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Kith
Sep 17, 2009

You never learn anything
by doing it right.


Varian Is one of the very few genuine successes of the draft-focused design that HOTS was chasing. If the enemy team doesn't have any way to shut you down, Twin Blades becomes the best choice by far.

Unfortunately, another issue that HOTS has is that there is an overwhelming abundance of ways to counter that. There are just too many stuns and roots and knockbacks and healing reductions and lord knows what else. Many characters are cool for the sake of being cool and that frequently makes them stifling to play against, and it's very easy to face an entire team made of such characters.

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Shockeh
Feb 24, 2009

Now be a dear and
fuck the fuck off.
Oh sure, there's Heroes whose class identity is 'Be good at the role they're in' (Looking at you, fuckin' Li-Ming).

They don't bring anything unique, or interesting, their entire gameplan is 'Top the chart of their relevant role by pressing all their buttons'. Now, arguably, you need some Heroes like that (Raynor) because their job is to provide basic, easy options. The issue is when those basic, easy options are also the best-in-class, or worse again, when there's a few of them in the same role, making them easily stackable.

appropriatemetaphor
Jan 26, 2006

Is Genji secretly a different category of assassin?

Got a HIGH ESTIMATED WAIT TIME of 200s for qm Genji, but no message for any other assassin?

Kith
Sep 17, 2009

You never learn anything
by doing it right.


yes. the matchmaker attempts to make teams with relatively equal amounts of lane presence, and genji is (incorrectly) assumed to have very low lane presence because his kit is focused on isolating targets and bursting them down. other pubstomp heroes like nova, valeera, and zeratul are also considered to have "low lane presence" and are frequently subject to that matchmaking adjustment.

further complicating matters is that all of the soloqueue tryhards pick genji because he's the apex example of a soloqueue tryhard character so you're also competing against thousands of other people trying to do the same thing and the matchmaker is choking because of it

Star
Jul 15, 2005

Guerilla war struggle is a new entertainment.
Fallen Rib
In short, the mada mada boys are out in force over the holidays

appropriatemetaphor
Jan 26, 2006

Ahh that's why I see stupid valeeras constantly.

But yeah I'm a soloqueue tryhard Genji. Gotta hit that Level 200 before Bill Gates delete the game.

Rogue AI Goddess
May 10, 2012

I enjoy the sight of humans on their knees.
That was a joke... unless..?

Nash posted:

Am I a bad person in that I like to just screw around in AI matches because I want to chill and not worry about somebody screeching at me when I screw up and don’t focus fire the correct person 100% of the time?
I also enjoy AI matches more.

Nash
Aug 1, 2003

Sign my 'Bring Goldberg Back' Petition
Quicker matches plus I can live out my rawr I’m a dragon power fantasies easier with Deathwing

Machai
Feb 21, 2013

appropriatemetaphor posted:

Gotta hit that Level 200 before Bill Gates Satya Nadella delete the game.

Kith
Sep 17, 2009

You never learn anything
by doing it right.


Rogue AI Goddess posted:

I also enjoy AI matches more.

well of course YOU would

appropriatemetaphor
Jan 26, 2006

Just turn off team chat then all your QM and ARAM games are like AI

ninjewtsu
Oct 9, 2012

watching the guy at the bottom of the scoreboard try to shift the blame for losing onto anyone else they think they can is a gift

Issakhar
Sep 10, 2009

Of course the time I finally clear my Leaver status the next game I get is all same hero ARAM :argh:

I dare say that 80% of the times I leave a match is because of this, even bad QM games I tend to endure through because one single mistake from the enemy team can be decisive comeback, ARAM same hero on the other hand got old years ago.

Star
Jul 15, 2005

Guerilla war struggle is a new entertainment.
Fallen Rib
Who’s the best tank and why is it stitches

Bisse
Jun 26, 2005

Star posted:

Who’s the best tank and why is it stitches

Johanna

Kith
Sep 17, 2009

You never learn anything
by doing it right.


Star posted:

Who’s the best tank and why is it stitches

Every tank has their strengths and weaknesses.

  • Anub'arak is extremely flexible thanks to the huge amount of CC he has access to, allowing him to initiate and peel in equal measure. However, he's fairly fragile as a result.
  • Arthas is a brawler with soft peel and initiation and can enable hard pushes against fortifications thanks to Sindragosa. His primary value comes from his Q build, allowing him to effortlessly poke soft targets and sustain himself at the same time.
  • Blaze has good initiation and very weak peel, but is an excellent brawler because of how comfortably he can exist in the middle of the enemy team. It's very possible to play him as a main tank, but if you're playing with a group, I highly recommend using Blaze as your Bruiser because he's basically Flamethrower Sonya.
  • Cho is a high-damage, high-durability brawler whose primary peel comes from being worth two kills. Depending on your choice of ult, you can also pick up some hard initiation or hard peel.
  • Diablo is very flexible but has strict positioning requirements. If you can flank and combo properly, Diablo is easily one of the best tanks in the game, if not the best. If you can't, he's trash.
  • ETC is similar to Anub'arak - tons of CC, can be any kind of tank, but lacks durability.
  • Garrosh has a reputation for being a hard initiation tank and he's definitely great at that, but folks forget that he can throw enemies away too, not just into the team. He also has the ability to throw allies, which can get them out of trouble (especially since its cooldown is separate from the enemy throw).
  • Johanna is a low-damage, high-durability brawler, and her job is to exist in the middle of the enemy team while being as big of a nuisance as possible.
  • Mal'Ganis is a mid-damage, mid-durability brawler, and his job is also to exist in the middle of the enemy team while being as big of a nuisance as possible.
  • Mei is a flexible tank that's tricky to play due to her skills' delays and knockbacks and so on. Unlike other flexible tanks, she's ridiculously durable. If you can get her trickiness down, the opposing team will find you impossible to deal with.
  • Muradin is a more of an initiator, but is overall very flexible since his stun can be used to initiate or peel. He's also very mobile, has great sustain if he can get away from a fight, and can use Haymaker to reposition targets easily.
  • Stitches is a hard initiator tank, but can have a little peel as a treat when used right.
  • Tyreal a mid-damage, mid-durability brawler who's more oriented towards team support than anything else. He's very tricky to play since everything he brings to the team is soft value until he gets his ults, at which point you have to decide between hard peel and hard initiation.
  • Varian can pick up a shield and be a semi-decent brawler, but almost all of his initiation and peel are reliant on his ult.
  • Dehaka, despite being classified as a Bruiser, is completely capable of serving a team's main tank needs due to how powerful Drag is and how it can be used to simply pluck someone out of the enemy lineup and move them where you want them.
  • Uther can moonlight as a tank when played properly and is arguably at his best when played in this role since he's kind of a lovely healer in most cases. Having a point-and-click stun that can be followed up by an AOE stun can be very valuable if your team is capable of capitalizing on it.

As for who's the best objectively, I would argue either Muradin or Mei. Both are very mobile, highly durable, have great sustain, and have access to excellent crowd control tools, allowing them to fit into practically any comp and do any job. I would argue that the only major difference between them is how difficult they are to play, with Muradin being very easy and Mei being very difficult.

Nash
Aug 1, 2003

Sign my 'Bring Goldberg Back' Petition
Muradin has an ultimate that allows me to punch someone in their stupid loving face and send them comically flying. Best tank.

Snacksmaniac
Jan 12, 2008

If you think about it hammer is the only tank

Star
Jul 15, 2005

Guerilla war struggle is a new entertainment.
Fallen Rib
Thanks for all the serious answers. I’m actually quite aware of the different tanks’ strengths and weaknesses, I just wanted to express my love for playing stitches and hooking idiots in ranked.

Nybble
Jun 28, 2008

praise chuck, raise heck
Anyone tried out Heroes of the Storm 1.5?

https://afkgaming.com/gaming/general/blizzard-killed-heroes-of-the-storm-but-fans-are-resurrecting-it

Kith
Sep 17, 2009

You never learn anything
by doing it right.


ROTS is a nice idea but it's not likely to go anywhere; partially because of its tiny playerbase, partially because it has no room for growth, and partially because their sense of balance is... not great. They're currently looking for art people and for Galaxy Editor wizards, both of which are in short supply because anything you put into SC2, Blizzard takes automatic ownership of. The amount of work they've done is genuinely impressive, but I would be shocked if it was still alive in a year.

e: For an idea of what I mean about not being great at balance, one of the talents they gave Diablo gives him the opportunity to combo his stuns such that he can stun someone for up to 6 seconds, which is a loving eternity.

Kith fucked around with this message at 16:26 on Jan 7, 2024

Macaluso
Sep 23, 2005

I HATE THAT HEDGEHOG, BROTHER!

Star posted:

Who’s the best tank and why is it stitches

Level 20 Murky

cmdrk
Jun 10, 2013
i hope this dead game comes back. i'm desperate for more bird magic shenanigans.

Kevin Bacon
Sep 22, 2010

falstad?

Kith
Sep 17, 2009

You never learn anything
by doing it right.


falstad, medivh, tyrande. malfurion with the right skin

bobthenameless
Jun 20, 2005

brightwing is kind of a bird too

also re: ROTS, falstad looks broken too. a level 20 map wide hinterland blast with a 35 sec cd and 15 secs off per hero hit sounds nuts.

also a quest talent that gives an extra charge of barrel roll and flight for taking merc camps.

Machai
Feb 21, 2013

Snacksmaniac posted:

If you think about it hammer is the only tank

Hammer is in a tank, Fenix is a tank.

Kith
Sep 17, 2009

You never learn anything
by doing it right.


d.va drives a lil' tykes twee tank

Snacksmaniac
Jan 12, 2008

Machai posted:

Hammer is in a tank, Fenix is a tank.

Whoa. Makes you think.

Shockeh
Feb 24, 2009

Now be a dear and
fuck the fuck off.
Any birb votes not for Medivh are just wrong, sorry.

Best bird, best Wizard, best Assassin not in the Assassin category.

Kevin Bacon
Sep 22, 2010

bobthenameless posted:

brightwing is kind of a bird too

also re: ROTS, falstad looks broken too. a level 20 map wide hinterland blast with a 35 sec cd and 15 secs off per hero hit sounds nuts.

also a quest talent that gives an extra charge of barrel roll and flight for taking merc camps.

now they just need to make the rest of the heroes broken too, then they will have achieved good balance

btw i hope bird medivh gets sucked into dva's mech's jet engine

FungiCap
Jul 23, 2007

Let's all just calm down and put on our thinking caps.
I really like this game and it's better with team chat off and when people spam ping a team mate after they do a big play or get a huge ulti off it makes me smile

ninjewtsu
Oct 9, 2012

personally i keep team chat on because i think the ways people melt down over the dead moba are often pretty funny

warms my heart every time i see a 13 death varian desperately grasp at excuses why actually it's someone else's fault that we're losing

also the classic experience of playing aba and being told how to play aba by some random dipshit who definitely does not play aba, it's incredible how everyone manages to have their own stupid but very outspoken opinion of what good aba play is

ninjewtsu fucked around with this message at 18:29 on Jan 11, 2024

Nybble
Jun 28, 2008

praise chuck, raise heck
*Taunt Varian initiates with no DPS near him, dies*

“HAT ME”
*pings Aba 20 times*

Kith
Sep 17, 2009

You never learn anything
by doing it right.


Nothing makes players like that go absolutely nuclear than just calling out their death counter. No commentary, nothing else, just "9". Or "10". Had a game like that last night in ARAM and the meltdown was utterly spectacular.

FungiCap
Jul 23, 2007

Let's all just calm down and put on our thinking caps.
i'm spam pinging these posts but in a good way

Star
Jul 15, 2005

Guerilla war struggle is a new entertainment.
Fallen Rib
The sa goons in-game chat group is very empty

Shockeh
Feb 24, 2009

Now be a dear and
fuck the fuck off.
Sick of those little bitches hanging at the back? Don't like getting dived by some shitbag Assassin? Want to be all aggro, all the time?

*Slaps roof of Artanis - You can fit so many dead motherfuckers on these arm blades*

bobthenameless
Jun 20, 2005

a well executed blade dash and phase prism is its own reward

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Issakhar
Sep 10, 2009

Another PTR!

Lili, Medivh and Nova buffs, along with more bug fixes, one step closer to the HoTS2 announcement.

Li Li

Jug of 1,000 Cups healing increased from 66 to 80.

Medivh

Mage Armor duration increased from 4 seconds to 6 seconds.
Mage Armor increased from 30 to 50 Armor.

Nova

Advanced Cloaking bonus mana regen increased from 3 to 6.
Anti-Armor Shells duration increased from 3 seconds to 5 seconds.

https://news.blizzard.com/en-us/heroes-of-the-storm/24056177/heroes-of-the-storm-ptr-patch-notes-january-17-2024

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