[Mideast + Africa] Getting rid of Bongo- but at what Brice?

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > C-SPAM > [Mideast + Africa] Getting rid of Bongo- but at what Brice?

uninterrupted: Jun 20, 2011

Cindy the SKULL posted:

i feel extremely stupid for not figuring out whats the correct thing to do with jihadist prisoners of war, and frankly, i should've known better than to ask such a foolish question

"get Americas pedophile army out of a foreign country" should be like, step one. poo poo it was Syria and Russia that actually defeated isis, the us had some half hearted bombing run and sex crimes against civilians by yokels who decided to murder Arabs instead of getting a real job.

# ? Jan 28, 2024 17:49

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# ? Jun 3, 2024 07:20

Cindy the SKULL: Nov 27, 2023; by Athanatos
(and can't post for 10 years!)

yeah, it's objectively a good thing for america to gently caress off from anywhere, but how does that change the material situation for the people in the prison camps? do they get re-educated with kindness and compassion for the horror they've experienced and perpretrated, and come out as model internationalists? get settled in afrin maybe, now that turkey has purged the kurds? what, was gonna happen?

# ? Jan 28, 2024 17:54

i say swears online: Mar 4, 2005

crepeface posted:

Cindy the numbskull

# ? Jan 28, 2024 18:02

uninterrupted: Jun 20, 2011

Cindy the SKULL posted:

yeah, it's objectively a good thing for america to gently caress off from anywhere, but how does that change the material situation for the people in the prison camps? do they get re-educated with kindness and compassion for the horror they've experienced and perpretrated, and come out as model internationalists? get settled in afrin maybe, now that turkey has purged the kurds? what, was gonna happen?

you prosecute people. if they were actually beheading and raping people you punish them. If they were just related to isis members, as the vast majority of these people seem to be, you let them go.

it's a remix of 'we need to stay in afghanistan for the women!'

# ? Jan 28, 2024 18:05

Atrocious Joe: Sep 2, 2011

Sending this thread back 10 years would be very funny.

"Yeah, actually the US needs to continue occupying parts of Syria and maintaining massive prison camps that include women and children so the Islamist militias don't take power"

# ? Jan 28, 2024 18:09

Cindy the SKULL: Nov 27, 2023; by Athanatos
(and can't post for 10 years!)

america isn't keeping these people in those camps, the SDF is ya numbskulls

# ? Jan 28, 2024 18:20

Cindy the SKULL: Nov 27, 2023; by Athanatos
(and can't post for 10 years!)

uninterrupted posted:

you prosecute people. if they were actually beheading and raping people you punish them. If they were just related to isis members, as the vast majority of these people seem to be, you let them go.

it's a remix of 'we need to stay in afghanistan for the women!'

where the gently caress do they go? some white frenchwoman who converted, married a salafist and made two kids before the man blew himself up in an alawite mosque, where are they going to go? is Assad going to give them an apartment in Damascus and a pension, and wish them the best of luck?

# ? Jan 28, 2024 18:25

Atrocious Joe: Sep 2, 2011

quote:

RAND researchers hosted a subject matter expert workshop, supplemented by an in-depth literature review, to determine proposed courses of action to reduce security threats from and meet international standards for prisons holding presumed former Islamic State of Iraq and Syria (ISIS) fighters. The prisons are insecure and require physical reinforcements, otherwise they will continue to present a danger to the region and world given their potential for fueling an ISIS resurgence. Prisoners, including youth, remain in legal limbo with no internationally agreed-on justice procedures or specific legal charges, potentially leading to indefinite detention in poor living conditions. RAND's research and discussions revealed that the situation of the ISIS prisoners carries four problems and risks that can be mitigated through both short-term courses of action and medium-term policy directions.

Key Findings

The situation of the ISIS prisoners carries four problems.

The risk of a prison breakout is the most critical security threat from the current situation.

Guarding the prisons is a challenge because of overcrowding, low resources for guards, and insufficient physical building protections.

Conditions within the prisons and the treatment of prisoners present an additional risk as the poor conditions do not meet international norms for treatment of prisoners, exacerbate humanitarian and public health concerns, and have led to riots. In addition, these conditions could provide fodder for ISIS messaging about mistreatment by Syrian Democratic Forces and the Defeat-ISIS (D-ISIS) Coalition, the multinational alliance that fought ISIS and remains together to prevent ISIS's return.

The prisoners include youth in conditions that do not accord with humanitarian norms and standards of care for children and could lead to greater risk of their radicalization.

https://www.rand.org/pubs/research_reports/RRA2287-1.html

Rand Corporation does studies for the SDF?

Also NGOs have addressed that argument

quote:

Syria: States supporting SDF share responsibility for horrific human rights violations

Geneva - Euro-Med Monitor strongly condemns the continued international support to the Syrian Democratic Forces (SDF), which controls large areas of north-eastern Syria despite its involvement in grave human rights violations.

The SDF continues to receive generous political, military, and financial support from countries such as the United States of America, the United Kingdom, and Sweden, Euro-Med Monitor said in a statement. These countries lack respect for the rights of people residing in the areas which the SDF controls, especially as the latter holds thousands of prisoners in inhumane conditions, over allegations that have not been independently verified.

For years, the SDF has held more than 4000 people�including about 750 children�in extremely poor humanitarian conditions, and without trial or proper legal procedures. They claim that the prisoners or their parents are connected to the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (ISIL), which the SDF declared military victory over in March 2019, with air and logistical support from the international coalition led by the United States.

In August 2021, the United Kingdom approved plans worth $20 million to support SDF prisons and improve their conditions. In doing so, the UK ignored the alarming violations practised inside the prisons, which caused the death of several prisoners as well as the spread of tuberculosis and other infectious diseases amidst the near-total absence of medical care.

Thousands are currently detained in SDF prisons, but the harsh conditions present a particular danger to children, who face horrific violations that seriously threaten their physical and mental health. Prisoners endure conditions similar to victims of enforced disappearance, as they are deprived of visits, health care, and daylight. On the pretext of maintaining security, the SDF refuses to release injured or sick prisoners.

The ISIL attack on Al-Sina'a Prison in the Al-Hasakah Governorate in January 2022 resulted in the killing of about 500 people, revealing gross negligence in the treatment of prisoners there; there was no attempt by the SDF to clearly announce the number of dead or injured prisoners during the attack. Some detainees reported the killing and wounding of several other detainees, including children, during the bombing and clashes. They said the wounded did not receive care, adding that one child prisoner was witnessed bleeding to death without any medical attention.

Bo Viktor Nylund, UNICEF Representative in Syria, visited the prison following the ISIL attack and asserted the humanitarian difficulties of the detainees� situation. Nylund was told by some of the children that they were hungry, and in need of water and medical care.

In June 2022, the family of the arbitrarily detained Australian boy Youssef Dahab announced his death, without their knowing its specific cause. Dahab�s family said he had contracted tuberculosis earlier in prison, and been wounded during the attack on Al-Sina'a Prison. The family also said they had appealed to the Australian government for years to bring their child home, but the government did nothing about it.

For years now, the United States has supported the SDF with hundreds of millions of dollars and substantial amounts of weaponry as part of its war against ISIL. The US also constantly pledges to maintain its partnership with the SDF, with disregard for its disgraceful human rights record: the US Department of Defense has allocated $450 million of its 2023 budget to a program designed to train and equip the SDF, the Iraqi Security Forces, and the Kurdish Peshmerga forces.

In March 2022, Euro-Med Monitor documented the death of two detainees in SDF prisons in less than one month, due to what are believed to be cruel torture practices. Recurring cases of torture inside SDF prisons have exposed a systematic policy aimed at inflicting physical and psychological harm on detainees, intended to intimidate activists and political opponents.

Anas Jerjawi, Euro-Med Monitor's Chief Operations Officer, said: �The countries supporting the SDF must realize that the money they provide directly contributes to the implementation of horrific human rights violations, and is used to strengthen the system of persecution practised by the SDF in the areas it controls in north-eastern Syria�.

The countries supporting the Syrian Democratic Forces (SDF), especially the United States, must stop their unconditional support for the armed militia, pressure them to immediately release the hundreds of children detained in their custody without trial or valid legal reasons, and improve the humanitarian situation in all detention centres to ensure the provision of the basic needs of detainees, especially medical care.

All countries should work to return their citizens detained in SDF prisons, grant them a fair and legal assessment to determine their fate, and address the inhumane conditions they experience in the prisons.

https://euromedmonitor.org/en/article/5277/Syria:-States-supporting-SDF-share-responsibility-for-horrific-human-rights-violations

# ? Jan 28, 2024 18:26

Zedhe Khoja: Nov 10, 2017; sürgünden selamlar
yıkıcılar ulusuna

momma hosed a jihadi
better throw them kids in a cage forever

# ? Jan 28, 2024 18:27

Atrocious Joe: Sep 2, 2011

The US is going to spend millions of dollars in Syria on jihadists. It's just a fact. And it's either going to be spent on sending them guns, or keeping them and their families in giant prison camps. It's just the way the world works.

# ? Jan 28, 2024 18:30

Cindy the SKULL: Nov 27, 2023; by Athanatos
(and can't post for 10 years!)

alla yours minds flashing all the worst possible horrors at you when presented with the simple question of "what's gonna happen" tells me you don't really have any positive alternatives in mind

# ? Jan 28, 2024 18:35

Brandon Proust: Jun 22, 2006; "Like many intellectuals, he was incapable of scoring a simple goal in a simple way"

Cindy the SKULL posted:

where the gently caress do they go? some white frenchwoman who converted,

france

# ? Jan 28, 2024 18:38

Cindy the SKULL: Nov 27, 2023; by Athanatos
(and can't post for 10 years!)

Brandon Proust posted:

france

france refuses to accept them
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/09/14/world/europe/france-isis-families.html

# ? Jan 28, 2024 18:39

uninterrupted: Jun 20, 2011

Cindy the SKULL posted:

alla yours minds flashing all the worst possible horrors at you when presented with the simple question of "what's gonna happen" tells me you don't really have any positive alternatives in mind

everyone's been pretty clear about what should happen, you're the one in the fetal position making GBS threads and farting to the point you're spinning on the ground like a top because you think Muslims are intrinsically evil �\_(ツ)_/�

# ? Jan 28, 2024 18:44

Mandel Brotset: Jan 1, 2024

crepeface posted:

Cindy the numbskull

# ? Jan 28, 2024 18:48

Cindy the SKULL: Nov 27, 2023; by Athanatos
(and can't post for 10 years!)

uninterrupted posted:

because you think Muslims are intrinsically evil �\_(ツ)_/�

...where the gently caress did you get that you weirdo

# ? Jan 28, 2024 18:56

Cindy the SKULL: Nov 27, 2023; by Athanatos
(and can't post for 10 years!)

anyway, the solution is just obvious to everyone, and it's silly to talk about this further

# ? Jan 28, 2024 18:57

Zedhe Khoja: Nov 10, 2017; sürgünden selamlar
yıkıcılar ulusuna

crepeface posted:

Cindy the numbskull

# ? Jan 28, 2024 19:01

HallelujahLee: May 3, 2009

crepeface posted:

Cindy the numbskull

# ? Jan 28, 2024 19:23

tristeham: Jul 31, 2022

crepeface posted:

Cindy the numbskull

# ? Jan 28, 2024 19:32

Pener Kropoopkin: Jan 30, 2013; by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
(and can't post for 25 days!)

the SDF is operating Guantanamo Bay for children but what can be done? :unsmigghh:

# ? Jan 28, 2024 20:30

i say swears online: Mar 4, 2005

while we were arguing, a drone blew up a US base in jordan and 3 soldiers are dead

# ? Jan 28, 2024 20:43

HallelujahLee: May 3, 2009

good

# ? Jan 28, 2024 20:55

SplitSoul: Dec 31, 2000

Pener Kropoopkin posted:

the SDF is operating Guantanamo Bay for children but what can be done?

But Guat�namo Bay was already Guant�namo Bay for children.

# ? Jan 28, 2024 21:12

i say swears online: Mar 4, 2005

https://twitter.com/JohnCornyn/status/1751647557023859017

# ? Jan 28, 2024 21:15

Weka: May 5, 2019; That child totally had it coming. Nobody should be able to be out at dusk except cars.

Cindy the SKULL posted:

where the gently caress do they go? some white frenchwoman who converted, married a salafist and made two kids before the man blew himself up in an alawite mosque, where are they going to go? is Assad going to give them an apartment in Damascus and a pension, and wish them the best of luck?

Uh, France? They have been repatriating many people in this situation.

Cindy the SKULL posted:

america isn't keeping these people in those camps, the SDF is ya numbskulls

As an American proxy, as requested by America, for American terrorist purposes.

# ? Jan 28, 2024 21:28

Weka: May 5, 2019; That child totally had it coming. Nobody should be able to be out at dusk except cars.

Cindy the SKULL posted:

france refuses to accept them
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/09/14/world/europe/france-isis-families.html

This article mentions 18 families, 16 of which returned to France.

# ? Jan 28, 2024 21:32

Cindy the SKULL: Nov 27, 2023; by Athanatos
(and can't post for 10 years!)

Weka posted:

Uh, France? They have been repatriating many people in this situation.

uh, what? no, they havent

e:16 families is a fraction of the french citizens in the camps

# ? Jan 28, 2024 21:33

Weka: May 5, 2019; That child totally had it coming. Nobody should be able to be out at dusk except cars.

Cindy the SKULL posted:

uh, what? no, they havent

e:16 families is a fraction of the french citizens in the camps

Here is a more recent article, the first google result for 'france isis wife return'

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...y%20has%20said.

40 more isis wives repatriated of the ~65 detailed in the article you posted

# ? Jan 28, 2024 22:12

Weka: May 5, 2019; That child totally had it coming. Nobody should be able to be out at dusk except cars.

In before '56 is a fraction of 81'

# ? Jan 28, 2024 22:14

Votskomit: Jun 26, 2013

It's really nice to see a thread dedicated to Africa / Middle East where no one falls for the western chauvinist "Yeah we may be bad for occupying them but can you imagine how bad it'd be if we left the brown people to govern themselves?" nonsense,
nor the "but what about the white victims?" nonsense,
nor the "all I'm asking for is a comprehensive solution that covers every edge case with zero downsides and THEN I'll support your anticolonial opinion" nonsense,
that usually pervades most online spaces when they talk about Africa.

It's refreshing.

# ? Jan 28, 2024 22:14

Cindy the SKULL: Nov 27, 2023; by Athanatos
(and can't post for 10 years!)

bratna, the opinions i hear fra naija bros aba boko haram, mang....

# ? Jan 28, 2024 22:36

Jose: Jul 24, 2007; Adrian Chiles is a broadcaster and writer

Just learned that almost surely up until the US pulled out afghanistan was producing massive amounts of ephedra as well as poppies for creating crystal meth to sell to markets in africa

# ? Jan 28, 2024 23:54

Pomeroy: Apr 20, 2020

Great news out of West Africa:
https://twitter.com/manolo_realengo/status/1751644390785777835

# ? Jan 29, 2024 01:15

Weka: May 5, 2019; That child totally had it coming. Nobody should be able to be out at dusk except cars.

Votskomit posted:

It's really nice to see a thread dedicated to Africa / Middle East where no one falls for the western chauvinist "Yeah we may be bad for occupying them but can you imagine how bad it'd be if we left the brown people to govern themselves?" nonsense,
nor the "but what about the white victims?" nonsense,
nor the "all I'm asking for is a comprehensive solution that covers every edge case with zero downsides and THEN I'll support your anticolonial opinion" nonsense,
that usually pervades most online spaces when they talk about Africa.

It's refreshing.

I believe in the white South African genocide but I think it's good

# ? Jan 29, 2024 02:11

Mandel Brotset: Jan 1, 2024

Pomeroy posted:

Great news out of West Africa:
https://twitter.com/manolo_realengo/status/1751644390785777835

nice, eat poo poo ecowas

# ? Jan 29, 2024 02:29

Pener Kropoopkin: Jan 30, 2013; by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
(and can't post for 25 days!)

Weka posted:

As an American proxy, as requested by America, for American terrorist purposes.

It doesn't make any sense for the SDF to do it. They have enough problems on their hands with the Turks and the FSA without also having to incarcerate 50,000 women and children. Why else would they be doing it if not the United States wanting to guarantee the resurgence of ISIS in the next generation?

# ? Jan 29, 2024 03:48

Complications: Jun 19, 2014

Pomeroy posted:

Great news out of West Africa:
https://twitter.com/manolo_realengo/status/1751644390785777835

Mandel Brotset posted:

nice, eat poo poo ecowas

Just out of general curiosity I'd like to know the precise reasons ECOWAS is bad as I'm not familiar with the region. Background reading on ECOWAS paints it as as economic union with a fuckton of 'former' French colonies in it and to my knowledge France still basically runs most of its colonies - so ECOWAS would be mostly an instrument of France loving around with Africa still? Or is ECOWAS more like the EU which has a few more prosperous nations sucking the life out of the rest?

# ? Jan 29, 2024 04:01

i say swears online: Mar 4, 2005

Complications posted:

Just out of general curiosity I'd like to know the precise reasons ECOWAS is bad as I'm not familiar with the region. Background reading on ECOWAS paints it as as economic union with a fuckton of 'former' French colonies in it and to my knowledge France still basically runs most of its colonies - so ECOWAS would be mostly an instrument of France loving around with Africa still? Or is ECOWAS more like the EU which has a few more prosperous nations sucking the life out of the rest?

i'd say ecowas is more US-aligned than france, but france has a lot of influence

# ? Jan 29, 2024 04:11

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# ? Jun 3, 2024 07:20

Weka: May 5, 2019; That child totally had it coming. Nobody should be able to be out at dusk except cars.

Most of the population of ECOWAS lives in Nigeria, which is an ex British colony.

# ? Jan 29, 2024 09:19

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