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I do think it's maybe better for workers than them acting as traditional "managers" since I've also seen way less petty fiefdom bullshit from scrum masters than "managers". It kindof workerifies them to an extent, which is good for the peons under them.
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Nov 21, 2023 09:14
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The Perfect Element posted:I honestly think it must be a hard job, because you have to be able to just churn out bullshit for 7 hours a day, with a straight face, to loads of other people who know all you're doing is churning out bullshit. Sounds like a job for AI.
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Nov 21, 2023 09:28
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Mega Comrade posted:Oh good that guy won. We gonna get a Falklands 2.0 from him? An actual war might be the one thing to save Rishi, so you know he'd be game. Falklands 2 : Life on Mars reboot 
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Nov 21, 2023 09:37
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smellmycheese posted:Falklands 2 : Life on Mars reboot Pretty sure we didn't negotiate last time it came up 
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Nov 21, 2023 09:42
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Milei? How many functional boats does he have?
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Nov 21, 2023 09:44
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Is this what will rescue the tories? A rerun of the Falklands / Malvinas debacle? Wonder how much they shovelled to Milei's campaign fund to get him to come out with that!
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Nov 21, 2023 09:45
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Surely a libertarian operating under the NAP would simply purchase the Falklands at the market price. How much do Falklands go for these days
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Nov 21, 2023 09:47
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Jaeluni Asjil posted:Is this what will rescue the tories? A rerun of the Falklands / Malvinas debacle? Wonder how much they shovelled to Milei's campaign fund to get him to come out with that! Falklands has a actual military base nowadays complete with Eurofighters and a sub on station there. Argentina has a lot of hot air but not enough to get their jets flying (the same ones they used during the Falklands War, bad idea).  He's just talking shite for the home audience.
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Nov 21, 2023 09:53
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As a libertarian he will probably just turn up in Port Stanley and start ranting at all the soldiers about being a free man on the land and a sovereign citizen
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Nov 21, 2023 09:58
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As a libertarian he will probably just turn up in Port Stanley and get arrested for attempting to gently caress a penguin.
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Nov 21, 2023 10:11
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NotJustANumber99 posted:where is all this loving people over everyone is talking about? It's actually both. Here's a story for you. I used to work for a company that made help desk software, the explicit aim of this was the reduce headcount in many cases. So the help desk would have more automated processes and fewer people doing it. We spent a long time writing software that would do the job really well and it was easy for the service desk staff to operate. Our product was pretty good for the users but we kept losing deal to our competitors who had flasher looking products and better stories. So eventually we had to pivot make the product worse for users but better for demos and get some good testimonials. Like we had a European capitals council was a customer and if you tweeted at them that street lights are broken it would automatically create a ticket and then it would just be an approval from a manager and dispatch a workman. No service desk staff involved at all. You're not selling to the people using it so they don't really care how usable it is, nor are they and end user so they don't really care what they think of it as long as it keeps customer complaints to a sustainable level. At that time the estimate was it cost £35 for a service desk operator to pick up a phone. So anything you could do to reduce the number of calls, and thus the number of staff, the better. Every single time you interact with an AI chatbot at a service desk you must know that they have laid people off in that service dept. So yeah AI are pretty bad, but people are losing jobs to them right now and have been for years.
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Nov 21, 2023 10:25
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Aramoro posted:At that time the estimate was it cost £35 for a service desk operator to pick up a phone. I wonder how much that mess cost them compared to just giving me the refund.
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Nov 21, 2023 10:28
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I mean one of the chief problems is that unless people have a very simple request you usually have information spread across multiple systems and, potentially, incorrectly filed information that needs to be corrected. That and, in some cases, having a human person on the phone helps.
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Nov 21, 2023 10:32
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"Bullseye contestant" is an incredibly powerful and stunningly good description of Milei's appearance Also that's some purestrain raving fash nonsense right there I would advise that he come and have a go if he thinks he's hard enough, but I can't decide if it'd be funnier to see just how badly the Tories can lose the next election, or see Keith's ambitions get shat on by Sunak getting a massive rally round the flag
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Nov 21, 2023 10:35
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NotJustANumber99 posted:where is all this loving people over everyone is talking about? I always bring it up but when an eating disorder helpline tried to unionise they replaced their staff with an AI chat bot and it very quickly devolved into telling people with eating disorders to do things that are eating disorder behaviours. They'll replace you with an AI at the first opportunity and if it only barely functions they'll consider that good enough.
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Nov 21, 2023 10:37
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Microplastics posted:Surely a libertarian operating under the NAP would simply purchase the Falklands at the market price. How much do Falklands go for these days Libertarian heard NAP and thought you said MAP
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Nov 21, 2023 10:40
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Help desk automation has always been about resolving tickets rather than actually solving them. I had part of an order go missing from Ninja, and getting through to them required 3 attempts to open a ticket because the first two tripped some automatic resolve flag. One of which was word for word 'we cannot solve faulty products through the ticket system, please visit the forums or submit a ticket' Yeah, great. The Argentinian president looks like a villain from Airwolf. I wonder what awful fashy things he'll try to do.
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Nov 21, 2023 10:48
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Does anyone have a link or can copy/paste to Twisto’s (RIP) bit about Austerity and likening it to a credit card?
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Nov 21, 2023 10:48
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Guavanaut posted:This just reminded me of the time I had to make six calls to First to get a refund for a £5.50 double charge for a bus ticket, and only actually got it when I threatened to reverse the charge from my bank. I had a bag damaged at the turnstiles of a London underground station - the gates closed on me and ripped my bag apart - on Christmas Eve trying to get the last train to the folks (in the olden days when I was young and went home for xmas) so I had to manhandle clothes, prezzies etc across London to Paddington and then home in a ripped bag. LU filled out a form gave me the name of their insurer who should have just paid up. They really really should. All I wanted was £35 to replace the bag. But they didn't despite numerous letters. Their argument was basically "noone else had a problem therefore there wasn't a problem" (ok it's Xmas Eve 4pm - how many people are actually using the gates then - very few - the underground was practically deserted that day). Two years later, and things changed with Secretary of State properties which instead of being self-insuring had to take out private insurance. Our basic central London estate was worth (1980s here) £500m + all the add-ons for public liability, intellectual property, 'business interruption' etc - we were talking premiums of £'000,000s pa. Guess whose job it was to procure the insurance hehehe and which insurance company was begging for a chance to tender. I did declare 'conflict of interest' but was still the person who had to send out all the paperwork - schedules of buildings, big machinery etc. Naturally, everyone wanted to know what my conflict of interest was. I didn't say anything except 'they don't pay up when there is a clear cut case' so the others involved in the process were very wary of them. They came and did tender presentations and all sorts which must have taken them hours upon hours of work. They didn't get the business. They probably would have been in with a very good chance otherwise (they won the business in several other areas). All because of £35. Never trust insurance companies named after Swiss cities, that's all I'm saying.
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Nov 21, 2023 10:48
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Jaeluni Asjil posted:Never trust insurance companies named after Swiss cities, that's all I'm saying.  
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Nov 21, 2023 10:51
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Jaeluni Asjil posted:
Never trust insurance companies. Your daily dose of "gently caress the Guardian": https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...&CMP=GTUK_email Jeremy Hunt has billions to allocate in his Autumn statement. Should he use this windfall to prop up social services? Fund the NHS? Reverse cuts to local authorities? Nah, let's ask where he should cut taxes.
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Nov 21, 2023 10:57
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you WAR milei? you take her island like the football? oh! oh! jail for mother! jail for mother for One Thousand Years!!!!
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Nov 21, 2023 11:05
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Just Another Lurker posted:Falklands has a actual military base nowadays complete with Eurofighters and a sub on station there.
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Nov 21, 2023 11:05
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quote:Laura Trott, chief secretary to the Treasury, told Sky News: “Of course there should be support for people to help them into work but ultimately there is a duty on citizens if they are able to go out to work they should. Those who can work and contribute should contribute.” Treasury secretaries, of course, well known for their fundamental contributions to society. https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/nov/21/disabled-people-work-from-home-laura-trott-benefits
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Nov 21, 2023 11:10
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Jaeluni Asjil posted:Never trust insurance companies named after Swiss cities, that's all I'm saying. I think they are named after the cantons. And you'll have to be more specific, I think there were at least 3, probably more, with that naming scheme.
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Nov 21, 2023 11:15
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Josef bugman posted:I mean one of the chief problems is that unless people have a very simple request you usually have information spread across multiple systems and, potentially, incorrectly filed information that needs to be corrected. That matters if you're trying to actually help the person. I was an SSE customer who got moved to OVO and during the summer I built up a £1000 credit balance on my electricity. That money has just vanished in the transfer, they tell me it will come back, first time they said 4 weeks to fix, now they're saying 6 months. At one point they double charged me, paying the DD to both SSE and OVO so obviously I called them up and their solution was for me to call my bank and reverse the DD which I did because I wanted my money back. In both these situations the onus is put back on me to do something. I could make an ombudsman complaint, and I probably will, I could switch suppliers etc. But that's all things I have to do. AI helps them push this further and further away from them actually doing anything.
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Nov 21, 2023 11:20
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domhal posted:Treasury secretaries, of course, well known for their fundamental contributions to society. What can you even say except to reiterate that the cruelty is the point. Tories can only relate to the world through the lens of cruelty and the only differences between them are that some relish it and others view it as a pragmatic and effective way to steer people and groups. Thankfully these bastards look set to be annihilated at the next election and the Labour government will surely reverse all this and start to rebuild the support fo... oh. 
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Nov 21, 2023 11:33
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OVO who dis
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Nov 21, 2023 11:34
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none of this sounds like ai
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Nov 21, 2023 11:34
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Aramoro posted:That matters if you're trying to actually help the person. I hate SSE. We have their business electricity - which didn't switch to Ovo but I suspect they are doing surreptitiously at the moment) for the communal areas of the flats (was stuck with it when I took over finances - hoping to switch to Octopus when our contract runs out next summer but there are difficulties getting Octopus to understand that we only pay 5% VAT given the nature of the premises which made switching at the last end of contract too much of a pain in the butt for me to sort it last time). Their website is atrocious, their bills are incomprehensible to anyone without a PhD, they ignore any meter readings for doing their estimates until after they issue a what is supposed to be quarterly bill and was 4 months last time but using 2 month old data... saying we were £400 in debt instead of £1500 in credit. FFS. One of our residents wants us to switch to British Gas. Not on your utter nelly. If she wants BG and others out vote me, she can take over full responsibility for dealing with the most useless and incompetent disorganisation ever in the history of the known universe, since the Big Bang (closely followed by SSE), since the Word walked upon the face of the Void or whatever it was, who have throughout my adult life - both personal and professional - being the worst company I have ever had to deal with.
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Nov 21, 2023 11:37
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NotJustANumber99 posted:none of this sounds like ai Let me reiterate for the slow folk in the audience. AI is being used right now to reduce the number of folk working in help desks. People are actively losing the jobs and have been for years. The thing is the AI doesn't have to actually work very well as the people paying for are not the users. All they care about is that fewer people pick up the phone.
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Nov 21, 2023 11:38
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Aramoro posted:Let me reiterate for the slow folk in the audience. AI is being used right now to reduce the number of folk working in help desks. People are actively losing the jobs and have been for years. I mean call centre job losses are not exactly the end of the world, its just the work moving elsewhere isnt it. Like you wouldn't have a job writing poo poo software otherwise would you. But it still doesn't sound like AI thats taking the jobs, its just the same old poo poo software we've had, as you say, for decades.
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Nov 21, 2023 11:43
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Pablo Bluth posted:For those unaware , the UK has been able to largely block their attempts at modernising their air-force (combined with ARG's terrible economy).; through a mixture of political affiliations and a lot of jets all using UK components (such as Martin-Baker ejection seats). If it was me I would ship them the fighter jets but make the ejector seats fire when you play the Lincolnshire poacher at them 
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Nov 21, 2023 11:45
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Doesn't IT help desk basically act as a pipeline to the more senior computer toucher roles? How do those get filled now if helpdesk is gutted to replace it with ticket manager gpt or whatever? I'm assuming more recruiting from colleges / unis? Which probably sucks because it's removing career options from people who maybe didn't do higher education but have done a poo poo helpdesk call centre and an IT cert in their spare time.
keep punching joe fucked around with this message at 11:54 on Nov 21, 2023 |
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Nov 21, 2023 11:52
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Catzilla posted:Does anyone have a link or can copy/paste to Twisto’s (RIP) bit about Austerity and likening it to a credit card? Think it was this one. https://pastebin.com/SAh5uTaL
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Nov 21, 2023 11:55
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Aramoro posted:Let me reiterate for the slow folk in the audience. AI is being used right now to reduce the number of folk working in help desks. People are actively losing the jobs and have been for years. Yeah, I've already had the experience of getting stuck going round in circles with an ai helpbot who can't resolve my problem. It's even worse when they're voice activated and it's all: "I'm sorry, I didn't understand that" and "You need to make a response" (I did make a response!).
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Nov 21, 2023 11:59
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NotJustANumber99 posted:none of this sounds like ai It's all AI as sold to us. When they talk about AI this is the real product beyond advertising. A chat bot hearing that eating makes you depressed and suggesting not to eat to stop the depression.
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Nov 21, 2023 12:18
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keep punching joe posted:Doesn't IT help desk basically act as a pipeline to the more senior computer toucher roles? How do those get filled now if helpdesk is gutted to replace it with ticket manager gpt or whatever? I'm assuming more recruiting from colleges / unis? Which probably sucks because it's removing career options from people who maybe didn't do higher education but have done a poo poo helpdesk call centre and an IT cert in their spare time. Yeah this is exactly it. IT helpdesk was your basic "no experience but get in the door" job that then sets you up for the rest. Similarly in a non IT space banks used to have call centres/branch staff as the straight from school jobs you could do and then progress within the company potentially over decades into very senior roles, but those roles are being cut as far as possible too. The ladder isn't so much pulled up as it was set fire and then the ashes scattered.
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Nov 21, 2023 12:18
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It does still seem to happen still in some places. Currently financial place I'm at still takes people from the floor and trains them to be mortgage advisors, so that is nice and something I am aiming for soon!
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Nov 21, 2023 12:24
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NotJustANumber99 posted:I mean call centre job losses are not exactly the end of the world, its just the work moving elsewhere isnt it. Like you wouldn't have a job writing poo poo software otherwise would you. But it still doesn't sound like AI thats taking the jobs, its just the same old poo poo software we've had, as you say, for decades. Folk working in call centres aren't retraining as software engineers. Jobs are not fungible in that sense, you can't parlay call centre jobs to software engineering jobs and call it a wash. What youre doing there is shifting the goal posts. AI is taking away jobs from people, you can't just say well those jobs don't matter. They matter to the people losing them. AI is another tool being used by companies to reduce headcount.
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Nov 21, 2023 12:25
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