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JohnClark posted:I just have to be direct here I guess; she absolutely is a politician. She's elected to office, and her decisions do a great deal to determine how the lives of the people who elect her unfold. If that's not a politician, again, I don't know what is. We might be talking past each other. Hillary doing dumb poo poo with bad optics was trouble because it ran the risk of and ultimately did, cause her to lose the election. Optics are critical in that situation because optics in that case were the entire ball game. If you lose the battle of public opinion, the underlying facts literally don't matter. In this case the underlying facts are all that matter. She either did gently caress this up and they can prove it (in which case the public might be hosed in any number of ways) or she didn't/they can't prove it. The fact that her public denial (such as it was) sucked rear end doesn't matter because this issue is going to be litigated, not subject to the electoral process. The judge isn't going to make his decision based on her tripping over her own rear end in a public speech, and to my knowledge no one in political office has the authority to recall her.
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Jan 15, 2024 20:14
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Caros posted:We might be talking past each other. I don't think that, even if the governor had no actual power, that political considerations wouldn't matter. As it stands though, the governor (slightly at remove) absolutely can remove Willis. https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/may/05/georgia-brian-kemp-bill-remove-local-prosecutors
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Jan 15, 2024 20:34
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JohnClark posted:I don't think that, even if the governor had no actual power, that political considerations wouldn't matter. (But yes, I thought of that legislation, too.)
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Jan 15, 2024 20:46
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Edge & Christian posted:Kemp was full-on endorsed by Trump in 2018, but by 2022 Trump and company had spent a year calling for his resignation and/or imprisonment, and Trump jokingly endorsed Stacey Abrams over Kemp at rallies and supported Purdue trying to primary Kemp out of the gubernatorial race.
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Jan 15, 2024 21:19
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I really hope the March trial for Trump is still going to happen. I know it's been temporarily postponed while his whole immunity thing is being looked at, but I think this could actually land him in jail. He'll probably never go to jail, but it would be nice if it was at least acknowledged.
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Jan 16, 2024 07:02
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The thing that wa always the open and shut case for trump was keeping the nuclear secrets in his bathroom so he could show them off and impress car dealership owners. They had pictures, the law is completely black and white, he admitted it and tried to make up some bullshit to justify it that was flagrantly illegal. And loving fate tossed him a hack judge who’d already embarrassed herself for him who’s going to run out the clock so that either a. He’s back in office or b. Hes convicted on something else. The people running these prosecutions are by and large are not up to the moment.
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Jan 16, 2024 13:37
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FizFashizzle posted:The thing that wa always the open and shut case for trump was keeping the nuclear secrets in his bathroom so he could show them off and impress car dealership owners. They had pictures, the law is completely black and white, he admitted it and tried to make up some bullshit to justify it that was flagrantly illegal. The biggest issue regarding Trump is that our national institutions are so thoroughly rotten that no one has been both willing and able to stop him. edit: except, bizarrely and briefly, Mike Pence Hieronymous Alloy fucked around with this message at 14:07 on Jan 16, 2024 |
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Jan 16, 2024 14:04
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FizFashizzle posted:And loving fate tossed him a hack judge who’d already embarrassed herself for him who’s going to run out the clock so that either a. He’s back in office or b. Hes convicted on something else. It wasn't fate. She was hastily voted through in mid-November as soon as it was clear Trump lost and is the functionally only judge for the district that covers Mar-a-Lago. This is another McConnell machination.
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Jan 16, 2024 16:42
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:The biggest issue regarding Trump is that our national institutions are so thoroughly rotten that no one has been both willing and able to stop him. Well, there was also governors like the ones of AZ and GA who didn't do his dumb coup plot bullshit.
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Jan 16, 2024 16:45
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FizFashizzle posted:The people running these prosecutions are by and large are not up to the moment. What would being up to the moment entail?
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Jan 16, 2024 16:54
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In other news, jury selection in the latest Carroll trial starts today and we're seeing the judge make clear that he's not treating the jury trial the same way Engoron treated his bench trial: https://twitter.com/eorden/status/1747269894704595074 https://twitter.com/eorden/status/1747270123352932471 https://twitter.com/eorden/status/1747271576670851259 https://twitter.com/eorden/status/1747287374655025414
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Jan 16, 2024 17:35
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FizFashizzle posted:The thing that wa always the open and shut case for trump was keeping the nuclear secrets in his bathroom so he could show them off and impress car dealership owners. They had pictures, the law is completely black and white, he admitted it and tried to make up some bullshit to justify it that was flagrantly illegal. So is the trial for keeping classified documents essentially on hold? I shouldn't be surprised, but I guess I still held out a little bit of faith in the justice system.
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Jan 16, 2024 17:39
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DeadlyMuffin posted:So is the trial for keeping classified documents essentially on hold? I shouldn't be surprised, but I guess I still held out a little bit of faith in the justice system.
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Jan 16, 2024 17:48
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DeadlyMuffin posted:So is the trial for keeping classified documents essentially on hold? I shouldn't be surprised, but I guess I still held out a little bit of faith in the justice system. Cannon has done everything judicially permissible to slow walk, delay and outright impede movement on the case. It could be that Smith is trying to grind this to the point of forcing recusal but really I think he's focusing on Jan 6 first.
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Jan 16, 2024 17:49
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I know some excerpts from the Washington Post about the allegations thrown against Fani Willis were shared, but I didn't see a link to something that wasn't paywalled. https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2024/01/15/fani-willis-donald-trump-prosecutor-controversy/72235662007/ Here's a full piece. Still frustrating that she hasn't responded explicitly to the comments and I hope that's not the sign of something horrible about to get unearthed.
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Jan 16, 2024 18:07
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Paracaidas posted:In other news, jury selection in the latest Carroll trial starts today and we're seeing the judge make clear that he's not treating the jury trial the same way Engoron treated his bench trial: That's nice. Are they going to put Trump in jail when he wipes his rear end with the ruling and does whatever the gently caress he wants?
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Jan 16, 2024 18:49
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bird food bathtub posted:That's nice. Are they going to put Trump in jail when he wipes his rear end with the ruling and does whatever the gently caress he wants? Well it's a civil trial so they could seize his assets I suppose.
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Jan 16, 2024 18:51
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Tesseraction posted:Cannon has done everything judicially permissible to slow walk, delay and outright impede movement on the case. It could be that Smith is trying to grind this to the point of forcing recusal but really I think he's focusing on Jan 6 first. Trials involving classified information have very stringent rules from CIPA to try and balance due process/free sharing of information with keeping national security secrets secret. There are timeline and process requirements and a bunch of explicit hoops to jump through, and Cannon through a combination of bias and inexperience /incompetence with this type of case has accepted practically any motion that is likely to cause a delay.
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Jan 16, 2024 18:51
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DarkHorse posted:Trials involving classified information have very stringent rules from CIPA to try and balance due process/free sharing of information with keeping national security secrets secret. There are timeline and process requirements and a bunch of explicit hoops to jump through, and Cannon through a combination of bias and inexperience /incompetence with this type of case has accepted practically any motion that is likely to cause a delay. Oh absolutely, this was going to be slow, but it can be slow despite a judge's best efforts, or it can be slow including a judge's best efforts.
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Jan 16, 2024 18:52
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John Yossarian posted:I really hope the March trial for Trump is still going to happen. I know it's been temporarily postponed while his whole immunity thing is being looked at, but I think this could actually land him in jail. He'll probably never go to jail, but it would be nice if it was at least acknowledged. The March trial date is almost certainly not going to happen.
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Jan 16, 2024 18:54
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We need more concern trolling from the left about how Mr. Trump's Constitutional right to a fair and speedy trial should be respected a great deal. After all it's the very same Amendment that even allows him to have a lawyer.
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Jan 16, 2024 19:03
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Paracaidas posted:In other news, jury selection in the latest Carroll trial starts today and we're seeing the judge make clear that he's not treating the jury trial the same way Engoron treated his bench trial: I'm curious if 'indirectly' counts him throwing a truth social tantrum. Because he was literally defaming her on truth social while in court. I'm also curious if there is an end to this cycle. Does she get to just keep suing him over and over each time he opens his mouth to spew the exact same lies?
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Jan 16, 2024 20:21
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Caros posted:I'm curious if 'indirectly' counts him throwing a truth social tantrum. Because he was literally defaming her on truth social while in court. If he keeps defaming her, then she should. Peyton Manning settled a sexual assault case against a trainer from when he was in college. Both sides signed an NDA, and every couple of years Peyton would slip and say something in public and she would sue and get a couple of million dollars. If you can't keep your mouth shut, then open your wallet.
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Jan 16, 2024 20:37
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Caros posted:I'm also curious if there is an end to this cycle. Does she get to just keep suing him over and over each time he opens his mouth to spew the exact same lies? At some point I would assume he gets permanently enjoined from talking about her and then if he does the penalties are automatic and much faster
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Jan 16, 2024 20:49
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Is there any point where the civil penalties can become criminal? Does he just get to keep perpetually defaming her as long as he pays up? What happens when he's bankrupt?
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Jan 16, 2024 20:53
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DarkHorse posted:Is there any point where the civil penalties can become criminal? Does he just get to keep perpetually defaming her as long as he pays up? What happens when he's bankrupt? "Woohoo! I can stop paying the bitch!" -Trump, presumably.
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Jan 16, 2024 20:54
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Caros posted:I'm curious if 'indirectly' counts him throwing a truth social tantrum. Because he was literally defaming her on truth social while in court. I'm pretty sure Trump defamed her in whatever his most recent speaking engagement was and has been doing this every few days for months. This trial is to asses damages for the period while he was president with a much broader reach. I expect the damages to be several multiples of the previous verdict.
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Jan 16, 2024 20:56
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Caros posted:I'm curious if 'indirectly' counts him throwing a truth social tantrum. Because he was literally defaming her on truth social while in court. If the judge meant to ban him from tweeting about the trial or publicly speaking about the trial, she would have specifically said so. The cycle ends when he gets tired of paying large amounts of money to her and shuts up. DarkHorse posted:Is there any point where the civil penalties can become criminal? Does he just get to keep perpetually defaming her as long as he pays up? What happens when he's bankrupt? No, but the penalties will escalate to much greater amounts as he continues to defame. When he's bankrupt, he presumably doesn't have nearly as much of a platform and thus his defamation wouldn't be much of a threat anymore. Presumably, though, he'd stop before blowing his entire fortune.
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Jan 16, 2024 21:01
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NY Supremes tossed Trumps appeal of Engoron's gag order. Would be kind of funny if Trump says something now and gets dinged for it because I assume it's still in effect at least until the case ends. Does it stay in effect until the appeals are over? Or until the judge annuls it?
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Jan 16, 2024 21:09
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Fart Amplifier posted:The March trial date is almost certainly not going to happen. Yeah, you're probably right. If it's delayed I at least hope that it happens in May or something like that. Pushing it back even more would be disappointing.
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Jan 16, 2024 21:27
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Paracaidas posted:What would being up to the moment entail? Not delaying the investigations for an entire year would have been a good start.
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Jan 16, 2024 21:30
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DarkHorse posted:Is there any point where the civil penalties can become criminal? Does he just get to keep perpetually defaming her as long as he pays up? What happens when he's bankrupt? At some point I guess he either whips up his morons enough or pays someone to have her killed
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Jan 16, 2024 22:05
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Main Paineframe posted:When he's bankrupt, he presumably doesn't have nearly as much of a platform and thus his defamation wouldn't be much of a threat anymore. Can we presume that? Social media accounts are free.
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Jan 16, 2024 22:17
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C. Everett Koop posted:If he keeps defaming her, then she should. this. she will keep suing him for this until she or he die because trump can't stop himself.
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Jan 16, 2024 22:29
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raminasi posted:Can we presume that? Social media accounts are free. As is attention from the media, who all about chasing are chasing those Trump ratings and giving him free airtime
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Jan 16, 2024 23:17
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C. Everett Koop posted:If he keeps defaming her, then she should. A stark reminder to not randomly drape your balls on some lady's forehead without her permission.
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Jan 16, 2024 23:19
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Bel Shazar posted:A stark reminder to not randomly drape your balls on some lady's forehead without her permission. Teabag Dome Scandal
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Jan 16, 2024 23:39
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I was trying to think, what did George Santos do that was worse than Trump's equivalent behavior? My only answer so far is Trump didn't categorically make up his background. A surprising % of Republicans condemn Santos but not Trump, so I think this is a good discussion topic because it can encourage people to think. I'm wondering if anyone has an intellectually honest answer, though I haven't searched for discussion on it much.
Eregos fucked around with this message at 00:11 on Jan 17, 2024 |
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Jan 16, 2024 23:58
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Eregos posted:I was trying to think what George Santos do that was worse than Trump's equivalent behavior? My only answer so far is Trump didn't categorically make up his background. A surprising % of Republicans condemn Santos but not Trump, so I think this is a good discussion topic because it can encourage people to think. I'm wondering if anyone has an intellectually honest answer, though I haven't searched for discussion on it much. If Trump was just a house member in an not super contested district they probably would give him the same poo poo they gave Santos.
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Jan 17, 2024 00:10
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Eregos posted:I was trying to think, what did George Santos do that was worse than Trump's equivalent behavior? Not be president, with an MK Ultra-grade hold over a substantial portion of their base.
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Jan 17, 2024 00:38
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