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Shard posted:In Man of Steel Superman does a ton of collateral damage in the city in the final fight. So much so that in Batman vs Superman it's used as the reason Bruce Wayne hates him at first. I know they become friends at the end but, does Superman ever comment on it or do anything to make up for all the people he got killed in that fight? Does he say anything on the matter at all? It's weird to phrase it as him getting people killed, when the alternative to the fight was sitting back and watching Zod kill everyone.
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Mar 7, 2024 19:14
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on the subject of DNA test, you would think given how the tech is good and fast enough to do on the spot tests under a min, they would do multiple test for redundancy. "okay blood prick, skin scrap, a hair snip, mouth and nose swab."
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Mar 7, 2024 19:46
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PhazonLink posted:on the subject of DNA test, you would think given how the tech is good and fast enough to do on the spot tests under a min, they would do multiple test for redundancy. ATTENTION ALL FREE THINKERS! Starfleet just wants your genetic material! Do not give in to their Orwellian search methods! Suspect Changeling infiltration? Inject them with a dose of Ivermectin! It'll reveal shapeshifters on the spot!
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Mar 7, 2024 19:54
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Oh god, how do you deal with conspiracy nuts when there actually are nanomachines? They would have a field day. "They SAY that Covid-95 was naturally occurring, but we know the truth. They engineered the whole supervirus so they can inject us with Borg Nanomachines! Then once all of the Federarion is injected, they'll unleash the kill code and TURN US ALL INTO BORG DRONES! Do you think we can trust this Captain Picard? We all know that once someone goes Borg, there's no going back! He's just a sleeper agent for the Hive Mind! Same thing with the whole crew of the Voyager! I heard that it came back to the Alpha Quadrant using BORG TECHNOLOGY! WITH A WHOLE FLEET OF BORG SHIPS! AND THEN WE JUST MADE HER AN ADMIRAL! Does any of this make sense, people? Wake up! The deep state is trying to make us all Borg so we're easier to control! But let me tell you, folks, that I found the secret. The way to TAKE BACK your mind from them! My new Brainforce Pro Omega is all-natural and will protect your body AND your mind! Available on my store and from all reputable Ferengi merchants."
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Mar 7, 2024 20:09
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Randalor posted:Oh god, how do you deal with conspiracy nuts when there actually are nanomachines? They would have a field day. "and watch out for PICARD'S KID too, I know that the BORG ASSIMILATED HIS BALLS"
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Mar 7, 2024 20:11
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I always suspected Mr. T worked for the Borg.
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Mar 7, 2024 20:20
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Crespolini posted:It's weird to phrase it as him getting people killed, when the alternative to the fight was sitting back and watching Zod kill everyone. At no point did he look around and seem horrified about all the destruction, he didn't care about any of the people except for those at the bank, he didn't even try to like grab zod and bring him somewhere else. Compare that to Superman 2 where he tries to get out of the city, freaks out when he sees the people getting hurt, and deliberately leads the fight away from the populated area.
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Mar 7, 2024 20:25
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Shard posted:At no point did he look around and seem horrified about all the destruction, he didn't care about any of the people except for those at the bank, he didn't even try to like grab zod and bring him somewhere else. Compare that to Superman 2 where he tries to get out of the city, freaks out when he sees the people getting hurt, and deliberately leads the fight away from the populated area. Uh, there are several points in the fight when he does just that. When Zod kicks a fuel truck at him he floats over it, but then it explodes behind him and he turns around to look at the mayhem, opening himself up for a sucker punch by Zod. We don't see his face though, I guess he could have been smiling for once. Superman doesn't try to leave in MoS because Zod won't let him. If he tried to pull that poo poo from Superman 2, Zod would happily start crushing skulls, but Superman can't even consider that as an option because Zod just keeps coming for him. The fight is a LOT faster and Zod more relentless than the very turn-based display in Superman 2.
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Mar 7, 2024 20:33
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I know I brought this up before, but I remember in Iron Man 2 where our hero is being pursued by dozens of iron mans who are constantly shooting him with bullets and rockets and Iron Man is like, lol can't hit me in this labyrinth of buildings. Iron Man you should have just let them kill you; every single bullet and rocket that hit a building instead of you killed people. That scene alone must have resulted in a thousand casualties. At least take the fight outside the city or something. It isn't even one of those situations where Iron Man is stopping innocent people from getting killed. The bad guys' ambition is financial and personal. They aren't trying to kill innocents, they're just trying to kill him. I am happy this sort of thing was kind of addressed in some of the later superhero movies but in the first wave of hits from the 00s on, there are so many people getting killed off-screen that is just shrugged away as nothing.
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Mar 7, 2024 21:18
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I love how in Avatar 2 they not only bring back the villain from the first movie in the weirdest way possible, but have him be defeated in the exact same way from the exact same hubris "Hey, you know how I died last time because I needlessly antagonized the natives and then led all my men into a frontal assault that got them all killed? Well, I antagonized the natives and led all my men into a frontal assault that got them all killed again. But at least I didn't die!" If Avatar 3 doesn't start with Quaritch being put in the Device for his constant failure I'm gonna be disappointed.
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Mar 7, 2024 21:37
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credburn posted:I know I brought this up before, but I remember in Iron Man 2 where our hero is being pursued by dozens of iron mans who are constantly shooting him with bullets and rockets and Iron Man is like, lol can't hit me in this labyrinth of buildings. Iron Man you should have just let them kill you; every single bullet and rocket that hit a building instead of you killed people. That scene alone must have resulted in a thousand casualties. At least take the fight outside the city or something. It isn't even one of those situations where Iron Man is stopping innocent people from getting killed. The bad guys' ambition is financial and personal. They aren't trying to kill innocents, they're just trying to kill him. IIrc that fight takes place at some big exhibition and everybody conveniently flees once the drones show up. It's a pretty blatant example of trying to have stakes but not wanting to deal with collateral damage, Marvel occasionally seems to suck people into the Danger Dimension for their fights. A magical place where poo poo blows up but everybody has gone out to lunch so there is no real danger.
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Mar 7, 2024 21:37
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Randalor posted:Oh god, how do you deal with conspiracy nuts when there actually are nanomachines? They would have a field day. I'm enjoying the thought of wingnut right-wingers in the Federation now. "Principles such as diplomacy with hereditary enemies, universal social support, and education for all have corrupted traditional Federation values of boldness and adventure. That's why I'm converting to Klingonism and making sure my family does too. We're planning our move to Q'onos right now, where my sons will grow up with honor and without the taint of weakness, and my daughters will marry strong warriors and breed hearty scions." Two weeks later: tries to move back home to the Federation because having a shuttlecraft with lifted, knobby nodules and modified to "roll coal" doesn't actually earn you any respect in the Klingon empire, but bragging about your collection of phaser rifles with bump stocks gets you branded as a petaQ when they find out you never served in the military. Umm, back on topic: Across the Spider-Verse, finally saw it on a plane not too long ago. Was disappointed because I thought David Dastmalchian played the Spot, not Jason Schwartzman. (But also saw Schwartzman in Asteroid City on the same flight and thought he did a fairly good job, though Goldblum stole the show (of course).)
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Mar 7, 2024 21:46
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Grendels Dad posted:IIrc that fight takes place at some big exhibition and everybody conveniently flees once the drones show up. It's a pretty blatant example of trying to have stakes but not wanting to deal with collateral damage, Marvel occasionally seems to suck people into the Danger Dimension for their fights. A magical place where poo poo blows up but everybody has gone out to lunch so there is no real danger. I like that. The Danger Dimension. I think that's why I'm sick of superhero stuff. The superhero scene needs to move towards introspection. I want to see real world consequences, satire, deconstruction. I know there's some stuff. My favorite is Super with Dwight from the office. I always loved this scene where bad guy screams at dwight "your no better than me, you almost killed someone for butting in line", and dwight screams back that "YOU DON'T BUTT IN LINE". (should start at 1:23) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EET138PjQnc&t=83s I always thought that summed up dwights character somehow, and it shows what "real life" superhero's would mean. Just fanatics enforcing their own morality through the use of power. Also, he does not get the girl. I want more poo poo like that, and I want it to be more popular so I will have something to talk about with regular people,
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Mar 7, 2024 22:22
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Jen heir rick posted:Just fanatics enforcing their own morality through the use of power. Watch the news if you want that.
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Mar 7, 2024 22:58
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As much as I dislike MoS, supes did try to get zod out of the city. Went to space and everything. Wrecked one of Bruce's satellites and then fell back a few miles from where they went airborne. He didn't really accomplish much with it but he did actually try to get him up, up, and away from the people.
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Mar 7, 2024 23:12
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Stupid_Sexy_Flander posted:He didn't really accomplish much with it but he did actually try to get him up, up, and away from the people. 
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Mar 7, 2024 23:49
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cowboy
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My takeaway with MoS and Clark's actions is that we're essentially watching Superman Begins. And he gets thrown in the loving deep end right away. Also, as others pointed out, he's clearly shown trying to lure Zod away
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Mar 8, 2024 02:33
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Admiralty Flag posted:I'm enjoying the thought of wingnut right-wingers in the Federation now. There's a gag in Lower Decks where someone yells 'Changelings aren't real! The Dominion War didn't happen!'
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Mar 8, 2024 02:42
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I drive my spaceship at warp 9 no matter what those alien scientists say, you can't "destroy the fabric of space" just by doing horrible things to it to travel faster than the speed of light.
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Mar 8, 2024 02:52
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HopperUK posted:There's a gag in Lower Decks where someone yells 'Changelings aren't real! The Dominion War didn't happen!'  must have been nice to be a REMF posted somewhere in the rear end end of the Beta Quadrant and not on one of the countless ships exploderated in DS9 battle scenes.
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Mar 8, 2024 02:56
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Deep Space Nine actually does have a crank scientist from the Federation, all suspicious of the 'soulless agents of orthodoxy' and working on a means of immortality by inventing a chamber to entertain your body cells so they don't die of boredom. Jake and Nog have to try to get him to trade them a famous baseball card. Changeling shapeshifting is shown from pretty early on to be very impressive, and also oddly enough very difficult- Odo isn't a very good shapeshifter by his species' standards, and it's kind of a point that he's far from being able to convincingly imitate another humanoid being. He meets another Changeling down the line who is far more advanced, being able to turn into smoke, into fire, and even to be able to travel through space on his own by imitating a spaceborn creature. I'm pretty sure there's potential for a Changeling to reach Q levels of power and ascension if they spent long enough developing their abilities. (Also possibly why a species-wide trait of them seems to be being control freaks and near OCD; proper shapeshifting requires superhuman attention to detail) MariusLecter posted:And it doesn’t work. The big bad promises not to kill the antagonist cause of that but they do realize it will be a very large portion of the human population that a big bad looking to scour all the descendants of their jailer is gonna wipe out. I've seen this come up in a few things, fantasy stories where 'descendant of the king' is way easier to do than you'd think; half of Europe is descended from Charlemagne and the dude just had eight kids who survived to adulthood and had kids. And more like your example, in City of Heroes of all things; one major villain group's whole thing is basically being the ghosts of an ancient magical civilization who made deals with demons for magical power so they could wipe out another ancient magical civilization, which was made a binding term- of course, they failed, and now a significant fraction of Earth's population is descended from their ancient enemies (which is one of the most common ways for magical talent to manifest as an ancient inheritance) and the evil cultists are still bound to wipe them all out to fulfil the pact. They haven't made a lot of headway, especially since significant amounts of both superheroes and supervillains are among those descendants. Blarghalt posted:I love how in Avatar 2 they not only bring back the villain from the first movie in the weirdest way possible, but have him be defeated in the exact same way from the exact same hubris That's just standard Western military operating procedure. It's kinda the entire point. Ghost Leviathan has a new favorite as of 05:43 on Mar 8, 2024 |
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Mar 8, 2024 05:29
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Blarghalt posted:I love how in Avatar 2 they not only bring back the villain from the first movie in the weirdest way possible, but have him be defeated in the exact same way from the exact same hubris 3 should start with Quaritch being born as one of the Navi, and even as a baby he looks evil as gently caress. He decides to lead the Fire Nation Navi People into an all out war. And maybe there's a robot that has TWO knives this time.
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Mar 8, 2024 05:47
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Cowslips Warren posted:3 should start with Quaritch being born as one of the Navi, and even as a baby he looks evil as gently caress. He decides to lead the Fire Nation Navi People into an all out war. And maybe there's a robot that has TWO knives this time. Or a crab robot that has a knife.
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Mar 8, 2024 05:58
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Randalor posted:Sisko's dad spotted the flaw in the way they tested for changlings as soon as Sisko told him. The Klingon that figured out this method was a Changeling that just used the general he was replacing as a blood bank. Just suck out some blood and store it in your hand before a meeting. This literally actually happened. Look up John Scheeburger. He implanted a tube of someone else's blood in his arm to get away with rape. Crazy!
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Mar 8, 2024 06:37
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Checking for changelings is easy. You shoot them, and if they don’t melt into goo you get the transporter buffer to spit out a new one.
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Mar 8, 2024 06:46
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MariusLecter posted:And it doesn’t work. The big bad promises not to kill the antagonist cause of that but they do realize it will be a very large portion of the human population that a big bad looking to scour all the descendants of their jailer is gonna wipe out.
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Mar 8, 2024 07:18
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Ommin posted:Ok, this is what you have to do when locking away ancient evils with blood magic. You make it that only such-n-such's bloodline can free the evil, then you destroy the bloodline right then. Depending on the context you might even get volunteers. I hereby declare Dorkius Redditor guardian of the Ancient One. Only the blood of his, hehehe, descendants may unlock the chains on this cursed beast!
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Mar 8, 2024 08:21
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DS9 also has a changeling literally just show up randomly in a park to Sisko disguised as O'Brien (who Sisko knows is a whole quadrant away) to chat and taunt him about how their mere existence is driving the galaxy into a paranoid frenzy without even having to do much.
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Mar 8, 2024 09:36
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Grendels Dad posted:I hereby declare Dorkius Redditor guardian of the Ancient One. Only the blood of his, hehehe, descendants may unlock the chains on this cursed beast! What happens if the person you chose was a frequent visitor to a sperm bank, though? If you really want to be certain that a seal is unbreakable, wouldn't the best way be to use a child, then kill the child? I sure loving hope someone who hasn't hit double-digits on their age doesn't have a descendant.
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Mar 8, 2024 12:22
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Just use something that doesn't have blood in that case.
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Mar 8, 2024 14:28
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Ghost Leviathan posted:DS9 also has a changeling literally just show up randomly in a park to Sisko disguised as O'Brien (who Sisko knows is a whole quadrant away) to chat and taunt him about how their mere existence is driving the galaxy into a paranoid frenzy without even having to do much. Didn't the changeling say something like there's only three of them on Earth? I already know the answer is soft sci-fi, but how do changelings copy retinal patterns so accurately?
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Mar 8, 2024 17:25
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Admiralty Flag posted:Didn't the changeling say something like there's only three of them on Earth? Yeah, the changeling was mocking how extreme and suspicious the Federarion had become of literally everyone. And why would they care about retinal scanners when they could just enter any buikding through, say, a vent or crack in the foundation? Or just turn into a fly and hang out on a nearby wall until someone else opens the door.
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Mar 8, 2024 17:56
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Ghost Leviathan posted:DS9 also has a changeling literally just show up randomly in a park to Sisko disguised as O'Brien (who Sisko knows is a whole quadrant away) to chat and taunt him about how their mere existence is driving the galaxy into a paranoid frenzy without even having to do much. Admiralty Flag posted:Didn't the changeling say something like there's only three of them on Earth? Randalor posted:Yeah, the changeling was mocking how extreme and suspicious the Federarion had become of literally everyone. And why would they care about retinal scanners when they could just enter any buikding through, say, a vent or crack in the foundation? Or just turn into a fly and hang out on a nearby wall until someone else opens the door. i havent watched a lot of stars trek so idk if thats pre or post 9/11, but it sounds like a commentary on security theatre. as in it doesnt matter if they can match retinas, it matters that the humans think they can & spend a ton of effort inconveniencing and maligning innocents. terrorists_win.aiff very deep
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Mar 8, 2024 18:02
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Randalor posted:What happens if the person you chose was a frequent visitor to a sperm bank, though? If you really want to be certain that a seal is unbreakable, wouldn't the best way be to use a child, then kill the child? I sure loving hope someone who hasn't hit double-digits on their age doesn't have a descendant.
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Mar 8, 2024 18:47
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I love the 'soulless minions of orthodoxy' DS9 guy. He thinks death only happens because cells get bored. He ends up making friends with Weyoun who is 1) my favourite trek character and 2) a soulless minion of orthodoxy right down to his bones.
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Mar 8, 2024 18:51
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I love when Weyoun gets out smugged by Kai Winn. "I think you'll find we are more alike than you give us credit for." Winn grabs his earlobe to check his Pah "No dear, we're not.  "She's just so detestable but in that scene you're just happy to see her doing it to someone who's just as much of a detestable prick. Also, unpopular opinion but the Wadi kind of owned. "Of course no one was hurt! It's just a game  "
BioEnchanted has a new favorite as of 19:04 on Mar 8, 2024 |
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Mar 8, 2024 19:02
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Carthag Tuek posted:i havent watched a lot of stars trek so idk if thats pre or post 9/11, but it sounds like a commentary on security theatre. as in it doesnt matter if they can match retinas, it matters that the humans think they can & spend a ton of effort inconveniencing and maligning innocents. terrorists_win.aiff very deep Deep Space 9 finished its original run in 1999. It was very prescient on how crazy things would get after 9/11.
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Mar 8, 2024 19:11
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The Lone Badger posted:Checking for changelings is easy. You shoot them, and if they don’t melt into goo you get the transporter buffer to spit out a new one. changelings explode when they are shot, they have the exploding organ
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Mar 9, 2024 04:05
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Admiralty Flag posted:Didn't the changeling say something like there's only three of them on Earth? As I said, I'm pretty sure it's implied Changelings have insane attention to detail. Jadzia regularly pranks Odo by sneaking into his quarters and moving things by an inch. Also one of the things that makes Odo a good detective. Randalor posted:Deep Space 9 finished its original run in 1999. It was very prescient on how crazy things would get after 9/11. See also Starship Troopers. It's wild how much DS9 got away with, not even counting things like the same-sex kiss. I still find it interesting how they consistently portray Odo as having the same shapeshifting abilities as the rest of the Changelings, but he's nowhere near as good at it- it's a skill that he's actively practicing and uses in many ways, and he's able to use it in many practical ways like turning into a rat to sneak around, a bird to fly and an inanimate object to hide, but he outright says that convincingly disguising as another organic being is a lot harder than people think. Some humans on Earth are impressed that he's able to pass as a seagull, but Odo says that the other seagulls aren't fooled. His whole basic form is implied to be an attempt to imitate a Bajoran (specifically the scientist who is basically his estranged father figure) that clearly struggled with the details, though at the point of the show he's clearly settled on it as his 'default' form and identity. (And of course, a big theme of the show is people's individual self-perceptions, and how they relate to and integrate with cultures, both others and their own) It's not an uncommon thing in fantasy/sci-fi, actually; have a species or type of beings with extraordinary powers, and the protagonists have one too, but who has far weaker or less developed versions of them, so the enemies can still pose a threat but the protagonists don't seem overpowered or inexplicably weak, just working with an extremely high skill ceiling. Also on a random rear end note; you may recognise Odo as the voice of Mr House. And also the chef in The Little Mermaid that sings in French. Ghost Leviathan has a new favorite as of 04:26 on Mar 9, 2024 |
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Mar 9, 2024 04:18
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Ghost Leviathan posted:It's wild how much DS9 got away with, not even counting things like the same-sex kiss. 90's trek was astonishingly chill about terrorism
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Mar 9, 2024 05:08
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