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Lol, I totally forgot about Otis. His mysterious injuries never got an explanation. I hope the original script(before the rebranding) leaks at some point. I doubt it was anywhere close to being such a mess.
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Feb 20, 2024 16:15
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mrmcd posted:It also doesn't make any sense why the ice ghost couldn't just kill Clarke. He's hiding out in the same ice caves that's her home and where she ganked Otis why does it need to wait for the detectives to catch him while it mulls around the station doing spooky ghost stuff? It seems to only exist out on the ice. Clark never left the caves, so he's good, just like how the scientists never left the base and only became vulnerable when forced out into the night.
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Feb 20, 2024 16:17
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GABA ghoul posted:Lol, I totally forgot about Otis. His mysterious injuries never got an explanation. It's the time is a flat circle thing where the past and future are in conversation with one another, but the show interprets this absurdly literally to mean "the ghost sent vengeance lasers into the past to hurt some random drifter" which is dumb, confusing, and thematically empty
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Feb 20, 2024 16:18
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Tender Bender posted:It's the time is a flat circle thing where the past and future are in conversation with one another, but the show interprets this absurdly literally to mean "the ghost sent vengeance lasers into the past to hurt some random drifter" which is dumb, confusing, and thematically empty True Detective Season Four: dumb, confusing, and thematically empty
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Feb 20, 2024 16:19
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I take it back actually I think "this area is a poisoned wasteland that is spiritually radioactive in all timelines with sometimes arbitrary consequences" is a fine one, but I think it would be better represented by like the fits of madness, suicidal behavior, even stuff like "the scientists being driven to a frenzied murder" being a consequence rather than a cause (or maybe it works if the latter is both? But you need to show that in more depth). The "past lasers burned his eyes" thing is too literal and confusing
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Feb 20, 2024 16:23
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What was the deal with the occult trailer with the yarn people. Was that ever followed up on?
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Feb 20, 2024 16:25
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The_Rob posted:What was the deal with the occult trailer with the yarn people. Was that ever followed up on? The thread has decided that was their kink, please no follow up questions.
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Feb 20, 2024 16:27
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orange peel spiral still cracks me up when I think about it
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Feb 20, 2024 16:51
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You can quote some director interview but the “evidence” (lol) the show provides only works with supernatural influences and the show very clearly wants you to believe by the end. The last episode has two separate instances of people vanishing in a single frame for christ’s sake. Danvers is experiencing the exact same traumatic hallucinations as Navarro. Knowledge is transferred via ghost whispers. The only clear thing is that Ennis is a nexus for spiritual experiences. Does this environment result in some kind of test of will out on the ice, with “passing” giving you otherworldly insight like the old ghost lady and final episode Navarro, and “failing” giving you burnt out retinas and psychosis? This labels Julia’s suicide as some kind of personal failure of will which is not a great idea imo. It also does not explain the tongue. Is this all happening because of the presence of some more traditional powerful spirit? Otis could have been injured by breaking into its home, and the scientists got hosed up by it as retribution for killing its neighbors. Why did it have to wait until years later when the Inupiak could have killed them right then anyway? How does this tie into all the other random spooky poo poo happening, especially to people who are trying to help solve the old murder, or are just random people who get lured out to suicide on the ice? You could try to tie both ideas together and make some sort of sense out of it but it’s a mess
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Feb 20, 2024 16:54
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I completely forgot about the part where future Navarro and past Clarke "see" each other during a mutual ghost-induced hallucination, which was stolen from Season 3 lol So yeah, it took the "time is a flat circle" metaphor from Season 1, in which it was an allegory for trauma and generational abuse (and maybe had subtle supernatural overtones if you took certain ravings of meth heads and dementia patients at face value) and made it actual time travel Oh gently caress, I just realised they possibly also literalised the "wind of invisible voices" line from S1 
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Feb 20, 2024 17:00
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The ending felt so self-indulgent in a way that they really wanted the ghost thing to be true but also to be an indigineous female-forward story so the true heroes of the story were a bunch of people who killed the scientists, or i guess left them in the snow naked so they could theoretically go back for their clothes. I don't really know why we had 4-5 episodes before hand of other stuff that was mostly irrelevant to this. An unwillingness to have Navarro really be a bad person probably comes from that. Though I mean even Rust's unpleasantness as a person gets softballed in his show.
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Feb 20, 2024 17:05
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Smith Comma John posted:Is this all happening because of the presence of some more traditional powerful spirit? Otis could have been injured by breaking into its home, and the scientists got hosed up by it as retribution for killing its neighbors. Why did it have to wait until years later when the Inupiak could have killed them right then anyway? How does this tie into all the other random spooky poo poo happening, especially to people who are trying to help solve the old murder, or are just random people who get lured out to suicide on the ice? Yeah this whole line of thought is a more interesting and coherent situation, a sort of spiritual blight that was unleashed by defiling the cave that doesn't operate with any kind of logic or intent (as a pretty blunt metaphor for the wiping out of the indigenous people). A manifestation of trauma and pain that hurts everyone. I guess you could argue that this was still the case on the show, and the characters just don't understand which is why they settled on "it's Annie K's ghost!" It feels like there was something there in an old draft with "is all of this crazy behavior caused from the microorganism or the unleashed spiritual malaise" but the show zeroed in on "Is this a vengeance ghost or some vengeance ladies" instead. The bones of the theme are still there but it just feels off. It reminds me of a lot of Stephen King adaptations, where there's a text that's exploring this internal struggle and universal themes through an externalized force, and then the movie interprets that as "what if a dog was evil". Except we don't have the source text here. Tender Bender fucked around with this message at 17:10 on Feb 20, 2024 |
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Feb 20, 2024 17:07
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Finally got around to watching the final episode. It does seem thematically incoherent in the end unfortunately, but it was still decent television I don't regret watching it. I think the major piece of incoherence for me is that in presenting an indigenous / settler dialectic it does a pretty good job through the first five episodes of presenting a nuanced view, but at the end no one seems to think that perhaps finding cures to a million diseases is worth some extra pollution? Like that's fine if you don't think so but to just drop it and suggest that the light has come after the long darkness is pretty weird. The bizarre treatment of hypothermia did take me out of the show for a minute I'll admit, but this thread still delivers good entertainment with such great criticisms as: Unrealistic that people would have jobs as janitors and at a cannery at the same time. The existence of indigenous people who are white passing despite the obvious presence of several mixed marriages in the actual show. That a group of people who carried out a complex murder plot would also be capable of slowly filing into a kitchen to support their fellow conspirators. That people filled a tub of water. And finally everyone seems to hate the increased pollution plot point, but they say that the pollution has the effect of thawing the permafrost as well as poisoning the town's water which seems extremely consistent with a tailings pond which is the main form of mine pollution so I really don't see why that upset so many people. Anyway, solid mid-tier show.
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Feb 20, 2024 17:10
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Panzeh posted:The ending felt so self-indulgent in a way that they really wanted the ghost thing to be true but also to be an indigineous female-forward story so the true heroes of the story were a bunch of people who killed the scientists, or i guess left them in the snow naked so they could theoretically go back for their clothes. I don't really know why we had 4-5 episodes before hand of other stuff that was mostly irrelevant to this. I don’t think his unpleasantness gets softballed everything he does is shown plain and simple. It’s just laid out for the viewer to see. In fact the viewer knows more than the detectives interviewing them know, and they still end up thinking he’s a serial killer. Rust is just a very smart person with deep convictions, but he’s also a human so we as humans sympathize with him. He’s a really well written three dimensional character.
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Feb 20, 2024 17:13
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This show could have redeemed itself if it warmed up Danvers next to a dumpster fire.
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Feb 20, 2024 18:23
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C-Bangin' it 
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FLIPADELPHIA posted:I think it's kind of lovely to quote someone's 8 year old posts as a gotcha to insinuate they are being dishonest with their criticism and are actually bigoted pieces of poo poo just lashing out at anything resembling feminism. People are allowed to change and grow- poo poo, I know I'm a lot better on most issues than I was 8 years ago. Show a little grace IMO Lmao the only reason I bothered to check his history is because that post was so bad it set off that sixth sense where you can tell the poster has Thoughts About Women It's particularly funny that in the literal True Detective thread, multiple posters read that and are like "Yup seems like a completely normal opinion to me!"
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Feb 20, 2024 18:33
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While flawed, and having some of the dumbest needle drops in prestige tv history, I think the first five episodes got people interested, otherwise it wouldn’t matter that the sixth was bad. Beyond Danvers accepting the supernatural, I think we were missing was the last few phases of the story cycle. Even the theme song is about suicide (“I wanna end me…”) and it played six times, so I don’t think Navarro‘s death came out of nowhere. But her main thrust in early episodes was about how indigenous lives were unvalued by the system because of systemic factors… Then decides to cover up a murder conspiracy. But she also abandons Qavvik, the indigenous man she used for sex and midnight Christmas first aid. So did the case help or hurt her? Was the entire investigation and exercise in her finding out the truth, even though justice had mostly been done? (All the killers were dead before she got to the crime scene, except the one who had been insane for six years.) Danvers, meanwhile, distrusts mysticism because she wants to finally get over the pain of losing her husband and son. She embraces the conspiracy on both ends (Covering for the women, embracing the official slab avalanche conspiracy) and seems happy about it. We never get to see how her relationship changes with Leah or Prior Jr. Does she stop drinking and driving? Torturing suspects? What’s the new normal for the Ennis police, now that Liz abandoned her duty to uncover crime? Prior Jr gets the least screen time of all. He hangs out with Rose, lies to Leah, and looks out meaningfully from bed. He briefly speaks with his wife who seems mad he’s spending all his time with the sextuple homicide case and cruel boss. But when he’s acting really weird and implied that he committed a crime, she loves him again. Their last fight was about only being together because they had a kid… how does this resolve anything? Life in Ennis is going to be very very easy for the cops now, unless he gets stuck investigating trooper Navarro’s mysterious disappearance, or ever figures out who committed the crime he killed his father over. He’s not going to get the intimidating “we’re 14 murderers, do you really want to charge us” speech, he’s going to get Liz telling him “don’t investigate” minutes before federal agents record him on the miniDV. Leah, torn between life as an activist, a lesbian, and a tagger, misses her mom. That’s all the closure she gets. When you pair this with intentionally leaving out clues (the tongue) and production handicaps (they probably wanted to shoot a lot more ice cave footage but didn’t have the locations, or budget, or whatever, so it looks like they traveled 120 feet), people fixate on plot holes. If we weren’t invested in the characters, it probably wouldn’t hurt so much that a guy had a creepy 'psychic freak-out cabin' or that an Arctic research facility had a secret area for no reason. Golden Bee fucked around with this message at 18:42 on Feb 20, 2024 |
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Feb 20, 2024 18:35
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koolkal posted:Lmao the only reason I bothered to check his history is because that post was so bad it set off that sixth sense where you can tell the poster has Thoughts About Women Because it is a normal opinion that other posters shared. You're trying to play the misogyny angle and failing. It's ok that Lopez wanted to do a female forward story but she botched it, made her own show look sillier and ended up undercutting the whole message in the process. New fodder for dipshit alt-right youtubers like critical drinker and the like, yay. You knew what you were doing when you quoted 2 out of context posts from 8 years ago, and it's something you've done before to try to "cancel" other people out of an argument. Most of your probes are from hostility to other posters and misreprenting other posters' opinions. tl;dr you behaved like a piece of poo poo and got called out too
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Feb 20, 2024 19:09
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Sorry for chopping up your post Golden Bee but I want to engage with a few specific things you wrote  Golden Bee posted:While flawed, and having some of the dumbest needle drops in prestige tv history, I think the first five episodes got people interested, otherwise it wouldn’t matter that the sixth was bad. She also learned her True Name, which ended up being the key to them learning the truth of what happened from the indigenous women of the village. That was a key part of her journey to find and accept her Self. Once that was done, she was satisfied. quote:Danvers, meanwhile, distrusts mysticism because she wants to finally get over the pain of losing her husband and son. She embraces the conspiracy on both ends (Covering for the women, embracing the official slab avalanche conspiracy) and seems happy about it. We never get to see how her relationship changes with Leah or Prior Jr. Does she stop drinking and driving? Torturing suspects? What’s the new normal for the Ennis police, now that Liz abandoned her duty to uncover crime? I didn't see any evidence she "abandoned her duty to uncover crime" in fact, she fought to find the truth until the bitter end. Her duty wasn't to be a cop, it was to find justice and truth. Her final major act in the show was leaking the truth and getting the mine shut down. We do see her relationship changed with Leah because they are happily driving in the car together. quote:Prior Jr gets the least screen time of all. He hangs out with Rose, lies to Leah, and looks out meaningfully from bed. He briefly speaks with his wife who seems mad he’s spending all his time with the sextuple homicide case and cruel boss. But when he’s acting really weird and implied that he committed a crime, she loves him again. Their last fight was about only being together because they had a kid… how does this resolve anything? Life in Ennis is going to be very very easy for the cops now, unless he gets stuck investigating trooper Navarro’s mysterious disappearance, or ever figures out who committed the crime he killed his father over. He’s not going to get the intimidating “we’re 14 murderers, do you really want to charge us” speech, he’s going to get Liz telling him “don’t investigate” minutes before federal agents record him on the miniDV. Life in Ennis is never going to be easy. Prior will have to live, forever haunted by what he did, while continually struggling to be a father and husband in that frozen hellhole. Reconciliation between him and his wife began at the crisis point after he killed his own dad, she never stopped loving him. She could see he was broken, he wanted to tell her everything but couldn't, and if she hadn't moved to show her love for him then and there, he could have gone in a completely different direction, she could have lost him, the father of her son, forever. edit: and Prior absolutely knows everything about the crime, Liz and Navarro would have told him. He was just as invested as them in solving it and covering things up, perhaps moreso because of what happened with his dad. Turpitude fucked around with this message at 19:16 on Feb 20, 2024 |
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Feb 20, 2024 19:10
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I feel like this season's vibe was colored heavily by the assumption that the groundwork laid in season one dictated supernatural involvement when in reality most of the creepy supernatural poo poo in season one came down to Rust being synesthetic with a brain permanently hosed by drugs
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Feb 20, 2024 19:14
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Toaster Beef posted:I feel like this season's vibe was colored heavily by the assumption that the groundwork laid in season one dictated supernatural involvement when in reality most of the creepy supernatural poo poo in season one came down to Rust being synesthetic with a brain permanently hosed by drugs Yeah it is clear that this story would have been fine as a stand alone spooky detective show, but as has been noted many times itt, no one would have watched it without the TD label. Their major mistake IMO was forcing the awkward references to season 1 all the time. It would still have been TD without all that nonsense
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Feb 20, 2024 19:18
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I still can’t believe the show actually said this is night country as an actual line.
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Feb 20, 2024 19:22
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I kinda want to dissect how insanely this show treats the scientists. And I'm gonna ignore the dumb pollution scheme and needlessly secret underground lab. -First off, there's the fact that they're all men. The only reason for this is so the show can have its Big Empowering Moment later on. -Then there's the murder of Annie itself. So the one guy freaks out about his smashed beakers and just immediately starts stabbing the interloper. Fine...But then there's the fact that the entire base pours and--with zero context towards what's going on, and against every natural instinct to either pull him off or to flee--they all enthusiastically join in on the murder. So what, do they share a hive mind or something? -The writers and viewers know that the Tsalal boys killed Annie, but in the universe of the show, a bunch of people just committed a mass murder based on the flimsiest of evidence. As far as I can tell they didn't even try and extract a confession, they just rounded everyone up and shipped them onto the ice. In any other show this would be a chilling vigilante slaying. But here, the act is moral because the women are moral. -Similarly, when the True Detectives torture Clark it's justified because the show has already decided he's guilty. Hooray for "enhanced interrogation"!
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Feb 20, 2024 19:28
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Turpitude posted:I didn't see any evidence she "abandoned her duty to uncover crime" in fact, she fought to find the truth until the bitter end. Her duty wasn't to be a cop, it was to find justice and truth. Her final major act in the show was leaking the truth and getting the mine shut down. We do see her relationship changed with Leah because they are happily driving in the car together. While I broadly agree with what you're saying here (and agree with the other points I'm not quoting) I think, in the end, Danvers leans into her own advice to Prior and decides to leave well enough alone -- as it pertains to the tongue, anyway. Navarro continues to explore that part of the mystery, possibly resulting in her death (and Prior was already burned by making a similar mistake by looking too far into the Wheeler incident, which indirectly results in him shooting his own dad). I think the finale would have been stronger for emphasising that leaving well enough alone is often a valid option, rather than capping off the "asking the wrong questions" line by having the characters discover the "correct" one. That said, yes, I think the show largely comes down on the idea that her duty was to achieve justice, and that justice could not be found through the various official legal systems that exist in Ennis.
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Feb 20, 2024 19:31
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Mordja posted:-Then there's the murder of Annie itself. So the one guy freaks out about his smashed beakers and just immediately starts stabbing the interloper. Fine...But then there's the fact that the entire base pours and--with zero context towards what's going on, and against every natural instinct to either pull him off or to flee--they all enthusiastically join in on the murder. So what, do they share a hive mind or something?! She destroyed their ice drill, which Clark later says took them two years to repair, along with all their samples. The other guys pour in (we don't see the full extent of the confrontation, but the existence of the video implies it's longer than what we saw in the finale), see all the damage, spot a well known troublemaker in their highly restricted, top secret science area. I can buy them realising that she represents a real and present threat not just to their work (so, by their logic, the future of the human race) but could also personally send them all the gaol for a very very long time. And then she violently attacks two of them, including the one guy who's trying to deeacalate the situation. If we go off the idea that exposure to whatever was in the ice, or even just the toxins, sends people a bit loopy, then it makes more sense than not.
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Feb 20, 2024 19:39
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Open Source Idiom posted:She destroyed their ice drill, which Clark later says took them two years to repair, along with all their samples. The other guys pour in (we don't see the full extent of the confrontation, but the existence of the video implies it's longer than what we saw in the finale), see all the damage, spot a well known troublemaker in their highly restricted, top secret science area. I can buy them realising that she represents a real and present threat not just to their work (so, by their logic, the future of the human race) but could also personally send them all the gaol for a very very long time. And then she violently attacks two of them, including the one guy who's trying to deeacalate the situation. This feels like such a stretch.
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Feb 20, 2024 19:42
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Mordja posted:I kinda want to dissect how insanely this show treats the scientists. And I'm gonna ignore the dumb pollution scheme and needlessly secret underground lab. -I think there are plenty of reasons a woman would not want to be doing science at that station, most of all because she would be stuck with a bunch of men in the middle of nowhere. If you are saying Tsalal should have been 6 men 6 women or something, perhaps on paper, but that's not how it works in real life. There are plenty of jobs that are male dominated. And yes it does tie in to the theme of violence against women, because that's what happens in male-dominated power structures and because, (based on her previous film) Issa Lopez is interested in the subject matter -We only see one guy stabbing, then the others run in and pile on. Whatever the other guys do is off screen, then they all back away and we see Clark finish Annie off. I don't recall any "enthusiasm" being shown by the other men in the scene, more like stunned horror or shock. They were however all complicit in the cover up and the denial of justice regardless of whether they each stabbed her or struggled to stop the stabber. -They show one of the women looking right at Annie's police files, with the "star shaped wound" info written in there, and the scene of the woman finding a drill bit and looking at it in horror. They didn't need more evidence than that. The women of the village knew more than they were letting on the entire time, they surely already had a hunch about what happened. I am sure they heard whispers and could tell something was wrong when they were working at Tsalal. The cops never even considered those dudes as suspects and they never would have listened to the women of the village. The mine was firmly in control of the police dept until Danvers broke ranks. We also have no evidence whatsoever that these scientists were telling the truth about their research being the key to curing all disease and saving the world. That sounds like horseshit to me. There are plenty of scientists working for resource extraction corporations who tell themselves the same thing to justify who is paying their bills.
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Feb 20, 2024 19:46
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Open Source Idiom posted:If we go off the idea that exposure to whatever was in the ice, or even just the toxins, sends people a bit loopy, then it makes more sense than not. There's nothing at all in the show to suggest this is something the writers thought about is there?
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Feb 20, 2024 19:48
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Turpitude posted:Sorry for chopping up your post Golden Bee but I want to engage with a few specific things you wrote I think you make some good points here. I haven’t watched the show since Sunday so I forgot the exact ending montage. I agree with posters who said the scientists all acting identically made their deaths pointless instead of cathartic. You think at least one in five people would say “Hey, stop stabbing this person, you’re committing murder! Since we’re all from different countries, my country thinks murder is bad!”
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Feb 20, 2024 19:52
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my bony fealty posted:There's nothing at all in the show to suggest this is something the writers thought about is there? I'm thinking about the various crazy people and the suiciding caribou. By "whatever was in the ice, or even just the toxins" I'm leaving my read open, just like the show does. So it could be a spiritual break in the fabric of reality, like I think Turpitude is suggesting, or a physical toxin from the mine, or the ancient bacterial life, or a creature that was awoken, or mental illness exacerbated by the isolation and the polar night, or (probably) some combination of the above. Golden Bee posted:I think you make some good points here. I haven’t watched the show since Sunday so I forgot the exact ending montage. Clark did try to deescalate, but he got smacked in the face. After that I doubt anyone cared.
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Feb 20, 2024 19:57
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Turpitude posted:. The show goes out of its way to show the geography teacher or whoever he is say the same thing about their work, that it's potentially life-changing. If the show wanted to portray them as hypocritical mining scientists it could have done so a lot more explicitly, I'm pretty sure they are supposed to be portrayed as true believers in what they're doing.
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Feb 20, 2024 20:13
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Mordja posted:
They also had no way of knowing that they were all involved. For all they know it could've just been one dude while the rest of them tried to stop him. But it's ok because a ghost will sort it out?
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Feb 20, 2024 20:17
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College Rockout posted:They also had no way of knowing that they were all involved. For all they know it could've just been one dude while the rest of them tried to stop him. But it's ok because a ghost will sort it out? I feel like thats important information for the show to tell us.
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Feb 20, 2024 20:18
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The entire town of Ennis is in a spiritual quagmire because of exploitation by colonial powers. This is the reality of Alaska, Greenland, and the Canadian north. The scientists are just doing more exploitation while pretending they are doing Important Work and this leads to them covering up the murder of a person who was attempting to shine light on the truth. The kind of pollution, suicide, and stillbirth epidemic they were talking about in this show is a real true to life example of the continuation of colonial genocide. Indigenous women getting revenge on foreign murderers of an indigenous woman is extremely cathartic, and the show leaves no room for doubt that the women of the village were correct in their belief that the Tsalal Boys were responsible. They saw all the evidence they needed to see to come to that conclusion. There is also no doubt that the cops and mine would never have let justice come to pass, no one was ever going to be held responsible for Annie's murder. It was only through spiritual catharsis on the parts of Navarro and Danvers that they/we viewers were given access to the truth. Navarro had to cross the boundary into Night Country--the realm between of life and death--to receive her True Name, which was the only way that she was allowed entrance into the circle of truth keepers. I forget her name's exact meaning but it was something like the Light after the long Darkness. ie the Truth burning away the evil secrecy. Danvers traversal into Night Country was required for her to survive into the future, her self destruction was going to continue unabated without her revelation, she was shown the light with the help of Navarro's visions. She was consistently shown to be wrong and in denial of the spiritual reality around her, she could not hear the message from her son with her own ears. Only in the vulnerability after her fall through the ice was she able to open herself up to the message from her son. The final scene of her and Leah in the car shows that she had turned a corner towards a less painful existence. Seldom Posts posted:The show goes out of its way to show the geography teacher or whoever he is say the same thing about their work, that it's potentially life-changing. Why should we believe that guy? I don't think the scientists were necessarily hypocrites until they covered up a murder they all witnessed. They were, however, always part of the colonial apparatus that was literally killing babies in the village next door that they never visited. They were all spiritually culpable as soon as they knew about the pollution. Turpitude fucked around with this message at 20:38 on Feb 20, 2024 |
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Feb 20, 2024 20:34
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Seldom Posts posted:The show goes out of its way to show the geography teacher or whoever he is say the same thing about their work, that it's potentially life-changing. Since you mentioned it, I just wanted to interject that the scene with Danvers and the geography teacher was were I first started to suspect that maybe this show sucks. I wish I could remember the exact line or lines that triggered that idea, but I know it had something to do with the dialogue. There's this idea that you can help add depth to a character through their word choices during a conversation. The difference between "What is that supposed to mean?" vs. "...the gently caress's THAT supposed to mean?" is subtle, but it means a lot. There was something about their back and forth that was just a bunch of "question?" "answer." "statement." with zero characterization that gave me the idea that maybe this show was heavily inspired by AI writing as others have theorized, and then not edited much after that. I'm no screenwriter but I'd imagine that a first draft gets all of those exchanges onto the page, and a 2nd or 3rd draft goes back and tries to characterize & humanize the dialogue beyond just conveying information to the viewer and advancing the plot. It felt like this script needed some extra passovers to make it suck less and it didn't get that.
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Feb 20, 2024 20:36
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Turpitude posted:The entire town of Ennis is in a spiritual quagmire because of exploitation by colonial powers. This is the reality of Alaska, Greenland, and the Canadian north. The scientists are just doing more exploitation while pretending they are doing Important Work and this leads to them covering up the murder of a person who was attempting to shine light on the truth. The kind of pollution, suicide, and stillbirth epidemic they were talking about in this show is a real true to life example of the continuation of colonial genocide. Indigenous women getting revenge on foreign murderers of an indigenous woman is extremely cathartic, and the show leaves no room for doubt that the women of the village were correct in their belief that the Tsalal Boys were responsible. They saw all the evidence they needed to see to come to that conclusion. There is also no doubt that the cops and mine would never have let justice come to pass, no one was ever going to be held responsible for Annie's murder. I agree that the scientists represent the colonial / settler mentality. However my problem with the show, as I mentioned above is that it leaves their claim that the evil they are doing is for a greater good just hanging out there with no resolution. The viewer is invited to conclude that their deaths are deserved, but leaves open the idea that they were right that the key to ending a lot of suffering is trapped out there in the ice.
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Feb 20, 2024 20:45
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College Rockout posted:They also had no way of knowing that they were all involved. For all they know it could've just been one dude while the rest of them tried to stop him. But it's ok because a ghost will sort it out? They knew that they were all stooges of the mining corporation and they knew they were covering up and hiding poo poo. The hidden hatch in the floor had the murder weapon within it. Their little secret lab down there was in an area considered sacred by the locals (iirc--I think they said somewhere that the ice caves had spiritual/ancestral significance). The wrath of the village women wasn't just about Annie but about everything wrong with Ennis, the stillbirth epidemic, the suicides, the abuse of power, the injustice. The scientists were never innocent, they were sucking up money from the mining corporation and encouraging the pollution leading to the suffering of the local population. Seldom Posts posted:I agree that the scientists represent the colonial / settler mentality. However my problem with the show, as I mentioned above is that it leaves their claim that the evil they are doing is for a greater good just hanging out there with no resolution. The viewer is invited to conclude that their deaths are deserved, but leaves open the idea that they were right that the key to ending a lot of suffering is trapped out there in the ice. I think their claim that they were doing evil for the greater good speaks for itself. You can either believe that there is such a thing as doing evil for the greater good--at the cost of the lives of innocents, power controlled by lies, supported by the prevention of justice and the genocide of an indigenous population--or you can reject that notion. If the scientists had behaved morally and truthfully then Annie would never have died and they could have continued their research into their holy grail. Instead they were corrupted completely and their "greater good" was lost. edit: I think the show makes it pretty clear that the scientists did everything wrong when they could have just done their work. If it was so important then why would they jeopardize it by colluding in a criminal conspiracy with the mining corporation, except that they were spiritually and morally bankrupt at heart? Turpitude fucked around with this message at 20:55 on Feb 20, 2024 |
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Feb 20, 2024 20:46
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Turpitude posted:They knew that they were all stooges of the mining corporation and they knew they were covering up and hiding poo poo. The hidden hatch in the floor had the murder weapon within it. Their little secret lab down there was in an area considered sacred by the locals (iirc--I think they said somewhere that the ice caves had spiritual/ancestral significance). The wrath of the village women wasn't just about Annie but about everything wrong with Ennis, the stillbirth epidemic, the suicides, the abuse of power, the injustice. The scientists were never innocent, they were sucking up money from the mining corporation and encouraging the pollution leading to the suffering of the local population. Yeah good point fair enough.
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Feb 20, 2024 20:56
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Turpitude posted:They knew that they were all stooges of the mining corporation and they knew they were covering up and hiding poo poo. The hidden hatch in the floor had the murder weapon within it. Their little secret lab down there was in an area considered sacred by the locals (iirc--I think they said somewhere that the ice caves had spiritual/ancestral significance). The wrath of the village women wasn't just about Annie but about everything wrong with Ennis, the stillbirth epidemic, the suicides, the abuse of power, the injustice. The scientists were never innocent, they were sucking up money from the mining corporation and encouraging the pollution leading to the suffering of the local population. Shouldn't the vigilante crew have continued their work and not just targeted the scientists Why's Kate and Dr Who still around Maybe they were killed offscreen and that's why they're not in the last episode
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Feb 20, 2024 20:59
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| # ? May 25, 2024 00:11 |
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The hatch leading from the ice caves to the science facility felt like it was out of Resident Evil, only somehow much dumber and more implausible. They didn't notice the ice cave entrance was in the parking lot of Tsalal?
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Feb 20, 2024 21:07
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