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xgalaxy
Jan 27, 2004
i write code

MetaJew posted:

On the other hand, the whole "infinite risk" part is spooky.

The whole infinite risk thing is way overblown. Infinite risk assumes absolutely zero management of the position.

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Shear Modulus
Jun 9, 2010



Stock Picking and Trading: The whole infinite risk thing is way overblown.

pseudanonymous
Aug 30, 2008

When you make the second entry and the debits and credits balance, and you blow them to hell.
Don’t sell the right for people to call you, naked.

Subvisual Haze
Nov 22, 2003

The building was on fire and it wasn't my fault.
Every trade has 2 sides. I'm guessing it's a common experience to accumulate infinite gains from buying options

The Door Frame
Dec 5, 2011

I don't know man everytime I go to the gym here there are like two huge dudes with raging high and tights snorting Nitro-tech off of each other's rock hard abs.

pseudanonymous posted:

Don’t sell the right for people to call you, naked.

Don't tell me how to run my Onlyfans

SKULL.GIF
Jan 20, 2017


VIX being utterly annihilated over the past five weeks have made the permabull/option-seller crowd extremely, extremely loving confident.

notwithoutmyanus
Mar 17, 2009

SKULL.GIF posted:

VIX being utterly annihilated over the past five weeks have made the permabull/option-seller crowd extremely, extremely loving confident.

Until we see vix over 14+ and holding, gamma hedging is going on down to 12 for further bullishness. So they have reason considering we just had the most bullish month on the SPY/SPX in a century.

Subvisual Haze
Nov 22, 2003

The building was on fire and it wasn't my fault.

SKULL.GIF posted:

VIX being utterly annihilated over the past five weeks have made the permabull/option-seller crowd extremely, extremely loving confident.
VIX being low is bad if you're selling options, less premium. The high short term interest rates do still help option sellers though as your cash+premium pile keeps accumulating ~5% interest while also being collateral for your sold options.

xgalaxy
Jan 27, 2004
i write code

SKULL.GIF posted:

VIX being utterly annihilated over the past five weeks have made the permabull/option-seller crowd extremely, extremely loving confident.

Option sellers love it when the VIX is high. Not low.
Also you can be an option seller and be a bull or a bear or neutral. Doesn't require a direction.

SKULL.GIF
Jan 20, 2017


Subvisual Haze posted:

VIX being low is bad if you're selling options, less premium.

xgalaxy posted:

Option sellers love it when the VIX is high. Not low.

Yes, the VIX has gone from 20+ in October to 13 now. There's no fear in the market.

Agronox
Feb 4, 2005

I'm really curious how this US Steel sale process is going. The CNBC rumor was that bids were due last Friday and the company would be evaluating them this week.

In the meantime the stock has been creeping up...

ist
Mar 9, 2007
lurkin since '01
.

ist fucked around with this message at 00:33 on Dec 5, 2023

pmchem
Jan 22, 2010


shorting tesla has lost people tons of money but man there is a huge divergence between their stock and supply/demand for lithium. if BYD ADR starts to topple that would be the canary for tsla. but if they both hold and lithium bottoms, maybe $alb is finally a buy again?

https://twitter.com/yuantalks/status/1732209649221607730?s=46

something’s gotta give. i basically just find the lithium futures free fall fascinating to watch

Subvisual Haze
Nov 22, 2003

The building was on fire and it wasn't my fault.
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/first-quadruple-leveraged-p-500-012947368.html

quote:

A small ETN issuer is seeking to launch the first quadruple leveraged S&P 500 ETN—with the ticker XXXX—as exchange-traded fund issuers push the envelope on high-risk, high-reward investment products.
Thinking of maximizing as many lines of credit as possible to fill my account and buy 0DTE call options (on margin) for the 4x leveraged SPY etf.

Baddog
May 12, 2001

Subvisual Haze posted:

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/first-quadruple-leveraged-p-500-012947368.html

Thinking of maximizing as many lines of credit as possible to fill my account and buy 0DTE call options (on margin) for the 4x leveraged SPY etf.

quadruple X etf, nice!

Be sure to get some credit from casinos too, don't just do credit card cash advances. Cash out refinance, etc.

Boris Galerkin
Dec 17, 2011

I don't understand why I can't harass people online. Seriously, somebody please explain why I shouldn't be allowed to stalk others on social media!
What does 3x/4x leverage mean

Subvisual Haze
Nov 22, 2003

The building was on fire and it wasn't my fault.

Boris Galerkin posted:

What does 3x/4x leverage mean
If the underlying goes up 1% for the day, the 3x leveraged tracker should go up 3% for the day (before fees and expenses) and vice versa for decreases. The fees and expenses tend to be higher to achieve this and generally make these sort of funds a bad idea to hold long-term. Leverage is like an amplifier, turns smaller moves into bigger moves.

The Door Frame
Dec 5, 2011

I don't know man everytime I go to the gym here there are like two huge dudes with raging high and tights snorting Nitro-tech off of each other's rock hard abs.
.

ReidRansom
Oct 25, 2004


After buying down significantly from an initial cost basis of like $23.xx, my years long losing AAL position has finally turned profitable lol.

Subvisual Haze
Nov 22, 2003

The building was on fire and it wasn't my fault.
Oil and energy slumping low. I might be tempted to buy, but I'm already too concentrated there. Citi has had a great bump in the last month, glad I scooped up some of that.

Beyond meat ($BYND) is catching my eye. It's a pretty hopeless nonprofitable company and I made some money shorting it earlier this year. In the last month though it seems to have surged up, probably a short squeeze seeing as the short interest on it is around 45%. IV is good on it so I might consider selling calls or credit spreads. Obviously the risk is the squeeze keeps going longer or higher than anticipated.

drk
Jan 16, 2005

ReidRansom posted:

After buying down significantly from an initial cost basis of like $23.xx, my years long losing AAL position has finally turned profitable lol.

Buying airlines has to be one of the all time greatest money losers. I wonder if that has changed now that they are basically banks

ReidRansom
Oct 25, 2004


drk posted:

Buying airlines has to be one of the all time greatest money losers. I wonder if that has changed now that they are basically banks

Oh, for real yeah. AAL is just a credit card provider that runs an airline as a side hustle these days. I swear we get the CC pitch like twice a flight now at least.

But also it was at an almost post-pandemic low when I increased my stake, and so barring something worse (don't let these words curse me, please), has to be mostly upside, I'd think. They're not going anywhere, after all.

Subvisual Haze posted:

Beyond meat ($BYND) is catching my eye. It's a pretty hopeless nonprofitable company and I made some money shorting it earlier this year. In the last month though it seems to have surged up, probably a short squeeze seeing as the short interest on it is around 45%. IV is good on it so I might consider selling calls or credit spreads. Obviously the risk is the squeeze keeps going longer or higher than anticipated.

I like Beyond, personally, but I'm on board with it probably not being something to put any money into short-term, or long at this price. Like, I'm married to a vegetarian, so we do use a lot of Beyond (or Impossible, they're basically interchangeable) products when I'm cooking something for both of us, and it's something that the difference wouldn't be noticeable, chili or lasagne or something. But I'm in an uncommon situation. Most people still choose meat. As long as livestock agriculture remains profitable (even if it's through government subsidy), and consumer culture doesn't make a huge shift, most people aren't likely to make a switch. Idunno. I'd touch it for some remora action maaybe, if it looks like it's going to continue this run, but I wouldn't put long money into it right now.

ReidRansom fucked around with this message at 20:49 on Dec 6, 2023

ReidRansom
Oct 25, 2004


Also, I'm holding my NVO through next earnings, at least, but I want to see resolution to their supply issues asap. I've started buying LLY to hedge in case they can't figure their poo poo out.

Subvisual Haze
Nov 22, 2003

The building was on fire and it wasn't my fault.

ReidRansom posted:

Also, I'm holding my NVO through next earnings, at least, but I want to see resolution to their supply issues asap. I've started buying LLY to hedge in case they can't figure their poo poo out.
Weird news I heard from NVO recently was that they are just going to stop producing one of their long-acting insulins (Levemir) entirely next year. There isn't even a generic version of it yet, the product's just going to vanish from the market. It's probably not one of their best sellers, and they do have another long-acting insulin (Tresiba) and will still keep making all the short-acting insulins but it's still a bit surprising. Could possibly have something to do with the political pressure to lower insulin prices in the US making that specific product not worth continuing. Or further supply issues. Maybe they'll use the freed up Levemir pens to package more Ozempic.

GhostofJohnMuir
Aug 14, 2014

anime is not good

Subvisual Haze posted:

The fees and expenses tend to be higher to achieve this and generally make these sort of funds a bad idea to hold long-term.

not only are fees high, there is an inherent volatility drag to highly leveraged products. taking compounding daily leveraged losses means that you can lose money even over periods were the underlying index is net positive. these products are intended for intraday trading and shouldn't even be held overnight

Ubiquitus
Nov 20, 2011

Any idea what’s driving the lithium demand downturn? Seems like it should be going up unless some new battery tech suddenly came through

pmchem
Jan 22, 2010


Ubiquitus posted:

Any idea what’s driving the lithium demand downturn? Seems like it should be going up unless some new battery tech suddenly came through

it’s the kind of thing where we probably don’t have enough information to really answer it. EV sales this year have disappointed and China is undergoing deflation, so a real hit to expected demand. the lithium futures themselves are a new thing in the market as of this year, so maybe their opening was grossly mispriced? there is also sodium battery tech that has been getting a lot of press lately, but as far as i know it’s not in any sort of serious volume production.

lithium futures were limit up this morning so optimists would be wondering if things are finally bottoming. what I’d really love to know is whether chinese producers are dumping lithium at a loss. that’d be bad for a company like $ALB

too murky to casually trade, it’d be a bit of a gamble barring wide economic upturn

pmchem
Jan 22, 2010


https://twitter.com/carlquintanilla/status/1734368429816103170?s=20

this train doesn't stop until congress slashes the budget

Gologle
Apr 15, 2013

The Gologle Posting Experience.

<3
Uh, isn't that a terrible allusion to make? Because the Great Depression brought an end to the Roaring 20's the first time, leading to widespread economic misery that only ended when a world war broke out and the war economy could get up and running? Why would anyone compare their prosperity to a time period so cursed?

Red
Apr 15, 2003

Yeah, great at getting us into Wawa.

Gologle posted:

Uh, isn't that a terrible allusion to make? Because the Great Depression brought an end to the Roaring 20's the first time, leading to widespread economic misery that only ended when a world war broke out and the war economy could get up and running? Why would anyone compare their prosperity to a time period so cursed?

A lot of people got richer during the depression, since, you know, everything was loving dirt cheap.

Link: https://www.history.com/news/great-depression-people-who-made-money

I would wager the wealthy who think a big recession is possible think they'll swoop in on incredibly cheap assets.

Shear Modulus
Jun 9, 2010



And they'll be right

Untagged
Mar 29, 2004

Hey, does your planet have wiper fluid yet or you gonna freak out and start worshiping us?
cnbc's new design is just garbáge

Zephyris
May 23, 2006

If you only knew the power of...
Just checking in here, myself and a few other people on the Discord touched the most stable of all commodities, NG, and we didn't blow up this year. With it dying again I've sold some KOLD, the 2x short NG ETF - here's how it's going:




The margin requirements are hilariously high even though I regularly short volatility naked, and daily moves can be expected to be 5-15%. KOLD is currently in NG futures Jan/Mar so as long as we don't crater below $2 much I won't have to bag hold this a few months.

edit: i feel compelled to say you should research just how volatile this is. not for the faint of heart or shaky nerves. i dont even think short volatility will blow you up as fast as this can if you over size

Zephyris fucked around with this message at 18:07 on Dec 13, 2023

Cacafuego
Jul 22, 2007

Number go up!

Wifi Toilet
Oct 1, 2004

Toilet Rascal
What just happened an hour ago? Everything just turned green.

e: oh rate hikes ending apparently

Wifi Toilet fucked around with this message at 20:40 on Dec 13, 2023

Hadlock
Nov 9, 2004

Wifi Toilet posted:

e: oh rate hikes ending apparently

:homebrew:

Back to business as usual

Edit: maybe I can finally offload these long $15 sofi calls I've been holding since '22 for more than $0 that expire in January :sweatdrop:

Hadlock fucked around with this message at 21:02 on Dec 13, 2023

notwithoutmyanus
Mar 17, 2009

Wifi Toilet posted:

What just happened an hour ago? Everything just turned green.

e: oh rate hikes ending apparently

Wording was "we'll do whatever we want, forecast is rate hikes next year between 3.5 and 4.75, and we will raise it if we have to"

Baddog
May 12, 2001

Hadlock posted:

:homebrew:

Back to business as usual

Edit: maybe I can finally offload these long $15 sofi calls I've been holding since '22 for more than $0 that expire in January :sweatdrop:

Too late for my redfins, what a dumbass trade.

Joink
Jan 8, 2004

What if I told you cod is no longer a fish :coolfish:
Yesterday before Fed speaking, I bought calls few strikes otm on Spy, and puts same few strikes otm on Spy. After the rally started, I sold the put contracts for a loss, and will sell the calls at market open today. Anyway is their a name for this strategy, essentially hoping for a direction and not sideways action.

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Agronox
Feb 4, 2005

Joink posted:

Yesterday before Fed speaking, I bought calls few strikes otm on Spy, and puts same few strikes otm on Spy. After the rally started, I sold the put contracts for a loss, and will sell the calls at market open today. Anyway is their a name for this strategy, essentially hoping for a direction and not sideways action.

Long strangle

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