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have they announced how RUCs are gonna work for normal people driving normal EVs/hybrids yet? like, do i have to save up to pay them when i get a wof? ?? david seymour please explain
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Jan 17, 2024 06:20
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| # ? May 23, 2024 17:36 |
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People with non plug-in petrol/electric hybrids will be feeling very smug. Best of both worlds! Minimal petrol taxes and zero RUCs.
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Jan 17, 2024 06:23
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at least until the government moves petrol cars to ruc
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Jan 17, 2024 06:50
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That'll totally happen, definitely
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Jan 17, 2024 07:05
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Please no
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Jan 17, 2024 07:12
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Ruc on evs has always been a matter of time, it's a pretty decent whack of income to effectively pass on. If it was culture war poo poo it would be RUC on electric bikes or some fuckery.
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Jan 17, 2024 07:17
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Just you wait lol. The idea is to transition over to rucs on everything so Ev drivers can pay more and ute drivers can pay the same as efficient vehicles. It's a big part of the coalition agreement and a big signal to the ute driving masses who vote national that they're on their side after years of 'unfair ute taxes'.
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Jan 17, 2024 08:06
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I don't need yahoos calling every 5 minutes cause they didn't think they needed to pay for RUCs now they owe $5k It's bad enough getting that every 10
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Jan 17, 2024 08:16
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What needs to be done is n overall assessment of the outputs of vehicles (carbon, pm, construction, etc), damage to the road, healthcare costs, and so on and use that data to formulate ruc charges. Seems fair, so it will never happen
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Jan 17, 2024 09:54
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That sounds like so much effort
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Jan 17, 2024 10:08
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just toll every route out of wellington and auckland.
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Jan 17, 2024 11:10
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Ghostlight posted:just toll every ute out of wellington and auckland.
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Jan 17, 2024 11:27
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Nah tolling every route just requires extensive monitoring. Instead, just implement a tax for each non residential parking space. After all, those cars driving everywhere need to stop at some point. [This also requires extensive monitoring, but only on the bigger parking buildings and commercial lots]
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Jan 17, 2024 11:36
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Saros posted:Just you wait lol. The idea is to transition over to rucs on everything so Ev drivers can pay more and ute drivers can pay the same as efficient vehicles. It's this^ The rhetoric is all about "treating all vehicles equally" rather than trying to incentivise people to use lower emissions options. Supposedly market forces (petrol prices) will take care of the rest. Never mind the trillion dollar military industrial complex and Western hegemonic order that enforces artificially low petrol prices.
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Jan 17, 2024 20:06
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Considering the petrol companies know people can afford 260/L this sounds like a great way for them to pocket more cash when the ruc tax is removed
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Jan 17, 2024 20:15
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System working as intended
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Jan 17, 2024 20:20
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Did the petrol companies raise prices when labour removed the petrol tax last year? I kinda recall them doing so but not all the way to 3 bucks a litre, maybe because they knew it was temporary but like it's not like we can vote with our wallets and buy our petrol from someone else. I predict that ICE cars will still be around in 20 years at this point. I just don't see them going away, even though IIRC new car registrations are something like 30% EVs
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Jan 17, 2024 21:28
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klen dool posted:Did the petrol companies raise prices when labour removed the petrol tax last year? I kinda recall them doing so but not all the way to 3 bucks a litre, maybe because they knew it was temporary but like it's not like we can vote with our wallets and buy our petrol from someone else. Stats NZ has historic petrol prices (by quarter, I think) going way back into the 80s. I'm fairly sure it's inflation adjusted (as from memory, it shows similar prices to today for the time of the oil crisis).
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Jan 17, 2024 21:38
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They didn't lower prices when the tax was removed, it took months and only happened because there was a media outcry followed by the gov sending the retailers a very angry letter. In the interim they trousered at a minimum tens of millions of dollars.
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Jan 17, 2024 22:11
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So the idea that adding a tax to a product or service will increase the retail price is kinda bullshit - or at least reductive and too simplified - since the market will only bear a certain price. Adding a tax to a product won't necessarily be "passed on" to the consumer like some people like to moan about, and its just as likely to reduce a companies profit thereby effectively making it a tax on the company not the consumer. It probably depends on the product, but I bet petrol is one of those products whose price is dictated far more by the consumers ability or willingness to pay rather than the cost to produce and deliver + taxes
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Jan 17, 2024 23:18
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Adding a tax to a product will necessarily be "passed on" to the consumer because the alternative is to reduce company profit.
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Jan 17, 2024 23:33
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klen dool posted:So the idea that adding a tax to a product or service will increase the retail price is kinda bullshit - or at least reductive and too simplified - since the market will only bear a certain price.
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Jan 17, 2024 23:46
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Ghostlight posted:Adding a tax to a product will necessarily be "passed on" to the consumer because the alternative is to reduce company profit. The company might reduce its profit to none if they pass on the tax while their competitors don't
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Jan 18, 2024 00:32
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Jan 18, 2024 00:44
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klen dool posted:The company might reduce its profit to none if they pass on the tax while their competitors don't
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Jan 18, 2024 00:51
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I think I should just get off my butt and design an entirely new economic system.
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Jan 18, 2024 02:21
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Ghostlight posted:lmao or they could all increase their profits by none of them doing so. yes correct they could <looks at supermarkets>
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Jan 18, 2024 02:45
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so the tax was reduced and the prices went down but immediately climbed back up (because that's what the market would bear) and didn't go down until (presumably) the govt had a word just after the importation spike
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Jan 18, 2024 02:47
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the green band is profits
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Jan 18, 2024 04:13
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Oh I misread the chart. So, the prices indicate that the petrol companies didn't take advantage of the tax waiver. Presumably because they knew it was temporary and people would notice though, I don't think the same will happen when (if?) the tax is removed entirely
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Jan 18, 2024 05:27
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klen dool posted:Oh I misread the chart. So, the prices indicate that the petrol companies didn't take advantage of the tax waiver. Presumably because they knew it was temporary and people would notice though, I don't think the same will happen when (if?) the tax is removed entirely Looks like a spike in profits when the importer cost was coming down, which isn't hugely surprising if price setting lags a bit
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Jan 18, 2024 07:16
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Isn't the distributors margin quite a lot larger after the fuel tax went back up?
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Jan 18, 2024 20:20
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https://twitter.com/henrycooke/status/1748076119843074437?s=20 Jfc I knew this stuff was coming but it's crazy reading this regardless. Confusedslight fucked around with this message at 21:54 on Jan 18, 2024 |
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Jan 18, 2024 21:43
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Well that could get pretty spicy if it's real.
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Jan 18, 2024 22:06
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What does that mean exactly
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Jan 18, 2024 22:26
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Comrade Blyatlov posted:What does that mean exactly I feel like I should do an effort post on the public law implications of the principles, but pending that read this https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Zealand_Maori_Council_v_Attorney-General
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Jan 18, 2024 22:31
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The proposed change essentially removes the treaty as a factor in NZ law.
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Jan 18, 2024 22:32
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Basically what Rawiri said, the intent is to erase Te Tiriti and remove any special status or rights for Māori people. That said that leaked paragraph does seem to be a bit on the nose, it doesn't quite read right, item 6 especially. Then again with the current lot who knows. Saros fucked around with this message at 22:38 on Jan 18, 2024 |
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Jan 18, 2024 22:35
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You reckon? I think it looks plausible, it's certainly accurate.
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Jan 18, 2024 22:40
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| # ? May 23, 2024 17:36 |
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Definitely plausible. From some asking around the general consensus seems to be it is David Seymour initiated red meat for the racists intended to make a stir then die in select committee. Similar stuff is in the act coalition agreement. It's doing triple duty of making leftists/Māori angry, distracting from other shady things and pandering to the base.
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Jan 18, 2024 22:49
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