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I didn't have high hopes for that series to begin with and I hope it's sorta memory holed. The first issue has Mallah kill The Brain and the last issue involves General Immortus getting merged with the remains of the Candlemaker and then him getting banished to the Bleed and landing on an evil version of Danny the Street and meeting the Batwoman Who Laughs. It was definitely trying to say something during its run but it just couldn't get anything down with an ending that's just poorly trying to appeal to fans. The Robotman story in the recent Halloween special where he's visited by the various dead Doom Patrol members was way more powerful at anything this recent series could do
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Oct 26, 2023 14:22
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BrianWilly posted:I will say King's intepretation of Steve is...well, real bad. What's this nonsense with him doubting Diana enough to be cussing at her? I think King was trying to evoke the Chris Pine Steve who was like nooo Diana you can't fight them all you're not good enough Yeah, I'm not near as well-versed in WW as you are but Steve felt miserably off. Xelkelvos posted:the Batwoman Who Laughs. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zfbK_dbsCu0
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Oct 26, 2023 18:35
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before the No Man's Land moment -- which of course leads her being very much good enough to absolutely fight them all -- but the difference is that Chris Pine Steve was a rookie Steve who hasn't seen Diana do all the cool poo poo, and this should be a Steve that has, so it just ends up making him look the most patronizing he's looked since, like, the 70s.
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X-O posted:This isn't the place for discussing Tom King's past pre-comic writing bullshit. Only his comic writing bullshit, of which is there is plenty to discuss. heheheh exactly!  In other news, I've finally been able to read through Martian Manhunter Son of Mars + Rings of Saturn, which although they've been good, they didn't have nearly enough of J'onn's corny police quips, etc like in The New Frontier. So, what I'm wondering is, are there any (actually obtainable  ) GNs/comics of MM bumbling around as a cop while spouting hilariously corny noir cop quotes, rather than being a proper green hero all the time?
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Oct 31, 2023 04:05
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I really liked King's Vision series, I thought it showed the problems with trying to act rational when you've really just got all these emotions you aren't dealing with, and the characters felt very real because of it. I really didn't like King's Mister Miracle. It wasn't clear to me if the New God's war thing was something I was supposed to recognize, or something that was there to show this reality was different from actual DC reality, and seeing characters tired of raising a baby just is not an interesting scene. There were some good character moments, but generally it was a slog. The two stories have a similar outline but very different execution. I'm not sure if I prefer Vision because I know the character better, or because Marvel editorial helped him focus on the good parts of his writing, or if King just sort of hit a dry spell as a writer.
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Oct 31, 2023 04:20
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Vision was when I understood that Tom King doesn't really care much about the previous history in universe and will character assassinate to tell the story he wants to tell. And when I complained about that a few years ago people laughed at me lol.
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Oct 31, 2023 08:39
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King wrote the omega men which was awesome
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Oct 31, 2023 09:00
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It was okay I guess. I was really little confused about why the summaries say that it stars Kyle Rayner, but when you read it he's nowhere in the whole series. 
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Oct 31, 2023 09:21
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Iirc King wrote Batman vs Elmer Fudd so I can’t hate him too much
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Oct 31, 2023 09:50
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King is good, even if the Batman run fell apart at the end and Heroes in Crisis was a good idea mashed together with a bunch of dumb poo poo.
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Oct 31, 2023 12:54
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Siegkrow posted:Vision was when I understood that Tom King doesn't really care much about the previous history in universe and will character assassinate to tell the story he wants to tell. It's not character assassination if it's a good story.  I joke, but I think a lot of people do feel that way to some degree or another. I, for one, am a lot more willing to swallow breaks from established characterisation and backstory if it's in service of a good book. If you're going to undermine existing dynamics just to write something like Heroes in Crisis, why even bother?
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Oct 31, 2023 14:48
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King has a handful of good stories and moments and a looooot of bad ones. He's incredibly frustrating to me because when he's good, he's really good but when he's bad he's just god awful terrible. I hope his Wonder Woman run is on the shorter side so we can try to get a better writer on her again. 
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Oct 31, 2023 17:13
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Vandar posted:I hope his Wonder Woman run is on the shorter side so we can try to get a better writer on her again. It's been such an inconsistent series of runs I am surprised so many people keep trying. At least the art is great in this one!
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Oct 31, 2023 17:28
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Dr Kool-AIDS posted:King is good, even if the Batman run fell apart at the end and Heroes in Crisis was a good idea mashed together with a bunch of dumb poo poo. It was all dumb poo poo though. The only good idea was the broad outline. The actual content of the story was bad.
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Nov 1, 2023 01:18
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Some of the therapy sessions were done well.
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Nov 1, 2023 02:37
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The last issue of Spirit World is really drat good.Open Marriage Night posted:Some of the therapy sessions were done well. The sessions were easily the best part of the whole thing. Maybe even the only good part.
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Nov 1, 2023 04:17
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So I guess Jason Todd is dead again?
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Nov 1, 2023 05:30
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Codependent Poster posted:So I guess Jason Todd is dead again? Why? Like, he's probably my least favorite Robin, but that's sorta why I don't see the point. Dick Greyson is probably relatively untouchable at the moment because he has popular solo series, but I would knock off Tim Drake or Damian again if I was gonna kill a Robin.
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Nov 1, 2023 05:41
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After the bullshit Bruce did to him, being dead is probably a mercy.
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Nov 1, 2023 05:53
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He was in a plane that blew up a meteor. But then he shows up to pat Batman on the shoulder? I really have no idea if that's supposed to be real or not. This whole thing was a mess.
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Nov 1, 2023 05:58
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I just read the issue and there's no way that's him, it's gotta be a hallucination. God what a lovely fuckin' story.
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Nov 1, 2023 06:12
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Jason Todd's final words: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gzthb6gqLDY
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Nov 1, 2023 06:17
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Codependent Poster posted:He was in a plane that blew up a meteor. But then he shows up to pat Batman on the shoulder? I really have no idea if that's supposed to be real or not. This whole thing was a mess. Go back a few panels. That dude in the parachute is Jason. Ejector seats!
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Nov 1, 2023 06:36
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Vandar posted:
This I can agree with. It’s like good Tom King came up with the therapy scenes, and then bad Tom King had to come up with a plot.
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Nov 1, 2023 14:48
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DivineCoffeeBinge posted:Go back a few panels. That dude in the parachute is Jason. Ejector seats! I totally missed that. So this issue had two death fakeouts.
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Nov 1, 2023 16:20
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Codependent Poster posted:I totally missed that. So this issue had two death fakeouts. Yeah I sort of scanned past that too - it would have been a lot more clear if they'd shown him eject instead of strongly implying that he'd sacrificed himself. I get how this is more dramatic but it wasn't great visual storytelling as the parachute scene is very busy. Is Selina going to return as an immortal with superpowers? Not a great mini-event.
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Nov 1, 2023 16:25
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it makes the latest true secret origin of gotham nonsense in detective look like a masterpiece.
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Nov 1, 2023 16:43
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Gotham War felt like they were just making it up as they went along. Suddenly it became about Vandal Savage and magic meteors instead of... whatever it started out as. An absolutely abysmal Bat-event. But hey, we have a Three Jokers retread to look forward to at least!
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Nov 1, 2023 21:42
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Open Marriage Night posted:This I can agree with. It’s like good Tom King came up with the therapy scenes, and then bad Tom King had to come up with a plot. King's actually talked about this - apparently the cast was decided by DC editorial, down to Wally being the murderer and his one big regret about the book is not pushing back against that. A version of that comic where the killer is Literally Anyone Else is probably better. (his other big regret being that he thinks the title sucked rear end and should have just been Sanctuary but comics sell more if you put "Crisis" in the name)
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Nov 2, 2023 00:46
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So did Selina learn that making an army of trained thieves was a bad idea?
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Nov 2, 2023 06:15
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thetoughestbean posted:So did Selina learn that making an army of trained thieves was a bad idea? It was working pretty well until Savage convinced them to work for him and I guess one of them broke into Bruce's brownstone.
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Nov 3, 2023 01:05
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That sucks, there should be a Cat Family
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Nov 3, 2023 03:09
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the nonviolent thief training would have been a great idea if they had all taken a quick score as a method to get the gently caress out of gotham. there's always going to be an immortal caveman hunting for meteorites or some such bullshit there. no one ever gets out of gotham, though.
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Nov 3, 2023 06:20
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Nightwing did! .....to the nearby city that makes Gotham look like Metropolis....
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Nov 3, 2023 14:01
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Current Bludhaven seems pretty nice. It even has the TItans headquarters.
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Nov 3, 2023 15:14
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I read the Return of Superman 30th Anniversary Special in a moment of weakness, and boy the DC timeline is weird. Lois mentions that this all happened "a few years ago" but it was a fair bit longer ago to some of us. There are a number of flashbacks to the original story where people are recording the events on their smartphones and there's a YouTube equivalent shown at one point in that era, but on the other hand Steel gives a kid an old school Game Boy to encourage him not to use guns. Having been around when the original story happened it just felt way off.
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Nov 3, 2023 15:21
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Open Marriage Night posted:Current Bludhaven seems pretty nice. It even has the TItans headquarters. Most of Taylor's run has been Nightwing fixing Bludhaven at the source of the problems instead of just beating up people in masks. There is of course also a large amount of beating up people in masks.
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Nov 3, 2023 15:28
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Darth Nat posted:Gotham War felt like they were just making it up as they went along. Suddenly it became about Vandal Savage and magic meteors instead of... whatever it started out as. An absolutely abysmal Bat-event. But hey, we have a Three Jokers retread to look forward to at least! Yeah it started out with a pretty great premise but I think they kind of came up with an idea... I don't know, too interesting for Big Two comics? Like the idea of Catwoman effectively ending violent crime (and especially the problem of henchmen) in Gotham by turning thugs into thieves and presenting Batman with the concept of letting one crime slide to prevent worse crimes is a fun thought exercise, especially the angle of having some Bat-family members agree that it's a solution they're okay with. ...But at the end of the day Batman needs crimes to fight or there are no more Batman comics. So eventually the moral conundrum has to be solved by making another villain hijack the plot (and the thief army) so there can be a definitive bad guy. Also dammit Zdarsky I thought we had put the 3 Jokers thing behind us with that Black Label story. Just file that whole thing with the New 52 stuff everyone else has been content to sweep under the rug.
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Nov 3, 2023 15:49
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But it's also kind of odd that every crim in Gotham has the capability to be a cat burglar, surely some have to bomb out and still go back to henching.
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Nov 4, 2023 03:53
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tbh "any criminal can be a cat burglar" seems like one of the least implausible things that happens in gotham every week
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Nov 4, 2023 04:27
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Still getting through Justice league America giffen run I love it and I love it more that, surprise surprise issue 46 is penciled by Linda Medley Great covers all around too
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Nov 4, 2023 08:06
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