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Deep Glove Bruno posted:bring um back I emailed putin and he said there would be training on teams but the invite never came through
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Nov 28, 2023 17:17
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Wafflecopper posted:smoking may kill a lot of people, but it also helps the government balance their budget, so, it;s impossible to say if its bad or not, It actually costs a lot more to treat people from their smoking related diseases than the tobacco tax brings the in lol. But tobacco companies (big donors!) Make lots of money.
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Nov 28, 2023 17:41
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redleader posted:absolute dogshit govt Should have voted for the absolute ruler dog
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Nov 28, 2023 18:00
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Saros posted:It actually costs a lot more to treat people from their smoking related diseases than the tobacco tax brings the in lol. But tobacco companies (big donors!) Make lots of money. yeah i meant balance it short term
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Nov 28, 2023 18:52
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Serious question though, is there some reason to expect prohibition to work for cigarettes when it didn’t for alcohol and doesn’t for other recreational drugs?
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Nov 28, 2023 18:54
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I would guess tobacco is less recreational given it's not particularly mind altering like the others. That and a marked reduction is still better than continuing status quo
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Nov 28, 2023 18:59
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Alcohol is super easy to make yourself, so good luck ever stopping that. other drugs have fun effects. Most smokers I know don't seem to enjoy smoking.
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Nov 28, 2023 19:21
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hehequote:Critics are calling deputy National Party leader 'Nicotine Willis', and Health Minister Shane Reti, 'Shane Cigareti'.
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Nov 28, 2023 19:44
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Wafflecopper posted:Serious question though, is there some reason to expect prohibition to work for cigarettes when it didn’t for alcohol and doesn’t for other recreational drugs? vapes would still be available
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Nov 28, 2023 19:47
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It's easy to make alcohol in the woods or under your house Less so with a tobacco plantation
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Nov 28, 2023 19:49
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Wafflecopper posted:Serious question though, is there some reason to expect prohibition to work for cigarettes when it didn’t for alcohol and doesn’t for other recreational drugs? It's not prohibition, nicotine would still be available in many forms and you can grow your own tobacco lol Love that the "hurr durr it's prohibition don't you loonie lefties hate prohibition" is how dumb national swing voters are justifying this You can get enough tobacco to last you a year off like 4 plants and they grow like weeds, if anything is easier than making beer
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Nov 28, 2023 19:51
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El Pollo Blanco posted:It's not prohibition, nicotine would still be available in many forms and you can grow your own tobacco lol I'm honestly surprised at this, learned something today
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Nov 28, 2023 19:53
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Yeah most* of the lines that National/ACT/NZF have been using to defend their repeal of the Smokefree amendments are lifted verbatim from the astroturf campaign run by tobacco companies earlier this year, mostly based around the false idea that this is prohibition and prohibition creates a black market and let's the gengs profit and poo poo. The government was actually going for the evidence based approach which is not to implement a blanket ban on a drug (nicotine), but instead to find the sweet spot between enough regulation that it reduces use, with enough availability (vapes, grow your own, nicotine patches/pills, limited sales of tobacco, etc) that it doesn't create a black market. Which is exactly what the cannabis referendum would've given us too, instead of the actual prohibition that we have currently. *I don't say all the lines because the astroturf tobacco campaign said that the tax revenue could fund 35,000 more cops, whereas national are saying it can fund landlords and rich people instead
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Nov 28, 2023 20:12
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A friend of my wife applied for a chief comms role at Philip Morris and apparently they were extremely clear that getting the changes repealed was existential for them. I'd be interested in knowing how much they spent.
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Nov 28, 2023 20:20
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Slavvy posted:I'm honestly surprised at this, learned something today It's probably fairly climate dependent but I grew a tobacco plant that I never pruned, it got to about 6 feet tall and the seed pods dropping resulted in hundreds of seedlings sprouting everywhere so I knocked it down before I accidentally created an ecological incident
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Nov 28, 2023 20:28
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exmarx posted:seymour getting to gut pharmac are there any details or information on this at all?
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Nov 28, 2023 21:03
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echinopsis posted:are there any details or information on this at all? ACT get money from pharmaceutical companies, acts number 4 is a big pharma lobbyist, act hate pharmac, Seymour is now the minister responsible for pharmac (I think it's normally the health minister who's responsible for pharmac?)
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Nov 28, 2023 22:50
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El Pollo Blanco posted:ACT get money from pharmaceutical companies, acts number 4 is a big pharma lobbyist, act hate pharmac, Seymour is now the minister responsible for pharmac (I think it's normally the health minister who's responsible for pharmac?) Health minister would need to be interested in health though
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Nov 28, 2023 23:24
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isn’t the new health minister a doctor?
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Nov 29, 2023 00:23
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wonder what gutting pharmac will mean? changing cost of scripts to patients? reducing number of medications funded maybe. surely it’ll be a wildly unpopular move that most people won’t realise what they’ve lost until it’s gone
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Nov 29, 2023 00:24
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echinopsis posted:wonder what gutting pharmac will mean? The only thing in their coalition agreement is changes to decision making around which medicines to fund such that these have to be based on positive returns on investment. I think the main risk is just that he manufactures a case for reform (read: scrapping a single payer model) by setting pharmac up for failure and bad press - not providing enough funding, so that it has to make increasingly unpopular calls around which drugs to fund, mostly.
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Nov 29, 2023 01:30
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echinopsis posted:isn’t the new health minister a doctor? Shane Cigareti?
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Nov 29, 2023 01:36
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Lobsterpillar posted:Shane Cigareti? ok this one's actually good. Nicotine Willis is way too forced
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Nov 29, 2023 01:42
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bike tory posted:The only thing in their coalition agreement is changes to decision making around which medicines to fund such that these have to be based on positive returns on investment. I think the main risk is just that he manufactures a case for reform (read: scrapping a single payer model) by setting pharmac up for failure and bad press - not providing enough funding, so that it has to make increasingly unpopular calls around which drugs to fund, mostly. righto I suspect and suppose could be well wrong, but I really hope Pharmac really is a case of having it so good for so long that people won’t tolerate it going backwards and if any govt destroys it, surely it’d be a number one promise for the opposition to ride on all the way home there’s a few things that all people love and one of them is cheap drugs
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Nov 29, 2023 02:07
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echinopsis posted:righto It's been said before, but people fundamentally don't understand how most of our healthcare system works. Underfunded and short-staffed systems fail, that failure is used to justify change. In an ideal world the change is more resources, internationally competitive pay and a focus on prevention. Poverty and lack of access to care is way more expensive in the long term. That is not what this government want. Expect public systems to fail and private solutions to be offered as alternatives. My suspicion is Seymour will cynically suggest Pharmac should be open about their decision making process, removing the majority of their bargaining power. If some version of National/ACT get multiple terms, Labour won't be able to coast in on the idea of fixing Pharmac (or whatever else they intentionally break). If the current government succeeds, the public trust in these organisations will have been destroyed.
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Nov 29, 2023 02:49
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don't worry, they won't kill pharmac off... ... quickly ... or obviously the playbook is to just make it shittier and shittier until they can 'justify' breaking its monopoly then, later, privatising it. bog standard stuff
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Nov 29, 2023 02:51
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once they break pharmac's monopoly it's dead. i don't think you could even sell it because its only commercial value is its ability to act as buyer for the entire new zealand market.
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Nov 29, 2023 03:05
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What the gently caress?quote:Allow the sale of cold medication containing pseudoephedrine.
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Nov 29, 2023 05:38
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not every proposal of theirs is bad and that is one of the better ones and I say this as someone who will literally be on the frontlines gatekeeping that poo poo
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Nov 29, 2023 05:41
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Comrade Blyatlov posted:What the gently caress? Slavvy posted:Sudo is back on the menu boys
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Nov 29, 2023 05:41
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Hashtag sudo life
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Nov 29, 2023 05:43
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echinopsis posted:not every proposal of theirs is bad and that is one of the better ones I'm pretty sure that's the only good policy they have. Can't really think of another one, and I've tried.
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Nov 29, 2023 06:20
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bike tory posted:I'm pretty sure that's the only good policy they have. Can't really think of another one, and I've tried. i'm sure "index tax brackets to inflation" is bad, but i don't know why. on the surface it doesn't seem immediately dumb
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Nov 29, 2023 06:29
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redleader posted:i'm sure "index tax brackets to inflation" is bad, but i don't know why. on the surface it doesn't seem immediately dumb it’s extremely good, if you don’t then as inflation leads to meaningless pay rises people still go up into higher tax brackets despite having no more purchasing power than before tbh I am surprised by the proposal because the people who mostly benefits is lower wage earners
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Nov 29, 2023 06:32
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4. Begin efforts to double renewable energy production, including a NPS on Renewable Electricity Generation. 8. Start reducing public sector expenditure, including consultant and contractor expenditure. 11. Cancel fuel tax hikes. 17. Introduce legislation to restore 90-day trial periods for all businesses. 26. Introduce legislation to ban gang patches, stop gang members gathering in public, and stop known gang offenders from communicating with one another. 27. Give Police greater powers to search gang members for firearms and make gang membership an aggravating factor at sentencing. 34. Improve security for the health workforce in hospital emergency departments. 37. Require primary and intermediate schools to teach an hour of reading, writing and maths per day starting in 2024. 38. Ban the use of cellphones in schools. on the surface these seem good to me at least, and yeah there are caveats and perhaps some of these are a screen for more sinister motives idk, but find it hard bike tory that you don’t think at least some of these are good.. increased security in emergency departments?? you said you can’t find any other good ones so perhaps you’re against that?
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Nov 29, 2023 06:39
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echinopsis posted:it’s extremely good, if you don’t then as inflation leads to meaningless pay rises people still go up into higher tax brackets despite having no more purchasing power than before It also didn't make it through the negotiations - there's a one off adjustment in 2024 (the tax cuts) but no inflation indexation.
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Nov 29, 2023 06:41
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as in NANZ is not gonna go forward with it
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Nov 29, 2023 06:51
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i’m quite pragmatic and certainly don’t view politics like it’s a sports team the left are terrible at executing some of their proposals without haemorrhaging money and the right sometimes has proposals that I personally think are good moves this govt might be poo poo for a lot of reasons but imma look on the bright side of whatever, this govt might be good for some of us personally, and it’s hard to feel bad about that
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Nov 29, 2023 06:53
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echinopsis posted:as in NANZ is not gonna go forward with it Yup. https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/503153/coalition-details-at-a-glance-what-you-need-to-know "The Parties confirm no ongoing commitment to income tax changes, including threshold adjustments, beyond those to be delivered in 2024, and recognise that details of the Fiscal Plan may be subject to amendment in response to significant new information or events"
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Nov 29, 2023 06:54
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Comrade Blyatlov posted:What the gently caress? The banning of it was a cynical tough on drugs move by national. Which at the time was shown it would not slow down the trade in methamphetamine. It was so they could have a headline saying they were taking action on the P usage. It didn’t do anything but they got to pretend.
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Nov 29, 2023 06:54
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