expecting Osvald based on the new VA though but he's not as... growly as Osvald, either.
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Oct 24, 2023 05:55
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It's funny, when asking how to make P2 harder, I got a few suggestions on Reddit about trying the PSX version. But that's the only version I've ever played. I thought the PSP one would be harder given it has difficulty levels and all, right? Oh well, here I am, playing Innocent Sin again. I might jump onto EP after since the PSP English translation is out and all. I just hope it doesn't make the game too easy since EP's difficulty was among its best features. Honestly, in retrospect, I think what hurts IS more than anything is how slow it is. It isn't even the battle system because the slowness of absolutely everything even impacts my enjoyment of the story. There is an impossible amount of dialogue in this game with party members and NPCs getting new stuff to say after every drat event. That's cool and I enjoy reading most of it but if the text speed in Xenogears drives people nuts, this is even worse. Someone in the RPG thread complained bout how long it takes to open menus in XG and that's a problem here, too. Everything about this game is at a snail's pace. I know technology has just ruined our brains but my point is just that P2's battle system, while not good, is probably hurt as much by the game's speed as anything. Just like how people poo poo on FFIX's battle system even though it's the best PS1 FF in terms of gameplay. But I continue to be astounded at the level of foreshadowing for everything in this game. Having beaten the game once, the incidental dialogue you can have with party members in random shops, if they aren't fun, quirky stuff, are all hinting at or building up to later evens and revelations. Also a cute detail that never even occurred to me in my first run is how all the healing spots are quack pseudoscience. So far we've got a chiropractor, aroma therapy, and now a tanning salon. When four people are beating the poo poo out of your friend, and a fifth is threatening a girl with a knife, what should you do?  Somebody once offered up the only vaguely acceptable explanation for this; that this isn't really me making the decision. I'm just supposed to do what "Tatsuya" would do. So while the natural impulse of every living human being would be to step in and help, Tatsuya is nothing like any of us and that is why just standing by and watching is the correct response. It's still stupid. It's been a few years since I played IS and I've read and thought a lot about exactly this kind of thing. Yukino says to save Eikichi would to be "insult his pride as a man." Pride in Western culture has been denigrated for a long time as he worst of sins but there's really nothing wrong with it in reasonable quantities. For example, rushing in to save Eikichi and his girl would be something to be proud of because you are helping others. Take pride in your desire and ability to assist other people. But the kind of pride which tells you to ignore all your basic empathy and instincts because of your own stupid ego? That is the kind of pride which should be abolished.
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Oct 28, 2023 21:45
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i think the psp ver makes some IS stuff faster and has a better UI? it also gives u a lil minimap, in dungeons also i always figured the ult persona choices in IS were basically just, do you have faith in your pals to handle stuff and realize things or do you wanna help them out?
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Oct 29, 2023 10:57
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