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TooMuchAbstraction
Oct 14, 2012

I spent four years making
Waves of Steel
Hell yes I'm going to turn my avatar into an ad for it.
Fun Shoe

Valgaav posted:

Ah, now for the least favourite part of any metroidvania: Trying to remember where all the poo poo you saw earlier actually was.

At least the odds are that the path to progress is in the mission log. Of course, if you just follow the log, then you'll miss all of the optional powerups that you get from exploring the map thoroughly.

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Rabbi Raccoon
Mar 31, 2009

I stabbed you dude!
I always find the hardest part of moving forward in Super Metroid hacks is figuring out what the author expects you to know how to do. Like the Mockball, or maneuvering effectively underwater for long periods of time without the Gravity Suit, or even Hell Runs. There's a lot of places you CAN get to, but SHOULDN'T. I wish more hacks were up front about what skills you need to get to the end. I was playing a fun hack a few years back and had to give up because I can't Mockball very well, let alone in midair

Bruceski
Aug 21, 2007

The tools of a hero mean nothing without a solid core.

Rabbi Raccoon posted:

I always find the hardest part of moving forward in Super Metroid hacks is figuring out what the author expects you to know how to do. Like the Mockball, or maneuvering effectively underwater for long periods of time without the Gravity Suit, or even Hell Runs. There's a lot of places you CAN get to, but SHOULDN'T. I wish more hacks were up front about what skills you need to get to the end. I was playing a fun hack a few years back and had to give up because I can't Mockball very well, let alone in midair

As someone who considers falling into the Etecoon pit a softlock I agree. Never could do a walljump consistently.

Kurui Reiten
Apr 24, 2010

Making Mockball mandatory should be a warcrime.

Procrastine
Mar 30, 2011


Are the yoku blocks in some obscure room in vanilla SM or are they a custom block?

TooMuchAbstraction
Oct 14, 2012

I spent four years making
Waves of Steel
Hell yes I'm going to turn my avatar into an ad for it.
Fun Shoe

Procrastine posted:

Are the yoku blocks in some obscure room in vanilla SM or are they a custom block?

So far as I'm aware, they're fully custom.

Rabbi Raccoon
Mar 31, 2009

I stabbed you dude!

Kurui Reiten posted:

Making Mockball mandatory should be a warcrime.

I can Mockball if I slow the game down the Universe isn't mad at me that day

I can do a Mockball in midair if I slow the game down, the Universe isn't mad at me that day, and I sacrifice a goat to the gods. I unfortunately no longer live with a goat who steals my beer

Cooked Auto
Aug 4, 2007

This is more relevant to the recent update that hasn't been posted here yet, but you should go back to older footage and see where that chozo statue that had powerbomb or somesuch revealed when you bombed it.

FPzero
Oct 20, 2008

Game Over
Return of Mido


Episode 13: Benthic bewilderment


Getting lost in the dark and underwater sounds horrifying, honestly.

----------

Cooked Auto posted:

This is more relevant to the recent update that hasn't been posted here yet, but you should go back to older footage and see where that chozo statue that had powerbomb or somesuch revealed when you bombed it.

Oh yeah, I remember that one, we'll have to check it out later. It'll be a while before it shows up in a video though, since we did more recording this past weekend and didn't go there at all.

Epicmissingno
Jul 1, 2017

Thank gooness we all get along so well!
The thing at the end is actually possible with your current equipment and without highly precise movement, but it's really, really dumb. I absolutely don't blame you for leaving it for later.

FPzero
Oct 20, 2008

Game Over
Return of Mido

I actually think I figured out the solution while editing videos today but we won't get a chance to test it until our next recording session.

Rabbi Raccoon
Mar 31, 2009

I stabbed you dude!

Epicmissingno posted:

The thing at the end is actually possible with your current equipment and without highly precise movement, but it's really, really dumb. I absolutely don't blame you for leaving it for later.

I wouldn't call it dumb, I actually like it. It's cheeky. A light troll. It's the developer giving a wink and a grin to the player. My friend was with me when I got it and he said I put on my "you got me, and I love it" face

EDIT: Also on a whim I looked up Metroid Mission Rescue on YouTube and found a playlist of 49 videos each about 2 hours long for the hard mode. Holy poo poo

Rabbi Raccoon fucked around with this message at 22:18 on Jan 23, 2024

Bloody Pom
Jun 5, 2011



A lot of the earlier SM romhacks fall into the trap of "let's make the game world loving gigantic and mazelike because more 'exploration' = more good". Redesign is probably the most well-known example but MMR is the worst offender.

e: With that last puzzle, maybe try turning off your gravity boots? Might cause your falling speed to be higher than usual, like doing a moonfall.

Bloody Pom fucked around with this message at 23:23 on Jan 23, 2024

FPzero
Oct 20, 2008

Game Over
Return of Mido


Episode 14: We have no respect for vital infrastructure


That elevator project is going to be set back by MONTHS now, the Space Pirate union is gonna be furious.

Geemer
Nov 4, 2010



Probably not a major item, but when you were going up to the energy station in the frozen area, one of those guys on the wall was different. All the other ones didn't have eyes and one connected to a wall with a blank map tile behind it did have eyes.

I bet you can kill it and go through where it connects, like in the vanilla Lower Norfair escape.

Rabbi Raccoon
Mar 31, 2009

I stabbed you dude!
Huh. I never realized you could shatter that tunnel too. But I don't think I came back that way until I had Screw Attack which would have rendered that shortcut kinda moot anyways

Valgaav
Feb 21, 2012
Congrats, you perfectly embodied the sense of "Okay now where the gently caress do I go?" that made me stop playing metroidvanias.

Rabbi Raccoon
Mar 31, 2009

I stabbed you dude!
The only one I gave up on was Castlevania: Harmony of Dissonance. It was pretty early but it felt like EVERYTHING opened up all at once and I couldn't figure out what they wanted me to do. I almost gave up on Circle of the Moon too. I couldn't find the item that negates damage from red water and hauled rear end through the sewers and had to beat the boss with like, 5 HP

Kurui Reiten
Apr 24, 2010

This is about where I got lost in the hack, too. The Hive feels like it really wants to kill you, it's a definite difficulty hump. I don't remember for sure, but I think Power Bombs are a pretty effective "get the gently caress off me" weapon there.

Simply Simon
Nov 6, 2010

📡scanning🛰️ for good game 🎮design🦔🦔🦔

Rabbi Raccoon posted:

The only one I gave up on was Castlevania: Harmony of Dissonance. It was pretty early but it felt like EVERYTHING opened up all at once and I couldn't figure out what they wanted me to do. I almost gave up on Circle of the Moon too. I couldn't find the item that negates damage from red water and hauled rear end through the sewers and had to beat the boss with like, 5 HP
Harmony is extremely bad about it, yeah. Circle I thought was fairly simple in its progression but it's helped a lot by generally being tiny. If you're still wondering, Death has the water purification thing and he hangs out in the bottom left corner of the map; you need to be able to push blocks to get in there. Biggest issue is remembering there was one in the entrance hall (which is a tiny midgame area).

Generally I do like when the game just lets you explore and find the path for yourself, because it means you usually also get the opportunity to check out various things locked behind the newest gadget and get a lot stronger during said exploration. The issue is that if you checked all the locations you remembered needing the gadget and still didn't find progression, it gets a bit ugly.

Super Metroid actually has had that moment for me...twice, my first time playing it and way later on a replay again, I went "gently caress I was lost before right here and now I'm lost again, I can't believe it". It's the part where you need powerbombs to get grapple, iirc. Just a random room but with an extra puzzle that is very easy to go "oh I need something else extra here" on

Rabbi Raccoon
Mar 31, 2009

I stabbed you dude!

Simply Simon posted:

Harmony is extremely bad about it, yeah. Circle I thought was fairly simple in its progression but it's helped a lot by generally being tiny. If you're still wondering, Death has the water purification thing and he hangs out in the bottom left corner of the map; you need to be able to push blocks to get in there. Biggest issue is remembering there was one in the entrance hall (which is a tiny midgame area).

Yeah I found it eventually. It was kinda fun getting to use the feather thingie for a little longer than you were supposed to, though. And sequence breaking is always fun

Simply Simon
Nov 6, 2010

📡scanning🛰️ for good game 🎮design🦔🦔🦔

Rabbi Raccoon posted:

Yeah I found it eventually. It was kinda fun getting to use the feather thingie for a little longer than you were supposed to, though. And sequence breaking is always fun
It is! I really like that Circle just lets you get through the poison water if you are willing to tank it. A lesser game would be "nuh-uh, there's a poison waterfall in the first room and you can't pass it!". And it's a "hell run" at a point where that's absolutely feasible even with moderate skill, not, like, the second area of the game.

FPzero
Oct 20, 2008

Game Over
Return of Mido


Episode 15: Chilling in the Fire Temple


I really love the use of the dried up enemies in this area, they tell such a story. Something's out there, but we don't know what.

Rabbi Raccoon
Mar 31, 2009

I stabbed you dude!
This game's full of surprises all the way through the credits. I was waiting for you to stumble on those blocks

Odd
Dec 30, 2006

I think everybody just needs to maybe cool out a little maybe
Aw dang, those iBuffalo controllers were really good. Mine gave up the ghost last year, I had it for like 10. My new replacement is an iNNEXT and it's fine but something about the iBuffalo was just right.

TooMuchAbstraction
Oct 14, 2012

I spent four years making
Waves of Steel
Hell yes I'm going to turn my avatar into an ad for it.
Fun Shoe
For the record, the Fire Temple music is from Super Castlevania IV.

Also, regarding those H blocks: in the Super Metroid Phazon hack, you can find Phazon fragments, and if you collect all of them, you unlock the Hyper beam for regular use. I have no clue what this hack has planned, I'm just saying: there's precedent. :v:

Rabbi Raccoon
Mar 31, 2009

I stabbed you dude!

TooMuchAbstraction posted:

Also, regarding those H blocks: in the Super Metroid Phazon hack, you can find Phazon fragments, and if you collect all of them, you unlock the Hyper beam for regular use. I have no clue what this hack has planned, I'm just saying: there's precedent. :v:

Oh, that's what they did. I think I finished that one but never got all the fragments

Falconer
Dec 7, 2003

Did you know, I was THE MOON once!

Yes! You see, one night it turned out the moon had been STOLEN!

The animal people asked ME to take its place as I am so WISE and BRILLIANT!!
This hack has made minor modifications to 'standard' Super Metroid a few times already (KOing Crocomire with a flying tackle instead of the usual method, Missiles/Super Missiles/Power Bombs sharing the same ammo, the night vision goggles visor, being able to exit the Ridley fight until you figure out how to crack the plot armor, etc) so the Hyper Beam being just another weapon upgrade seems fair enough.

FPzero
Oct 20, 2008

Game Over
Return of Mido

Odd posted:

Aw dang, those iBuffalo controllers were really good. Mine gave up the ghost last year, I had it for like 10. My new replacement is an iNNEXT and it's fine but something about the iBuffalo was just right.

Thankfully it seems to be working again! I don't know what happened during recording, but here's hoping it keeps on trucking for a few more years.

senrath
Nov 4, 2009

Look Professor, a destruct switch!


Could have temporarily failed for a lot of reasons, but if it happens again it might just be a cracked solder joint that needs to be reflowed.

Odd
Dec 30, 2006

I think everybody just needs to maybe cool out a little maybe

senrath posted:

Could have temporarily failed for a lot of reasons, but if it happens again it might just be a cracked solder joint that needs to be reflowed.

Mine was the left direction on the D-pad, it just wore out to nothin. 10 years is a good run though!

FPzero
Oct 20, 2008

Game Over
Return of Mido


Episode 16: Majora's Mask music opinions


Stone Tower Temple (upside-down) is probably my favorite dungeon theme, though Ikana Castle is also a very strong contender.

C-Euro
Mar 20, 2010

:science:
Soiled Meat
Thank you for always posting your Saturday videos to YT while my kid is napping :hfive:

Rabbi Raccoon
Mar 31, 2009

I stabbed you dude!
Man, the day the Space Pirates invest in technology that can't be operated by a gun arm the galaxy is gonna be screwed

Simply Simon
Nov 6, 2010

📡scanning🛰️ for good game 🎮design🦔🦔🦔
You seem to be extremely allergic to charging. Any reason? I wonder if that wouldn't have helped a lot against the Hive enemies even earlier.

TooMuchAbstraction
Oct 14, 2012

I spent four years making
Waves of Steel
Hell yes I'm going to turn my avatar into an ad for it.
Fun Shoe

Simply Simon posted:

You seem to be extremely allergic to charging. Any reason? I wonder if that wouldn't have helped a lot against the Hive enemies even earlier.

I'm just as happy to not be constantly listening to charging sounds, frankly.

Rabbi Raccoon
Mar 31, 2009

I stabbed you dude!
Honestly, it's probably habit. In the base game it's pretty useless outside of boss battles

FPzero
Oct 20, 2008

Game Over
Return of Mido

Yeah, charge beam is mostly useful early when you don't have other beams, and during boss fights after running out of Super Missiles. Otherwise firing normally is usually sufficient for most enemies.

ulmont
Sep 15, 2010

IF I EVER MISS VOTING IN AN ELECTION (EVEN AMERICAN IDOL) ,OR HAVE UNPAID PARKING TICKETS, PLEASE TAKE AWAY MY FRANCHISE

FPzero posted:

Yeah, charge beam is mostly useful early when you don't have other beams, and during boss fights after running out of Super Missiles. Otherwise firing normally is usually sufficient for most enemies.

If you watch the video again, your beam appears to have a fairly short range for some reason and was stopping just before hitting the enemies you were wondering about.

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Geemer
Nov 4, 2010



Looks like it was hitting the dry remains until that sprite fully disappeared.

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