(Thread IKs:
weg, Toxic Mental)
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Samovar posted:Blyaaaat! Cyka blyat! Oooooh, cyka blyaaaat! 
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Mar 14, 2024 22:11
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Tai posted:Su-57 could of been a decent plane if they hadn't half arsed. It might not of been as good as the F-35 but you've got 5th gen plane (lol posh 4th gen) that NATO has probably already marked the Su-57 as ''N/A''. So its the perfect successor of the feared MIG-25, as presented by the Putin's Russia. "Could have been great, but then cutting corners happened". But the solid-silver fountain at the dog kennel in Putin's dacha sure looks nice.
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Mar 14, 2024 22:13
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grumplestiltzkin posted:Probably sooner than you'd think. I can't remember which company it was (probably being or lockmart) has said that they can make a laser wildly stable/accurate thanks to all the development that has gone into lower powered targeting lasers over the last few decades. On top of that, the 6th gen fighters apparently have "shitloads of power generation" as a design requirement and it's believed that this is in support of lasers that are either already ready to go or will be shortly. Most of the speculation I've seen thinks it's for missile defense rather than offense, but a massive networked formation of fighters each covering each other with air defense lasers would be an absolute nightmare to deal with. The survivability onion would be insane. You’ll need a top turret. And a bottom one. And a front one. And a rear one. Maybe 2 per turret. This is a plot to get b17’s back into combat.
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Mar 14, 2024 22:17
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Jerk Burger posted:A Su-57 will detect an F-35 after the NATO press conference that announces an F-35 shot down a Russian jet This is a complete fabrication, as exposed by the Russian press conference that proves a Russian jet shot down a Russian jet.
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Mar 14, 2024 22:19
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I think drone swarm home base and the answer is bring back zeppelins with lasers mounted all over the exoskeleton.
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Mar 14, 2024 22:20
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Jerk Burger posted:A Su-57 will detect an F-35 after the NATO press conference that announces an F-35 shot down a Russian jet I mean, being hit by a missile is fairly solid evidence that the plane that fired the missile exists, so shouldn't that count as a detection?
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Mar 14, 2024 22:27
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Tuna-Fish posted:I mean, being hit by a missile is fairly solid evidence that the plane that fired the missile exists, so shouldn't that count as a detection? Who said anything about a plane firing the missile?
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Mar 14, 2024 22:29
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lmao the west flies around in UA lobbing missiles at 200km. Russia has a meltdown and accuses the west and the west is all ''prove it was f-35s because you don't have the tech to detect them''. I know there is a 0.000% chance of this happening.
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Mar 14, 2024 22:38
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Tai posted:Su-57 could of been a decent plane if they hadn't half arsed. It might not of been as good as the F-35 but you've got 5th gen plane (lol posh 4th gen) that NATO has probably already marked the Su-57 as ''N/A''. the only 5th gen features on the su-57 seems to be a little added angularity. they didn't and don't have the resources to have 5th gen radar and nav systems. more importantly however, even after being the best of russia that's still not as good as the best of the west, the russians can't loving afford it. they can't afford their t14 armata even though it's apparently the best tank ever, meaning that they would rather save money for... reasons, rather than arm their guys with the best they have got. https://en.topwar.ru/238201-armata-v-boj-ne-pojdet.html imagine trying to fight war on a budget, if you weren't willing to turn russia upside down to collect every spare kopek, then why the gently caress would you even start the biggest war in recent history? geworfenheit fucked around with this message at 23:12 on Mar 14, 2024 |
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Mar 14, 2024 22:59
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The radar isn't dog poo poo. It has roughly 200km detection range buuuuut it's not all round only from the nose as in 120d degress forward. Giving Russia the benefit of doubt here, Russia focused fair too much on the dog fighting aspect (as well as half arsing some of the stuff). The Su-57 would probably come out on top in a dog fight with F-35. But we're at the same thing as always happens. Russia builds something pretty decent for a role 30-40 years ago. This would of been the kick rear end plane for the Falklands war. As always happens with Russia, war has changed and Russia has been left behind again.
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Mar 14, 2024 23:13
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Which one has better stats in ace combat?
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Mar 14, 2024 23:27
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EorayMel posted:Who said anything about a plane firing the missile? They only detected the missile. No idea where it came from.
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Mar 14, 2024 23:59
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Horsebanger posted:Which one has better stats in ace combat? Whichever one first gets a waifu paintjob
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Mar 15, 2024 00:02
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anonumos posted:They only detected the missile. No idea where it came from.
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Mar 15, 2024 00:07
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But not where it wasn't 
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Mar 15, 2024 00:20
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Tai posted:The radar isn't dog poo poo. It has roughly 200km detection range buuuuut it's not all round only from the nose as in 120d degress forward. it makes vatniks proud when they see it at an air show in dubai or whatever, and that's pretty much all that it's good for. they literally made it useless at modern necessities like stealth just to make it more maneuverable because they think the red baron is gonna fly it or something. it's just gonna be blown up before it does anything cool, or at least it would if russians could afford to deploy it.
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Mar 15, 2024 00:34
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geworfenheit posted:it makes vatniks proud when they see it at an air show in dubai or whatever, and that's pretty much all that it's good for. Pugachev's cobra is admittedly a neat maneuver, but yeah I wouldn't have personally built the latest generation fighter around it.
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Mar 15, 2024 00:58
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geworfenheit posted:it makes vatniks proud when they see it at an air show in dubai or whatever, and that's pretty much all that it's good for. A lot of Russia's planes do look pretty cool though. Which again is another inherent problem. It must look cool. Russia would take an average cool looking jet over a meh advanced jet. X-35(?) looked like poo poo and it could be the best jet for the next 30 years and Russia wouldn't touch it.
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Mar 15, 2024 01:02
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What is wrong with laserpig?
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Mar 15, 2024 01:04
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Tai posted:Obligatory a F-35 crashed so it must be a bad plane.
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Mar 15, 2024 01:09
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Unit cost for an F-35 is quite cheap. The program cost became ludicrously high, primarily due to attempts to save money (which, if it had worked, would have saved heaping shitloads of money, so you can't really fault the people pushing for it), but now that it is going into mass production it comes out cheaper than most aircraft even with the bloated procurement cost.
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Mar 15, 2024 01:16
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Prettz posted:it's the most cost-ineffective warplane ever built. does that make it bad? lol, is this trolling?
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Mar 15, 2024 01:18
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Gnoman posted:Unit cost for an F-35 is quite cheap. The program cost became ludicrously high, primarily due to attempts to save money (which, if it had worked, would have saved heaping shitloads of money, so you can't really fault the people pushing for it), but now that it is going into mass production it comes out cheaper than most aircraft even with the bloated procurement cost.
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Mar 15, 2024 01:23
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Prettz posted:So it's not cheap then. It is. Not for you to afford, of course.
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Mar 15, 2024 01:29
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you have to think in russian to control the su-57
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Mar 15, 2024 01:30
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Gnoman posted:Unit cost for an F-35 is quite cheap. The program cost became ludicrously high, primarily due to attempts to save money (which, if it had worked, would have saved heaping shitloads of money, so you can't really fault the people pushing for it), but now that it is going into mass production it comes out cheaper than most aircraft even with the bloated procurement cost. Yeah it was very funny for a good decade or so then the wrinkles got ironed out and now it's just a good, if less interesting, fighting plane.
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Mar 15, 2024 01:34
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Runa posted:Yeah it was very funny for a good decade or so then the wrinkles got ironed out and now it's just a good, if less interesting, fighting plane. And for the record, I've been following F-35 development since the early days when it seemed like a great idea.
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Mar 15, 2024 01:36
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ded posted:you have to think in russian to control the su-57 Just shat my pants and it fired its entire payload of flares.
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Mar 15, 2024 01:37
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the salespeeps came in and saved the project by amortizing the nuts r&d cost over more planes, basically which doesn't happen much so get a good eyeful of the fact that it happened here
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Mar 15, 2024 01:38
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but at the rate the rest of the world is developing weapons, the F-35 could have B-52 longevity
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Mar 15, 2024 01:38
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Prettz posted:That doesn't make the cost go away. They were up to half a trillion dollars before it could even carry weapons. You're a polymathic genius.
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Mar 15, 2024 01:40
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Prettz posted:That doesn't make the cost go away. They were up to half a trillion dollars before it could even carry weapons. Well yeah, but such is life
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Mar 15, 2024 01:41
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Prettz posted:So it's not cheap then. The f35b is the most expensive at around $130m/each. The f14 was introduced in '74 for $38m/ea, or in today's dollars over 200m. The f35 isnt cheap but it is cheaper than one might expect. The reason the overall program cost is so high (and the individual cost so comparatively low) is that they're making an absolute shitload of them, which gives them plenty of experience to streamline/improve manufacturing, further driving down prices. Edit: Prettz posted:That doesn't make the cost go away. They were up to half a trillion dollars before it could even carry weapons. ....you do understand that 500b wasn't for a single plane... Right? Is this trolling, because it seems like it is. grumplestiltzkin fucked around with this message at 01:46 on Mar 15, 2024 |
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Mar 15, 2024 01:43
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I say we all go back to the good* old days of putting dudes in hot air balloons and have them throwing hand grenades at each other
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Mar 15, 2024 01:46
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geworfenheit posted:they literally made it useless at modern necessities like stealth just to make it more maneuverable because they think the red baron is gonna fly it or something. grumplestiltzkin posted:The f35b is the most expensive at around $130m/each. The f14 was introduced in '74 for $38m/ea, or in today's dollars over 200m. The f35 isnt cheap but it is cheaper than one might expect. The reason the overall program cost is so high (and the individual cost so comparatively low) is that they're making an absolute shitload of them, which gives them plenty of experience to streamline/improve manufacturing, further driving down prices.
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Mar 15, 2024 01:54
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grumplestiltzkin posted:....you do understand that 500b wasn't for a single plane... Right? Is this trolling, because it seems like it is. At one point in time the 500b was for a very, very small number of planes built up to that point. There were a shitton of upfront development costs and it's true that those costs don't go away, but the cost per-plane is vastly lower once you spread it out over a couple thousand planes.
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Mar 15, 2024 01:59
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Prettz posted:Did they? The F-22 is as maneuverable and it's pretty stealthy. You do know the ATF program started in 81?
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Mar 15, 2024 02:06
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Prettz posted:So it's not cheap then. by russian standards where they must save money by not supplying body armour or proper helmets, no, it's not.
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Mar 15, 2024 02:18
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the holy poopacy posted:At one point in time the 500b was for a very, very small number of planes built up to that point. There were a shitton of upfront development costs and it's true that those costs don't go away, but the cost per-plane is vastly lower once you spread it out over a couple thousand planes. That was my point. The program cost is huge, but it's (somewhat) offset on the price per airframe because there's so many airframes. Economies of scale is like econ 101 but lots of people seem to turn their brains off when they see "trillion" in the cost
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Mar 15, 2024 02:20
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economy of scale in russia means dredging up old soviet hunks of machinery from lake baikal, scraping off the rust (scale), and putting it back to work.
geworfenheit fucked around with this message at 02:30 on Mar 15, 2024 |
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Mar 15, 2024 02:24
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