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Schwarzwald posted:I think it was KWaste who pointed out how much Skull Island seems to go out of its way to avoid featuring romance. Entirely possible, exact memory of that movie is clouded by the haze of antihistamines I was on when I streamed it And I mean, not EVERY movie needs a romance plot, those other Godzilla movies I mentioned functioned perfectly fine without them. Frankly too many movies waste time on an obligatory romance subplot that does nothing but fill time and kill the pacing, it's like if every movie had a gunfight or a Bollywood dance number regardless of appropriateness to the plot. It's just interesting that for kind of a long time Godzilla movies have been... well "sexless" isn't the word, it's not like the leads in Minus One are getting mad rutty or anything, the romance is fairly chaste. But it does feel like they've been leaving narrative potential on the table lately that this one picks up.
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Dec 11, 2023 23:48
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It's a question the film asks right at the start. What good is throwing your life away in the face of the inevitable
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Dec 11, 2023 23:49
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I wrote up a whole draft about my theory on Godzilla -1 being an exploration of a "philosophy of death" versus a "philosophy of Life", and how characters motivated by a philosophy of life (taking care of an orphan, pushing someone to safety, coming to others rescue etc) are rewarded narratively with good fortune in the end. Meanwhile, those approaching a situations with a philosophy of death (war, the use of weapons, etc) only create more evil in the world- the way that America supposedly builds atomic bombs out of an interest to defeat a great evil and save American lives, but only end up creating a monster that carries out terrible violence well after the end of the war. Looking at the movie with this lens I figured that ultimately not shooting baby Godzilla with the plane turret was the correct decision, not resorting to weapons or violence to resolve the issue- and that opening fire on Godzilla at all was the ultimate mistake that everyone killed. I feel like my theory is also partially supported by the fact that the plan to destroy Godzilla seems to reject the aesthetics of a military operation, and is explicitly a citizen effort that utilizes science in order to defeat it. Plus ultimately koichi rejects a philosophy that his death can fix things, a decision that not only allows them to win the day but allows him to be in the lives of the people he cares about. Of course my theory is a little muddied to by the bomb and the plane but pobody's nerfect
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Dec 11, 2023 23:55
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Arc Hammer posted:It's a question the film asks right at the start. What good is throwing your life away in the face of the inevitable This is a good and succinct answer
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Dec 11, 2023 23:56
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Common tropes are tropes for a reason, so it makes sense that romance is a tested and proven way to get people invested in characters. I will say that for -1 specifically, it helps to show how koichi is still battling his demons the way that he can't fully open himself up to Noriko and move on past his trauma, or his war. Maybe you could cynically throw in romance into other movies to get people's interest, but I think for minus one it was an intentional and well reasoned decision
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Dec 12, 2023 00:00
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Tea Party Crasher posted:
Yea the ambiguous part of it is good. Like the post-atomic Godzilla is OP. But maybe just maybe the Dino sized regular one would have been at least made to flee if he really went at it with the machine gun. It’s like a 1-5% maybe
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Dec 12, 2023 00:17
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Shikishima's extreme guilt over the casualties on Odo Island can only be explained if he believed the guns would have stopped the monster. That is why he sees himself as such a failure and deserving of being miserable. Now, whether that belief is grounded in reality or not, we'll never know but that was his perception at least. The thing is, at least from my memory of it, Godzilla came out of the sea in the first attack already hostile. Yes, the soldiers made it worse by shooting, but Dino-G seemed malicious from the jump. That being said, even if he had pulled the trigger, he was as good as dead. The monster would have been injured (potentially) but would have attacked the plane. It would have been a kamikaze attack all over again. Considering the character hadn't grown at all narratively, it's no wonder he couldn't go through with it. He did the right thing for the wrong reason. Yet, the "Death vs. Life" reading does give a good framework as to why his fear ended up saving the country. Maybe blindly throwing away God-given fear in the name of culture and honor is a bad thing?
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Dec 12, 2023 01:57
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FooF posted:Shikishima's extreme guilt over the casualties on Odo Island can only be explained if he believed the guns would have stopped the monster. That is why he sees himself as such a failure and deserving of being miserable. Now, whether that belief is grounded in reality or not, we'll never know but that was his perception at least. The thing is, at least from my memory of it, Godzilla came out of the sea in the first attack already hostile. Yes, the soldiers made it worse by shooting, but Dino-G seemed malicious from the jump. I saw some idiot going a bit sideways over the Odoians naming Godzilla, took a minute for him to unpack that Odo is part of Japan (in the movie.) Stegosnaurlax fucked around with this message at 02:05 on Dec 12, 2023 |
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Dec 12, 2023 02:03
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Arc Hammer posted:I'd like to see a rubber suit movie that keeps the physicality we've seen in Legendary Goji and Minus One Goji. Throw some punches. My dream is still a Godzilla movie with FX from the Jim Henson Company or its Japanese equivalent. The stuff you can actually do with suit animatronics is pretty impressive and while we saw a little of it in the Millennium films it didn’t get far enough before the series stopped.
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Dec 12, 2023 04:22
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I would buy a ticket right now if they made a new modern Godzilla suit film I love animatronics and puppets
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Dec 12, 2023 04:23
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CelticPredator posted:I would buy a ticket right now if they made a new modern Godzilla suit film Same. During the pandemic when I watched the Star wars films for the first time in my life The thing that really got me roaring and hyped was all the puppets
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Dec 12, 2023 04:38
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Star Wars aliens are so cool because of that. That’s something I felt was missing for a lot the newer stuff. Less cool aliens.
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Dec 12, 2023 05:11
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Maxwell Lord posted:My dream is still a Godzilla movie with FX from the Jim Henson Company or its Japanese equivalent. Frank Oz's Little Shop of Horrors is very nearly this. edit: if you watch the version with the fun ending
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Dec 12, 2023 05:29
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CelticPredator posted:I would buy a ticket right now if they made a new modern Godzilla suit film The moves they got Jet Jaguar to do in the new short were so good. I’m with you on this - need a modern day suit movie!! E: dropping this gold here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PMorED2wfqE
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Dec 12, 2023 05:35
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Maxwell Lord posted:My dream is still a Godzilla movie with FX from the Jim Henson Company or its Japanese equivalent. The stuff you can actually do with suit animatronics is pretty impressive and while we saw a little of it in the Millennium films it didn’t get far enough before the series stopped. All talk who like puppets and Godzilla should at least check out Gojiban- it’s not serious but it is all-puppet Godzilla and is fun https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lWENjwsFKNs
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Dec 12, 2023 05:47
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Have those been translated ever? I loving love those designs. I just Christmas’d mine up.
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Dec 12, 2023 06:02
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Vintersorg posted:The moves they got Jet Jaguar to do in the new short were so good. I’m with you on this - need a modern day suit movie!! Funny enough Ryunosuke Kamiki, the guy who plays Shikishima in Minus One, is in Big Man Japan as the creepy rear end child monster thing.
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Dec 12, 2023 06:09
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GateOfD posted:Yea the ambiguous part of it is good. Like the post-atomic Godzilla is OP. Yeah, it's a case where the ambiguity is the point. It probably wouldn't have done any good, but him not knowing amplifies his guilt. His parents told him to survive no matter what, and he did, but he's left wondering if him living meant he was a coward who sent others to their deaths. It's part of why the ending is so satisfying. He finally shot Godzilla with the 20mm, he flew his plane as a bomb, he proved his courage to himself and everyone else beyond the shadow of doubt, but he did it without throwing his life away. Something that hasn't been talked about in relation to the theme that I've noticed, though, is some of the people at the meeting. The ones who ditched. It feels like they're relevant because the film doesn't condemn them. They have their families, they risked their lives already, they're out... and that's fair. It's heroic to put your life on the line, not cowardly to stay back to be there for the people who need you.
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Dec 12, 2023 06:10
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Tea Party Crasher posted:I do like that it's ambiguous enough though that It is believable why he feels responsible. It's a path untraveled similar to his kamikaze mission that leaves him with the nagging question of "If I had done it, would that have been enough?" The ambiguity is why he's still tormenting himself about it years after the event. He doesn't know. That uncertainty is acting like a multiplier to the survivor's guilt he'd have had even if he never had the opportunity to fire the cannons. Just surviving where so many other died, again, is a terrible experience. Add in a(nother) chance to save others, even at the cost of his own life, that he didn't take, is a huge burden of guilt. The poor guy is basically convinced he doesn't deserve to be alive, it's no wonder he doesn't grab a chance at happiness.
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Dec 12, 2023 06:18
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Vintersorg posted:Have those been translated ever? I loving love those designs. I just Christmas’d mine up. Yes, turn the subtitles on that video I linked. Edit: gonna see Minus One in 4DX today 
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Dec 12, 2023 14:15
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Schwarzwald posted:I think it was KWaste who pointed out how much Skull Island seems to go out of its way to avoid featuring romance. In a lot of ways Skull Island feels a lot like an MCU movie but one from the earlier era of MCU movies where there was still something worthwhile in them. It's kind of glib but not TOO glib yet, and is curiously sexless.
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Dec 12, 2023 21:12
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So glad I caught the IMAX showing of -1 yesterday, really looks like it's on its way out by Thursday in theaters here. What an awesome film.
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Dec 12, 2023 21:48
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Has anyone ever kissed anyone else in a Godzilla movie? It just kind of isn't done. Maybe Nick Adams with his Kumi Mizuno hyperclone girlfriend in Monster Zero.
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Dec 12, 2023 22:59
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Desumaytah posted:Has anyone ever kissed anyone else in a Godzilla movie? It just kind of isn't done. Soldierboy and his wife get real close to loving in '14 before he has to go to Japan to bail out Bryan Cranston
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Dec 12, 2023 23:02
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RichterIX posted:In a lot of ways Skull Island feels a lot like an MCU movie but one from the earlier era of MCU movies where there was still something worthwhile in them. It's kind of glib but not TOO glib yet, and is curiously sexless. Gotta bone in the skull crawler skeleton pit baby
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Dec 12, 2023 23:06
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CelticPredator posted:Gotta bone in the skull crawler skeleton pit baby
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Dec 12, 2023 23:34
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god, giving King Kong an "i must avenge my murdered parents" backstory was so lame
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Dec 12, 2023 23:34
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Desumaytah posted:Has anyone ever kissed anyone else in a Godzilla movie? It just kind of isn't done. Monster Zero, G'98, G'14, maybe Godzilla vs. Kong (can't remember if Skarsgard and Hall kiss or not). One of the anime trilogy movies too maybe?
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Dec 13, 2023 00:25
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Monster Zero / Godzilla vs. Astro-Monster is basically my model for what a Godzilla film should be like, notwithstanding Ishiro Honda's own skepticism towards it.
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Dec 13, 2023 01:07
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Desumaytah posted:Has anyone ever kissed anyone else in a Godzilla movie? It just kind of isn't done. Serizawa and Godzilla in kotm
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Dec 13, 2023 01:11
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Spoiler for anyone who doesn't know any film monsters named Jean Jacket: Is NOPE a Kaiju film? I think it's gotta be. Muscle Tracer fucked around with this message at 01:46 on Dec 13, 2023 |
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Dec 13, 2023 01:21
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undoubtedly, but that's a spoiler
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Dec 13, 2023 01:25
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Muscle Tracer posted:Is NOPE a Kaiju film? I think it's gotta be. in theory but not in practice. I think it's a all rectangles are squares but not all squares are rectangles situation
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Dec 13, 2023 01:31
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What I mean by that is it does feature what I would call a Kaiju, but I don't think the movie itself is a Kaiju movie just in the way it's executed
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Dec 13, 2023 01:33
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It's a western or possibly a buddy chimp movie
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Dec 13, 2023 01:36
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Mantis42 posted:It's a western or possibly a buddy chimp movie Shin Buddy Chimp
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Dec 13, 2023 01:39
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That scene in the alien's throat? Digestive tract? Is still one of the most horrifying movie scenes I've ever seen and was worth the price of admission all on its own, I'm glad I saw that in theaters
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Dec 13, 2023 01:46
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Asterite34 posted:And I mean, not EVERY movie needs a romance plot, those other Godzilla movies I mentioned functioned perfectly fine without them. Frankly too many movies waste time on an obligatory romance subplot that does nothing but fill time and kill the pacing, it's like if every movie had a gunfight or a Bollywood dance number regardless of appropriateness to the plot. It's just interesting that for kind of a long time Godzilla movies have been... well "sexless" isn't the word, it's not like the leads in Minus One are getting mad rutty or anything, the romance is fairly chaste. But it does feel like they've been leaving narrative potential on the table lately that this one picks up. Again though; I don’t think this is really an actual trend. G Minus One is strictly a “subtext is for cowards” remake of not Godzilla 1954 but Godzilla Raids Again, where the protagonists are ex-military (now working as commercial pilots in the fishing industry) who get pulled into fighting a Godzilla without the benefit of an Oxygen Destroyer. There’s an overriding (if, frankly, boring) focus on maintaining a ‘normal life’ in the aftermath of the previous film - which includes the protagonists courting women and going on dates and such. Okay, sure, that’s early in the franchise. But it’s still not at all unusual for Godzilla movies to be about romantic relationships, even if they’re largely about tragic romances or dysfunctional relationships (because those are simply more interesting, and obviously tie into the monstrosity of the literal monsters). Like, Terror Of Mechagodzilla is doing a Forbidden Planet riff where the overwhelming focus is on the father character’s incestuous overprotectiveness towards his daughter and jealousy against the random dude attracted to her - moreso than the awkward, fraught romance itself. But Terror Of Mechagodzilla is still primarily about this psychosexual melodrama.
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Dec 13, 2023 01:55
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Hi thread, Godzilla '54 is one of my favorite movies, but then I watched Raids Again (ugh) and King of the Monsters '56 (ew) and lost steam. My secret shame is that I haven't seen any other 'zillas. My 2024 resolution is to watch all the movies, starting obviously with the Showa stuff. I watched Mothra vs. Godzilla today and it kicked rear end. Gonna share my thoughts as I work through it all.
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Dec 13, 2023 02:48
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Raids Again is very bad and I frequently forget it exists.
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Dec 13, 2023 02:49
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