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Some cursory googling I could spare didn't turn up anything useful on these topics from less than five or so hours ago, presumably because it's currently nighttime in Israel and Europe. Here's the unrwa newsroom: https://www.unrwa.org/#mm-3 And here's their most recent Gaza report, from Friday: https://www.unrwa.org/resources/reports/unrwa-situation-report-93-situation-gaza-strip-and-west-bank-including-east-Jerusalem The specific numbers are interesting if youre either a nerd or compiling week to week data, but other than stuff reported in this thread iirc (the attacks on that hospital, some amount of bombardment of Rafah), the only big picture novel thing appears to be a topic I've been trying to follow anyway: the (Israel-caused) famine is worsening rapidly.
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Mar 24, 2024 23:33
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Is there really anything that could stop Israel from committing atrocities at this point? Despite some opposition, it seems like they'll just be able to keep doing what they want.
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Mar 24, 2024 23:40
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Altared State posted:Is there really anything that could stop Israel from committing atrocities at this point? Despite some opposition, it seems like they'll just be able to keep doing what they want. Israel could force the Palestinians into the sea en masse and American media would report that IDF sources said the Palestinians just wanted to go for a swim.
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Mar 24, 2024 23:45
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Separately from all this, and belatedly: stop talking about Chinese actions in Xinjiang et al in this thread for now. That goes for everyone.
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Mar 24, 2024 23:45
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Altared State posted:Is there really anything that could stop Israel from committing atrocities at this point? Despite some opposition, it seems like they'll just be able to keep doing what they want. If you believe the retired IDF officer quoted in an article we discussed a page or so ago, yes: The US could stop sending Israel weapons, that would force Israel to deescalate. If you don't trust that argument, the US could also stop giving Israel political cover at the UN, and stop giving Israel funding. Israel's economy is hampered by this conflict, and allowing them to feel that pain might make some Israelis feel that this war isn't worth it. Also without political cover, the UNSC would not be prevented from acting. I don't believe either is likely. One of the downsides of a unipolar world is that the US wields great influence (though I think both Ukraine and Yemen demonstrate that US control is crumbling), and they're all in on this genocide and are unlikely to want to stop Israel. More of the world could adopt BDS. That movement is dangerous to Israel, that's why it's being made illegal in various Western countries. More systemic sanctions on Israel would of course also be welcome. This is a large part of how Apartheid South Africa was dismantled.
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Mar 24, 2024 23:59
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The US could stop this at any time they wish. Israel isn't a resillient war economy, nor are its citizens durable to hardship; if you enacted actual repercussions for the genocide, Israel would either concede the point or collapse. It would be akin to the Six Day War; besides the element of surprise, the Arab nations were unwilling to shed a colossal amount of skin in defense of Palestine, whereas the Irgun terrorists were ideologically hardened and ready to die to create Israel. Israel is not ready to die to erase Gaza and the West Bank. 10% of Israel has dual-citizenship, which is a huge detriment for hunkering down. You make conditions in Israel significantly worse than conditions in the US, and Israel would lose an incredible chunk of its population virtually overnight.
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Mar 25, 2024 00:22
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I can't find anything by searching... Has anyone tried to get courts to hear anti-BDS laws as being unconstitutional because they block our first amendment right to protest against and not participate in a genocide?
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Mar 25, 2024 00:55
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Bel Shazar posted:I can't find anything by searching... Us bds laws are largely unenforceable, universally deranged, and yes, probably unconstitutional. I haven't heard of any actual enforcement attempts, which didn't mean they didn't happen. However, "you are required to do business with this country" and "you are not required to do business with this country, unless you announce the reason you are not doing business is because you're mad about seventy years of genocide" are both... legally questionable.
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Mar 25, 2024 01:01
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Bel Shazar posted:I can't find anything by searching... I found something from Arkansas last year: https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/2/21/top-us-court-refused-to-review-anti-bds-law-heres-what-it-means quote:A district court initially dismissed the lawsuit, but a three-judge appeals panel blocked the law in a split decision in 2021, ruling that it violates the First Amendment. So, looks like it's kind of a dead end at this point. Maybe/hopefully only until someone successfully gets a district court to rule in their favor of suing a state for an anti-BDS law? Kalit fucked around with this message at 01:07 on Mar 25, 2024 |
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Mar 25, 2024 01:01
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Oh, that's a bit interesting. A state university (presumably in keeping with dumb state requirements) demanded a magazine sign a pledge not to boycott Israel, if they wanted uni advertising dollars. The magazine declined, the uni canceled their offer, and that's the center of the lawsuit. It's not the magazine going back on a weird unenforceable demand, it's them being unwilling to sign it in the first place. and the chilling effect of that sort of business is the actual impact anyway
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Mar 25, 2024 01:08
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Note: a user in this thread (Stringent) was previously banned for something which is not actually against the rules in D&D (denying genocide). Accordingly, he is being unbanned.
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Mar 25, 2024 03:19
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Koos Group posted:Note: a user in this thread (Stringent) was previously banned for something which is not actually against the rules in D&D (denying genocide). Accordingly, he is being unbanned. That's the sound of violent racists breathing just a small bit easier. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Mar 25, 2024 03:34
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The Guardian posted:The United Nations agency for Palestinian refugees, Unrwa, said on Sunday that Israel had definitively barred it from making aid deliveries in northern Gaza, where the threat of famine is highest. This seems to just formalise what has been happening in practice, since as the article notes no aid has gotten in to the North from UNRWA since 29th January. Still utterly appauling. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/mar/24/israel-reportedly-blocking-un-food-aid-to-northern-gaza-despite-high-famine-risk
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Mar 25, 2024 04:56
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I thought aid trucks started actually delivering aid again in the North but then the IDF killed the Hamas cops that were actually providing the security for the aid moving north in the Al-Shifa raid. Maybe i was getting some information from osmosis incorrectly.
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Mar 25, 2024 05:57
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Kalit posted:My point is, even if Biden stopped weapon sales, Israel would continue the genocide. You've said this in passing several times. The obvious point here is that Biden hasn't tried stopping weapon sales. Or basically any other lever he has. Instead, there's direct US intelligence involvement, probably some American presence on the ground for some period, vast amounts of gifted aid, large-scale urgent military airlifts. Perhaps don't do that and just see what happens? If Israel continues to misbehave, do more.
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Mar 25, 2024 10:37
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Bel Shazar posted:That's the sound of violent racists breathing just a small bit easier. Advocating (or spreading videos from people as they commit) violent assault, on the other hand, is banned in D&D. So I don't think this unbanning will do much to encourage racist violence in society.
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Mar 25, 2024 14:51
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Fuschia tude posted:Advocating (or spreading videos from people as they commit) violent assault, on the other hand, is banned in D&D. So I don't think this unbanning will do much to encourage racist violence in society. Not much, but not none.
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Mar 25, 2024 14:53
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Another UNSC vote coming up shortly, this time all the temporary members have their names on it. Including US allies Japan and South Korea as well as Algeria for the Arab states. If they can't get this one through I'm not sure they'll ever pass anything at all, never mind the fact that enforcement of the resolution will be a nightmare. AJE has live coverage (note there are pretty frequently graphic images on their live pages): https://www.aljazeera.com/news/liveblog/2024/3/25/israels-war-on-gaza-live-nine-killed-in-israeli-strike-on-deir-el-balah Also lmao: quote:Sources said that the US has asked for the text to not include a reference to a “permanent” ceasefire but a “lasting” one. Hopefully this doesn't happen and they suck it up with the initial phrasing. Kagrenak fucked around with this message at 15:18 on Mar 25, 2024 |
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Mar 25, 2024 15:15
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celadon posted:unrwa probably prefers not getting direct funding anyway; I bet they’ve asked multiple times for their financial support to be obscured and refracted through other organizations but no administration was brave enough to face headlines of ‘us defunds aid agency’ until Biden swooped in The Trump administration cut off all funding for UNRWA in September 2018, and it wasn't restored until the Biden administration restored it in April 2021. So, at least one other administration. https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2021/4/7/us-announces-it-will-restore-aid-to-palestinians-cut-by-trump
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Mar 25, 2024 15:18
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Kagrenak posted:Another UNSC vote coming up shortly, this time all the temporary members have their names on it. Including US allies Japan and South Korea as well as Algeria for the Arab states. If they can't get this one through I'm not sure they'll ever pass anything at all, never mind the fact that enforcement of the resolution will be a nightmare. Looks like it passed (using "immediate" instead of "permanent") with the US abstaining: https://news.un.org/en/story/2024/03/1147931. Better than them vetoing it for the 4th loving time. Granted, I don't think this resolution passing will actually make any difference in Israel's actions...
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Mar 25, 2024 15:51
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Kalit posted:Looks like it passed (using "immediate" instead of "permanent") with the US abstaining: https://news.un.org/en/story/2024/03/1147931. Better than them vetoing it for the 4th loving time. Something is wrong with that URL for me, but looking at Guardian's reporting, the resolution seems to only demand ceasefire during Ramadan. Another step in the right direction, I guess, but the pace is glacial. Even though Netanyahu personally is very unhappy, it's hard to say what real additional pressure it may result in. It's also different from what the US proposed in that although it demands the release of all hostages, it doesn't make it a prerequisite. Also, some interesting behind-the-scenes bits about the final wording. quote:While the resolution demands a temporary ceasefire during the remainder of the Muslim holy month of Ramadan, it adds that should lead to a “lasting sustainable ceasefire”. In a late amendment demanded by the US, the word “lasting” was substituted for “permanent”, to Russian objections. A Russian effort to restore the word “permanent” was defeated by 11 votes to three. E: Now this would be really good to see implemented as soon as possible. Is another vote required? Paladinus fucked around with this message at 16:22 on Mar 25, 2024 |
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Mar 25, 2024 16:18
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Hopefully this will mean something in real terms.Paladinus posted:Something is wrong with that URL for me, but looking at Guardian's reporting, the resolution seems to only demand ceasefire during Ramadan. Yes, but the Guardian article says the resolution also calls for the temporary ceasefire to lead into a "lasting ceasefire". quote:Hopefully this doesn't happen and they suck it up with the initial phrasing. Seems like the edited version passed. Kalit posted:Granted, I don't think this resolution passing will actually make any difference in Israel's actions... Probably not, but it might make a difference in how other countries treat Israel. Aren't UNSC resolutions theoretically binding and something countries have to act on? Edit: Ah wait, the Guardian explicitly calls out this resolution as "non-binding". Unrelated to the resolution, but relevant to the discussion we had earlier: https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/israel-will-stop-working-with-unrwa-gaza-government-spokesperson-says-2024-03-25/ Israel will stop working with the UNRWA in Gaza entirely. Esran fucked around with this message at 16:47 on Mar 25, 2024 |
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Mar 25, 2024 16:38
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They are binding but unenforceable.
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Mar 25, 2024 16:45
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https://twitter.com/tksshawa/status/1772276355620597977 As the tweet says, Trump's an opportunist and would only be using this in the same way he used being vague about healthcare to needle Clinton, but it's still an outflanking that doesn't need to happen.
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Mar 25, 2024 19:02
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Neurolimal posted:https://twitter.com/tksshawa/status/1772276355620597977 This interview doesn't show him "outflanking" Biden. It's just him bragging about being more supportive of Israel than Biden is, calling UNRWA the enemy, and telling Israel to hurry up and "finish your war". Here's the full quote of what was in that tweet: quote:He added that "what I saw October 7 was one of the saddest things I've ever seen," but says Israel should draw the fighting to a close. "You have to finish up your war. To finish it up. You gotta get it done. And, I am sure you will do that. And we gotta get to peace, we can't have this going on. And I will say, Israel has to be very careful, because you're losing a lot of the world, you're losing a lot of support, you have to finish up, you have to get the job done. And you have to get on to peace, to get on to a normal life for Israel, and for everybody else." Trump seems to be calling on Israel to kill Hamas faster, which is far from anything resembling a ceasefire. Kalit fucked around with this message at 19:26 on Mar 25, 2024 |
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Mar 25, 2024 19:24
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Neurolimal posted:https://twitter.com/tksshawa/status/1772276355620597977 He's even vague in the same sentence, he says that he would've done the same but also that they shouldn't do it, one right after the other. Then he wanders off into mostly unrelated things including later than my quote, something about Iran being in control $300B of Iraq's funds (???? Maybe the oil field deal is how he got this in his head??). In summary Trump is an idiot but Biden should've been first to say something like the above pull quote. quote:Q: I want to present you with a question I think every world leader has to answer. How would you react if your children or grandchildren were kidnapped by Hamas and underwent the same atrocities many Israelis have experienced since Oct. 7? https://www.israelhayom.com/2024/03/25/trump-to-israel-hayom-only-a-fool-would-have-not-acted-like-israel-on-oct-7/ Kalit posted:This interview doesn't show him "outflanking" Biden. It's just him bragging about being more supportive Israel than Biden is, calling UNRWA the enemy, and telling Israel to hurry up and "finish your war" (i.e. definitely not a ceasefire). NL has a point where Trump's insane way of throwing poo poo at the wall really is ideally suited for our media environment. He basically just says a million different things and people pull what they want from it to show how he's actually playing 5D chess. Kagrenak fucked around with this message at 19:26 on Mar 25, 2024 |
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Mar 25, 2024 19:24
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Kagrenak posted:He's even vague in the same sentence, he says that he would've done the same but also that they shouldn't do it, one right after the other. Then he wanders off into mostly unrelated things including later than my quote, something about Iran being in control $300B of Iraq's funds (???? Maybe the oil field deal is how he got this in his head??). In summary Trump is an idiot but Biden should've been first to say something like the above pull quote. But that's not outflanking... that's right wing culture jamming.
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Mar 25, 2024 19:28
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Yeah, that doesn't sound like any sort of threat to Israel. Just some friendly advice.
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Mar 25, 2024 19:29
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Surprising very few people, the NY Times continues to walk back its reporting on the October 7 sexual assaults: https://www.nytimes.com/2024/03/25/world/middleeast/video-sexual-assault-israel-kibbutz-hamas.html quote:Israeli Soldier’s Video Undercuts Medic’s Account of Sexual Assault
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Mar 25, 2024 20:48
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Weed Wolf posted:Surprising very few people, the NY Times continues to walk back its reporting on the October 7 sexual assaults: I am always surprised when the NY Times actually walks back their lies
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Mar 25, 2024 21:26
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They know it doesn't matter anymore, the narrative is set.
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Mar 25, 2024 21:36
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Yawgmoft posted:They know it doesn't matter anymore, the narrative is set. Yeah, just like with the Iraq War, the purpose of the article was fulfilled, and with the rising suspicion that rape occurred during the latest Al-Shifa siege it's as good a time as any to start cleaning up and recycle a portion of the integrity they've lost.
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Mar 25, 2024 21:41
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Esran posted:Hopefully this will mean something in real terms. https://twitter.com/comrade_sweezy/status/1772280610058305706 Not exactly a shock that the US would say this ("non-binding resolution").
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Mar 25, 2024 22:54
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I don't think you can do that. All Security Council resolutions are binding by default.
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Mar 26, 2024 00:10
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Content Warning: https://twitter.com/MiddleEastMnt/status/1771870105884065888 https://twitter.com/zei_squirrel/status/1771917638538523107 https://m.jpost.com/israel-hamas-war/article-793420 Israel is using rape as a weapon of genocide and the United States government is fully aware of this.
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Mar 26, 2024 02:25
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Nucleic Acids posted:Israel is using rape as a weapon of genocide and the United States government is fully aware of this. 3 of the last 5 presidents are rapists, so this isn't all that surprising. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Mar 26, 2024 02:46
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B B posted:3 of the last 5 presidents are rapists, so this isn't all that surprising. That we know of. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Mar 26, 2024 02:58
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Jaxyon posted:That we know of. This is a very fair point, but 3 of the 5 are definite rapists.
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Mar 26, 2024 02:59
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B B posted:This is a very fair point, but 3 of the 5 are definite rapists. Isn’t it 4 of 5? The only one I’m aware of who isn’t a known rapist is Obama. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Mar 26, 2024 04:06
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