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As someone who recently got into dnd what are the beefs (beeves?) with dnd combat
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Feb 17, 2024 12:15
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| # ? May 24, 2024 23:09 |
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The Wicked ZOGA posted:As someone who recently got into dnd what are the beefs (beeves?) with dnd combat Do you want a long rant or a short version? The short version is that D&D has a billion terrible things that are simply there because "that how it always was" and also D&D is explicitly designed to prioritize fast combat rounds in a PnP setting and not needing to do complicated math, over having a good combat system, with the idea that a DM will fix the game on the fly if needed, which is something video games don't have. All of those are in total antithesis to how video games work and what their strengths and weaknesses are. For what it's worth, Larian clearly understands that, which is why large portions of the D&D system are changed for BG3.
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Feb 17, 2024 12:22
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The Wicked ZOGA posted:As someone who recently got into dnd what are the beefs (beeves?) with dnd combat you have to balance it with magic items and dm fiat or else it barely works
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Feb 17, 2024 12:31
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Jack Trades posted:Does anyone know what happen when playing multiplayer and reaching Act 3 Temple of Bhaal, Orin encounter with a party than has a Dark Urge? Character Reactivity or Dialogue priority? Our problem was that Durge got focused for most dialogue in act 3 because a lot of people recognize them. Regarding the title screen temple. You can open the door without doing the tribunal because its your house. I am giving you information based on that approach. Regarding the encounter there are a few things that can happen here. If you want the duel you walk down and trigger the encounter. If you want the entire temple to fight you + Bhaals lair action then have anyone else approach / do aggro drawing activities. If you the Durge approach then you will activate the duel, You can walk down, go invisible and talk to Orin, go invisible and lockpick the altar to release the hostage. If any of you has an army of summons like 2 Flying Ghouls and the Thay Zombies it's quite possible the Orin will aggro them by accident with an AOE and your ghouls will break the duel barrier aggroing the entire temple Anyone can break the barrier and cancel the duel so you need to tell your party to not move / do not use any reactions to help you or interfere. If you lose the duel you hit one of the Durge fail states and will aggro the entire temple. If you win and embrace your party stands there looking stupid while they are just standing in a sewer murder altar but you get an achievement. Major complaint here. If you win and resist then you get the special scene but no achievement. The entire temple will ignore you at this point unless you draw aggro but you can now shove all those sanctuary guys into the chasm
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Feb 17, 2024 14:05
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Black Noise posted:Character Reactivity or Dialogue priority? Our problem was that Durge got focused for most dialogue in act 3 because a lot of people recognize them. No, I know what happens in Act 3. I already beat the game as a Dark Urge on my own. I was more curious about how those events work in multiplayer specifically because so far, I've been letting my friends go first to trigger the events, so they get to choose the dialogue options, and the game has been completely ignoring my Dark Urge character as if I wasn't there. I'm assuming that's going to continue all the way. Multiplayer is extremely narratively unsatisfying in this game. You don't play as separate characters, instead the players have a Tyler Durden situation and the NPCs only react to "Tyler" or "Jack" only when one of them initiates the conversation. It kind of blows. I think would've much rather had a system where one player was the designated protagonist.
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Feb 17, 2024 14:13
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Goa Tse-tung posted:edit too slow turns out ImprovedUI Assets is the culprit
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Feb 17, 2024 14:13
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Goa Tse-tung posted:turns out ImprovedUI Assets is the culprit Yeah it hasn't been updated for Patch 6.
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Feb 17, 2024 14:15
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Jack Trades posted:I was more curious about how those events work in multiplayer specifically because so far, I've been letting my friends go first to trigger the events, so they get to choose the dialogue options, and the game has been completely ignoring my Dark Urge character as if I wasn't there. If you don’t take charge of the dialogue then you don’t get the duel you get the regular encounter with everyone. Multiplayer wasn’t ready for launch apparently only the host got a Goblin Party scene until a few patches ago. Protagonist system though would be an additional nightmare for my play through however.
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Feb 17, 2024 14:35
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Jack Trades posted:The short version is that D&D has a billion terrible things that are simply there because "that how it always was" and also D&D is explicitly designed to prioritize fast combat rounds in a PnP setting and not needing to do complicated math, over having a good combat system, with the idea that a DM will fix the game on the fly if needed, which is something video games don't have. There famously was an edition that had a much better system to use for a video game but people didn't like it because they said the system was like a video game, or at least listened to people who said that was the case. What people ignore is when one of the devs was asked why they made the system similar to an MMO the answer was "because those are more fun to play than previous editions of Dungeons & Dragons."
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Feb 17, 2024 15:46
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If no one likes your new system is it really better?
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Feb 17, 2024 15:54
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Dawgstar posted:There famously was an edition that had a much better system to use for a video game but people didn't like it because they said the system was like a video game, or at least listened to people who said that was the case. I'm old enough to remember when people dismissed 3rd edition D&D because it was "too much like a video game / too much like WoW". 4th was definitely the best version of D&D to do video game adaptions and it's a shame that very few ever happened using that system.
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Feb 17, 2024 15:54
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4e wasn't much like an MMO at all, but quite a lot of BG3's changes - heavy slot-based itemization, keyword-based interactions, a lot of easy mobility, and recharging resources - have the effect of making it much more like 4e in practice. 5e doesn't do item slots, thinks at-wills that do anything but damage are op, is extremely reluctant to let any abilities interact and has a known grudge against non-daily actions. "Any failed saves now inflict stacking penalties" and "add radiant damage to attacks, triggering radiant orb and arcane synergy" are anti-5e but would not feel very out of place in my 4e sorcerer's kit. This is a good thing.
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Feb 17, 2024 16:02
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I’ve never played 5E in tabletop but I imagine it would probably start to feel rather bland and samey as most classes share like 70% of all spells between them. Larian did a great job with the itemization, which is where the uniqueness and strategy of every class build really starts to shine. There are great pickups for pretty much everyone from Level 4 onwards and it can be a little minigame in itself working out the optimal path to set up your build in Act 1. The gear is generally well thought-out and have multiple uses across all the possible subclass combos such that even when you come across an item that’s useless to anyone in the party, you’re already thinking “well, maybe if I roll THIS character in the next campaign…” As far as I know this level of itemization is virtually nonexistent in 5E, which makes their work even more impressive.
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Feb 17, 2024 16:06
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exquisite tea posted:I’ve never played 5E in tabletop but I imagine it would probably start to feel rather bland and samey as most classes share like 70% of all spells between them. It isn’t, but because in tabletop spells are much more dynamic and powerful. You also don’t get the absolute avalanche of spell scrolls in tabletop like you do in BG3, so you could have 4 spellcasters in your party all with completely different spell loadouts. Familiars and mage hand especially caught an absolutely massive nerf for BG3, so did polymorph. Spells are extremely cool in tabletop and way more fun and they only feel like they’d be boring if they actually worked like they do in BG3.
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Feb 17, 2024 16:14
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How are the Origin playthroughs? I keep thinking about playing as Karlach with Laezel, Shart, and Minthara, but I'm wondering if you miss out on Karlach stuff because you're playing as her.
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Feb 17, 2024 16:22
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Origin playthroughs have unique scenes and in some cases power-ups but you lose their outer voice in exchange for the narrator filling you in. Someone did the testicular torsion meme https://www.nexusmods.com/baldursgate3/mods/6155
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Feb 17, 2024 16:29
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Origins can be fun, there’s at least a few unique scenes you would otherwise never see if you were just playing as normal Tav. You do miss out on a character’s voice but you still usually get to see the “let me step in” dialogue sequences acted out in full. In a Karlach origin for instance you have a special interaction with Astarion when he tries to bite you in Act 1 and can read the runes on his back in Act 2. I’ve only seen clips on youtube but there are also some phenomenally well-acted scenes in a Karlach/Minthara romance, which is pretty crazy for how unlikely a pairing that is.
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Feb 17, 2024 16:41
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Shyfted One posted:How are the Origin playthroughs? I keep thinking about playing as Karlach with Laezel, Shart, and Minthara, but I'm wondering if you miss out on Karlach stuff because you're playing as her. Karlach is pretty much considered one of the best to do. I tried out SH, gale and Wyll for a bit and they are fine but the fact of the matter is that it's basically TAV+, 80-90% of the lines are gonna be the same but you get some unique content and possibilities to engage with. They all pale in comparison to durge though, which seems to have even more stuff added to it in this patch noticed that the lines better reflect your amnesia now like how you can bullshit SH about baldurs gate during the first romance scene and is pretty compelling way to connect with your romanced companion of choice. Edit: Actually if you are looking for someone with a direct gameplay benefit go with Gale since he gets some legitimately nice goodies. Lawman 0 fucked around with this message at 16:44 on Feb 17, 2024 |
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Feb 17, 2024 16:41
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Gale also gets Tara.
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Feb 17, 2024 16:43
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Here’s my arguement for Origin Astarion. You can get the act 2 potion without breaking up with yourself or needing to do a check. Unique companion disapprovals if you do the thing but since you are in control you don’t have to lean all the way in. You can be selfish and save the day. Much like you can make origin Karlach or Wyll go down the Minthara timeline.
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Feb 17, 2024 16:51
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Looks like the double click pouch exploit still works in the new patch. I though for sure they would fix that with the barter screen improvements.
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Feb 17, 2024 17:00
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Playing evil wyll that is down for doing whatever the devil asks of him is a distinct experience.
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Feb 17, 2024 17:07
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Wyll doing the sex scene with Mizora sounds like it would be funny.
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Feb 17, 2024 17:33
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Cloud of daggers is my greatest enemy. Just killed Mayrina with it by accident so I'm taking the hair.
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Feb 17, 2024 17:39
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Dragonwagon posted:Looks like the double click pouch exploit still works in the new patch. I though for sure they would fix that with the barter screen improvements. Wait, what's this? I thought that was patched awhile ago and the shift + drag was the last one left until this patch?
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Feb 17, 2024 17:55
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Professor Beetus posted:Wait, what's this? I thought that was patched awhile ago and the shift + drag was the last one left until this patch? 1. Sell a bag to the merchant. 2. Open the bag in barter mode and drag whatever you want into it, then close it. 3. Select another party member on the left. 4. Double click the bag. After you close the trade screen and exit dialouge the bag will open as a lootable container and you can take everything with no consequences.
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Feb 17, 2024 18:58
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Dragonwagon posted:1. Sell a bag to the merchant.
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Feb 17, 2024 19:04
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New barter screen is pretty great but they need to re-enable being able to ctrl- and shift-click on stuff.
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Feb 17, 2024 19:05
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Shumagorath posted:Seeing archetypal security vulnerabilities abused in RPG vendors is hilarious. Gonna name my next character a GUID and see if it crashes the servers
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Feb 17, 2024 19:06
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Am I the only one who is getting weird delays in combat before all kinds of actions? I didn't have those few days ago.
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Feb 17, 2024 19:08
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Jack Trades posted:Am I the only one who is getting weird delays in combat before all kinds of actions? thats the dm trying to decide what his npcs are gonna do
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Feb 17, 2024 19:11
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Dragonwagon posted:1. Sell a bag to the merchant. lol
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Feb 17, 2024 19:13
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Jack Trades posted:Am I the only one who is getting weird delays in combat before all kinds of actions? Last night I got to the fight with the demon in Shars Gauntlet and it took FOREVER for each turn. I had the same issues in the Goblin fortress too though
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Feb 17, 2024 19:14
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Mozi posted:New barter screen is pretty great but they need to re-enable being able to ctrl- and shift-click on stuff. lmao if the "fix" to that problem was just to disable shift and ctrl clicking in the vendor windows
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Feb 17, 2024 19:19
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Flowing Thot posted:If no one likes your new system is it really better? This is kind of a loaded sentiment. Lots of people enjoyed 4e, but I won't relitigate the Great Edition Wars here. The Wicked ZOGA posted:As someone who recently got into dnd what are the beefs (beeves?) with dnd combat It's complicated. Here are some of the reasons why 5e in particular has lots of poor design: a.) Ability Scores make no sense. The fact that you have an 18 doesn't matter, it's the +4 that matters. They're also terrible arranged, so the only smart people are always going to be Wizards, etc. b.) A D20, while iconic, is a weirdly swingy die to use for your primary task resolution. If you have a +4 in one thing, and a +6 in another, your character contributes 10% more to one than the other, but the die can swing that by a massive number, making many task resolutions a coin flip. c.) There is a wide gulf between so-called martial characters (fighter, rogue, ranger etc) and pure casters. This is less pronounced in a videogame because most spells are combat focused and there is less overall outside-the-box thinking one can do, but in TT the spellcasters can kind of do anything while martials are only ever going to swing sword slightly harder. There are also lots of smaller issues like how saving throws work against spells that effectively kill or disable a character for long stretches of the gameplay, or how magic items are both required and not required simultaneously like some kind of game-design Schrodinger's Cat. D&D as it stands now is basically just a vibe? Like people enjoy the culture that surrounds it, and that's fine, and it's perfectly serviceable, but if you actually examine how its put together it does leave a lot to be desired.
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Feb 17, 2024 19:25
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I mean the problems with 5e are absolutely what contributes to act 3 being such a mess because higher level combat with lots of opponents is a mess.
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Feb 17, 2024 19:34
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scary ghost dog posted:thats the dm trying to decide what his npcs are gonna do (Pre-patch) During the second phase of the Ketheric fight at some point he got disarmed so he would spend like a full minute every time it was his turn with his arms up just walking back and forth. I gave him a pass because he's old he can't help it.
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Feb 17, 2024 19:43
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D&D's biggest problems are a combination of poor balance that results in very large deltas of effectiveness (re: it's very easy to make a character that sucks and perfectly optimized characters outpace bad performers by a country mile) and a lack of ability rate limiting, meaning that the correct choice in 90% of encounters is to blow your strongest poo poo immediately which restricts the design space severely the latter's a tough nut to crack due to the format of tabletop demanding a faster pace of play, but the former's a result of legacy mechanics that no one wants to change because the brand's whole identity is tied up in them
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Feb 17, 2024 19:45
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I'm remembering when I was in elementary school we had a D&D club and of course we ignored all the rules and had OP characters with tons of magic items. One day one of the guys brought their older brother who was a hardcore purist and he got so pissed tears were coming out because we "didn't earn the items we were using" it was glorious
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Feb 17, 2024 19:48
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Can you imagine how annoying attunement would be.
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Feb 17, 2024 19:56
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