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does the concept of a "change of pace back" really need to be explained in 2024
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Feb 21, 2024 02:02
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wandler20 posted:If you'd rather take your shot in the top 10 on a position that isn't a premium position that's your problem. I think it's dumb. And you're not taking EDGE5 in the top 10, that argument doesn't even make sense. Detroit’s first three picks were RB, off ball linebacker, and TE ergo they must have been awful this year.
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Feb 21, 2024 02:02
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Definitely was all on Gibbs and not the myriad of other times the Lions poo poo their pants during the meltdown. Truly the Scott Norwood of RBs.
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Feb 21, 2024 02:02
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Alaois posted:can't believe a first round pick loving fumbled a football... I know! CMC did the same drat this in the Super Bowl. These guys, smh.
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Feb 21, 2024 02:02
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wandler20 posted:Gibbs is a good player but they got just as much production out of a third round cast off this season. No they did not lmao he's a very special player
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Feb 21, 2024 02:03
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Metapod posted:No they did not lmao he's a very special player Look, if you want to draft a complimentary RB #12 overall, that's your business. I personally would not.
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Feb 21, 2024 02:05
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wandler20 posted:Just going to ignore that costly turnover by Gibbs. The play that ended up being the turning point in the game and cost his team a chance to go to the Super Bowl? Guess Zay Flowers also wasn't worth the first round pick since he also fumbled in the championship game
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Feb 21, 2024 02:07
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Gibbs is basically a shorthand for everything you need to know about the nuances of positional value + Good pick despite being a RB taken in the top 15 + Arguably had a better rookie season than the more highly touted RB drafted ahead of him because his team had a better plan for how to use him than the Falcons did for Bijan (and also because the Lions had fewer holes to fill, which meant they were better positioned to make a "luxury pick") (tl;dr: situation matters) + Pretty good chance that he wasn't the best possible pick for the Lions long-term because of positional value reasons (if Christian Gonzalez is as good as he looked in his first few games, you'd probably rather have a legit CB1 than a very good timeshare RB) + Just because it worked out for the Lions once doesn't mean it was smart for them to ignore positional value again when they used a first rounder on Jack Campbell
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Feb 21, 2024 02:10
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what sort of compliments does he give?
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Feb 21, 2024 02:12
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This may be controversial, but I am brave enough to say it. The Chargers should draft Brock Bowers at 5. And if they don't, the Giants should draft him at 6. Both spots are good positions to draft a TE imo. Neither team should draft Joe Alt. Based on my draft calculations, LTs should not be drafted until the 7th pick, which happens to be when my team, which coincidentally is in dire need of a franchise LT, is picking. I ran the numbers, i checked the charts, and "Picking the player my team needs ahead of them" is in the lower-left quadrant, which is always the evil quadrant. You're not an evil person, are you?
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Feb 21, 2024 02:13
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Cavauro posted:what sort of compliments does he give? He told my mom she smelled nice. I guess it was with good intentions but it was a little weird
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Feb 21, 2024 02:15
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Getting a pre-combine longshot prediction on the record: Chargers end up taking Taliese Fuaga at 5
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Feb 21, 2024 02:16
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The giants should draft Michael Penix Can't stop thinking about what kind of Giant Penix would be.
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Feb 21, 2024 02:17
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Anyway this is all moot until the combine when the NFL scouts measure the circumference of the players' skulls and can determine how much dawg is residing in the players' brains.
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Feb 21, 2024 02:18
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xbilkis posted:Getting a pre-combine longshot prediction on the record: Chargers end up taking Taliese Fuaga at 5 OK that'd make me mad. If you're taking an OT, you take Alt
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Feb 21, 2024 02:18
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xbilkis posted:Gibbs is basically a shorthand for everything you need to know about the nuances of positional value Good pick period. Who cares about the position? It's a success to not miss on your first rounder as they bust constantly. Bijan and Gibbs both did well last year is the better point. They had no guarantee that Gonzalez was going to be as successful for them as the Pats had him, nor did Gonzalez play enough to be properly rated yet. They also attempted a top 3!! pick for a lockdown corner and that blew up in their faces. Having 3 of your first 4 top 50 picks pan out is very good drafting. It's also only one season in so who knows, they could all suddenly suck and Jack Campbell could become better, but that's the type of guess work we have to take into account when we're pretending draft picks would be as successful on different teams in different schemes.
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Feb 21, 2024 02:19
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a neat cape posted:OK that'd make me mad. If you're taking an OT, you take Alt I love when a team has an elite OL. How is your guard situation looking? I remember your center took a pay cut which was nice.
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Feb 21, 2024 02:26
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Mega64 posted:This may be controversial, but I am brave enough to say it. Thank you for your bravery. I am hoping with all my power that your titans get one of the great offensive tackles and then your new OL Coach, one of the best ever, takes them to the next level 
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Feb 21, 2024 02:29
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personally, I just love to read this endless positional value argument and then go stare at the top of the Raiders draft from 2000 picking an RB high doesn't seem so bad with perspective
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Feb 21, 2024 02:49
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positional value is important to generally think about somewhat, it's why the Lions didn't draft Gibbs at 6 or wherever they were originally. But the notion of not drafting a blue chip player on your board in the first round because ~*positional value*~ is silly. It's a datapoint, or a consideration, or a tiebreaker. At the end of the day, players are the ones who play the game and win games. If you pick good players it'll all work out. If your team has a plan to use and maximize Bowers to his fullest potential then draft him.
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Feb 21, 2024 02:56
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Ornery and Hornery posted:I love when a team has an elite OL. Guard is weird. LG is Zion Johnson who was our first rounder two years ago. Had a decent rookie year and kinda took a step back this year. Jury still out. RG is Jamaree Salyer who was Slater's fill in two years ago and was decent. He wasn't great this past year. Center is a blank space. Linsley took a restructure but is still retiring, so we'll need someone there.
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Feb 21, 2024 03:37
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It wouldn’t be sexy but if I’m the chargers I’d look to see if one of the min/den/lvl/atl bunch is interested in trading up. Obviously two of those are division rivals but if you can trick one of them into moving up for jj McCarthy that would be worth it. If you can get down even further, like late teens, the center from Oregon would be a really excellent pickup for them IMO. As a titans fan at this point I am basically hoping that one of Alt / Nabers / Fashanu are available at 7. Any of those three are blue chip talents IMO and also fill an enormous need. If all three of those gone and your options are Bowers, Odunze, or (Other), I’d probably rather try and trade down. I haven’t looked at Odunze that much yet, though. It is early obviously but it really does seem like there will either be a run on the second tier of receivers or tackles at the end of round 1/start of round 2. There should be at least one good body available at either of those spots when they pick again. I just hope it doesn’t end up being Legette lol. If they could trade down a little from 38 and land Polk I would be psyched although as I have endlessly alluded to I would be thrilled with Troy Franklin or one of the Texas dudes at 38.
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Feb 21, 2024 05:21
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I think players that help you win games are the best kind of players to draft
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Feb 21, 2024 05:27
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Forrest on Fire posted:If he's an undersized elite pass catcher, what's stopping a team from using him as a receiver and putting a second TE on the line? If the Chargers do have to move Williams then they don't have a necessary must play 3rd WR on the field. Call him a TE so you can franchise him cheaper than as a WR
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Feb 21, 2024 05:28
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I think I like Frazier more than Powers-Johnson. It's really a toss up of what you have versus what you could have. Frazier is probably the most experienced starter in the NCAA outside of Bo Nix. JPJ didn't get play time until this year. The intelligence on blocks has such a huge gap between the two that you're basically drafting JPJ to be a complete train up project. Frazier's ability to rotate out of the middle of the pocket and take out edge's on the corner is stuff you only see in veteran centers in the NFL. But on the flip side it's undeniable that JPJ moves guys better in the run game, and when he gets a good set with his hands he can stand up guys just as well as Frazier. Frazier's big problem is that he isn't nearly as fluid as JPJ with blocking on his hip which could limit how much he moves out of his gap on run plays. I believe people will start copying the 49ers' 1 step blocking scheme and JPJ would probably fit that way better.
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Feb 21, 2024 05:28
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Bismack Billabongo posted:It wouldn’t be sexy but if I’m the chargers I’d look to see if one of the min/den/lvl/atl bunch is interested in trading up. Obviously two of those are division rivals but if you can trick one of them into moving up for jj McCarthy that would be worth it. If you can get down even further, like late teens, the center from Oregon would be a really excellent pickup for them IMO. I think passing on Nabers would be very silly, personally. If both he and MHJ are gone then yeah trade out but then it's a team wanting Daniels/Maye not Mccarthy and you can probably get a pretty nice load of picks there
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Feb 21, 2024 05:32
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Bismack Billabongo posted:It wouldn’t be sexy but if I’m the chargers I’d look to see if one of the min/den/lvl/atl bunch is interested in trading up. Obviously two of those are division rivals but if you can trick one of them into moving up for jj McCarthy that would be worth it. If you can get down even further, like late teens, the center from Oregon would be a really excellent pickup for them IMO. Fashanu aside, the Chargers would have to really try to make me angry. I'll be happy with Nabers, Bowers, Alt, or a trade down. We definitely need more picks.
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Feb 21, 2024 05:39
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I love Olu and his upside is strong and danger
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Feb 21, 2024 05:43
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wandler20 posted:Only one of those starters was a first round pick. CMC shouldn't even count because the 49ers didn't spend a first on him. Part of this discussion is that you can get a great RB in trade/FA for cheaper than a great LT/edge
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Feb 21, 2024 10:55
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Doltos posted:I think I like Frazier more than Powers-Johnson. It's really a toss up of what you have versus what you could have. Frazier is probably the most experienced starter in the NCAA outside of Bo Nix. JPJ didn't get play time until this year. The intelligence on blocks has such a huge gap between the two that you're basically drafting JPJ to be a complete train up project. Frazier's ability to rotate out of the middle of the pocket and take out edge's on the corner is stuff you only see in veteran centers in the NFL. But on the flip side it's undeniable that JPJ moves guys better in the run game, and when he gets a good set with his hands he can stand up guys just as well as Frazier. Frazier's big problem is that he isn't nearly as fluid as JPJ with blocking on his hip which could limit how much he moves out of his gap on run plays. I believe people will start copying the 49ers' 1 step blocking scheme and JPJ would probably fit that way better. I think I've settled on my pre-combine centers as: 1. JPJ 2. Matt Lee 3. Frazier 4. Nugent 5. Van Pran I think for me Frazier's athletic limits are more of a hindrance, but I admittedly love me some OLine athletes.
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Feb 21, 2024 15:08
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Amy Pole Her posted:Mims gonna skyrocket soon This came across my feed and lol I love stumbling across footage of NFL players in high school: https://twitter.com/ChadSimmons_/status/1321946610012663808
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Feb 21, 2024 17:19
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Zierlein has a lot of his scouting profiles available with number grades. https://www.nfl.com/draft/tracker/prospects/all-positions/all-colleges/all-statuses/2024?page=1 Some interesting data points in this. Nabers highest graded overall at 6.86. JC Latham much higher graded than his Alt/Fashanu/Fuaga tier. https://twitter.com/LanceZierlein/status/1760346606501515385?s=20
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Feb 21, 2024 18:00
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Diva Cupcake posted:Zierlein has a lot of his scouting profiles available with number grades. Honestly from the media I've consumed I think grading Nabers as having a higher ceiling than MHJ seems to be pretty fair. But at the same time MHJ has a much higher floor so is probably the better pick. e: I just read his legend at the bottom and giving nobody a "pro bowl talent" grade in this class is honestly wild to me IcePhoenix fucked around with this message at 18:16 on Feb 21, 2024 |
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Feb 21, 2024 18:09
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Zierlein can lie all he wants he clearly only cares about athleticism. Not a bad thing but he's not being honest about his grading.
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Feb 21, 2024 18:39
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Diva Cupcake posted:Zierlein has a lot of his scouting profiles available with number grades. I know that a lot of scouts do that style of grading but I do find it a bit odd that bigger number =\= better prospect. I feel like they should use a numbering system with some alpha suffix adding qualitative descriptors like high ceiling / low floor.
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Feb 21, 2024 18:51
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IcePhoenix posted:Honestly from the media I've consumed I think grading Nabers as having a higher ceiling than MHJ seems to be pretty fair. But at the same time MHJ has a much higher floor so is probably the better pick. Yeah it’s wild to me too. Everyone seems so stoked on the talent in this class and he seems a lot more lukewarm. Love that he has Maye as QB3. TFF leading the meta again: Jayden is better than Maye 
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Feb 21, 2024 18:53
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The only thing I know about Maye (or really any of these guys) is what I've seen from highlights and his highlights scare the poo poo out of me. Lots of ample time and space in the pocket leading to big bombs to wide open dudes. Reminds me a lot of Zach Wilson.
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Feb 21, 2024 19:06
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Ornery and Hornery posted:Yeah it’s wild to me too. Everyone seems so stoked on the talent in this class and he seems a lot more lukewarm. Thinking more on it I think my biggest gripe on using a scale like that is that it needs to be 100% position independent but you can tell he's also clearly grading the prospects against each other to rank them.
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Feb 21, 2024 19:08
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The Puppy Bowl posted:The only thing I know about Maye (or really any of these guys) is what I've seen from highlights and his highlights scare the poo poo out of me. Lots of ample time and space in the pocket leading to big bombs to wide open dudes. Reminds me a lot of Zach Wilson. Maye is bigger and has a better arm, that alone makes him a better prospect than Wilson. He doesn't wow you the way Jayden Daniels does but I wasn't wowed by Justin Herbert at Oregon either.
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Feb 21, 2024 21:06
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Cash Monet posted:In terms of just bottom line production taking a tight end in the top 10 probably isn't good value. Cash Monet posted:In terms of just bottom line production taking a tight end in the top 10 probably isn't good value. like travis kelce, brock bowers is a TE in name only, ie he is a white guy you can pay less than if he had WR by his name. he plays like travis kelce, ie wr who blocks a few times per game, not like gronk, or any other actual TE you could name and wide receivers are drafted in the top 10 every year so the question is, do you look at his tape and think he is a really good wide receiver, if yes, then draft him. If you don’t, then don’t imho a lot of people are weighing in without actually knowing how he plays Dejan Bimble fucked around with this message at 21:19 on Feb 21, 2024 |
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Feb 21, 2024 21:16
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