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Safety Factor posted:Nah, there was some insane idea that if you took a large enough unit of skaven slaves, deployed them horizontally, and then turned them they would contact an enemy unit and lock them down from across the board with an endless column of lovely rats. And you could then fire into whatever that enemy unit was. That came from the rulebook not having a very thorough explanation of wheeling I think? Like it didnt specifically say when you made a wheel the maximum distance a model could travel was its movement characteristic.
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Feb 2, 2024 22:37
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My favourite variant of that, was Night Goblin units with instant fire Fanatics. 
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Feb 2, 2024 22:46
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Hello everyone, I have some older WarHams that I have no real use for, and curious if some can be identified, and a general note of any that may be worth something to anyone. I honestly just want to get rid of these, but I don't know how to price them at all as it stands.   Vampire Count guy right?  Some Pegasus chick, her weapon is very bendy, and one of the wings didn't glue well, probably should be pinned I guess? All of it is there though.  Some random Dark Elves I think, they have instruments, a banner, etc.   Warlord Head Taker?  9/10 of these Dark Elf Warriors? Most of the stuff is here, probably missing a sword bit or two?  Skeleton Horse?   Random human peeps? Any of these of interest? Even as a big lot? I know I have the 3 headed Chaos Dragon somewhere around here too... ( This guy:  completely unpainted or assembled though )
Drowning Rabbit fucked around with this message at 17:52 on Feb 3, 2024 |
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Feb 3, 2024 17:48
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If you're in the US, I'm into the sneaky vampire guy, the mounted wight with the bat wing helmet, and the skeleton horse.
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Feb 3, 2024 17:56
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The Pegasus is Morathi, Queen of the dark elves. The blistered Skaven is an old named character, the bat-wing helmet human goes with the skeleton horse, the top guy is a chaos sorcerer, and the musical dark elves are a command group for Black Guard. I'd love to get that two headed dragon if you're in the US. It's Galrauch, who inexplicably goes for $30 - $140 on eBay.
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Feb 3, 2024 18:10
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EdsTeioh posted:If you're in the US, I'm into the sneaky vampire guy, the mounted wight with the bat wing helmet, and the skeleton horse. I'm in New England, so yeah. PM me and we can work something out. moths posted:The Pegasus is Morathi, Queen of the dark elves. The blistered Skaven is an old named character, the bat-wing helmet human goes with the skeleton horse, the top guy is a chaos sorcerer, and the musical dark elves are a command group for Black Guard. I have to dig up the dragon, he's around here somewhere, I have him in the box still. I'm pretty sure that I had looked into selling it before, and found out that people used that model in 40k as a chaos demon if I recall...
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Feb 3, 2024 18:18
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Leperflesh posted:The story goes that the player in white shirt there was cheesing a 40k game by holding his entire army (they're all on bikes) in reserve. The idea is to get to bring them all on from the opponent's edge of the table after the other player has to do their deployment, putting them at a severe disadvantage. But the fellow in the black shirt realized he could cheese right back, using the unit coherence of his large Kroot unit to deploy it so that it completely covers the table edge on which the bikes have to enter. And they're not allowed to enter within x inches of a unit. So in the background there's white shirt consulting with a judge, who eventually agreed this was legal and gave the match to the guy in the black shirt. Funnily enough GW have just brought this whole thing up again in a AoS article: https://www.warhammer-community.com/2024/02/02/call-the-judge-grand-justice-gormayne-weighs-in-on-tabletop-disputes/ And indeed they decree RAW wins the day and tis 'precedent established in ancient tournament record'. All told in the manner of a ghoul judge, of course, bless em
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Feb 3, 2024 19:34
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also the toilet dice
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Feb 3, 2024 19:48
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The skaven warlord is Queek Head-Taker, he was a pretty good named character with a sweet back rack fulla skulls.
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Feb 3, 2024 23:33
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Isn't the additional background on that pic that Everything In Reserves Guy had been doing his everything in reserves trick for a while and people were getting tired of his poo poo, so Infiltrate Kroot Guy made an army specifically to hard-counter it?
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Feb 3, 2024 23:42
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Something that gets lost in theory-hammer is that your gimmick is only going to be a surprise one time. By the time this happened, that Tau player has likely had hours to plan a counter. I made a stupid discovery today and the AoS dawnbringer flesh-eater-court and a box of 20 ghouls adds up to a thousand points of vampire counts. (Using the character as a Striogi.)  I'm curious if four 10-strong packs of ghouls can make their points back, but I'm going to find out. If I can find Ghouls in stock anywhere. Jeez. E: Fear is written, "If a unit is engaged with an enemy unit that both causes Fear and has a higher Unit Strength ..." (emphasis mine.) Does that mean multiple fear-causing units can't add up? So 10 elves guys getting charged by 10 ghouls and then 10 more in the same turn don't make a check? moths fucked around with this message at 01:20 on Feb 4, 2024 |
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Feb 4, 2024 01:09
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moths posted:E: Fear is written, "If a unit is engaged with an enemy unit that both causes Fear and has a higher Unit Strength ..." (emphasis mine.) Does that mean multiple fear-causing units can't add up? On 168, it says you only check once per turn.
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Feb 4, 2024 01:48
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That's true, but what I'm asking is: Do the Elves even need to check? Because neither opposing Ghoul unit has a greater Unit Strength, it looks like the answer is no. Which only gets sillier if a third unit of ghouls charges in.
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Feb 4, 2024 04:45
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Well that depends, what are the modifiers when charging the flank? Because I don't see how you're cramming three units of zombies in front a single elven one.
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Feb 4, 2024 05:17
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Suppose they're lined up ten across and one deep, just for the purposes of this exercise.
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Feb 4, 2024 05:28
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7+ wide elves nestled between two impassible terrains, Ghouls are 5x2 and all in the elf front arc. Seven wide seems to be the starting point for a lot of melee infantry since that is getting full attacks against other infantry. I was gonna say that they would be better off hitting stuff in the flanks after it has been (kinda) pinned by skellies/zombies, but they are back to being Undead (since like 4th, 5th?), and can't march now. You might be better off getting as many of those Fangs of the Blood Queen box since it is $10 cheaper than getting bats and wolves on their own (and extra Sekhars would be real easy to move). Though I have been looking for excuses to spam 'bats and wolves' after seeing that. e: Actually, they could march in 4th and 5th, not in 8th, so they are continuing their previous ouvre. Amazing. Robert Facepalmer fucked around with this message at 06:14 on Feb 4, 2024 |
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Feb 4, 2024 06:00
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Ghouls have Reserve move, so they can move a second time in the shooting phase. They seem like perfect troops for the flanks, as they get no benefit from the Hellish Vigor spell your more highest level mage probably has.
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Feb 4, 2024 06:47
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Stephenls posted:Isn't the additional background on that pic that Everything In Reserves Guy had been doing his everything in reserves trick for a while and people were getting tired of his poo poo, so Infiltrate Kroot Guy made an army specifically to hard-counter it? No it was just a popular mechanic at the time for bike armies. That style of army needed the first turn so they could take out the scary things that could really hurt them then get into combat round 2 with only having to survive 1 round of shooting. If you lost the first turn roll you kept everything in reserve to essentially do the same thing. Its just very few armies had a hard counter to it that would be in a normal tournament force. Kroot were at the time very effective troops for their points cost and could infiltrate, so the guy would have had them in his army anyway.
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Feb 4, 2024 08:13
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it had been so long since i played brets that i forgot hippogryph knights werent an actual whfb model jesus lmao
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Feb 4, 2024 09:02
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Robert Facepalmer posted:7+ wide elves nestled between two impassible terrains, Ghouls are 5x2 and all in the elf front arc. Seven wide seems to be the starting point for a lot of melee infantry since that is getting full attacks against other infantry. 7th is when they dropped the “alive” keyword for ghouls, and made them ranked instead of skirmish I remember bc I was a middle school dork and read so many angry grog complaints on hams forums when that book came out
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Feb 4, 2024 13:16
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I don't know if Skirmisher was ever like this before, but now it's optional: "A unit consisting of models with this special rule may adopt a Skirmish formation, as described on page 184." (Emphasis mine.) hoiyes posted:Ghouls have Reserve move, so they can move a second time in the shooting phase. They seem like perfect troops for the flanks, as they get no benefit from the Hellish Vigor spell your more highest level mage probably has. Van Hel's can give them +1D3 M, which synergizes with their reserve move and Move Through Cover, making them ridiculously mobile. If skirmishing, they'll generally form a fighting rank two bigger than their target. Fell Bats also seems like a missile: Hellish Vigor, 10" fly, and Swiftstride gives them a 20"+2d6 threat range (max 29") - ignoring terrain! E: i goofed - charge doesn't get a reserve move, but I forgot to add it above so I two-wronged it into being correct. moths fucked around with this message at 17:35 on Feb 4, 2024 |
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Feb 4, 2024 16:08
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Dire Wolves are real good as well. M9, Vanguard, Reserve Move, Swiftstride. Nice 27” move on the first turn. Another fun bit is Open Order, so they can cruise down the side of the board, then just pivot at the end to hide their flanks and set up for a charge next turn without wasting any movement on wheeling. e: I also like how hosed up Hellish Vigor is and _maybe_ it will get an errata? I guess use the higher casting values for now and if it does get clarified, it will get easier? Robert Facepalmer fucked around with this message at 17:06 on Feb 4, 2024 |
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Feb 4, 2024 16:58
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Finally picked up my Tomb Kings box! Have assembled the first four skeleton warriors (no shields yet, I'll paint them on the sprue and stick them on later). Have already lost a left arm after it pinged off the frame while I was cutting it. One of the lads looks like he's been on the undead beers for the last three thousand years and is a bit wonky so he'll have to go on the back left of his unit.
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Feb 4, 2024 17:28
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I wish they had resculpted TK skeletons instead of the chonk boys that are buffer than the guard or characters. I guess this means we’re getting the ancient helf militia with monkey hands too 
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Feb 4, 2024 17:36
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I like the skeleton horses with the ©1993 on them. It's been a long long time since I've had to assemble an army from plastic and looking at it you can see the attraction of the monopose single piece units from the 4th edition Fantasy box. A lot easier to get a game up and running then (not least because half your army was cardboard).
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Feb 4, 2024 22:25
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I had a fuckload of Skull Pass Night Gobbos I sold cheap to a friend that said he was going to make an army out of (that never happened...). That is probably one of my biggest hobby regrets. In a similar vein, if they do start replacing core plastics, I really hope they do monopose sprues of dudes. Don't care that five of you all have the same head, you are living in ranks 2+, be happy you are getting a shade AND a highlight...
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Feb 4, 2024 23:23
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I’d love for them to reprint skull pass and isle of blood tbh. Very pretty models and you barely notice the monoposing.
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Feb 4, 2024 23:30
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Got to play this for the first time today, first time playing any kind of rank and flank game. My ogres seemed pretty busted at a lower points level (750) so going to 1250 next time.
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Feb 4, 2024 23:53
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Finally got to play this last night. Took some high elves against my mate's ogres in a learning game at 1250 points. Some thoughts: Ellyrian Reavers are good at march blocking and staying out of charge arcs, keep them in open order and use them to break the rank bonus of chaff. White Lions are deadly on the charge, but will get absolutely crushed in any later round of combat, they'd better cripple the unit they hit. Giving your prince the "Warden of Saphery" honor gives them the killing blow special rule, and a sword of hoeth (S+2, ap-2, magical attacks, 2 hands) for 10 points! Normally you'd be paying 45 points for the headsmans axe which is same but worse. Ogres will not be even slightly slowed down by a unit of 10 elves. I really like facing on single characters/monsters, because now they aren't just cruise missiles that can see and go anywhere, you can actually avoid their facing. Gnoblars next to a tyrant are annoyingly hard to remove. And a question: If a unit falls back in good order through an enemy unit, do they take damage as if they had fled through the enemy unit or do they stop. Same question with an allied unit, do they bump into the allies and stop or pop through as per a flee move.
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Feb 5, 2024 07:35
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hooman posted:And a question: Definitely the former, as I understand it. FBIGO is a special flee move but still a flee move; the unit rallies automatically when the move is complete, but while it's happening it counts as fleeing and triggers all relevant rules interactions. (Unlike giving ground) I'm a huge fan of this rules change BTW. In previous editions I hated how a single unlucky Ld check could wipe whole blocks off the board. Too bad it's almost certainly going to be months before I actually get a game in...
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Feb 5, 2024 08:24
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i too really like the new break rules. Giving the winner the option to disengage regardless of the result of the break test is *such* a nice touch. And I’m legit impressed that they managed to make combat less all or nothing without ruining units that rely on a strong initial charge. Although idk if I like that following up into a FBIGO unit is *only* a charge, and doesn’t count as a “new” combat for things like flails, hatred, etc.
Gato The Elder fucked around with this message at 09:44 on Feb 5, 2024 |
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Feb 5, 2024 09:37
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And this is super minor, but the FBIGO rules make the dwarf flee/pursue roll mod into something with tradeoffs instead of pure penalty. If you’re automatically going to rally, and you can’t be run down, then fleeing 1d6-1 is probably better than fleeing a full 1d6
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Feb 5, 2024 09:42
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hooman posted:I really like facing on single characters/monsters, because now they aren't just cruise missiles that can see and go anywhere, you can actually avoid their facing. As the poster above mentioned, the fall back in good order is a short flee move with an automatic rally at the end, so apply the same rules for fleeing units. Also, the bit about single characters is true, however take into account that single character with infantry or cavalry type still have the skirmish formation, so watch out for the 360º of vision.
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Feb 5, 2024 09:54
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Angry Lobster posted:As the poster above mentioned, the fall back in good order is a short flee move with an automatic rally at the end, so apply the same rules for fleeing units. Also, the bit about single characters is true, however take into account that single character with infantry or cavalry type still have the skirmish formation, so watch out for the 360º of vision. Ah, I had missed that with my mage on foot, I was carefully setting up his facing. But he becomes skirmish because he wasn't a monsterous creature so didn't have lumbering/close order! Thanks!
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Feb 5, 2024 10:06
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Also reading in all the places for disruption: Skirmishers don't disrupt units when in the flank or rear. Heavy infantry need a unit strength of 10 in the flank/rear to be disrupted. Everything else needs a unit strength of 5 in the flank/rear to be disrupted. Another question that came up: Travel Mystical Pathway in elementalism and Move Or Shoot weapons: Move or Shoot A weapon with this special rule cannot be used in the Shooting phase if the model equipped with it moved for any reason during this turn (including rallying and reforming) Travel Mystical Pathway If the target friendly unit is not fleeing and has not already moved during this Movement phase, you may immediately remove it from the battlefield and replace it anywhere within 12" of its original location, but not within 6" of any enemy models. The target friendly unit cannot move again during this Movement phase. Is the remove and replace a "move" as per move and shoot or not? It didn't end up coming up, but if it's not a move it's a good way to reposition war machines for better shots.
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Feb 5, 2024 13:37
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I'd say it's intended to be a move because it says you "cannot move again."
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Feb 5, 2024 13:39
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For FBIGO, if a unit has a unit to its flank or rear, loses a modified break check and then falls back in good order, then the enemies pursue, do the pursuing units then end up in the front for the next combat? It just feels weird that failing a check puts you in a better position where everything is in your front than passing your check and being stuck in a worse position. I guess all models get to attack now regardless of being base to base so you are just losing the negating of ranks so multiple units in the front isn't as bad for the units crammed in there. Eggplant Squire fucked around with this message at 13:58 on Feb 5, 2024 |
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Feb 5, 2024 13:51
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hoiyes posted:I'd say it's intended to be a move because it says you "cannot move again." That's mainly to avoid a teleport+move combo. This is the typical ambiguous wording and, afaik, there's no mention in either the rulebook and the FAQs if this type of conveyance spells (the teleport/remove ones) are considered as being moved. I'd say that counting as a move would be the most logical interpretation, however with 'rules as written' in mind, it's unclear, so do the usual: Talk it out with your opponent beforehand (or the TO's if it's an event), if there's no agreement, just decide which interpretation prevail with a roll of a dice. I'd say the rulebook is pretty solid overall, however there's quite a lot of ambiguous interpretations like this one that should be clarified in further FAQ's.
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Feb 5, 2024 13:56
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Maybe the game will get there with development time, but I'm a little surprised there isn't more objective play in scenarios given that the new break test results really lend itself to the push and pull of fighting over a specific area.Gambrinus posted:It's been a long long time since I've had to assemble an army from plastic and looking at it you can see the attraction of the monopose single piece units from the 4th edition Fantasy box. A lot easier to get a game up and running then (not least because half your army was cardboard). It definitely lent itself to batch painting and prep for sure. On the other hand if I do get into this I'm looking forward to having the more modern spear and archer kits because even 20 years later I don't think I can face painting the exact same elf archer and spearguy over and over again.
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Feb 5, 2024 16:06
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Having just realized that Dark Elves get Chaos as Allies and now I'm giddy all over again. I loved the Cult of Slaanesh army list they put out for Storm of Chaos, time to rebuild a little bit of that.
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Feb 5, 2024 16:17
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