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flashman posted:Of course genre expectations have changed in 23 years dude is this a bit? What is your opinion about trains? (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Dec 22, 2023 21:35
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Just wanted to let everyone know that I updated Diablo 3 today in preparation of skipping S3 of Diablo 4.
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Dec 22, 2023 21:35
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EC posted:Just wanted to let everyone know that I updated Diablo 3 today in preparation of skipping S3 of Diablo 4. Escape from Tarkov is about to wipe and update in a few days if you want to play a good loot game.
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Dec 22, 2023 21:37
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El Scandelouse posted:Well Diablo 5 will never happen or have the opportunity to be good unless you engage with the hyper monetization of Diablo 4 (The beta for Diablo 5). gonna be honest there isnt actually anything that suggests that diablo 4 could be a beta for diablo 5, because whenever they do that im sure theyre just going to use an entirely different team and actively hunt down and eradicate any institutional knowledge that could help them do it better
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Dec 22, 2023 21:45
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Verviticus posted:gonna be honest there isnt actually anything that suggests that diablo 4 could be a beta for diablo 5, because whenever they do that im sure theyre just going to use an entirely different team and actively hunt down and eradicate any institutional knowledge that could help them do it better It’s the American way. The next dev group is gonna have to bootstrap their way to releasing an early access game for $70.
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Dec 22, 2023 21:47
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flashman posted:Of course genre expectations have changed in 23 years dude is this a bit? ...every arpg i've played has a map overlay
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Dec 22, 2023 21:53
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GreenBuckanneer posted:...every arpg i've played has a map overlay he was talking about a different post, not yours but no, no overlay here and as far as i know no announced plans to implement one
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Dec 22, 2023 22:33
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harrygomm posted:he was talking about a different post, not yours bummer
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Dec 22, 2023 22:36
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What's a map overlay? Is it like the mini-map but bigger? Or the big map but smaller?
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Dec 22, 2023 22:37
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EC posted:Just wanted to let everyone know that I updated Diablo 3 today in preparation of skipping S3 of Diablo 4. I played the PTR and having the Altar + the shard gems + the portals from last season all at the same time is very good
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Dec 22, 2023 22:44
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The campaign was a good buy but it wasn't a $70 good buy. If D4 was a $40 game it'd be pretty cool. Currently it's kind of playing catch up and I expect the expansion to get it there. It's really weird to add "expansion costs money" to D4 monetization. That was actually the ideal model 20 years ago. Good game is released for $60. Expansion adds more good game and even transforms good game into good game+ for $30-40. The Frozen Throne to your Rain of Chaos. The Brood War to your Starcraft. Even SC2 releasing 3 times was 3 of possibly the best beefy RTS campaigns of the last decade. So Diablo 4 for $70 is a bit more than I'd like relative to my perception of the quality but Diablo 4: Hate More for $40 is understandable. Diablo 4 proudly left beta status but it can still be mocked for being a post-modern ARPG(all the competitors released ten years ago and are still competing with it) that doesn't really understand its own end game. It's there yeah, but AoZ to Gauntlet sound kind of strained, like they started working on them after the game released.  D4 monetization is actually VERY tame.  Cosmetics you can ignore(base game armor looks great) is nothing compared to Immortal/mobile game style soul sucking.
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Dec 22, 2023 22:54
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early access enjoyers and beta haters please get along
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Dec 22, 2023 22:58
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GreenBuckanneer posted:...every arpg i've played has a map overlay Ya sorry dude didn't quote him, this has no map overlay and it's a weird omission
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Dec 22, 2023 23:00
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Why are you guys so hung up on the map overlay I say this as somebody who spent literally 1000+ hours on Diablo 2 with the map overlay overlaid over the middle of the screen, it's really not a big deal that it's not there in D4. The dungeons aren't exactly labyrinthine, and the overworld map has a ping you can place down for GPS-style navigation. The map overlay in the older games were a necessity because of the design of the maps, it's much less the case in D4. I don't miss it at all. There are plenty of other, legitimate and much much bigger issues with the game. Like the lack of an endgame and seemingly moribund seasons bereft of ideas and creativity we're currently seeing in D3
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Dec 22, 2023 23:42
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It's a QoL feature that shouldn't be a big dev demand that people like, what else does it need to be? It's like before the pre-S2 patch that smoothed out a lot of things in cities and so on that people didn't like. They're not deal breakers but the more comfort people feel the more they'll play, simple as. I still compulsively push Tab every so often for it.
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Dec 22, 2023 23:48
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Idk about everyone else but I wanna explore the whole map and I often go the wrong way in a map instead of going to all the side points on a map, I often find myself reach the boss before exploring the map thinking I was going the wrong way.
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Dec 22, 2023 23:49
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my eyes are focused in the corner instead of on the screen where the action is happening
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Dec 23, 2023 00:01
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i dont care how they do it, but it should be easy to navigate a random dungeon without having to look at the main map
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Dec 23, 2023 00:10
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flashman posted:my eyes are focused in the corner instead of on the screen where the action is happening yeah this is the thing for me. iirc one of the reasons they went with mini map was because they wanted to show off the art assets or whatever. instead i spend about half my time staring at the mini map corner looking for edges of paths (can't see them well in game, think the various path splitting in fractured peaks, especially during helltide/yuletide) or for the red dots for important mobs treasure goblins/objective arrows at least with an overlay im still looking at the bulk of the action center screen and don't have to look at top corner of tv and then back. e: or yeah design poo poo so you don't need either like verv says (i understand this is an enormous effort potentially)
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Dec 23, 2023 00:20
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Lmao y'all cannot possibly be this upset at the lack of a loving map overlay. What's next, bitching and moaning about character voice lines? It's like you people collectively get together to create fake problems to be mad at.
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Dec 23, 2023 00:58
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Destiny is far and away the worst money gouger I’ve played recently. Friend bought lightfall but we couldn’t do any of the seasonal content together for the rest of the year. Everything we went to do it just said a party member couldn’t participate. Even worse now it gives you the quest lines and then says no when he tried to launch them. And those passes are not full of cosmetics either. That was a $70 game that told you to pretty much gently caress off after you did a half arsed campaign that took a few hours. Absolutely atrocious. The Final Shape is my middle finger at Bungie. We decided to become dwarven space miners instead. It’s really dumb trying to capture a gaming market (who might only get the chance to login once a week for a few hours) by gatekeeping all the fun parts with the need to spend more money if you don’t want to do the same dull poo poo as the last three years. Makes it easy to say nah. Compared to D4 campaign and two seasons of new stuff, where if you aren’t beating the game to death with 400 hrs of play, many gamers are still having fun and doing new things without having spent any more money and will continue to do so for some time. I still want hell tides where we have to reclaim territory and fight off SWARMS of creatures. Give me helms deep!!! BG3 has me now. Now this is a masterpiece. But I’ve really got my monies worth out of D4 even if I never touched it again. And yes, with the proviso they need to fix the stuff beaten to death in the thread thus far to ensure longevity (pse give endgame), $70 for a game with 3/4 seasons of new stuff isn’t egregious by comparison at all.
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Dec 23, 2023 01:09
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Needing a map overlay up all the time is annoying but navigating the butt-tier dungeon map layouts without one is more annoying. It's a minor annoyance to add to the "I'd expect better from the fourth game in THE arpg franchise" pile.
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Dec 23, 2023 01:10
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Kaysette posted:Needing a map overlay up all the time is annoying but navigating the butt-tier dungeon map layouts without one is more annoying. Cause that seems to be working just fine, unless you want dungeonsntonbeba literal straight line from start to finish, which is what it's starting sound like. Hell, it's not like you can teleport through walla like in d3, so what even is the argument now? You don't want to do the bare minimum of walking? There's a solution for that(don't do dungeons, problem avoided). SmallpoxJenkins fucked around with this message at 01:46 on Dec 23, 2023 |
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Dec 23, 2023 01:43
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SmallpoxJenkins posted:Did the devs not do a streamlining pass on all dungeons, to address this very "issue" the people were seeming to have with them? please upload a clip of you navigating from a randomly selected point on the map, let's say the tree of whispers, to the Onyx Watchtower and then flawlessly navigating the dungeon start to finish without backtracking but also hitting all the elite packs with a piece of paper taped over your minimap alternatively, maybe it isn't so weird to desire a genre mainstay to be in a genre
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Dec 23, 2023 02:06
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SmallpoxJenkins posted:Did the devs not do a streamlining pass on all dungeons, to address this very "issue" the people were seeming to have with them? 1.2.0 did help but there are still combinations of objectives and tile sets that suck to complete compared to others. That’s why there are clear tier lists of dungeons based mainly on ease of navigation and therefore completion. I do prefer activities like rifts/aoz but until recently grinding NMD was the only way to get glyph xp so it wasn’t optional for endgame.
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Dec 23, 2023 02:09
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SmallpoxJenkins posted:Did the devs not do a streamlining pass on all dungeons, to address this very "issue" the people were seeming to have with them? why do you type like that
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Dec 23, 2023 02:22
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harrygomm posted:please upload a clip of you navigating from a randomly selected point on the map, let's say the tree of whispers, to the Onyx Watchtower and then flawlessly navigating the dungeon start to finish without backtracking but also hitting all the elite packs with a piece of paper taped over your minimap What the gently caress is wrong with you? (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Dec 23, 2023 03:04
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Kaysette posted:1.2.0 did help but there are still combinations of objectives and tile sets that suck to complete compared to others. That’s why there are clear tier lists of dungeons based mainly on ease of navigation and therefore completion. I do prefer activities like rifts/aoz but until recently grinding NMD was the only way to get glyph xp so it wasn’t optional for endgame. Wait, how else do you get glyph XP? Carrion Fields is at the top of my personal tier list as there's only one sub-objective and it's clear where you need to go.
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Dec 23, 2023 03:28
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harrygomm posted:please upload a clip of you navigating from a randomly selected point on the map, let's say the tree of whispers, to the Onyx Watchtower and then flawlessly navigating the dungeon start to finish without backtracking but also hitting all the elite packs with a piece of paper taped over your minimap Why the gently caress would I do that, that's just stupid and has nothing to do with what we were talking about(dungeon navigation). And for the other guy, I typed like that because I was at the bus stop with half frozen fingers, and autocorrect clearly didn't want to play nice.
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Dec 23, 2023 03:31
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Maker Of Shoes posted:What the gently caress is wrong with you? He didn't overlay the wrinkles on his brain. or maybe he's just saying it's hard when you don't use the map, and when you tape a piece of paper over your minimap, and this would not be an issue if they added a third, overlayed map SmallpoxJenkins fucked around with this message at 03:51 on Dec 23, 2023 |
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Dec 23, 2023 03:47
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Maker Of Shoes posted:What the gently caress is wrong with you? nothing pertinent to the thread. sometimes i use examples to show what i mean because, particularly in this thread, simply stating something doesn't work SmallpoxJenkins posted:Why the gently caress would I do that, that's just stupid and has nothing to do with what we were talking about(dungeon navigation). perfect example here. what we were talking about was the desire for a map overlay, not dungeon navigation. while dungeon navigation is an important reason to want an overlay, it is not the only one. this is why i used an example that included navigating the overworld in addition to navigating a common activity to demonstrate that an overlay would be more helpful, and easier to use for a lot of long time fans of the genre, than a minimap shoved into a corner. being able to see more information in the center of your vision is a benefit to a lot of people who have gotten used to navigating arpg maps with overlays. moving to a minimap seems like a regression. by facetiously requesting someone to do something patently stupid, as i did earlier, it can quickly bring to light the flaws of the counterpoint. i hope this helps! SmallpoxJenkins posted:He didn't overlay the wrinkles on his brain. they could also, as they did in their previous two titles in the same genre, allow a toggling between the types of maps so you can use the one most suited to the situation! in this way, more choice is present and genre conventions are maintained!!
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Dec 23, 2023 05:36
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But why did you ask him to tape over the mini map?
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Dec 23, 2023 05:49
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My man's having a rough day.
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Dec 23, 2023 05:50
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American McGay posted:But why did you ask him to tape over the mini map? And also hit every elite pack, which is not and has never marked on any map in any Diablo game I've played(3 and 4). So no, king idiot, that effort post does not actually help anything.
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Dec 23, 2023 05:53
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American McGay posted:But why did you ask him to tape over the mini map? so that you can't use it. from what i recall, his position was that navigating dungeons was easy to do without the minimap after the developer pass competently navigating from one location to a dungeon and then easily navigating through the dungeon all without use of the minimap would demonstrate either that everyone who says they want an overlay doesn't really need one (they just need to learn the maps better i guess). and if you couldn't navigate the overworld and dungeon without a minimap, it would mean that the map navigation assistance is required and putting in the genre standard, easier to use/more info dense overlay would be a better option am i maybe just really stupid? i honestly felt that this was the easy to understand reason i would say what i did e: regardless, i think the lesson here is that i should stop posting anything except exactly what i mean because i am already a bad enough communicator as it is. also that we should probably move on from the topic as currently discussed because it seems like we can't do so without a weird amount of name calling for grown adults to be doing harrygomm fucked around with this message at 05:59 on Dec 23, 2023 |
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Dec 23, 2023 05:55
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harrygomm posted:so that you can't use it. from what i recall, his position was that navigating dungeons was easy to do without the minimap after the developer pass Not even remotely what I was saying or even hinting at.
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Dec 23, 2023 05:58
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I think we can all agree that navigation is harder without maps If you made it home today, thank your local cartographer
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Dec 23, 2023 05:58
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harrygomm posted:so that you can't use it. from what i recall, his position was that navigating dungeons was easy to do without the minimap after the developer pass Keep posting through it my dude. The over-world isn’t randomized like d2/3 and dungeons follow a pretty strict layout depending on the tileset. I’ve never once been playing d4 wishing I had a giant map overlay on my screen to find out where I need to go. Helltides? I check out ole Helltides.com and drop a pin on the living steel chest. Glance at the minimap a time or two till I get to it. Why are you running to dungeons anyway? You can just teleport to nmds. If you need aspects in early season again drop a pin on it. Your argument is bad and you’re trying to make this into a bigger deal than it actually is. Maybe if you spent more time playing the game you would find it easier to navigate. Your position as an IK in this thread is confusing as hell. You tiptoe around trying to both sides Diablo being bad or good but you’re constantly siding with people who are just spite posting and making up imaginary scenarios about dlc pricing or saying the game is a beta. If I can run from Gea Kul to Duriels Lair with some paper taped over my minimap on stream will you probe yourself for a week?
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Dec 23, 2023 06:08
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SmallpoxJenkins posted:Not even remotely what I was saying or even hinting at. my bad i read this SmallpoxJenkins posted:Did the devs not do a streamlining pass on all dungeons, to address this very "issue" the people were seeming to have in response to this Kaysette posted:Needing a map overlay up all the time is annoying but navigating the butt-tier dungeon map layouts without one is more annoying. as being a continuation of the overlay vs minimap discussion and not as taking it in a different direction. i absolutely should not have tried to be snide in my response. in short: GoGoGadgetChris posted:My man's having a rough day.
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Dec 23, 2023 06:09
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A wise Mephisto once told me,
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