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HootTheOwl
May 13, 2012

Hootin and shootin

Aphrodite posted:

I played a few games with a guy who had limited mobility in his arms one time.

He had a card holder, like a Scrabble tray, and a friend with him who would draw his cards and put them on the holder. He would tell him what he was tapping, and use instructions like “3rd card from the left” to play stuff. If he tutored anything, he told the friend what to grab, etc. They had it down pretty well so they’ve probably been playing together that way for quite a while.

(The friend was playing too, so he couldn’t just name the cards he was playing.)

I think I saw a duo like this at an NRG once.

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kalel
Jun 19, 2012

if I was blind and playing paper magic and punching braille into cards, I would write "⠽⠕⠥ ⠇⠕⠎⠞ ⠞⠓⠑ ⠛⠁⠍⠑" on each one just in case

Khanstant
Apr 5, 2007
What if they wrote a magic sigil in braile or French on the front of the card that let them reorder the deck using unholy magic?

Lord_Magmar
Feb 24, 2015

"Welcome to pound town, Slifer slacker!"


Perfume the cards so you know which is which by scent alone.

Leperflesh
May 17, 2007

The only advantage I can think of that could possibly be there is if the person with the braille cards was cheating at shuffling by because they can feel where the cards are at. Which can probably be solved by the opponent cutting their deck after each shuffle. What possible other information could you put on the face of a card that would be helpful that anyone else can't just get by taking notes on a notepad or checking the oracle on a card or something?

I feel like the inaccessibility of the stickers is one reason to not play with stickers, for the folks still grasping for legit reasons to hate stickers. Hey, you can be an ally of the vision impaired!

The ADA generally requires businesses, events, etc. to make "reasonable accommodation" for people who need it in order to have access. Exactly what constitutes "reasonable" is intentionally flexible, but it does scale with how big, moneyed, etc. you are. A tiny nonprofit with a tiny budget might not reasonably be able to offer wheelchair access to their third-story facility in an old building that'd cost $100k to provide, for example, whereas a giant corporation with a billion dollar annual revenue "reasonably" can offer extensive accommodations for a wide variety of customers and employees and their needs even if that costs millions to do. I'm not a lawyer but based on that I would guess that a large, well-financed Magic tournament has a greater legal responsibility to offer accommodation and access to a person with vision impairment, not less; a small local game store doesn't have to hire an interpreter for example, but a tournament with a multimillion dollar budget actually might.

Also "open to the public" doesn't mean "literally anyone can come in." A club that you have to buy membership to is open to the public. A sporting event you have to qualify for, is too.

Froghammer
Sep 8, 2012

Khajit has wares
if you have coin

Managed to his Mythic with Merfolk Tribal of all things. Standard sucks so hard that it has looped back around into being awesome.

Cleretic
Feb 3, 2010


Ignore my posts!
I'm aggressively wrong about everything!
So, something that's occurred to me, and I'm wondering if I'm actually noticing something or am just responding to a narrow knowledge of the game:

Is blue just... not very interested in high-concept gimmick stuff?

In the few sets I've been around/buying stuff for, I've noticed that red and green seem to most often get to play with some weird poo poo, with white and black joining in to some degree depending on what said weird poo poo is; black loved itself some play with poison counters in Phyrexia, while white loved a lot of Karlov Manor's ideas. But throughout all the sets I've got, blue's not really playing in those spaces; it might incidentally poke at them, occasionally through reactive keywords like corrupted and paradox, but blue seems to default to its core playbook much more often than the others. You see a bunch of every other color stunting off of some unusual gimmick or keyword, and then you hit a blue card and it's just going 'yep, I'm still card draw and flying'.

Cleretic fucked around with this message at 03:41 on Mar 19, 2024

Lord_Magmar
Feb 24, 2015

"Welcome to pound town, Slifer slacker!"


Cleretic posted:

So, something that's occurred to me, and I'm wondering if I'm actually noticing something or am just responding to a narrow knowledge of the game:

Is blue just... not very interested in high-concept gimmick stuff?

In the few sets I've been around/buying stuff for, I've noticed that red and green seem to most often get to play with some weird poo poo, with white and black joining in to some degree depending on what said weird poo poo is; black loved itself some play with poison counters in Phyrexia, while white loved a lot of Karlov Manor's ideas. But throughout all the sets I've got, blue's not really playing in those spaces; it might incidentally poke at them, occasionally through reactive keywords like corrupted and paradox, but blue seems to default to its core playbook much more often than the others. You see a bunch of every other color stunting off of some unusual gimmick or keyword, and then you hit a blue card and it's just going 'yep, I'm still card draw and flying'.

Because Blue is probably the most defined set of card effects that are borrowed the least by other colours.

Counter Spells and Card Draw. Instants Matter. Flying/Combat Evasion.

Froghammer
Sep 8, 2012

Khajit has wares
if you have coin

WotC has reigned in blue a lot over the years because it's historically the best color by a country mile

Eej
Jun 17, 2007

HEAVYARMS
Thinking about how many blue decks win the game by decking themselves or their opponents. Definitely not gimmicky.

Eej
Jun 17, 2007

HEAVYARMS
When I see T1 Ruin Crab I know I'm in for some good old fashioned back and forth no gimmick Magic

ram dass in hell
Dec 29, 2019
Probation
Can't post for 4 hours!

Eej posted:

When I see T1 Ruin Crab I know I'm in for some good old fashioned back and forth no gimmick Magic

agent of treachery is a good sign too

Khanstant
Apr 5, 2007
I feel like some recent sets do let blue do set gimmicky stuff, but primarily as grease for another colour all-on on that gimmick.

Cleretic
Feb 3, 2010


Ignore my posts!
I'm aggressively wrong about everything!

Eej posted:

Thinking about how many blue decks win the game by decking themselves or their opponents. Definitely not gimmicky.

You've definitely found the one exception in terms of 'gimmick stuff', but I think it just sort of refines the point rather than refute it: mill is kind of the only 'gimmick' blue's got, but it's a gimmick that's existed in the same form for decades. It's just part of blue's core, and blue sticks to its core so much more strictly.

What I'm noticing is more the fact that it doesn't get to play much with new keywords, to get new weird gimmicks, probably because of the sheer power level of that core. Blue pretty much remains the same across the years while everyone else gets to go weird; the only 'new thing' that I'd say is consistently given to blue more than anyone else in what I've got is adventures, but that's still more than a presidential term old--and you can argue it's basically just a new way to let them get to their usual tools, rather than something new itself.

I was going to say the big exception is rad counters, which are a distinctly 'blue' gimmick that provide a different direction to their usual stuff... but looking at those cards, rad counters mostly aren't blue. Green and black get the lion's share of those actual cards, blue is just providing support; less outright 'give rad counters', more proliferates. (EDIT: As Khanstant said, supporting the other colors going hard on the gimmick rather than pressing it itself.)

Cleretic fucked around with this message at 04:44 on Mar 19, 2024

Fuzzy Mammal
Aug 15, 2001

Lipstick Apathy
You can go back to illusions donate. Tons of poo poo. Blue is cracked.

Eej
Jun 17, 2007

HEAVYARMS

Cleretic posted:

You've definitely found the one exception in terms of 'gimmick stuff', but I think it just sort of refines the point rather than refute it: mill is kind of the only 'gimmick' blue's got, but it's a gimmick that's existed in the same form for decades. It's just part of blue's core, and blue sticks to its core so much more strictly.

What I'm noticing is more the fact that it doesn't get to play much with new keywords, to get new weird gimmicks, probably because of the sheer power level of that core. Blue pretty much remains the same across the years while everyone else gets to go weird; the only 'new thing' that I'd say is consistently given to blue more than anyone else in what I've got is adventures, but that's still more than a presidential term old--and you can argue it's basically just a new way to let them get to their usual tools, rather than something new itself.

I was going to say the big exception is rad counters, which are a distinctly 'blue' gimmick that provide a different direction to their usual stuff... but looking at those cards, rad counters mostly aren't blue. Green and black get the lion's share of those actual cards, blue is just providing support; less outright 'give rad counters', more proliferates. (EDIT: As Khanstant said, supporting the other colors going hard on the gimmick rather than pressing it itself.)

Every colour is just catching up to Blue because Blue has been doing weird gimmicky poo poo since the start.

How is White supposed to contend with Blue in the gimmick category when Blue can do even in recent times:

Time Walk (Alrund's Epiphany 2021, Nexus of Fate 2018)
Mill your opponent to death (Ruin Crab 2020, Tasha's Hideous Laughter 2021)
Mill yourself to victory (Thassa's Oracle 2020, Jace, Wielder of Mysteries 2019)
Narset, Parter of Veils + Commit // Memory so you pitch your opp's hand and they draw 1 card while you draw 7 cards (2019)
Sublime Epiphany (2020)
Discontinuity (2020)

I do think that restricting yourself to "one presidential term" in terms of design is very shortsighted. Pioneer's library starts in 2012. Standard itself is 3 years now which edges dangerously close to one presidential term.

flatluigi
Apr 23, 2008

here come the planes
if anything blue shouldn't get a lot of the "if you don't interact with this silliness, you lose" since it's the best color at stopping its opponent from interacting with them

Khanstant
Apr 5, 2007
There's also a lot of cool things blue can do but only in some weird world where you get to have 10 mana and your opponent to not leave 6 turns ago.

Cleretic
Feb 3, 2010


Ignore my posts!
I'm aggressively wrong about everything!

Eej posted:

I do think that restricting yourself to "one presidential term" in terms of design is very shortsighted. Pioneer's library starts in 2012. Standard itself is 3 years now which edges dangerously close to one presidential term.

For some context on my window of experience, I've been playing since Wilds of Eldraine/Doctor Who, but throw myself way too hard into new hobbies and have been playing Commander pretty often. So while I admit I don't have the biggest view of things, it's enough to start noticing that, say, whenever there's a new keyword it's never blue that gets to play with it, and it's never the blue decks I'm playing against that are throwing me the weird new curveballs; blue's gameplan just doesn't change per set in the way other colors do. For Adventure I actually looked up its debut for that post because I thought it might've been in Wilds, and found out that the closest thing I could call a 'new blue-centric keyword' was still six years old.

I am noticing that I think you're making a whole different argument, though. Like, I'm largely talking about new keywords; the new central gimmicks of a set that means that this crop of green cards has some distinctly different style from previous green cards. You're instead bringing up individual cards and combos that are powerful, even if they aren't powerful in especially new ways; I hate to tell you, 'mill as victory condition' isn't exactly new and different in blue.

Everyone else is answering what I was talking about, though. Flatluigi's right, blue probably shouldn't get a whole lot of, say, poison counter access given how much access they have to ways to shut down counterplay.

Cleretic fucked around with this message at 09:35 on Mar 19, 2024

flatluigi
Apr 23, 2008

here come the planes
i do want to second people saying that blue does get its own set of gimmicks, but it's usually on an axis that doesn't involve combat damage (since that's out of the color pie, which you should look into if you like thinking about how the game's designed as a newer player). for example, it didn't explicitly have poison counter interaction, but in that set it *did* have a couple cards that just granted a poison counter as well as several cards that could proliferate those counters

Vando
Oct 26, 2007

stoats about
reprint Battle of Wits you cowards

ilmucche
Mar 16, 2016

What did you say the strategy was?

Vando posted:

reprint the cheese stands alone in black border you cowards

Vando
Oct 26, 2007

stoats about
reprint it as blue cheese

Chakan
Mar 30, 2011
Are you forgetting about Barren Glory, or do you need the card to have art with cheese in it for some reason?

ilmucche
Mar 16, 2016

What did you say the strategy was?

Chakan posted:

Are you forgetting about Barren Glory, or do you need the card to have art with cheese in it for some reason?

The cheese is funny, hth.

Also they aren't the same effect.

fadam
Apr 23, 2008

Outlaws Teaser here:
https://markrosewater.tumblr.com/post/745397908624523264/maros-teaser-for-outlaws-of-thunder-junction
--
• A new batch of five related creature types

• A card capable of returning three different card types from the graveyard to the battlefield

• A mechanic players have been asking us to do for many years gets made as the setting was the perfect place to finally do it

• Dual lands with a land subtype that has never been on dual lands before

• A new modal mechanic that introduces something different to think about

• A card that can swap/exchange control of up to three different card types

• A new creature token that has an ability no creature token has ever had before

• A typal card for Skeletons and Zombies

• Creature tokens in the set: (some might have abilities) 1/1 white Sheep, 1/1 blue Bird, 1/1 black Vampire Rogue, 1/1 red Mercenary, 2/1 green Varmint, 2/2 white Ox, 2/2 white Spirit, 2/2 blue and black Zombie, 3/1 red Dinosaur, 3/3 white Angel, 3/3 green Elk, 4/4 red Scorpion Dragon, X/X green Elemental, */* Blue Ox

• Some of the planes with legendary Villains in this set: Dominaria, Eldraine, Fiora, Innistrad, Ixalan, Kaladesh, Kaldheim, Kamigawa, New Capenna, and Ravnica

Next, here are some rules text that will be showing up on cards:

• “Then repeat this process X more times.”

• “if it wasn’t cast or no mana was spent to cast it.”

• “Plotting cards from your hand costs {2} less.”

• “You can’t cast this spell during your first, second, or third turns of the game.”

• “That card gains flashback {0}”

• “Target creature becomes a white Rabbit with a base power and toughness 0/1.”

• “When you win that flip, copy that spell.”

• “If a triggered ability of a legendary creature you control triggers, that ability triggers an additional time.”

• “you get that many additional upkeep steps after this phase.”

• “Oxen you control have double strike.”

Here are some creature type lines from the set:

• Creature – Armadillo

• Creature – Shark Rogue

• Creature – Plant Bard

• Creature – Coyote

• Creature – Homarid Mercenary

• Creature – Rhino Brawler

• Creature – Ox Angel

• Creature – Porcupine Mount

• Legendary Creature – Kor Advisor

• Legendary Creature – Giant Scout

Finally, here are some names in the set:

• Claim Jumper

• Form a Posse

• Gold Rush

• Great Train Heist

• High Noon

• Quick Draw

• Reach for the Sky

• Resilient Roadrunner

• Shoot the Sheriff

• This Town Ain’t Big Enough
--

I think we can answer one of these based on the leak. "Dual lands with a land subtype that has never been on dual lands before" we saw the GW desert that pings something, presumably that's a cycle.

A mechanic players have been asking us to do for many years gets made as the setting was the perfect place to finally do it Last Strike? People are saying it is Saddle, but who wanted that?

fadam fucked around with this message at 18:53 on Mar 19, 2024

Justin_Brett
Oct 23, 2012

GAMERDOME put down LOSER
I could see people wanting saddle since so many creatures are things riding other things.

It's probably one of the zombie twins, but I wouldn't put it past them to stick a cowboy hat on the Gitrog Monster with the way the set's looking.

Khanstant
Apr 5, 2007
Please please include legends for Pecos Bill, John Henry, and Paul Bunyon so I can make a Tall Tales deck. The Blue Ox is really giving me hope.

LifeLynx
Feb 27, 2001

Dang so this is like looking over his shoulder in real-time
Grimey Drawer

fadam posted:

Outlaws Teaser here:
https://markrosewater.tumblr.com/post/745397908624523264/maros-teaser-for-outlaws-of-thunder-junction
--


I think we can answer one of these based on the leak. "Dual lands with a land subtype that has never been on dual lands before" we saw the GW desert that pings something, presumably that's a cycle.

A mechanic players have been asking us to do for many years gets made as the setting was the perfect place to finally do it Last Strike? People are saying it is Saddle, but who wanted that?

I read his blog from time to time and people are always asking about a horse and rider type mechanic.

We know a lot of these from the leaks, like the card that can swap multiple things is also the same one that has the new modal mechanic.

TheKingofSprings
Oct 9, 2012
I’ve had a hot take brewing for a while that every colour should have counterspells, they just don’t necessarily behave like a counterspell.

Green counterspell that turns a spell on the stack into a rampant growth, red counterspell that makes a spell into both players lose 2, white counterspell that makes both players draw a card, etc.

HootTheOwl
May 13, 2012

Hootin and shootin

TheKingofSprings posted:

I’ve had a hot take brewing for a while that every colour should have counterspells, they just don’t necessarily behave like a counterspell.

Green counterspell that turns a spell on the stack into a rampant growth, red counterspell that makes a spell into both players lose 2, white counterspell that makes both players draw a card, etc.

Every Color but green does.

Green gets stifle

Time
Aug 1, 2011

It Was All A Dream
I like the green space of fizzling targets for spells with hexproof on combat tricks and veil etc as a pseudo counterspell but it would probably be cool to stretch it a bit

kalel
Jun 19, 2012

until end of turn, if an opponent would create one or more creature tokens, instead each player creates an 0/1 white Bunny creature token

Procrastinator
Aug 16, 2009

what?


Ostensibly, in terms of regular effects: blue gets counter spells, green gets hex proofers, red gets counter burn (i.e. eidolon, the dino from LCI that damages instants), white gets tax effects (i.e. Thalia), and black gets discard/thoughtseize.

The rates are the big differentiator to me, and some of those spaces could probably be expanded.

Lord_Magmar
Feb 24, 2015

"Welcome to pound town, Slifer slacker!"


The big notable thing is that White and Black get counter spells less often than other ally colours generally get stuff.

Part of this is that counter spells just are rare in general for good reason. But still, I feel that the conditional counterspells (this small, this big, no creatures) could be shared between blue and white more, and Black could stand to get counterspells with costs beyond mana more often (sac a creature to counter a spell). Whilst reducing the mass of counterspells blue gets in a given set.

Basically if a set has 5 counter spells I think 1 should be in white 1 in black, 3 in blue.

Edit: as an example of the allies sharing stuff more often thing. Green gets bites and red gets fights quite a bit, compared to how often white gets counterspells.

Khanstant
Apr 5, 2007
I like Reprieve a nicer counter. Just send it back to hand and try again later.

CatstropheWaitress
Nov 26, 2017

Could go the route of desert twister and just make it cost something stupid like 3GGG, 2/2 creature with Flash that when it enters eats the spell and gets a buff depending on what it was. Similar to white's exile spells but just destroy it instead or whatever.

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

A bracing glass of carrot juice!

CatstropheWaitress posted:

Could go the route of desert twister and just make it cost something stupid like 3GGG, 2/2 creature with Flash that when it enters eats the spell and gets a buff depending on what it was. Similar to white's exile spells but just destroy it instead or whatever.

Counterspells on creatures is generally a bit simic, but something like "etb: counter target non-creature spell. Put a number of +1/+1 counters on this creature equal to that spell's mana value" would work at that MV. The comparison point being Bane of Progress.

Cleretic
Feb 3, 2010


Ignore my posts!
I'm aggressively wrong about everything!

fadam posted:

• Some of the planes with legendary Villains in this set: Dominaria, Eldraine, Fiora, Innistrad, Ixalan, Kaladesh, Kaldheim, Kamigawa, New Capenna, and Ravnica

So to get my head around this tease a bit: could Eldraine's villain just be Oko, who we already knew? Just trying to figure out if Mark's talking 'villains with origins from other planes but are more generally around', or 'villains specifically tied to these planes now getting to do something outside of it'.

Eldraine's my attention here either way, one of the fairytale folk rocking up to the wild west has to be fun. I immediately thought Ixalan's import was gonna be them trying to have their cake and eat it too with Thunder Junction being an empty plane (so no displaced natives) while still getting to do some of the native American stuff from classic westerns, but I don't know if any of Ixalan's villains really do that aesthetic; Ixalan's villains these days are more the pirates and the vampire conquistadors, right? So it's probably someone like Lannery Storm, or maybe one of the dinosaurs; maybe Etali's coming back.

Cleretic fucked around with this message at 02:21 on Mar 20, 2024

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Macdeo Lurjtux
Jul 5, 2011

BRRREADSTOOORRM!
Well the set has a bonus sheet of legendaries so he could be including those too.

We know we're getting Olivia and Gonti in the commander decks, alongside the Lone Wolf and Shrub guy introduced in the fiction last week.

Oko's team is Tiny Bones and Vraska, plus four more, one of which looks like Kiora. One was thought to be Rakdos but he's likely still napping in Ravnica.

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