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irl there are even gas stations with residential above, although they are getting scarce. Here is one from Vienna. 
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Oct 29, 2023 08:26
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I haven't had a chance to play that much but it feels like a lot of complaints here are that the city accurately depicts small/medium town life way too long instead of faking its way into city style population dynamics relatively early.
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Oct 29, 2023 08:33
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MikeJF posted:You, uh, know that you can't just add a shop onto a house or apartment building arbitrarily in real life? You have to be in an area that's specifically earmarked to have a commercial business as the front-facing facade or a building. Earmarked via a 'zone'. tbf zoning in city builders is quite simplistic compared to IRL I think most countries have zoning laws (or equivalent) that are mostly what would be considered "mixed use". Here's a local example: https://www.catalogoarquitectura.cl/cl/oguc/conoce-los-6-tipos-de-uso-de-suelo-establecidos-en-la-oguc   Gray is pure residential, light blue, yellow and orange are residential + various degrees of commerce/services ("equipment"), red is basically medium/high density commercial (big box store chains will often buy whole apartments/office buildings and convert'em into one big store), purple is basically low density industry. However, even "pure residential" allows commercial/industry/office so long as the location still has habitation as its primary purpose. In other words, stuff like restaurants, bike shops, hairdressers, mom and pop stores and other such things that are run from converted/refitted houses. The kinda stuff that can stay open during holidays because it's staffed by the residents. There's also a special allowance for services that are part of a housing complex or similar, stuff like pools, laundry, etc, which would normally be classified as "commercial" in city builders. And you can also do industry-type activities in commercial zones given previous authorization as long as its nuisance rating is "inoffensive", without changing the zoning. None of that is really available in CS2. Kyte fucked around with this message at 09:26 on Oct 29, 2023 |
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Oct 29, 2023 09:24
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I just ran a highway over the top of an industrial estate, expecting it to bulldoze a perfect column through the place, but instead it only knocked out a few properties where the supports went. I'll put this into the 'improvements that pleasantly surprise me' column. 
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Oct 29, 2023 09:33
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It was really disappointing unlocking the high density commercial and finding it only gives you multi-story version of the same businesses as low density commercial, no supermarkets or movie theaters. Unless I need to zone a really big continuous block to get a single big building or something?
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Oct 29, 2023 09:49
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Man why does my game keep switching to loading the ultra low quality assets/textures/etc. and back to the good ones constantly, it's incredibly distracting
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Oct 29, 2023 10:03
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chadbear posted:irl there are even gas stations with residential above, although they are getting scarce. Here is one from Vienna.  At least I hope the rent is low to compensate for the constant car noise, gas smell and risk of explosive fiery death.
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Oct 29, 2023 10:33
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Poil posted:
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Oct 29, 2023 11:20
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Kyte posted:tbf zoning in city builders is quite simplistic compared to IRL So like, from the player's perspective, the way you make any given type of zone happen is by making the zone more valuable to that specific type than it is to the other types, with the different types obviously valuing different qualities differently. Basically, residential, office, commercial might care about noise in that order, while commercial and office care more about the immediate infrastructure around them, while residential values leisure areas more. Essentially, you zone an area implicitly rather than explicitly, letting buildings fill out with different functions based on demand. Obviously you could still zone areas explicitly to only include some categories, which might even serve as a nucleus around which your more dynamic/flexible mixed-use zoning could exist - with an explicit commercial zone drawing in people and noise which makes neighboring mixed-use zones relatively more attractive to other commercial functions. Or designate a specific part as residential-only, resulting in residential pooling around that area because it ends up being less noisy. Or you could just go forced single-use across the board if that's the type of environment you're trying to create, like some proper exurbia style environment.
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Oct 29, 2023 12:13
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Mixed use places seem great but they never seem to get built for me, even when there is a demand for both halves of the mixed building.
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Oct 29, 2023 15:18
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chadbear posted:irl there are even gas stations with residential above, although they are getting scarce. Here is one from Vienna. ‘Grabbing my IBC codebook-checking fire separation requirements for flammable liquids dispensing and R2 occupancy.’ “Hmm cant seem to find that option for some reason”
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Oct 29, 2023 15:20
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Vahakyla posted:What do you think this is zoned as: This one, though, uh. I'd bet it is zoned, in western citybuilder terms, light I, but without a closer look at the garages it could be the closest match to literally any zone type in C:S2 except light R, low-rent R, or specialty I, and in any case there would be no zoning barriers to building mid R or mixed R/C in it. The 'strip' style development is entirely due to it being a high traffic road without adjacent heavy R/mixed or rail access and thusand a good place for light C no matter what else is allowed there. e: 
Mandoric fucked around with this message at 15:28 on Oct 29, 2023 |
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Oct 29, 2023 15:22
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Yeah I know enough about land-use safety regulations around petrol stations down here in Oz that that boggles the mind a bit.
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Oct 29, 2023 15:24
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Just stumbled on this, check out the way the legend is organized: (From https://collections.leventhalmap.org/book_viewer/commonwealth:69701g66q#1/1; it's from 1962)
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Oct 29, 2023 15:27
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chadbear posted:irl there are even gas stations with residential above, although they are getting scarce. Here is one from Vienna. Something like this could never happen in Germany, with it's strict rules and... ...gently caress that, of course it can, that one is in my hometown. The thing in the middle is a gas station. 
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Oct 29, 2023 15:30
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In Oz, my local shopping street is zoned C1Z (Commerical 1 Zone) under the Metropolitan Melbourne planning scheme, general descriptionquote:To create vibrant mixed use commercial centres for retail, office, business, entertainment and community uses. Residential uses exist as a secondary allowance to the commercial frontage which is the purpose of the zone. I don't believe you'd be able to just drop a pure residential use in there, you'd have to provide ground level commercial use dominating the frontage.  So yeah, aside from the lack of secondary residential add-ons, which is minor, I've always been pretty at-home with city sim zoning concepts. MikeJF fucked around with this message at 15:50 on Oct 29, 2023 |
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Oct 29, 2023 15:32
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Also, related to how that Japanese example came about, since 'income' and 'net worth' are notionally tracked, the simulation really should spot non-driving sims an extra 10-20k/year, and let that factor in housing-finding. There will be people who value spacious rooms over the money, and that strip is there for their daily shopping, but there are also people who would rather the treats or a more luxurious flat.
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Oct 29, 2023 15:38
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Mandoric posted:Also, related to how that Japanese example came about, since 'income' and 'net worth' are notionally tracked, the simulation really should spot non-driving sims an extra 10-20k/year, and let that factor in housing-finding. There will be people who value spacious rooms over the money, and that strip is there for their daily shopping, but there are also people who would rather the treats or a more luxurious flat. the simulation does do that, it costs money to drive
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Oct 29, 2023 15:41
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In Germany, residential is just assumed to have light mixed use, i.e. corner shops, bakeries, supermarkets. Red: Majority Residential Brown: Mixed Use Orange: Special Yellow: Roads and parking Green: Green You will find shops in the red areas, while the brown ones contain bigger shops and some residential. Specifically: BauNVO posted:§4 General residential areas Note the complete lack of commercial in much of the city. Commercial does exist, but it is what many city games call light industrial. City builders utterly fail to represent the actual design of a typical German city.
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Oct 29, 2023 15:46
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turn off the TV posted:the simulation does do that, it costs money to drive No, I mean also a big lump cost to flag the individual sim as able to drive (or a big lump SoL boost to flag as unable), and without the ability to drive rejigger happiness to care a lot less about room size and a lot more about what's accessible on foot. Having a big barrier to driving even once and then a smaller barrer to driving once you have also lets not quite enough transit show itself as a happiness penalty rather than downtown suddenly flooding with cars, esp important in that 'not quite enough transit' tends to show itself when downtown floods with cars over something else. Remove the potential for deathspirals of car pref after an accident/bad through traffic rolls.
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Oct 29, 2023 15:57
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How can I connect distant city tiles with road? Surely I should be able to establish little villages all over the map and connect them up with roads even via tiles I have not yet claimed? Also am I blind or is there no way to edit a road after you've laid it down? As in grab a node to smooth out an annoying kink in a curve.
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Oct 29, 2023 15:58
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Sumerian Telecom posted:How can I connect distant city tiles with road? Surely I should be able to establish little villages all over the map and connect them up with roads even via tiles I have not yet claimed? until mods are in you'll need to just demolish and rebuild the road I really want them to fix how lumpy roads can get. I have a road that just jump up to the intersection like this _/ which makes it impossible to lay down tram tracks. I guess free terraforming is the solution to this but i wish the roads were a bit more aggressive with smoothing the terrain under them
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Oct 29, 2023 16:02
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AceRimmer posted:It was really disappointing unlocking the high density commercial and finding it only gives you multi-story version of the same businesses as low density commercial, no supermarkets or movie theaters. Unless I need to zone a really big continuous block to get a single big building or something? Yeah this was another catalyst for my shower idea, I put down some high density commercial in a big grid expecting something like a mall or a bigger single store, and instead it plopped down these odd looking 2x4 multi-storey buildings, with an accompanying garage entrance with empty space above it. I've also tried creating local suburban malls via plopping down roads and parking lots along with zoning large bits of low density commercial, but what I got was like an odd combination of fast food and gas stations. Maybe it'll just be a matter of waiting for a new equivalent of the District Styles mod to fine tune what actually shows up, and adding custom assets for a real suburban supermarket. piratepilates fucked around with this message at 16:12 on Oct 29, 2023 |
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Oct 29, 2023 16:09
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Sumerian Telecom posted:
It’s not quite up to Move-It standards but you can make adjustments with the replace tool well enough in my experience. Learned it from City Planner Plays.
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Oct 29, 2023 16:16
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To be fair a big mall is a major enough development that it's not just a regular part of zone growth, it's something that is usually specifically worked out with the city. Like Signature Buildings! Are there signature malls?
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Oct 29, 2023 16:18
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MikeJF posted:To be fair a big mall is a major enough development that it's not just a regular part of zone growth, it's something that is usually specifically worked out with the city. Like Signature Buildings! Are there signature malls? It looks like 2 has one in the European theme, none in the American theme? (strange) The American theme does apparently have a multi-level fashion mall and a "muscle car garage" that's about half the size of the European supermarket. All are only ploppable once in a city IIRC, since they're signature buildings.
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Oct 29, 2023 16:23
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I have come to the conclusion that you can trust ABSOLUTELY NOTHING on the UI charts and displays. Ex. Only of these can be true.  Either my city has a massive worker shortage to the tune of 1500 people across the entire economy OR I have a 9.2% unemployment rate. But then the screen says I have just a hair under 29k jobs available yet there are 29.4k employed workers. What gives? Similarly my wealth chart for office building is like -50 million dollars. But I can't satisfy Office demand fast enough. Every tile zoned is instantly gobbled up and filled with workers.
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Oct 29, 2023 16:31
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Nobody wants to WORK anymore!
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Oct 29, 2023 16:42
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That chart appears to say you have minus 1800 or so unemployed people. Which I don't know what that means to be honest.
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Oct 29, 2023 16:56
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OwlFancier posted:That chart appears to say you have minus 1800 or so unemployed people. I mean negative unemployment technically isn't possible but I was being generous and gave them the out that it might represent a worker shortage. In other news....the Slater family got divorced. QQ
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Oct 29, 2023 16:59
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Ms Adequate posted:Man why does my game keep switching to loading the ultra low quality assets/textures/etc. and back to the good ones constantly, it's incredibly distracting This is why I refunded the game.
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Oct 29, 2023 17:04
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That does actually raise the question, does the game model the same person having multiple jobs because that might explain some of the weird numbers, although I still don't know how you have more employed people than jobs.
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Oct 29, 2023 17:05
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Ms Adequate posted:Man why does my game keep switching to loading the ultra low quality assets/textures/etc. and back to the good ones constantly, it's incredibly distracting Is it panicking about VRAM and then un-panicking?
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Oct 29, 2023 17:05
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MikeC posted:
After Amber pulled that whole family up by the bootstraps and paid for Robert's education???? drat shame.
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Oct 29, 2023 17:08
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For all the road building improvements in the sequel and the inclusion of a "build a grid" tool, building an actual grid-based road system sure is tedious as hell.
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Oct 29, 2023 17:19
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deep dish peat moss posted:For all the road building improvements in the sequel and the inclusion of a "build a grid" tool, building an actual grid-based road system sure is tedious as hell. If you could at least set the length and height of a grid square it would be a lot easier. Unless I'm missing something the squares will largely stretch however they want.
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Oct 29, 2023 17:21
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I'd also like it if I could just use the grid tool to staple a grid onto an existing road, but every time I try that, the auto-grid starts having a lot of collision issues with the existing road that prevent it from placing 
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Oct 29, 2023 17:43
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Sumerian Telecom posted:How can I connect distant city tiles with road? Surely I should be able to establish little villages all over the map and connect them up with roads even via tiles I have not yet claimed? You can only do this if you buy a strip of tiles to run a road through, or buy stuff along the prebuilt highway to connect to it. You can't run a country road through tiles you don't own. Sumerian Telecom posted:Also am I blind or is there no way to edit a road after you've laid it down? As in grab a node to smooth out an annoying kink in a curve. Someone will make the Move It mod for CS2 eventually that will let you arrange roads however you like, but for the moment if you go to the replace function and turn off all the snapping, you can actually slide the road around a bit and take care of a lot of stuff. Dollar store Move It.
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Oct 29, 2023 17:47
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What the hell does the "Small Homes" debuff mean? Also why the gently caress is it so tedious to do anything with subways? Who thought this view made sense? I'm zoomed all the way in as far as I can go to try to get a better glimpse of what I'm doing down there but man it's difficult, especially when you have multiple stations all on different levels for some reason. Is there a way to easily see how deep a laid track is?
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Oct 29, 2023 17:51
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What's the detaily stuff you can turn of graphically that saves performance that won't look actively bad to be off, just simpler. Is there a way to make it so that night mode is still unrealistically well lit, just a bit dimmer and blue-y? Like the moon is suddenly ten times brighter than it should be. I know you can turn it off altogether but. MikeJF fucked around with this message at 17:58 on Oct 29, 2023 |
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Oct 29, 2023 17:55
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