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The rockets going faster isn't as significant for buildings because they're mostly stationary. It gives engies less time to get out the short circuit and makes it slightly harder to time, but it's less significant an issue than against a moving player. Hell, a rocket that moved at 1/3 speed and did 300% damage would be devastating against buildings but worthless against players in a 1v1. If you want to nerf the dh then reduce its rampup, that would limit its ability to erase scouts.
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Feb 1, 2024 01:39
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The direct hit is from an era before the heavy minigun was buffed to do more damage to engineer buildings and in certain locations (the flag room in turbine comes to mind) it was nearly impossible to break in without it because almost no other weapon could body three turrets spread across the area in the span of one ubercharge. Having said that, I don't think it needs changed now that the dangers of that have been reduced by making the heavy more effective against them. Imo sentries should be an effective defense primarily when there is an engaged team backing them up and keeping them in play and a speedbump when there isn't.
reignofevil fucked around with this message at 02:51 on Feb 1, 2024 |
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Feb 1, 2024 02:49
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Ditocoaf posted:Don't let me stop anyone from saying their piece again, but I just want to point out that the argument from the last time you raised this opinion ended on the previous page of this thread. To be fair this ain't a very active thread so I had actually forgotten that I had posted that opinion comparatively "recently" Baron von Eevl posted:The rockets going faster isn't as significant for buildings because they're mostly stationary. It gives engies less time to get out the short circuit and makes it slightly harder to time, but it's less significant an issue than against a moving player. Hell, a rocket that moved at 1/3 speed and did 300% damage would be devastating against buildings but worthless against players in a 1v1. I have no problem whatsoever with the DH being "Scout-B-Gone"
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Feb 1, 2024 08:24
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I will accept removing the DH's building bonus the day after they remove the Wrangler's shield. Until then, it's a necessary evil.drrockso20 posted:To be fair this ain't a very active thread so I had actually forgotten that I had posted that opinion comparatively "recently"
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Feb 1, 2024 08:56
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drrockso20 posted:To be fair this ain't a very active thread so I had actually forgotten that I had posted that opinion comparatively "recently" Please don't moan about it once every 6 weeks
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Feb 1, 2024 10:27
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Have any scientist discovered why no one has made an online multiplayer first person shooter as good as team fortress 2 despite having 17 years to make an attempt. Aint nothing out there like having a good day of playing the demonstration man
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Feb 1, 2024 11:19
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Whitenoise Poster posted:Have any scientist discovered why no one has made an online multiplayer first person shooter as good as team fortress 2 despite having 17 years to make an attempt. In a cunning ploy TF2 introduced random lootboxes into online FPS games, thus poisoning the well for future attempts.
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Feb 1, 2024 11:53
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still pretty pissed off that there hasn't been any new weapons since Jungle Inferno 
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Feb 1, 2024 14:17
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Whitenoise Poster posted:Have any scientist discovered why no one has made an online multiplayer first person shooter as good as team fortress 2 despite having 17 years to make an attempt. in tf2, the game came first and the hats were a tacked-on afterthought in all its competitors, the hats are the priority, competitive matchmade sports nonsense is the second priority, and the rest of the game is an afterthought
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Feb 1, 2024 17:08
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Honestly, maybe it's for the best that ranked was a colossal failure
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Feb 1, 2024 17:52
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Yeah, TF2 started with years of unwavering support, and Valve was then able to make vast sums of money by slowly tapering off supporting the game and trickling in a constantly increasing supply of cosmetics and monetizations. Other game devs that try to repeat the formula are unable to temper their greed and try to skip immediately to the “we get all the money” phase. In order for there to be another TF2, there would have to be a studio willing and able to put years and years of effort into a multiplayer game and then sell it in a way that doesn’t necessarily maximize revenue in the short term.
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Feb 1, 2024 17:53
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There's something to be said for the market at the time of TF2s release being the perfect environment for it to succeed so much in addition to the fact Valve pioneered lootboxes and cosmetics value. The first person introducing something is typically gonna be the biggest winner if they pull it off right, and Valve sure did.
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Feb 1, 2024 17:59
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Whitenoise Poster posted:Have any scientist discovered why no one has made an online multiplayer first person shooter as good as team fortress 2 despite having 17 years to make an attempt. the genre went in a radically different direction for a number of years due to cod so there really weren't many attempts for a while. then when it began swinging back the first attempt at a new TF2 was Overwatch which was super popular but also had an extremely misguided design philosophy, and subsequent attempts copied that more than they did TF2 and ran into the same problems Also, while it doesn't play like TF2, Titanfall 2 is an online fps that is good. It's funny to me that my two favorite shooters are both called TF2 and were largely abandoned by their developers but maintain an appreciable player base years later despite an ongoing plague of bots ruining their public servers.
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Feb 1, 2024 18:12
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Whitenoise Poster posted:Have any scientist discovered why no one has made an online multiplayer first person shooter as good as team fortress 2 despite having 17 years to make an attempt. My simplest reason is that TF2 is basically the last major multiplayer FPS built on community servers first and foremost. For a wide variety of reasons major companies absolutely do not want to build things in that fashion anymore. Also its one of the last that was still using 90s style advanced movement mechanics (though I haven't played stuff like Quake Champions so I don't know if that was too).
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Feb 1, 2024 19:51
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Quake Champions did it yeah, it's not that people have tried but the FPS shooter has gone extremely to more basic movement aside from whatever weird poo poo you see in Modern CoD. That and a move to matchmaking/competitive focus means they've drifted away from how older modern shooters on PC used to function.
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Feb 1, 2024 20:10
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other shooters don't let you move that gear up, how can they even compete
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Feb 1, 2024 20:13
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What's really interesting about this question is that, like, I can't honestly say that Valve has genuinely given the game Good support through its life, like something I'm continuously amazed by is the absolute cavalcade of half finished, lazy, and abandoned features that probably could have turned into something good if they put any effort into things and didn't treat TF2 as a dumping ground for ideas they came up with during a drunken stag do at 3am, along with some of the worst, most poorly thought out design and balance decisions I've ever had to deal with in a game like this. The support helps, but there are other games that also got support, probably much better support honestly, that just don't have the legs that TF2 does, there's something about TF2 that it had from day 1 that helped ensure it would last decades, its a bit like Age of Empires 2 or something in that regard, which has had a similar trajectory.
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Feb 1, 2024 20:18
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TF2's most revolutionary feature was making the healing class (kinda) fun to play
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Feb 1, 2024 20:45
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There is zero chance a modern game would make a builder class's construct as powerful as the default sentry gun. People would riot in the e-streets if they were mulched from full hp by the auto tracking hitscan machine with 210 hp in 1.5 seconds in an e-sports shooter
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Feb 1, 2024 20:52
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Countblanc posted:There is zero chance a modern game would make a builder class's construct as powerful as the default sentry gun. People would riot in the e-streets if they were mulched from full hp by the auto tracking hitscan machine with 210 hp in 1.5 seconds in an e-sports shooter So much of it is like, an overall balance and game design thing though. TF2's maps and team sizes create a nature ebb and flow that getting punked by a sentry is annoying, but probably not going to cause the match to swing widely in an instant, and sentries being so strong helps to make battle lines where combat will focus for awhile. Modern e-sport shooters all have like team sizes of 3-5 players, so annihlated for turning the wrong corner poses some considerably different balance issues. But also, yeah, if you want a high mobility game, or even something like Counter Strike, yeah, a sentry gun like TF2's is going to be hell. e: Like I do kind of appreciate that Toborn needs to be actively aggressive and trying to distract players from his sentry, as opposed to just turtling up in a corner.
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Feb 1, 2024 20:59
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Milo and POTUS posted:TF2's most revolutionary feature was making the healing class (kinda) fun to play hard disagree, in fact it did basically the opposite and removed everything interesting or enjoyable and reduced it to a pure heal hose as opposed to most other shooters where the healing class was "the guy who shoots thing(and can heal, also)". the end result being that medic's primary purpose is to bumble around behind their teammates holding M1 at them so that they can go play the game while the medic himself cannot. people who "like" medic actually like winning and have associated playing medic with winning and not playing medic with losing, because medic is very powerful and teams without medics tend to lose. medic itself is not likeable because you are literally a dispenser with legs and the only people who would find it fun are the sort of people who would find it even more fun to watch paint dry
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Feb 1, 2024 21:01
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medics fine
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Feb 1, 2024 21:08
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(Fortress Forever intro splash) The Medic
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Feb 1, 2024 21:08
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cock hero flux posted:hard disagree, in fact it did basically the opposite and removed everything interesting or enjoyable and reduced it to a pure heal hose as opposed to most other shooters where the healing class was "the guy who shoots thing(and can heal, also)". the end result being that medic's primary purpose is to bumble around behind their teammates holding M1 at them so that they can go play the game while the medic himself cannot. people who "like" medic actually like winning and have associated playing medic with winning and not playing medic with losing, because medic is very powerful and teams without medics tend to lose. medic itself is not likeable because you are literally a dispenser with legs and the only people who would find it fun are the sort of people who would find it even more fun to watch paint dry I did say kinda
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Feb 1, 2024 21:11
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I don't think it was a bad idea to make Medic's fundamental ability mechanically easy to use, but it leads to issues regarding engagement and skill ceilings and I think in light of that its pretty clear why the Crossbow is one of the most beloved weapons ever added to the game since it complements Medic's intended role in a way that rewards skilled shooting and good timing, as they should in an FPS.
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Feb 1, 2024 21:17
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I want a medigun that automatically heals nearby allies when you shoot stuff with syringe guns(and buffs the syringe guns somewhat). let me battlemedic while also healing and not being useless
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Feb 1, 2024 21:23
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Positioning and gamesense are really important skills on par with clicking on mans and I think it's ok that the game has a class that is about other skills than clicking on mans. Medic does have a pretty low skill ceiling but it's still higher than most players are gonna reach.
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Feb 1, 2024 21:25
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the holy poopacy posted:Positioning and gamesense are really important skills on par with clicking on mans and I think it's ok that the game has a class that is about other skills than clicking on mans. Medic does have a pretty low skill ceiling but it's still higher than most players are gonna reach. medic is still about clicking on men it's just that the men you're clicking on want to be clicked on so instead of running around and shooting at you they stand still and go "please click on me"
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Feb 1, 2024 21:32
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cock hero flux posted:medic is still about clicking on men it's just that the men you're clicking on want to be clicked on so instead of running around and shooting at you they stand still and go "please click on me" no they still run around and try to dodge you, as anyone trying to use the crossbow for heals can attest to
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Feb 1, 2024 21:33
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well don’t that beat all
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Feb 1, 2024 21:40
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Jabor posted:no they still run around and try to dodge you, as anyone trying to use the crossbow for heals can attest to Also Medigun.
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Feb 1, 2024 21:59
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cock hero flux posted:medic is still about clicking on men it's just that the men you're clicking on want to be clicked on so instead of running around and shooting at you they stand still and go "please click on me"  Thanks, Mrs. DeGroot.
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Feb 1, 2024 22:02
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i saw a red tape recorder named 'valve time inducer' which made me lol
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Feb 1, 2024 22:04
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Whitenoise Poster posted:Have any scientist discovered why no one has made an online multiplayer first person shooter as good as team fortress 2 despite having 17 years to make an attempt. TF2 isn't even ten years old, what are you talking about? ... Oh. Oh my god.
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Feb 1, 2024 22:11
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Endorph posted:i saw a red tape recorder named 'valve time inducer' which made me lol What's the joke? (I don't play spy lol)
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Feb 1, 2024 22:15
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Milo and POTUS posted:What's the joke? (I don't play spy lol) the red tape recorder is a sapper that takes like 5 times longer to destroy buildings than the regular one
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Feb 1, 2024 22:18
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Also it reverse previous progress on a building that the engineer made.
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Feb 1, 2024 22:29
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Oh so it's a Valve™ joke?
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Feb 2, 2024 01:02
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Milo and POTUS posted:Oh so it's a Valve™ joke? No it's a fortnite joke
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Feb 2, 2024 01:20
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khwarezm posted:What's really interesting about this question is that, like, I can't honestly say that Valve has genuinely given the game Good support through its life, like something I'm continuously amazed by is the absolute cavalcade of half finished, lazy, and abandoned features that probably could have turned into something good if they put any effort into things and didn't treat TF2 as a dumping ground for ideas they came up with during a drunken stag do at 3am, along with some of the worst, most poorly thought out design and balance decisions I've ever had to deal with in a game like this. The support helps, but there are other games that also got support, probably much better support honestly, that just don't have the legs that TF2 does, there's something about TF2 that it had from day 1 that helped ensure it would last decades, its a bit like Age of Empires 2 or something in that regard, which has had a similar trajectory. TF2 didn't get microtransactions until three years after it first came out. Until then, it was a normal game that you bought once and then never spent money on again. Valve kept updating it and supporting it for the sake of maintaining a healthy player population and continuing to bring in new players. The focus was on making a fun game, not on making a game that was just fun enough to tolerate all the skinner box bullshit begging you to come back every single day and grind out your dailies. It's very different from all the live-service bullshit we see nowadays where every game launches with a season pass or a lootbox gacha, experience points and level-ups everywhere, does events every two weeks to keep people coming back every single day for those daily rewards, and so on. Plus there's stuff like being a game that was based on community servers rather than matchmaking, let community members create new weapons and maps rather than doing everything in-house according to what'll sell the most lootboxes, and so on.
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Feb 2, 2024 01:38
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