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GiantRockFromSpace posted:IIRC we can assume most (not all) IDs have the same backstory for the Sinners but circustamces lead them there? Cause Rodion being so generous and happy about meals is both sad but heartwarming given her origins Depends on how far back the change in their circumstances happened, but yes most of the Identities have the same backstory and diverted to a company/job other than Limbus. Blade Lineage Meursault definitely doesn't have the same backstory as normal Meursault, but it has a similar "energy". Just replace probably killing his mother for entirely personal logic reasons with definitely killing that corrupt official's bodyguards.
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Feb 29, 2024 10:58
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2/2/4 for Ryoshu, but Rodion's is trickier from the animations. 2/3, and then the last one is either 2 or 4, from what I see
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Feb 29, 2024 11:06
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Liu Rodion going on about how the Liu are just a big ol' happy family, and her being director, makes me suspect she might have Liu faction specific buffs following the precedent of Kimsault. Which would be nice given their generally poor clashing ability.
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Feb 29, 2024 15:45
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Kimsault is great and having an ID like him would be neat every once in a while, but I really hope he doesn't become the new template. "Group mentor ID + 3-5 Group IDs and maybe 1-2 extremely powerful non-Group ID, if you are feeling super spicy" would be extremely boring as the meta.
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Feb 29, 2024 16:12
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This may be a dumb question but I'm just now realizing that absolute resonance gives you a bonus to clash power, does anyone know how much it actually is? In my defense 95% of the time I press winrate and let that do my thinking for me
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Feb 29, 2024 16:30
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Aumanor posted:What were you running? If I'm on sinking, bleed or burn, I'd slam pick the compass in this selection. Blade Lineage which relies on normal damage, so welp e: that's also why "just evade lol" doesn't really work since Meursault in particular has no form of damage mitigation and will explode if he's caught with his pants down i probably could have worded that better anyway I picked the worst choice in final power +3 and somehow survived. sinclair didn't but you know what I mean. thankfully I had The Coat so my clashes weren't TOTALLY hopeless, just mostly. but I had both the notebook and zippo lighter from floor 2 so I had resources for days. for kim i got both the blade lineage and poise fusion gifts at the last moment and vaporized him in 3 turns Yinlock fucked around with this message at 17:22 on Feb 29, 2024 |
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Feb 29, 2024 16:47
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Lord_Magmar posted:Depends on how far back the change in their circumstances happened, but yes most of the Identities have the same backstory and diverted to a company/job other than Limbus. Meursault is part of the "stick a Sinner's face on an already existing character" ID subtype, in this case Kim RandomReader posted:https://youtu.be/I2ytdOuizWo lol of course Ryoshu is 00 despite having 2 burn EGO. Still the fact that she can actually get use out of hers' now is good e: also burn REALLY needs IDs that aren't those 3 goobers so i'll take it Yinlock fucked around with this message at 16:55 on Feb 29, 2024 |
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Feb 29, 2024 16:52
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Yinlock posted:Meursault is part of the "stick a Sinner's face on an already existing character" ID subtype, in this case Kim So far most of those have done a good enough job of matching the identity to an appropriate Sinner. N Corp Faust is obviously "Kromer" but still Faust, Ahab Ishmael is the same thing, the original LCC Identities were Rodion and Ishmael as Effie and Saude. LCC Ryoshu is Pilot. If a character has an identity, it is in theory a valid path their life could've taken, no matter how odd, and their history in that mirror world will fit whilst keeping them somewhat the same person (mostly). Leviathan outright has (spoilers obviously) Garnet have an alternate version of himself as Roland, dead wife (who wasn't Angelica), Black Silence Rampage and all. The main thing with Blade Lineage Mentor Meursault is that we basically get no direct characterisation of Kim to compare to, unlike most of the swap a Sinner with a story character identity. Obviously he has the same rough backstory as Kim, but they might have differences we don't see because we barely get any characterisation of Kim himself. N Corp Meursault is another good example, he's meant to be "Guido" but they clearly carry themselves differently in character and what we see of Guido's relationship with Kromer is different from Meursault's with Faust in the N Corp Timeline. Edit: Pierre and Jack are in some sort of vaguely healthy relationship/partnership of mutual trust care and affection, Ryoshu and Gregor in the same situation hate eachothers guts and each are planning to kill the other eventually. For a situation more analagous to Mentor Meursault. Edit x2: Sorry, I didn't mean to ramble and go off. Just trying to point out that Project Moon still put in effort to make identities clearly based on other characters still remain true to the Sinner and their personality/life history. Outside whatever specific change to set them on the alternative path. Lord_Magmar fucked around with this message at 17:43 on Feb 29, 2024 |
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Feb 29, 2024 17:37
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Lord_Magmar posted:The main thing with Blade Lineage Mentor Meursault is that we basically get no direct characterisation of Kim to compare to, unlike most of the swap a Sinner with a story character identity. Obviously he has the same rough backstory as Kim, but they might have differences we don't see because we barely get any characterisation of Kim himself. Yeah, this is the main thing for me. The basic beats of Kim's story line up with Meursault. You have a guy who goes :| who just wants to serve, you have a random burst of violence that has an explanation that he never really goes into, he's now trapped in a legal punishment, all the pieces are there. We just don't have any direct Kim characterization to compare it to. You could make an argument that Meursault is a worse leader than Kim is, since all the sinner BL grunts are fuckups and all the salsus are emotionally isolated blade mystics that don't seem to care about the Blade Lineage as a whole nearly as much as Aeng-du does? But that's all we can say until we get more Kim content. (Which we probably will, but still.) EDIT: I'm only going off of Limbus here, of course, but if there was a wealth of Ruina content for Kim you all would have mentioned it by now. Lurks With Wolves fucked around with this message at 18:08 on Feb 29, 2024 |
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Feb 29, 2024 18:06
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Lurks With Wolves posted:Yeah, this is the main thing for me. The basic beats of Kim's story line up with Meursault. You have a guy who goes :| who just wants to serve, you have a random burst of violence that has an explanation that he never really goes into, he's now trapped in a legal punishment, all the pieces are there. We just don't have any direct Kim characterization to compare it to. You could make an argument that Meursault is a worse leader than Kim is, since all the sinner BL grunts are fuckups and all the salsus are emotionally isolated blade mystics that don't seem to care about the Blade Lineage as a whole nearly as much as Aeng-du does? But that's all we can say until we get more Kim content. from what I can gather from both Ruina and Limbus the Lineage are a clan of bodyguards/assassins/whatever that eventually got the boot due to politics and became wandering murderers without a cause because murder is all they really know I think they're a play on the whole dichotomy between the Honorable Samurai ideal and how samurai actually acted(ie like psycho bandits)
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Feb 29, 2024 18:56
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Yinlock posted:from what I can gather from both Ruina and Limbus the Lineage are a clan of bodyguards/assassins/whatever that eventually got the boot due to politics and became wandering murderers without a cause because murder is all they really know Yeah this seems to more or less be it. Specifically, between some of the writing in the event and on the Meursault Identity. The Blade Lineage were a Syndicate or Fixer group in S Corp all trained by Kim/Meursault. When Kim/Meursault snapped and assaulted a corrupt official the whole lineage were forced, or willingly, followed him into exile until they might return and free their "homeland" from corruption. Although given the tone and Aeng-Du it is likely they know this is a lost cause and are instead hoping to carve a new home somewhere. Edit: If I was to make an observation, the likely big difference between Kim and Meursault. Based on the mirror dungeon visions, identity story and event story, is that Meursault as the Mentor doesn't do much in the way of emotional guidance, he simply teaches the swordplay to perfection with an unfeeling mien. Whereas Kim more openly connected with his students, and ultimately seeing them be slaughtered like his old master without being able to protect them drives his distortion. Because Meursault is unwilling (possibly incapable) to take more than the most basic actions without guidance, he cannot he as much of a pillar for his students to lean on as Kim. Meursault needs someone else to provide structure in his life, since he doesn't like making his own decisions. Being a wandering ronin leading other wandering ronin is not in his wheelhouse, but teaching swordplay by example is (his gameplay gimmick). Lord_Magmar fucked around with this message at 19:11 on Feb 29, 2024 |
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Feb 29, 2024 19:04
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Lord_Magmar posted:Yeah this seems to more or less be it. Specifically, between some of the writing in the event and on the Meursault Identity. The Blade Lineage were a Syndicate or Fixer group in S Corp all trained by Kim/Meursault. When Kim/Meursault snapped and assaulted a corrupt official the whole lineage were forced, or willingly, followed him into exile until they might return and free their "homeland" from corruption. Although given the tone and Aeng-Du it is likely they know this is a lost cause and are instead hoping to carve a new home somewhere. This seems pretty plausible. I'm surprised he took the initiative to send that threat at all, guess even Meursault can get angry. Going by Aeng-du the Lineage seem to utterly revere Kim as their clan leader but also kind of resent him for putting them into their current situation. It's a no-win situation for our bamboo boy. He can't let the murder go unpunished but at the same time is fully aware that offing the corrupt official won't change the system that put him there in the first place. So he tried to thread the needle with a showy threat and gets the worst of both worlds: exiled from his home AND his clan are slowly becoming wanton murderers anyway e: it's pretty vague when he got the invitation though but going by how excited he apparently was about it he's still looking for a chance to overthrow his corrupt Wing at least, even if the rest of the Lineage see it as a lost cause or don't care Yinlock fucked around with this message at 19:39 on Feb 29, 2024 |
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Feb 29, 2024 19:32
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Rodya sure does enjoy the perks of leadership whenever she can.
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Feb 29, 2024 19:42
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Yinlock posted:This seems pretty plausible. I'm surprised he took the initiative to send that threat at all, guess even Meursault can get angry. I half-said this earlier, but if you're going to make comparisons to The Stranger the threat is simultaneously the moment where he shoots a man because he has heatstroke and the moment where he blows up at the priest for not understanding anything. On one hand, it's the random piece of badly-explained violence that ruins everything. On the other hand, it's him finally expressing himself to a powerful man who doesn't actually understand him the night before his punishment (ie, being cast from his home and watching the entire organization he built slowly dissolve into a band of violent vagrants) comes to pass. If there's one circumstance for Meursault actually being angry and emotive, it's something like this.
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Feb 29, 2024 19:45
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KobunFan posted:Rodya sure does enjoy the perks of leadership whenever she can. we're all one big happy family here at the liu ishmael: *looking absolutely dead inside*
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Feb 29, 2024 19:56
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Yinlock posted:we're all one big happy family here at the liu To be fair to Rodya, that's because Liu Ishmael is explicitly uncomfortable around people: quote:The child was enjoying her lunch alone at the table. quote:From the sound of it, the child is particularly skilled among her peers in Section 4 of the Liu's southern branch. Her specialty of quickly closing the distance for a close-quarter thrashing made her excellent at dealing with groups of foes alone.
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Feb 29, 2024 21:25
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Aumanor posted:What were you running? If I'm on sinking, bleed or burn, I'd slam pick the compass in this selection. I wouldn't pick the compass even if I was on sinking. Headstrong is the absolute never-pick option, no matter what. If i was offered those on my BL run it'd be special contract.
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Feb 29, 2024 23:10
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Yinlock posted:Meursault is part of the "stick a Sinner's face on an already existing character" ID subtype, in this case Kim Hong Lu is only mostly a goober because there's no such thing as a bad Hong Lu identity
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Mar 1, 2024 01:05
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Google Jeb Bush posted:Hong Lu is only mostly a goober because there's no such thing as a bad Hong Lu identity A 6+2+2 skill 2 says otherwise. He really is much better benched. 5 of his 6 skills barely crack 10.
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Mar 1, 2024 01:47
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ShoutokuTaisho posted:A 6+2+2 skill 2 says otherwise. He really is much better benched. 5 of his 6 skills barely crack 10.
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Mar 1, 2024 01:53
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He gets better once his coin power conditional are active
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Mar 1, 2024 02:04
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Junpei posted:He gets better once his coin power conditional are active Yes, but out of the entire team, his conditionals are the only ones not trivial to achieve. Also, 2 coins on all his skills means he gets the least out of Soothe the Dead.
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Mar 1, 2024 02:06
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I just want to know when Don is getting a Burn ID so she can make use of Lifetime Stew.
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Mar 1, 2024 02:48
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I can't wait until the very popular and useful Shi Association build gets more IDs.
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Mar 1, 2024 03:08
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Saigyouji posted:To be fair to Rodya, that's because Liu Ishmael is explicitly uncomfortable around people: Sounds like she's got lingering issues around attaching herself to other people due to the loss of the Pequod Crew then. Aversion to forming new relationships or friendships that might die in a violent line of work due to her previous attachments being all dead/devoured.
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Mar 1, 2024 03:15
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Solitair posted:I can't wait until the very popular and useful Shi Association build gets more IDs. i cant wait to get actual assassination IDs from the assassination association, instead of more berserker poo poo
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Mar 1, 2024 03:23
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Lord_Magmar posted:Sounds like she's got lingering issues around attaching herself to other people due to the loss of the Pequod Crew then. Aversion to forming new relationships or friendships that might die in a violent line of work due to her previous attachments being all dead/devoured. I was going to say that most of Ishmael's IDs could easily be versions of her that didn't decide to join the Pequod, since Ishmael deciding to join a different group would be an easy inflection point in much the same way that a lot of Heathcliff's identities are just him joining a different organization than Limbus Company after he left Wurthering Heights. And then I remembered that she only grew her hair out because of Queequeg. Not that she couldn't have had a girlfriend who permanently changed her fashion sense on dry land, but you get the idea. Anyway, what I was trying to get at is that even when we look at the earliest Ishmaels in the chapter 5 flashbacks, she's standoffish and not particularly sociable when she's just a burnt out office worker. As an official Ishmael Weirdo, we should admit that even without the trauma she's probably just Like This.
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Mar 1, 2024 03:51
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Yinlock posted:we're all one big happy family here at the liu Ishmael: "My loving noodles... The fault lies within you, Rodya!" Saigyouji posted:To be fair to Rodya, that's because Liu Ishmael is explicitly uncomfortable around people: Something interesting to note is that Liu Ishmael is considered Season 0 (or Standard Fare), which mean that her backstory most likely back track directly from the event of the Pequod, while other Seasonal ID changes and wiggle the story/circumstances of the Sinner to fit the ID in question. Considering the history of Ishmael before Limbus, there is also the chance that she might leave Liu Association to join other group of Fixer in the search of the Pequod crew. Although, it is also interesting to consider the possibility that she might also have given up considering the Uptie story of identity such as the Shi, where she lament the fact that this is the furthest rank she can achieve* and that she immedieatly receive an invitation for the Shi association immediately after the Whale incident. *Funnily enough, she achieve a higher rank in Liu than in the Shi. Lt. Lizard posted:Kimsault is great and having an ID like him would be neat every once in a while, but I really hope he doesn't become the new template. That's kinda always been the case, ever since the release of NCorp? Like, yeah, some ID works better with others but considering the game might take a while to finish, we might finish with a setup similar to the Library, where people from entirely different background and with widly different ability working together giving a result that is much, much higher in power and efficiency than the sum of its part. e: Lurks With Wolves posted:I was going to say that most of Ishmael's IDs could easily be versions of her that didn't decide to join the Pequod, since Ishmael deciding to join a different group would be an easy inflection point in much the same way that a lot of Heathcliff's identities are just him joining a different organization than Limbus Company after he left Wurthering Heights. And then I remembered that she only grew her hair out because of Queequeg. Not that she couldn't have had a girlfriend who permanently changed her fashion sense on dry land, but you get the idea. She might just go "gently caress it we ball" and grow her hair out!
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Mar 1, 2024 03:59
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Google Jeb Bush posted:Hong Lu is only mostly a goober because there's no such thing as a bad Hong Lu identity true, he can also work fine benched too Lord_Magmar posted:Sounds like she's got lingering issues around attaching herself to other people due to the loss of the Pequod Crew then. Aversion to forming new relationships or friendships that might die in a violent line of work due to her previous attachments being all dead/devoured. tbf she's also not particularly extroverted in general, even before the whole Pequod thing. being more insular is how she was able to dodge Ahab's brainwashing Yinlock fucked around with this message at 18:37 on Mar 1, 2024 |
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Mar 1, 2024 18:35
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Lurks With Wolves posted:I was going to say that most of Ishmael's IDs could easily be versions of her that didn't decide to join the Pequod, since Ishmael deciding to join a different group would be an easy inflection point in much the same way that a lot of Heathcliff's identities are just him joining a different organization than Limbus Company after he left Wurthering Heights. And then I remembered that she only grew her hair out because of Queequeg. Not that she couldn't have had a girlfriend who permanently changed her fashion sense on dry land, but you get the idea. More definitively, Liu Ishmael also still has the hairband made from Queequeg's rope.
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Mar 1, 2024 20:08
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Junpei posted:If Kimsault kills something in MD with just base Yield My Flesh, and you have the Perversion gift, would you get two Pride and one Wrath? Okay so, if the text is correct, it should give 1 Wrath EGO ressources, since To Claim their Bones only activate if you lose the clash of Yield My Flesh, but with the condition of Perversion, Kimsault should get 3 Pride, 1 Wrath and 1 Envy, since you get 1 ressource for all affinities the ally.
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Mar 2, 2024 23:55
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So, I've got a question. I've built up a little power ranking in head and I want to double check that I don't have something wrong. IN GENERAL 1v1 Fights Colors>Head (ABC) Elite>Finger Elite>Wing Elite Is that about right?
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Mar 3, 2024 06:11
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I do think Arbiters and Claws are naturally probably the strongest, Kali just got really drat close to their level, and to be fair to the first Kali vs Garion match, she had to fight through waves of abnormalities first. Other than that, it's hard to say.
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Mar 3, 2024 06:17
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See, that's the thing, Kali did, in fact, draw with Garion and TWO Claws AFTER beating down every abnormality in the lab. Unless Kali was just a legend even among the Colors, I can't imagine she was THAT much stronger than her fellow Colors. Maybe it was her EGO but then, Vergil also has an EGO. The Indigo Elder beat one of the forces of nature that was one of the Five by himself.
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Mar 3, 2024 06:19
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Of course, the real thing is that the Head does not particularly fight fair. The Colors are amazing by themselves, but if you ask the Head "you and whose army", they'll answer "ours", and it'll all be Arbiters and Claws.
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Mar 3, 2024 06:26
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Yeah, that's why I specified "in general" and "1v1".
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Mar 3, 2024 06:27
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KobunFan posted:See, that's the thing, Kali did, in fact, draw with Garion and TWO Claws AFTER beating down every abnormality in the lab. Unless Kali was just a legend even among the Colors, I can't imagine she was THAT much stronger than her fellow Colors. Maybe it was her EGO but then, Vergil also has an EGO. The Indigo Elder beat one of the forces of nature that was one of the Five by himself. Vergil was the one he said was the "most dangerous" with no competition, though.
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Mar 3, 2024 06:28
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Plus, most Arbiters are packing multiple Singularities: 'Fairy' is F Corp's, and 'Lock' is J Corp, just on Garion/Binah, and those are the two we have confirmed, we don't know if Chain, Pillar and Shockwave are applications of those or full other Singularities in and of themselves.
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Mar 3, 2024 06:29
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GilliamYaeger posted:I'll note that Roland, the man who wiped out a branch of the Middle solo, said that Gebura/Kali was the strongest Fixer with zero hesitation. When pressed about who'd be the strongest other than her, the Indigo Elder, as "The Great Lake's Fixer" was one of the Fixers who Roland said was second to the Red Mist. Well that's just... unhelpful. Very much like Vergil! (Comparing Vergil to himself, not you to Vergil) Again, though, aiming for generalities. I'm wondering more about Finger Elite vs Wing Elite. KobunFan fucked around with this message at 06:36 on Mar 3, 2024 |
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Mar 3, 2024 06:31
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The circumstances and the planning going into the battle matter more once you start hitting elites than any specific level of power. When looking at a Finger vs a Wing elite, the question becomes who had more information going in, and who was able to use it to make the battlefield work in their favor more effectively.
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Mar 3, 2024 07:03
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