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Admiral Joeslop posted:Was Macho Man hard to work with or overly political? I know he had a lot of problems with Hogan, Elizabeth, and anyone he was paranoid about seeing Elizabeth but did he bring any of that to the ring? Getting lazy with the elbow drop due to wear and tear was pretty egregious since he just transferred all the pain and impact to the opponent. DDP Commented in that thread. " level 1 RealDDP OP · 1 hr. ago Mach didn't say things like this to ANYONE...not because he was a dick or anything, he was just that old school introverted closed off type that kept to himself and left everything bottled up inside. The closest thing I had to him opening up, was the hug he gave me for leaving him a voicemail on Thanksgiving telling him I was thankful for him in my life. This video resurfaced just in time for the anniversary of Halloween Havoc 1997, the final match in the feud of Randy “Macho Man” Savage vs DDP… The other day I was thinking, Man I wish Randy did at least one shoot style interview talking about our 1997 PWI feud of the year. Mach didn’t do any sit down interviews that were shoot style. Then my buddy Sean found this interview. Turns out to be from the WCW Superstar Series. A collection of VHS tapes WCW put out in 1998. There were so many wrestling vhs tapes being made then, I never would have seen just a random bio tape. It's pretty wild to hear these powerful words posthumously from one of my heroes who helped make my career. RIP Randy. DDP"
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Oct 27, 2023 17:15
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Macho's paranoia and desire to not look weak makes sense when you remember that Hogan was around him for most of their careers, getting in his way and trying to keep him down.
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Oct 27, 2023 17:18
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DDP was the other guy who famously liked to plot out every step of a match beforehand, so it makes sense they got on well
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Oct 27, 2023 17:21
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CombineThresher posted:Macho's paranoia and tendency to map out his matches to the letter made him pretty hard to work with for a lot of the guys who were used to winging it because they were too drunk to remember pre-planned spots. He was a weird intense guy and there aren't many personalities who mesh well with that. According to Flair anyway and Ricky Steamboat doesn't think as highly of his match at WM3 with Savage as you might think because it was so planned out step-by-step.
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Oct 27, 2023 18:01
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I remember Jake Roberts said that Savage's moods were unpredictable and he wrestled accordingly, and that he would often sandbag Savage in the first couple minutes of the match just to get him to chill out and figure out the pace of the match.
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Oct 27, 2023 18:24
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Yeah Jake's story about Randy asking Jake to have his snake bite himself so he knew it wasn't poisnous, then Randy WAITING AROUND FOR AN HOUR to make sure he didnt take an antidote kinda summarizes him. I get the sense that Randy is less Hulk/Flair ego and debauchery and just intense paranoia/anxiety/need to control his environment
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Oct 27, 2023 18:38
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And cocaine. Even by the standards of the time, he was doing a lot of cocaine, if I'm not mistaken.
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Oct 27, 2023 18:39
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Kvlt! posted:Yeah Jake's story about Randy asking Jake to have his snake bite himself so he knew it wasn't poisnous, then Randy WAITING AROUND FOR AN HOUR to make sure he didnt take an antidote kinda summarizes him. I definitely think coming up in Memphis (one of the carniest territories there was), and being undercut by Hogan every time he was getting over didn't help, but being a cokehead didn't help either, especially wrt paranoia
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Oct 27, 2023 18:42
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El Gallinero Gros posted:I definitely think coming up in Memphis (one of the carniest territories there was), and being undercut by Hogan every time he was getting over didn't help, but being a cokehead didn't help either, especially wrt paranoia Not just Memphis, but legit outlaw mudshow Memphis. His dad promoted against the NWA so you know the Poffos were always looking over their shoulders. There was a story of Macho planning on shoplifting at a grocery store; either he'd get arrested on a minor charge and make the papers which would lend credibility to his wildman character and serve as advertising for their upcoming shows, or he'd get free steak out of it. When your logic tree works like that, you have no chance of being normal.
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Oct 27, 2023 20:12
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I'm glad wrestlers have twitter and twitch these days to advertise instead. Much safer/more legal
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Oct 27, 2023 20:37
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Dawgstar posted:According to Flair anyway and Ricky Steamboat doesn't think as highly of his match at WM3 with Savage as you might think because it was so planned out step-by-step. And while if you only watched the WWF that match was amazing, compared to Steamboat's very best it isn't on that level.
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Oct 27, 2023 21:10
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Savage being a micro-managing control freak certainly explains the horrible way he treated Elizabeth when he was on the road and she wasnt
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Oct 27, 2023 21:15
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MassRafTer posted:And while if you only watched the WWF that match was amazing, compared to Steamboat's very best it isn't on that level. Yeah. It's a very very good WWF match for the time and for a good while after but it doesn't compare to the Flair trilogy or versus Funk later. Maybe even Ricky's stuff with Rude. SatoshiMiwa posted:Savage being a micro-managing control freak certainly explains the horrible way he treated Elizabeth when he was on the road and she wasnt To Hogan and his wife at the time's credit, apparently Elizabeth legit sought refuge with them and they gave it to her.
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Oct 27, 2023 21:43
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Dawgstar posted:Yeah. It's a very very good WWF match for the time and for a good while after but it doesn't compare to the Flair trilogy or versus Funk later. Maybe even Ricky's stuff with Rude. Or Steamboat's earlier stuff.
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Oct 28, 2023 06:33
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MassRafTer posted:Or Steamboat's earlier stuff. Seen very little of that, unfortunately. I'd love to see the stuff with him and Youngblood vs. Sgt. Slaughter and Don Kernodle.
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Oct 28, 2023 20:24
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The even funnier thing is the WWF slowed down and cut down Tiger Mask vs Dynamite Kidd matches were better than Steamboat/Savage too but those got memory holed
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Oct 28, 2023 20:36
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Dawgstar posted:Seen very little of that, unfortunately. I'd love to see the stuff with him and Youngblood vs. Sgt. Slaughter and Don Kernodle. Here you go! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wNr4b9QtPOc
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Oct 29, 2023 01:12
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Someone mentioned, perhaps it was further up this thread, that AAA should be up for Worst Promotion on the Observer Awards. Why is that? I don't mean this in a "oh yeah? Prove it!" sense. Just more in a "I don't watch much in the way of lucha (read: none), so I genuinely don't know and would appreciate it if someone could fill me in" sense. I'm assuming it's a whole bunch of stupid poo poo, like Peak-TNA stupid, but I am ignorant as to what that stupid poo poo is.
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Nov 1, 2023 10:28
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Bellator should win worst promotion since it died
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Nov 1, 2023 11:04
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edogawa rando posted:Someone mentioned, perhaps it was further up this thread, that AAA should be up for Worst Promotion on the Observer Awards. Their booking is really really bad and they shoot themselves in the foot all the time. Just a really annoying product to watch and not really funny. Even bright spots like QT Marshall are just retreads of the same outsider stuff they do every year. They can't compete with the NWA for overall badness or WWE for evil or MLW for barely existing so it's hard to justify a vote for AAA.
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Nov 1, 2023 15:01
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MassRafTer posted:Their booking is really really bad and they shoot themselves in the foot all the time. Just a really annoying product to watch and not really funny. Even bright spots like QT Marshall are just retreads of the same outsider stuff they do every year. When you say the booking is bad, is it stuff like undermining potential stars and ruining them, and loving up major storylines, things of that nature? All without the comedy value of late-era WCW? That's a shame.
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Nov 2, 2023 10:17
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Follow up: Isn't it usually thought that AAA started to go downhill after they ran out of Peńa's material?
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Nov 2, 2023 14:05
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edogawa rando posted:When you say the booking is bad, is it stuff like undermining potential stars and ruining them, and loving up major storylines, things of that nature? All without the comedy value of late-era WCW? That's a shame. They undermine their own stars and their storylines don't have a lot of consistency. There's comedy value there but the company has been doing the same kind of things for so long that it's just kind of annoying.
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Nov 2, 2023 14:59
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What's Daga up to now? I liked him a lot on LU. Did he just burn every bridge by getting with Tessa or something?
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Nov 7, 2023 01:13
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Nehru the Damaja posted:What's Daga up to now? I liked him a lot on LU. Did he just burn every bridge by getting with Tessa or something? He's in NOAH, won the Jr title last weekend. I have no idea if it was good but he was against HAYATA so probably not
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Nov 7, 2023 01:23
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Nehru the Damaja posted:What's Daga up to now? I liked him a lot on LU. Did he just burn every bridge by getting with Tessa or something? He's in NOAH, in the current edition of Yoshinari Ogawa's Stinger group with Ogawa, Chris Ridgeway and Fujinami's failson LEONA. He was Jr Tag champ until his partner got hurt, & he challenged HAYATA for the Junior Title over the weekend, he may have won, I haven't checked.
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Nov 7, 2023 01:23
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has there been a storyline done in wrestling based on a heel fixing matches? Preferably after 1999.
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Nov 8, 2023 17:57
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Suplex Liberace posted:has there been a storyline done in wrestling based on a heel fixing matches? Preferably after 1999. The Beautiful People slept with Slick Johnson to get him to fix a title match.
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Nov 8, 2023 18:00
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Suplex Liberace posted:has there been a storyline done in wrestling based on a heel fixing matches? Preferably after 1999.
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Nov 8, 2023 18:05
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Halloween Jack posted:Are you specifically trying to exclude the HOOOOOOO train?!? that doesn't feel like match fixing to me. If vince was offering the hoes up then yes.
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Nov 8, 2023 18:13
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Shane McMahon was special guest referee a lot in the 99-00 era.
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Nov 8, 2023 18:16
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Suplex Liberace posted:that doesn't feel like match fixing to me. If vince was offering the hoes up then yes.
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Nov 8, 2023 18:36
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Suplex Liberace posted:has there been a storyline done in wrestling based on a heel fixing matches? Preferably after 1999. In Chikara, there was this whole storyline where Quackenbush introduced a complicated submission move the Chikara Special that everyone kept using to tap out Chris Hero. Only the faces in the locker room knew how to do it and how to escape it. Shane Storm was in the middle of a losing streak and he had a match against Hydra, who was a popular heel on the verge of a face turn. Hydra's leader UltraMantis Black stepped in and knocked out Hydra so that Shane could get the pin. Later it was revealed that Shane was so desperate to end his losing streak that he told the heels how to escape it in exchange for a win.
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Nov 8, 2023 18:51
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Nehru the Damaja posted:What's Daga up to now? I liked him a lot on LU. Did he just burn every bridge by getting with Tessa or something? Didn't he get stuck with wrestling Tyrus in Mexico recently or was that someone else?
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Nov 8, 2023 19:06
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Gavok posted:In Chikara, there was this whole storyline where Quackenbush introduced a complicated submission move the Chikara Special that everyone kept using to tap out Chris Hero. Only the faces in the locker room knew how to do it and how to escape it.
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Nov 8, 2023 19:17
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Halloween Jack posted:If someone pays you to throw a match, it's match-fixing. Publicly fixing the match on live television is a bad idea, legally, but most sports leagues will also overturn victories if it's revealed that you won because your buddy hit your opponent with a shinai that was under the ring for some reason. i get that its in the spirit of match fixing but i was looking for something more like the chikara thing. More backroom than just in the ring.
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Nov 8, 2023 20:49
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Apologies for kramering in here with an unrelated question to the current topic but I remember buying a VHS tape of WWE (I think it might've been before the rebrand) Best of Hardcore Title matches hosted by Tazz. One of the matches featured was a women's hardcore match that I'm pretty sure was between Tori and Ivory. The reason I'm bringing this up is because I vividly remember a spot where they wrestle to a backstage area and Ivory (I think? maybe it was the other way around) took a hot iron to Tori's back and burned the poo poo out of her with it and I even remember seeing the mark it left behind and the blood curdling scream Tori belted out. Thinking back on it, I can't believe that spot even happened and am super curious to know what the deal was behind the scenes about it, like, was it agreed to beforehand? Was it improv and if so how did Tori handle/react to it after the match? Has to be a gnarly triangle shaped scar on her back forever now you'd think. I don't know, maybe I just marked out super hard and it was a really well done work or maybe I hallucinated it. Does anyone else remember this match?
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Nov 8, 2023 20:58
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So here's the match in question, timestamped to when the iron appears: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PxoMAyC4NLE&t=211s To me it looks staged, the searing sound seems added and the attack didn't so much leave a scar as it did bloody up her upper back. If I had to guess they gimmicked the iron somehow to leave a bunch of fake blood behind without actually hurting Tori.
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Nov 8, 2023 21:07
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Barry Bluejeans posted:So here's the match in question, timestamped to when the iron appears: Ok, yeah that makes sense. I just remember being mindblown by the spot because holy poo poo a hot iron?! I'm still impressed by it all these years later even though it (rightfully) turned out to be a work.
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Nov 8, 2023 21:28
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For sure, it's a great spot and pulled off really well. I'd never seen that match before and it's pretty fascinating (trashy as it is), so thanks!
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Nov 8, 2023 21:41
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