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Kagrenak posted:You could analyze the actual reporting instead of making up what you think it would look like you know. The tone has been shifted since October and November when everyone was stumbling over themselves to mention that the Gazan health ministry is "Hamas Run". The media is definitely still being soft in Israel and it's sickening that it took this long for it to even get here but you're vastly overstating where it is now. I think some cynicism and dislike of the media is warranted in light of the fact that CNN was shown last week to have been (are?) operating as a propaganda outlet for Israel. https://www.theguardian.com/media/2024/feb/04/cnn-staff-pro-israel-bias posted:According to accounts from six CNN staffers in multiple newsrooms, and more than a dozen internal memos and emails obtained by the Guardian, daily news decisions are shaped by a flow of directives from the CNN headquarters in Atlanta that have set strict guidelines on coverage. I think being a little disillusioned with mainstream media is completely reasonable. I see no reason to assume CNN is unique in this respect, considering what coverage has looked like the past months. Western mainstream media are about as trustworthy on this subject as RT are on Ukraine.
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Feb 11, 2024 11:29
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Hong XiuQuan posted:'The Hundred Years' War on Palestine' by Nur Masalha is great. Pro read. It's by Rashid Khalidi though 
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Feb 11, 2024 11:35
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ContinuityNewTimes posted:It's debated! The fact that one side has no reasonable case doesn't change that fact. One could technically call the holocaust debated. Even though the side who disagrees with it's framing are neonazis holocaust deniers with no factual basis.
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Feb 11, 2024 13:55
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https://twitter.com/ireallyhateyou/status/1756438313899024862 It's shocking how normalised all of this is
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Feb 11, 2024 14:41
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SurgicalOntologist posted:Pro read. It's by Rashid Khalidi though Brain on autopilot, facepalm.
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Feb 11, 2024 14:54
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Who?
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Feb 11, 2024 16:15
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Esran posted:I think some cynicism and dislike of the media is warranted in light of the fact that CNN was shown last week to have been (are?) operating as a propaganda outlet for Israel. That's why I directly pulled the articles and didn't defend them in absentia. Because I don't trust them enough to give them the benefit of the doubt so I directly went and read what they wrote. There's a difference between being disillusioned and making things up. This isn't a venting forum, it's the one for nominally serious discussion. Kagrenak fucked around with this message at 17:06 on Feb 11, 2024 |
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Feb 11, 2024 17:01
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Sounds fine, I wasn't really disagreeing with you. It was mostly an excuse to share the article about fake news and the propaganda effort. I think it is worth reading.
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Feb 11, 2024 17:37
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Esran posted:Sounds fine, I wasn't really disagreeing with you. It was mostly an excuse to share the article about fake news and the propaganda effort. I think it is worth reading. Fair. I did read the article fwiw. Then I went back and scanned through some CNN articles and you know what they do mention 7 Oct in basically every mention of Gaza in a way the NYTimes just doesn't, and also still constantly insert the phrase "Hamas-run" in front of casualty figures from the health ministry.
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Feb 11, 2024 17:51
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fuctifino posted:It's shocking how normalised all of this is This has to be a byproduct of National Service being a core pillar of Israeli life, right? When American cops and soldiers post things like this, they do it in closed and unofficial Facebook groups or similar for an audience of other cops or soldiers. But compulsary service in the IDF has created a huge audience of Israeli civilians who are ex-servicepeople who will glom onto this type of content.
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Feb 12, 2024 00:34
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High Warlord Zog posted:This has to be a byproduct of National Service being a core pillar of Israeli life, right? When American cops and soldiers post things like this, they do it in closed and unofficial Facebook groups or similar for an audience of other cops or soldiers. But compulsary service in the IDF has created a huge audience of Israeli civilians who are ex-servicepeople who will glom onto this type of content. I dunno, I feel like the volunteer aspect of our armies means we put them on a pedestal so when PFC John Joeson got photographed stealing from a random house in Kabul there were a thousand chickenhawks telling us to not disrespect our heroes
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Feb 12, 2024 00:54
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The IOF has begun bombing Rafah with the heaviest bombardment the city has seen to date This is Rafah a week ago. It's probably filled up with many more survivors over the past 7 days.  1.5 million people are crammed in the red area that Israel is now dropping bombs onto  I'm just lost for words. Numb.  e: Netanyahu seems to have timed the slaughter to coincide with the Superbowl fuctifino fucked around with this message at 02:19 on Feb 12, 2024 |
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Feb 12, 2024 02:16
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Israeli conscription is in a weird place, I think, because while normally conscript soldiers don't really get a ton of respect - sympathy, yes, but not respect - Israel has the whole thing about feeling existentially threatened by military force 24/7/365. Self fulfilling prophecy aside, that's a pretty strong booster to military service being seen as a bit of a sacred duty (unless you're particularly leftist, particularly pacifist, or one of the various ultradevout groups that gets exemptions).
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Feb 12, 2024 02:17
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I was hoping against hope they'd back down from Rafah. gently caress.
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Feb 12, 2024 02:20
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I mean why would they, they're soulless ghouls and no one with power in the American government is actually putting any effort in to stop them.
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Feb 12, 2024 02:24
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It's like people can't quite grasp what 'Israel is openly committing genocide' means.
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Feb 12, 2024 02:24
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Seems like the IDF timed its new wave of attacks with the Superbowl in the US. I mean, it's likely wasted craftiness because it's not people would care even if they were not glued to the screen, but you do you I guess.
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Feb 12, 2024 03:37
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Israel is looking to expand the war into Egypt, with their media manufacturing consent for a war with Egypt. https://www.jpost.com/middle-east/article-786386 quote:Egypt may become an unstoppable enemy for Israel, former IDF general warns This is the same day, that Sisi in Egypt formally advised Netanyahu that they will seek to withdrawal from the Camp David Accords if Israel invades Rafah.
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Feb 12, 2024 03:39
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I hope everyday that the Israeli public gets wise to the conflict constantly expanding and threatening the stability of the region just to keep Netanyahu in power for a few days longer and it just never seems to happen.
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Feb 12, 2024 03:45
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Young Freud posted:Israel is looking to expand the war into Egypt, with their media manufacturing consent for a war with Egypt. Hmm. I'd take this with a whole shaker of salt. Not to give Israel any credit, but retired military officers say a LOT of insane poo poo that is basically airing their martial fantasies and hoping someone in power picks them up and makes them real.
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Feb 12, 2024 03:48
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Young Freud posted:Israel is looking to expand the war into Egypt, with their media manufacturing consent for a war with Egypt. I've never said this before and never will again, but good on Sisi. As bad as the humanitarian situation was, and also the pre oct 6 very slow ethnic cleansing and humanitarian situation, this is a distressing and substantial escalation.
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Feb 12, 2024 03:54
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Nice to see the president of Mexico taking the lead to put pressure on Israel
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Feb 12, 2024 03:59
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We need to stop giving Israel money and weapons. I know that won't make all the weapons we've already given them magically go away, that damage can't be undone, but it's inexcusable to keep supplying them.
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Feb 12, 2024 04:19
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E: Nevermind, blanked on the stupid joke
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Feb 12, 2024 05:23
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Kalit posted:E: Nevermind, blanked on the stupid joke E: nm
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Feb 12, 2024 05:24
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Space Cadet Omoly posted:We need to stop giving Israel money and weapons. I know that won't make all the weapons we've already given them magically go away, that damage can't be undone, but it's inexcusable to keep supplying them. Actually, the way Israel is using munitions, it would appear to magically go away for them.
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Feb 12, 2024 05:26
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Google Jeb Bush posted:I was hoping against hope they'd back down from Rafah. gently caress. I was hoping against hope the Nazis would volunteer to close their concentration camps.
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Feb 12, 2024 09:06
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Marenghi posted:I was hoping against hope the Nazis would volunteer to close their concentration camps. more like hoping an aggressor would decide further shittery was too expensive but go off I guess
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Feb 12, 2024 09:37
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Google Jeb Bush posted:more like hoping an aggressor would decide further shittery was too expensive but go off I guess Both Biden and the Biden admin are giving a blank check.
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Feb 12, 2024 09:44
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What expense. Biden gave them the go ahead provided they had a plan in place to minimize casualties. Which is vague AF. They can claim they had a plan as they murder women and children by the 100s.
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Feb 12, 2024 10:31
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Google Jeb Bush posted:more like hoping an aggressor would decide further shittery was too expensive but go off I guess Eh, I think it is fair to see this as a category error - this is being approached as the culmination of a campaign of genocidal extermination, not just military aggression, and that means that the usual cost/benefit analyses don't really apply (even before we get into the unlimited largesse Israel is getting from the US).
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Feb 12, 2024 11:07
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Darth Walrus posted:Eh, I think it is fair to see this as a category error - this is being approached as the culmination of a campaign of genocidal extermination, not just military aggression, and that means that the usual cost/benefit analyses don't really apply (even before we get into the unlimited largesse Israel is getting from the US). Yeah, my post earlier was more glib than I meant it to be, but this is what I was trying to express. Israel is trying to kill or displace every single Palestinian. It's not war, it's genocide. Especially if anyone in Israel actually fears international intervention might be on the way. That would mean that no expense is too high, because this might be their last chance to eradicate the Palestinian population of Gaza.
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Feb 12, 2024 11:21
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Google Jeb Bush posted:more like hoping an aggressor would decide further shittery was too expensive but go off I guess that was a reasonable response to your post. why would israel voluntarily stop doing something that they 1) want to do and 2) fulfils longstanding geopolitical objectives and 3) no one is apparently going to or willing to stop them from doing israel isn't stopping until compelled to stop
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Feb 12, 2024 12:30
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Herstory Begins Now posted:that was a reasonable response to your post. why would israel voluntarily stop doing something that they 1) want to do and 2) fulfils longstanding geopolitical objectives and 3) no one is apparently going to or willing to stop them from doing To be fair, I had a brief moment of hope that maybe Egypt would actually step up (out of self-interest if nothing else), so I can understand the impulse to seek things to hope for. Unfortunately it seems to me that Israel and Egypt might have made a deal behind the scenes that Israel will just keep doing the same short bombing runs on Rafah like they made today, to maximise the killing but minimise the fleeing across the border. Egypt (its leaders and military, not its people) only cares about Palestinians insomuch as they don't want a refugee crisis on their hands. They're totally on board with letting Israel slaughter as many as possible and letting hunger and illness take care of the rest. The tanks Egypt moved to the border unfortunately work both ways - they might be a threat to Israel, but they also work as a warning to any Palestinians thinking of trying to cross the border.
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Feb 12, 2024 12:45
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it has weirdly escaped notice how lovely egypt's government is and how this plays into the execution-en-masse of the gaza population but yeah their primary concern in all this is "how do we end up with as little of this riff-raff in OUR borders" like playing a little balancing act of finding the appropriate level of cover your rear end appearances which still keeps as many Palestinians out
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Feb 12, 2024 13:05
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Marenghi posted:What expense. Biden gave them the go ahead provided they had a plan in place to minimize casualties. Which is vague AF. They can claim they had a plan as they murder women and children by the 100s. The go-ahead and insane levels of military aid, non-military aid and it seems at least $1bn has been raise at state/local govt level in the US for bonds https://news.littlesis.org/2024/02/05/u-s-state-and-local-treasuries-hold-at-least-1-6-billion-in-israel-bonds/. Highly suspect it's likely this kind of bond investment is actively encouraged at federal level as a form of alternate funding for Israel. Vast sums.
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Feb 12, 2024 13:27
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Probably not in the way you expect but effectively yes. Those categories of investor are heavily restricted in what they can buy, both in legal and practical limits. Effectively, the only thing they can substantially invest in are AAA and government bonds. They are utterly desperate for returns, and willing to take war bonds and pseudo war bonds as a non excluded speculative asset. Considering that BDS is effectively banned in official rationalization they absolutely will take the bumped premiums. Currently, Israeli bonds are about 1.5% over same maturity US notes because they are issuing so many. Never expect the money managers to do any good.
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Feb 12, 2024 14:12
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Good, lengthy thread on the IDF's latest round of bullshit, this time about a 'Hamas command centre' under the UNRWA headquarters. https://x.com/michakobs/status/1756821215212130459?s=46&t=ARI_L-v32Oind1-d9B3a3Q
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Feb 12, 2024 15:45
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Darth Walrus posted:Good, lengthy thread on the IDF's latest round of bullshit, this time about a 'Hamas command centre' under the UNRWA headquarters. I'm surprised journalists gave this even 5 seconds of consideration. "You'll show us what you consider evidence under your terms even though it's extremely questionable?" This is about the level of ill conceived Russian propaganda. Even in the most extreme scenario if it's actually somehow magically true, what would anyone do with this information? Israel apparently would keep doing what it's doing and so would Egypt. Those two are actually the most complicit parties here.
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Feb 12, 2024 16:06
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notwithoutmyanus posted:I'm surprised journalists gave this even 5 seconds of consideration. You literally named a third complicit party yourself: western media uncritically laundering Israeli propaganda. To say nothing of America continuing to supply Israel and run interference for them in the global stage.
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Feb 12, 2024 17:10
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